OT: Farve

[Murffieus]

McDish----you're being kind----a 70 QB average is way below average-----in both 2005 & 2006 Favre ranked in the bottom 20% of all starting QBs insofar as QB rating is concerned!

He's coming back to break records----Period!

BTW-----Aaron Rodgers had a better QB rating than Favre in preseason games 101 to 93 !

[AlumKCof93]

I think it would be in everyones best interests if the Packers draft a good QB this year.  That way, the story about whether Favre retiring isn't that big a story for the Packers and wouldn't waste the time of Bears fans who are sick and tired of the "story".

So my hope is that next year at this time, the powers that be in Lambau say thank you Brett for winning as many super bowls as Rex Grossman has and thank you for throwing those touchdowns amidst all the interceptions and have a good life in Mississippi.

[NavinRJohnson]

Why in the heck would I, as a Bears fan, want a 38 year old Brett Favre? Would I have wanted him at 29? Darn right! I have no shame in saying he is the best QB I have ever seen. (Grossman is 26 by the way.) The fact is, the Packers went 8-8 against a brutal schedule. Have you seen next year's Packers schedule? Good luck getting to 8-8 next season with that team. By your logic, every other team will also imporve in the NFC as well.

Favre may be the best qb ever, but did I mention he's going to be 38??

For fun, take a look at these stats, and tell me who you would rather have next year?

QB #1
Had QB ratings of 70.0 or below in 9 of his 16 games this season. (70.0 is considered an "average" game)

QB#2
Had QB rating of 70.0 or below in 6 of his 16 games.

QB #1
In games vs playoff opponents, he threw 6 TD's, 11 Int's.

QB#2
In games vs playoff opponents, he threw 6 TD's, 4 Int's.

Who would you rather have? I'll give you a hint, QB#2 is Rex Grossman.

Do I have to pick one? You aren't really doing Rex Grossman any favors posting those numbers. For the record, Brett Favre is better than Rex Grossman right now. Rex Grossman's season QB rating surrounded by a good team - 73.7. Brett Favre's QB rating surrounded by a terrible team - 72.7. So their QB rating for the season are identical. One was consistently playing from behind with a weak RB, no TE, and 1 WR. One was consistently playing with a lead with 2 RB's, a good TE, and 2 WR's, supported by a defense that consistetly scored points. Not to mention 2 Pro Bowl O-Linemen. With all of that in mind, if 70 is considered average, what do these numbers say?

QB #1: Games with QB rating below 40!!!!! - 1
QB #2: Games with QB rating below 40!!!!! - 5

QB #1: Games with QB rating below 15!!!!!!!!!!! - 0
QB #2: Games with QB rating below 15!!!!!!!!!!! - 3

QB #1: Games with QB rating below 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - 0
QB #2: Games with QB rating below 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - 2

Do you really want to try to make that argument?

Favre threw for more yards, better completion percentage and threw fewer Int's. Grossman did have more TD's.

You are right that Favre was the best QB ever. But, the fact of the matter is, even at 38 he is better than Rex Grossman at 26 - and I like Rex Grossman, but you are trying to argue something that the numbers simply don't support.

[MilTown]

Madden is pitching a huge tent in the back of his bus right now!

[NavinRJohnson]

McDish----you're being kind----a 70 QB average is way below average-----in both 2005 & 2006 Favre ranked in the bottom 20% of all starting QBs insofar as QB rating is concerned!

He's coming back to break records----Period!

BTW-----Aaron Rodgers had a better QB rating than Favre in preseason games 101 to 93 !

His QB rating the past 2 seasons has been bad, but it is more than fair to note that his team has also been awful and routinely played from behind, yet he had the same QB rating of Rex Grossman who's team went 13-3.

I agree breaking records is a huge factor. He'll be collecting some rather nice checks too.

As far as Rodgers goes, I'll tell you right now, he stinks. They need to keep looking for the replacement.

[NavinRJohnson]

Madden is pitching a huge tent in the back of his bus right now!

Thank you for ruining my weekend with that visual. I was just telling someone how glad I was that Madden will not be doing the game.

[IAmMarquette]

Packers fans seem to be living off Favre's history.

'85 Bears what? 

8-8/9-7 in the NFC means nothing? Weren't the Giants 8-8? Weren't they in the playoffs? The Packers were less than a game out of the playoffs this season, and *should* have won 3 more games (Saints, Rams, Bills). With another year, they will win those games, which (all else being equal) puts them at 11-5, which this year would have been good enough for second in the conference.

As for letting Favre walk off into the sunset for the long-term benefit of the team, at the risk of tanking another season, I'll consult Chiefs Head Coach Herman Edwards...

Coach, your thoughts?
"You play to win the game.... HELLO!?!? You PLAY to WIN the GAME!"

In other words, WIN and WIN NOW! Any fan who supports his/her teams' tanking of a season to get a higher draft pick (while very few if any teams actually do this - there is such a thing as pride) are not the type of fans with whom I wish to associate.

[Murffieus]

Grossman had a significantly better QB rating than Favre (77 to 72)-----furthermore this was Grossman's rookie playing season-----finally Grossman did better against the better teams than Favre----Favre melted down against just about everyone of the better teams he played against----beefed up his overall nimbers from disaster to semi disaster against teams with losing records!

Grossman's best years are ahead of him----Favre's unforunatly are well behind him!

[spiral97]

Favre melted down against just about everyone of the better teams he played against

except the late season bears.. oh wait.. guess they don't qualify since we're talking about teams BETTER than the packers..  8)

[Dish]

8-8/9-7 in the NFC doesn't mean squat. The Giants finished 8-8 and made the playoffs, you're right. By the way, they also went one and done in the playoffs. You know where that gets them next year? A crummy draft pick, and mediocrity and more questions than answers on how to get to that next step. They're losing Tiki Barber this year to retirement. As a Packers fan, would it make your day for the Packers to go 8-8, make the playoffs, and get beaten in the wild card round, then lose Favre to retirement? Where does that get you?

As Mike Greenberg says repeatedly, the absolute worst thing you can be is average. I agree, you do play to win the game. Playing to win meaningless games in '07 certainly doesn't benefit you in '08 and beyond. But hey, as a Bears fan, I love it. We get a mediocre Packers team in '07, and a brutal team in '08 (or when ever Brett eventually retires).

[MilTown]

I think the main reason Farve is coming back is because he is within striking distance of a bunch of records right now. He will feed the media with some B.S. that he is coming back for the love of the game, or because he thinks the Packers can make the playoffs, but in the end its all about the records and cementing his legacy. At the end of next year, Favre can walk away with all of the major QB records and as possibly the title of greatest QB of all time. Sounds like a pretty good reason to come back to me.

[IAmMarquette]

Disagree. If 8-8 is good enough for the playoffs via wildcard, 8-8 is good enough to win the Super Bowl. If I recall, the Steelers were a wildcard team last season in the AFC, which is clearly the better conference. You're telling me a wildcard in the NFC has no chance of beating the higher seeds in the weaker conference? Get in the playoffs, and get in the playoffs now. Before last season, when the Bears were 5-11 (I'm not sure on this figure... just estimating) were you, as a Bears fan, really enjoying it based on the prospect of a higher draft pick for a player who could be the next Peyton Manning, but just as easily the next Ryan Leaf? Most years, the difference between spots 5-18 of the draft is minimal. So in the current NFC, you could go 8-8, make the playoffs, have a chance to play for a championship, and end up with draft status roughly equal that of a team that went 5-11 and was sitting at home in January. Now, if you're one of those teams "battling" for a top 3-5 pick, then I suppose you could make the argument in favor of losing another game or two to get that top pick (I don't agree with it, but I can understand the argument in this case). When you're in a position like the Packers or Giants, you do everything you can to get into the playoffs NOW, and let the draft seedings work themselves out. I don't think any fan of any team/player would prefer to see that player go out on a 4-12 season to a playoff game. At the beginning of the playoffs, there were 20 teams who would have traded anything to be in the Giants' position, even if it meant one-and-done.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Da Bears just locked up the 2007 NFC North!

GO BEARS!!!

[NavinRJohnson]

Grossman had a significantly better QB rating than Favre (77 to 72)-----furthermore this was Grossman's rookie playing season-----finally Grossman did better against the better teams than Favre...

Did you forget to take your medication my friend?

Favre QB Rating = 72.7
Grossman QB rating = 73.9

That whole rookie playing season is bunk too. The guy is finished his third year in the league - having played regular season games in all three, and a playoff game last year. Again, I like Grossman and you are right that his best years are ahead of him while Favre's are behind him, but you give each of them the same supporting cast next season, and Favre's team is better.

Better competition? The Bears played the easiest schedule in the NFL, and the quality of the teams around each of these guys were light years apart - yet their QB ratings for the year were the same. Hmmm.

[77fan88warrior]

I thought this was a MU message board. Did I mention the Bears are playing tomorrow and the Packers are talking about next season? Go Bears and Warriors!

[spiral97]

Still want Grossman over Favre (the correct spelling by the way)?

I was pulling for the bears but my god, if Grossman was QB'ing for the pack I'd wear a paper bag over my head most games...if his best years are still to come, they are way WAY down the road..

Much like the Ravens' in their heyday, the bears' defense is certainly able to win games even with a baaaaaad quarterback as we saw often this year.  Problem is, the defense only had a 50% attendance mark tonight.

Too bad..

[MUMac]

After watching Grossman and the Bears, a 38 yr. old QB is far superior and gives a better chance to winning than the QB of the Bears.  He should have been MVP for the Colts today.  Without Hester, they would never have been in contention.  His TD and kicking away from him gave the Bears field position that only a weak QB and offense could waste away.

Next year will be an interesting one in the division.   

[spartan3186]

Best QB ever, period.

This is a very bold statement. I would like to see this backed up with something. Yes he is an outstanding QB, but best ever period?? I dont think so. You are saying he is head and shoulders about Marino, Elway, Montana, Starr, Bradshaw, Blanda, Fouts, Luckman, Namath, Staubach, Unitas, Young. While i concede he may be better than some, possibly even most of these players I will not concede that he is the best ever period. A convincing case could be made for any of these players. Hell a convincing case could even be made for Manning at this point after his win over the bears helped legitamize his other accomplishments. So please, explain to me how there is no doubt Favre is the best quarteback, period.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

I am a big Brett Favre fan, but he's not even CLOSE to being the best quarterback ever. He's not even in the team picture. I really, really admire the guy and love to watch him play, but to say something like is completely ridiculous.

And people talk about obnoxious Bears fans??

[HoopDreams]

Favre=Best quarterback ever..period. Never put Peyton in the same ballpark as Favre. Peyton's a bitch and has always had a great supporting cast (in particular receivers). Favre 4ever. Believe..