The Beer Thread

[Sir Lawrence]

Glow and I made the pilgrimage to Chippewa Falls this weekend.  Wenthe to the local ice cream parlor and indulged in some Oktoberfest-flavored ice cream.

Please tell me that the pilgrimage included, well, actually going to the brewery.   

[Chili]

Favorite Oktoberfest brews?


I need a couple new ones to try.

Favorite thus far is Great Lakes Brewing.

I'll 2nd MUFan2 with Staghorn - it's great and my favorite.

I also really like Goose Oktoberfest (homer plug I know) but it's a damb good beer. Firestone's Oaktoberfest is solid too.

Spaten is my favorite of the Munich Fest Biers.

[Benny B]

So if you're ever flying on Aer Lingus, you can get this beer:

Fungi the Dingle Dolphin is a much more renowned in Dingle (and beyond) than Tom Crean.  As should be the case, of course.

[Spotcheck Billy]

What should I take? Tony is a good businessman but he did just want John did. Something Tony railed John for.

I know Tony has put down others for doing similar but still, roughly $500M for just a 50% share vs. $39M for 100% of GI's ownership.

Note: I don't know the size of GI at time of sale vs. Lagunitas but did find data showing that in 2010 GI was rated the 22nd largest US brewer vs. Lagunitas clocking in at #31.

[GoldenEagles1990]

Favorite Oktoberfest brews?


I need a couple new ones to try.

Favorite thus far is Great Lakes Brewing.

Sam Adams is the first Oktoberfest beer I buy every year.  Haven't found many Oktoberfest beers I haven't liked though.

[Chili]

I know Tony has put down others for doing similar but still, roughly $500M for just a 50% share vs. $39M for 100% of GI's ownership.

Note: I don't know the size of GI at time of sale vs. Lagunitas but did find data showing that in 2010 GI was rated the 22nd largest US brewer vs. Lagunitas clocking in at #31.

comparing the two sales is like comparing apples to tbones. i would look more at what Duvel just paid for FW (roughly $220MM). Tony made out like a bandit.

[mu03eng]

Favorite Oktoberfest brews?


I need a couple new ones to try.

Favorite thus far is Great Lakes Brewing.

Need to try Great Lakes Oktoberfest, have a sixer in my fridge waiting for the weekend.

Staghorn is great, and I thought O'So's oktobeerfest to be solid.  I'm not a general fan of Sierra Nevada but their oktoberfest was ok.

I know its not a Marzen but I really liked Sculpin's Pumpkin Down which is a Pumpkin version of their Piper Down Scottish Ale.

[MU B2002]

comparing the two sales is like comparing apples to tbones. i would look more at what Duvel just paid for FW (roughly $220MM). Tony made out like a bandit.

Ah Duvel.....

[Securitizer]

As the weather turns from weissbier weather (if you haven't had Weihenstephaner, do so now) to Oktoberfest weather, I'm going to plug two events:

1. Oktoberfest at Old Heidelberg Park in Glendale for the next three weekends.  Fun times.  I bust out the lederhosen and the atrophied German-major language skills.

2. If you are in the craft beer industry (or know someone who is), I'm speaking at a seminar/reception on Thursday 9/17 hosted by my law firm and an accounting firm.  We'll be covering regulatory issues (in the news a lot recently here in Milwaukee), alternative financing options, accounting and more.  And drinking good WI beer.  PM me for more details and I'll send you a link.

[jsglow]

I guess I'll only drink Lakefront going forward.....

http://www.jsonline.com/business/budweiser-parent-company-confirms-interest-in-acquiring-sabmiller-b99577947z1-327861331.html

[mu03eng]

I guess I'll only drink Lakefront going forward.....

http://www.jsonline.com/business/budweiser-parent-company-confirms-interest-in-acquiring-sabmiller-b99577947z1-327861331.html

Miller's gonna be spun off if this happens....MolsonCoors will acquire them and consolidate operations.  The question is, what craft brands go with Miller and what stay with InBev and what get jettisoned.

I hate InBev brands, only ones I allow myself to drink are the Germans (Lowenbrau, Spaten, and Franziskaner)

[drewm88]

Miller's gonna be spun off if this happens....MolsonCoors will acquire them and consolidate operations.  The question is, what craft brands go with Miller and what stay with InBev and what get jettisoned.

I hate InBev brands, only ones I allow myself to drink are the Germans (Lowenbrau, Spaten, and Franziskaner)

Is Molson Coors not under the SABMiller umbrella?

And are you saying that this is only for the smaller brands, and that AB InBev doesn't want Miller or Coors?

[JWags85]

Is Molson Coors not under the SABMiller umbrella?

And are you saying that this is only for the smaller brands, and that AB InBev doesn't want Miller or Coors?

Molson Coors is a separate company.  MillerCoors is a joint venture between SABMiller and MolsonCoors for just the US market.

InBev's interest in SABMiller is largely for their global brands, as the expansion of the beer market is occurring in places like Asia.

This would be bad news for Milwaukee if it happens.  InBev would likely downsize anything Milwaukee based even more.  If Miller was indeed absorbed into MolsonCoors, those jobs would likely be moved out to Denver.  I find it hard to see the JV operations in Chicago remaining if this indeed comes to fruition.

[mu03eng]

Is Molson Coors not under the SABMiller umbrella?

And are you saying that this is only for the smaller brands, and that AB InBev doesn't want Miller or Coors?

InBev can't have Coors and/or Miller because of US anti-trust considerations.

Molson Coors and SABMiller have a joint operation agreement, they have stakes in each other's company but neither owns the other. 

MolsonCoors stands on it's own so can't be part of the SABMiller acquisition by InBev.  If InBev aquires SABMiller, they would have to spin off Miller otherwise they would own greater than 60% of US domestic sales.  When Miller is spun off it will be far too small to stand on it's own and will get gobbled up by Molson Coors.

[mu03eng]

Molson Coors is a separate company.  MillerCoors is a joint venture between SABMiller and MolsonCoors for just the US market.

InBev's interest in SABMiller is largely for their global brands, as the expansion of the beer market is occurring in places like Asia.

This would be bad news for Milwaukee if it happens.  InBev would likely downsize anything Milwaukee based even more.  If Miller was indeed absorbed into MolsonCoors, those jobs would likely be moved out to Denver.  I find it hard to see the JV operations in Chicago remaining if this indeed comes to fruition.

Yep, if InBev acquires SABMiller.....Milwaukee and Chicago will each lose an HQ operation as it will all go to Golden.  Long term, I think MolsonCoors keeps some operations in Milwaukee as part of the brand effort but you will likely see a significant decrease in corporate donations as well as involvement in the Milwaukee community.

That's the doomsday scenario, I could be wrong, I thought the same thing when M&I was purchased by BMO, but it hasn't seemed to have been an appreciable drop off to date.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Hmmm, Thursday's choices, DFH tap takeover at Rays or GI Bourbon County tap takeover at Romans

[rocky_warrior]

Hmmm, Thursday's choices, DFH tap takeover at Rays or GI Bourbon County tap takeover at Romans

Myabe it's a regional bias, but the GI BC takeover would be the no-brainer for me.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Myabe it's a regional bias, but the GI BC takeover would be the no-brainer for me.

hard to pass up

[Chili]

Miller's gonna be spun off if this happens....MolsonCoors will acquire them and consolidate operations.  The question is, what craft brands go with Miller and what stay with InBev and what get jettisoned.

I hate InBev brands, only ones I allow myself to drink are the Germans (Lowenbrau, Spaten, and Franziskaner)

You're missing a lot of great beer then - just saying. More BCBS, Apocalypse IPA, Grand Prestige, Mitten for the rest of us.

[Chili]

Myabe it's a regional bias, but the GI BC takeover would be the no-brainer for me.

Smart man there. Also, can big Mike a bit too.

[Chili]

Molson Coors is a separate company.  MillerCoors is a joint venture between SABMiller and MolsonCoors for just the US market.

InBev's interest in SABMiller is largely for their global brands, as the expansion of the beer market is occurring in places like Asia.

This would be bad news for Milwaukee if it happens.  InBev would likely downsize anything Milwaukee based even more.  If Miller was indeed absorbed into MolsonCoors, those jobs would likely be moved out to Denver.  I find it hard to see the JV operations in Chicago remaining if this indeed comes to fruition.

Asia is part of it but the markets most wanted the presence in Africa & Australia. Columbia is another one.

[drewm88]

Thanks to JWags and 03 for the info

[tower912]

http://www.mlive.com/beer/2015/09/a_guide_to_grand_rapids_brewer.html#0

So, if this inspires anyone to road trip..... microbrewery tour on top of Artprize or something like that,  PM me.   

http://www.artprize.org/

[Benny B]

Yep, if InBev acquires SABMiller.....Milwaukee and Chicago will each lose an HQ operation as it will all go to Golden.  Long term, I think MolsonCoors keeps some operations in Milwaukee as part of the brand effort but you will likely see a significant decrease in corporate donations as well as involvement in the Milwaukee community.

That's the doomsday scenario, I could be wrong, I thought the same thing when M&I was purchased by BMO, but it hasn't seemed to have been an appreciable drop off to date.

I wouldn't be surprised if Miller was spun-off to PE and eventually IPO'd.  Miller can stand on its own two feet; the beer business is all about distribution, not necessarily size/sales/production.  Though since distribution was part of the consolidation of operations agreement with MolsonCoors, I'm not sure that would be as clean of a divorce as one could hope (who knows, maybe the agreement has some sort of dissolution plan).

However, it could be a huge marketing coup to stake claim to being the largest US brewer... and Milwaukee is still synonymous with beer, so there would be a huge hit to the brand to move out of Wisconsin.  As people move towards craft beer and many imports are falling out of favor, there could be a huge opportunity for someone to come in and fill the void of a "great American brewer."

[mu03eng]

I wouldn't be surprised if Miller was spun-off to PE and eventually IPO'd.  Miller can stand on its own two feet; the beer business is all about distribution, not necessarily size/sales/production.  Though since distribution was part of the consolidation of operations agreement with MolsonCoors, I'm not sure that would be as clean of a divorce as one could hope (who knows, maybe the agreement has some sort of dissolution plan).

However, it could be a huge marketing coup to stake claim to being the largest US brewer... and Milwaukee is still synonymous with beer, so there would be a huge hit to the brand to move out of Wisconsin.  As people move towards craft beer and many imports are falling out of favor, there could be a huge opportunity for someone to come in and fill the void of a "great American brewer."

Actually the production efficiency is much more critical than you may realize.  My company does a lot of work with Miller in Milwaukee and getting significant production volumes to justify the existence of plants is critical plus the current partnership allows for regional production to easy distribution costs as well (Coors for east coast sales is brewed in Milwaukee and Miller for west coast sales is brewed in Golden, etc)

And while I agree with your marketing idea being a powerful one, I don't think it requires a stand alone company to pull it off.  First, the general public (anyone not posting in a 64 page thread dedicated to beer on a college basketball internet message forum) isn't sophisticated enough to know if a company really is an American brewery or not.  Hell, the vast majority of general beer drinkers I know that would buy Miller have no idea that Third Shift is a Miller beer or that Leine's is owned by Miller, etc.  Not sure that Miller standing by itself would be a market driver.

Now where it may work from a business perspective is the move towards contract brewing.  Most micro's that are mass produced go through a contract brewer.  A ton of Wisconsin micro brews go through Point or Minhas brewing.  Some national Wisconsin brands are contact brewed in Ashville, NC for east coast distribution, etc.  So Miller could become an American brewer but likely wouldn't have manufacturing in Milwaukee.

Bottom line, I don't see Miller(as Miller) production in Milwaukee surviving a successful InBev acquisition of SAB