Chicos Bail Bonds Sighted

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Just like Sammy Sosa changed his swing and plate approach prior to the 1998 season?

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/09/01/sports/baseball-homers-come-with-patience-neck-neck-with-mcgwire-sosa-knocking-them.html

Again, none of us know how Arrieta became elite so late in his career. I think we can all agree it's highly unusual. If you think the question of PEDs is somehow automatically invalid or illegitimate, you're every bit the naive homer as the Cubs fans who defended Sosa to the very end.

Did you actually even read the articles that were posted or did you just immediately decide look one up on Sosa?  I could share some additional articles regarding Arrieta but I assume it would be pointless. 

First of all, this is not "so late" in Arrieta's career.  He is square in his prime right now at 29 years old.  He was an excellent pitcher last year and began showing some progress with the Cubs back in 2013 after he was called up after the trade.  This is not the case of a pitcher who had never seen any success who suddenly begins to dominate. 

Arrieta always had a world of potential and was a top prospect for the Orioles.  The problem was he could never harness it.  The pitching infrastructure and instruction with the Orioles didn't mesh with Arrieta.  They had a very cookie cutter approach that was used for all of their young prospects (Arrieta, Tillman, Matusz, etc.). 

This IS all about repeating his mechanics and command of his pitches.  He has always thrown hard and had very good stuff - he was just never able to consistently harness it.  This is not the case of a guy who suddenly gained 3 -5 mph on his fastball in his early to mid-30s from out of nowhere. 

Not everyone's career progression is the same.  Arrieta was able to find success in his late 20s.  And because of that he should be suspected of juicing?  I'll be the first to eat crow if it is ever proven true but for now it's nothing more than ridiculous speculation.  That's not naivete whatsoever.  It's a guy with elite talent who works hard finally figuring it out.   

[wadesworld]

Did you actually even read the articles that were posted or did you just immediately decide look one up on Sosa?  I could share some additional articles regarding Arrieta but I assume it would be pointless. 

First of all, this is not "so late" in Arrieta's career.  He is square in his prime right now at 29 years old.  He was an excellent pitcher last year and began showing some progress with the Cubs back in 2013 after he was called up after the trade.  This is not the case of a pitcher who had never seen any success who suddenly begins to dominate. 

Arrieta always had a world of potential and was a top prospect for the Orioles.  The problem was he could never harness it.  The pitching infrastructure and instruction with the Orioles didn't mesh with Arrieta.  They had a very cookie cutter approach that was used for all of their young prospects (Arrieta, Tillman, Matusz, etc.). 

This IS all about repeating his mechanics and command of his pitches.  He has always thrown hard and had very good stuff - he was just never able to consistently harness it.  This is not the case of a guy who suddenly gained 3 -5 mph on his fastball in his early to mid-30s from out of nowhere. 

Not everyone's career progression is the same.  Arrieta was able to find success in his late 20s.  And because of that he should be suspected of juicing?  I'll be the first to eat crow if it is ever proven true but for now it's nothing more than ridiculous speculation.  That's not naivete whatsoever.  It's a guy with elite talent who works hard finally figuring it out.

I actually think Arrieta is a far less likely candidate than a lot of players to have used PEDs.  Having said that, this is exactly the case of a pitcher who never had any success who suddenly begins to dominate.

He went from having ERAs in the 4.66-6.20 ERA with a WHIP between 1.33-1.77 and WAR between -1.0 to 0.6 from ages 24-27 and then at age 28 went to 2.53 ERA, 0.99 WHIP, and WAR of 5.3.  That's essentially the very definition of a pitcher who never had any success to suddenly dominating.

He has had a relatively consistent average fastball speed, but his slider speed did go from 85 MPH in his rookie year to 90 MPH the past 2 years.

[jesmu84]

I don't honestly know the answer, but other than pointing to pitching stats, would there be any other indicators that a pitcher might be on PEDs? The obvious, of course, is average pitch speed. Any others?

[Benny B]

I don't honestly know the answer, but other than pointing to pitching stats, would there be any other indicators that a pitcher might be on PEDs? The obvious, of course, is average pitch speed. Any others?

1. How quickly they're able to recover from a DL stint.

2. How quickly they are willing to sign a long-term contract.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

I actually think Arrieta is a far less likely candidate than a lot of players to have used PEDs.  Having said that, this is exactly the case of a pitcher who never had any success who suddenly begins to dominate.

He went from having ERAs in the 4.66-6.20 ERA with a WHIP between 1.33-1.77 and WAR between -1.0 to 0.6 from ages 24-27 and then at age 28 went to 2.53 ERA, 0.99 WHIP, and WAR of 5.3.  That's essentially the very definition of a pitcher who never had any success to suddenly dominating.

He has had a relatively consistent average fastball speed, but his slider speed did go from 85 MPH in his rookie year to 90 MPH the past 2 years.

He also had a 3.66 ERA and a 1.12 WHIP with the Cubs in 9 starts after the trade in 2013.  There's been a clear progression since his acquisition and it's too bad some thoughts jump to PEDs instead of a guy putting it together.  As for his slider speed, I won't pretend to know about that but the change in velocity could be mechanics, grip, release point, added strength, etc.  As a Cubs fan I am biased but I've watched him pitch for 2 and a half years now and have listened to him speak many times and I just don't see it.  If Kyle Hendricks comes back throwin 94 next year then we can talk.