MUScoop

MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Heisenberg v2.0 on January 21, 2020, 06:47:28 PM

Title: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on January 21, 2020, 06:47:28 PM
If you have not noticed, I scrapped a bunch of data and I have been making charts.

This is from Kenpom data.  He runs a daily rating for all teams.  The chart below is the game-by-game rating for MU last year (blue) and this year (orange).  Today (St. Johns) is game 19.

Last year's team was popular with the media, as the polls had it as high as #10.

But, if you believe Kenpom is an objective standard, there is very little difference in the ratings between last year's team and this year's team.

So, where would the orange line be if the Hauser's had stayed?  Would it be much lower (like 10 or below)?  Or, would it be essentially where it is now, which is the same place as last year?  Would it be worse?

(https://snipboard.io/wEzJj9.jpg)
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: BLM on January 21, 2020, 06:48:23 PM
Who?
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: WhiteTrash on January 21, 2020, 07:07:57 PM
Do I think MU would be better with the Hausers? Absolutely.

I base my opinion on Wojo, Izzo and Bennett's ability to evaluate talent. I think they are really good.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: warriorjoe on January 21, 2020, 07:10:50 PM
Sam and Joey have a lot of time to think about their decision while sitting on the bench this season.

Go Warriors!
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: GooooMarquette on January 24, 2020, 12:02:39 PM
Who?


KenPom. He says we're as good this year as we were last year, before some dudes transferred.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: 79Warrior on January 24, 2020, 12:09:43 PM
Do I think MU would be better with the Hausers? Absolutely.

I base my opinion on Wojo, Izzo and Bennett's ability to evaluate talent. I think they are really good.

Yep. To think otherwise is silly.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: tower912 on January 24, 2020, 12:59:40 PM
If the Hausers had stayed, it is likely the rest of the roster would be different.   So it is difficult to project how good MU would be with them.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: GooooMarquette on January 24, 2020, 01:51:00 PM
If the Hausers had stayed, it is likely the rest of the roster would be different.   So it is difficult to project how good MU would be with them.


Yeah...like the Hausers staying appeared to be contingent on Markus leaving, so we'd be missing a pretty important scorer.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: guzica on January 24, 2020, 01:55:31 PM

Yeah...like the Hausers staying appeared to be contingent on Markus leaving, so we'd be missing a pretty important scorer, and a couple of other players.....
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FIFY
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Elonsmusk on January 24, 2020, 02:04:04 PM
[/b][/u][/color]

FIFY

Who were the players that were going to leave if the Hauser's stayed? 
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: BM1090 on January 24, 2020, 02:49:38 PM
Who were the players that were going to leave if the Hauser's stayed?

Not verified but rumor was a Sacar grad transfer and possibly Brendan in addition to Markus.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: willie warrior on January 24, 2020, 03:01:22 PM
Not verified but rumor was a Sacar grad transfer and possibly Brendan in addition to Markus.
This all BS speculation. No one knows.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: MU1980 on January 24, 2020, 03:13:07 PM
This all BS speculation. No one knows.
You are correct that no one knows, but if you think everyone else was going to stay had the Hausers not left, I am not sure what to tell you.  Would you want to be teammates with Joey Hauser? His attitude would have most likely been even worse as a sophomore. The team would have had a much different look than this years team had they stayed and others left and most likely been much less athletic and worse defensively.  So when people say that we would have been better this year if the Hausers had stayed, that is just a guess, since like you said, no one know what would have happened with other players. 
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: tower912 on January 24, 2020, 03:19:52 PM
This all BS speculation. No one knows.
It's bs speculation to say there would have been no roster shake up if they had stayed.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: BM1090 on January 24, 2020, 03:31:09 PM
This all BS speculation. No one knows.

I did say "rumor"
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Elonsmusk on January 24, 2020, 03:32:30 PM
It's bs speculation to say there would have been no roster shake up if they had stayed.

True. Likely a function of players not thinking they could beat out Sam and Joey for starting spots/max minutes.

Think the whole Joey had a bad attitude was way overblown. Don’t recall reading much of that during the season - but only after transfer announced. Truthfully, if I were a skilled offensive player, I’d find it frustrating to play with Markus. Not meant to slam Markus, btw.

All this aside seems to have worked out best for everyone involved and the team has done great without them.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: lawdog77 on January 24, 2020, 03:36:48 PM
True. Likely a function of players not thinking they could beat out Sam and Joey for starting spots/max minutes.

Think the whole Joey had a bad attitude was way overblown. Don’t recall reading much of that during the season - but only after transfer announced. Truthfully, if I were a skilled offensive player, I’d find it frustrating to play with Markus. Not meant to slam Markus, btw.

All this aside seems to have worked out best for everyone involved and the team has done great without them.
if I were a skilled offensive player, I would love to play with Markus. His man cannot play help defense. Plenty of opportunities.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 24, 2020, 03:38:26 PM
True. Likely a function of players not thinking they could beat out Sam and Joey for starting spots/max minutes.

Think the whole Joey had a bad attitude was way overblown. Don’t recall reading much of that during the season - but only after transfer announced. Truthfully, if I were a skilled offensive player, I’d find it frustrating to play with Markus. Not meant to slam Markus, btw.

All this aside seems to have worked out best for everyone involved and the team has done great without them.


There was plenty of bad Joey body language toward the end of last season.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: MU1980 on January 24, 2020, 03:44:08 PM
True. Likely a function of players not thinking they could beat out Sam and Joey for starting spots/max minutes.

Think the whole Joey had a bad attitude was way overblown. Don’t recall reading much of that during the season - but only after transfer announced. Truthfully, if I were a skilled offensive player, I’d find it frustrating to play with Markus. Not meant to slam Markus, btw.

All this aside seems to have worked out best for everyone involved and the team has done great without them.

Did you not watch the games last year, especially starting halfway through the season?  It was obvious even from a casual fan that he did not have a great attitude.  The interesting thing to me is that Sam was always one of my favorite players and Joey quickly turned into one of my least favorite players.  I think Sam has a brighter future ahead of him than Joey does just because of their different personalities and attitudes.  It will be very interesting to me to see how they both do next year, but I would expect Sam to have more success. 
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: bilsu on January 24, 2020, 03:48:40 PM
I keep reflecting back to what I thought when the team got in a fight with Seton Hall in the Big East tournament. The Hausers just stood by as the rest of the team got involved in the melee. At that time I thought they were smart and showed more discipline than our other players. Now I believe they just did not care to defend their teammates.

Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Frenns Liquor Depot on January 24, 2020, 03:52:16 PM

There was plenty of bad Joey body language toward the end of last season.

Yes but how did he do with his slaps of five?
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Ellenson Family Reunion on January 24, 2020, 03:53:15 PM
I keep reflecting back to what I thought when the team got in a fight with Seton Hall in the Big East tournament. The Hausers just stood by as the rest of the team got involved in the melee. At that time I thought they were smart and showed more discipline than our other players. Now I believe they just did not care to defend their teammates.

Soft serve vanilla
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 24, 2020, 03:58:15 PM
To be fair, I interpreted his bad body language at the time as more frustration at himself.  But in retrospect, it was obvious that he wasn't happy at MU. 
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: zcg2013 on January 24, 2020, 04:13:49 PM
To be fair, I interpreted his bad body language at the time as more frustration at himself.  But in retrospect, it was obvious that he wasn't happy at MU.

I thought it was about his play but I remember one game (I believe vs. DePaul) Joey had a turnover right before the break and Markus got in his face just a bit. Joey's reaction was just horrible. When you got one of the leaders on your team talking to you about a mistake, you can't have that attitude. I am fairly certain this was mentioned in other threads but if Joey has that attitude, imagine how he reacts if Izzo gets in his grill like he did Aaron Henry last year.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: lawdog77 on January 24, 2020, 04:17:54 PM
I keep reflecting back to what I thought when the team got in a fight with Seton Hall in the Big East tournament. The Hausers just stood by as the rest of the team got involved in the melee. At that time I thought they were smart and showed more discipline than our other players. Now I believe they just did not care to defend their teammates.
Is there a video of this? The only one I can find when Theo was ejected, as well as Anim, is that Joey was on the bench and Sam was in the fray holding people back.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: GooooMarquette on January 24, 2020, 04:28:08 PM
This all BS speculation. No one knows.


Even if Sacar and Brendan were just speculation, it doesn't get past the fact that Markus would have had to leave for Sam and Joey to stay.

And with Markus, we have one of the most unstoppable offensive players the game has ever seen. Every team game-plans for Markus as the 1, 2 and 3 options, hedges on every screen and drapes him with two or three defenders. And he still keeps dropping 30 points per game. I will take the unique joy of one more season with Markus over one with Sam and one or two with soft-serve vanilla any day.

So yeah, maybe Sacar leaves or maybe he doesn't. Maybe Brendan leaves or maybe he doesn't. But if we still had Sam and Joey, it would mean we do NOT still have Markus, and that would be very unfortunate.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on January 24, 2020, 06:28:12 PM
Update chart through game 20 (Butler).  The ranking is going into the game
(see the first post in this thread for more color on this chart)

(https://snipboard.io/7SeQ8w.jpg)
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on January 24, 2020, 06:35:17 PM
Game-by-game KenPom rankings since he starting daily rankings in 2011.

(https://snipboard.io/Gys7gV.jpg)
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: #UnleashDiener on January 24, 2020, 07:02:57 PM
You are correct that no one knows, but if you think everyone else was going to stay had the Hausers not left, I am not sure what to tell you.  Would you want to be teammates with Joey Hauser? His attitude would have most likely been even worse as a sophomore. The team would have had a much different look than this years team had they stayed and others left and most likely been much less athletic and worse defensively.  So when people say that we would have been better this year if the Hausers had stayed, that is just a guess, since like you said, no one know what would have happened with other players.

Oh look, more hearsay that has never been said anywhere but scoop. And its taken as the truth.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: tower912 on January 24, 2020, 07:05:44 PM
So your hearsay says that if the Hausers had stayed no one else would have left?
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: rocket surgeon on January 24, 2020, 07:12:00 PM
I thought it was about his play but I remember one game (I believe vs. DePaul) Joey had a turnover right before the break and Markus got in his face just a bit. Joey's reaction was just horrible. When you got one of the leaders on your team talking to you about a mistake, you can't have that attitude. I am fairly certain this was mentioned in other threads but if Joey has that attitude, imagine how he reacts if Izzo gets in his grill like he did Aaron Henry last year.

Unfortunately or not, I’d rather have wojo in my grill than Izzo.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: jsglow on January 24, 2020, 07:13:06 PM
I thought it was about his play but I remember one game (I believe vs. DePaul) Joey had a turnover right before the break and Markus got in his face just a bit. Joey's reaction was just horrible. When you got one of the leaders on your team talking to you about a mistake, you can't have that attitude. I am fairly certain this was mentioned in other threads but if Joey has that attitude, imagine how he reacts if Izzo gets in his grill like he did Aaron Henry last year.

Happened RIGHT in front of us as chick and I were courtside.  VSS couldn't take a little motivation from his freakin' Captain.  In contrast that night was Jamal.  He had been absolutely mired for weeks.  Had a good game and feed off the motivation of the upperclassmen and the MU fans in the stands.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: MU82 on January 24, 2020, 07:21:01 PM
Unfortunately, the chart doesn't reflect the Hausers staying but Markus, Bailey, Sacar and others going. And Dawson not signing.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: MU1980 on January 24, 2020, 08:04:21 PM
Oh look, more hearsay that has never been said anywhere but scoop. And its taken as the truth.

Not once did I say anything about heresay and in fact started my post by saying no one knows for sure. I came to the conclusion all by myself that it was very unlikely everyone stays if the Hausers had not left. This is not based on heresay, but from watching the team and using common sense and logic. It was a very, very good thing for Marquette that Joey left and unfortunate that Sam did. But this is a better team this year than it would have been had they stayed and certainly we are much better off going forward without Joey here, since our recruiting class would have had a very different look next year. Most of us can see this and then there are a few that think we would be better off if they stayed, but with no logical arguments for thinking that.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: ZiggysFryBoy on January 24, 2020, 08:11:26 PM
Unfortunately or not, I’d rather have wojo in my grill than Izzo.

Izzo would be yelling at your belly button.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: willie warrior on January 24, 2020, 08:19:22 PM
You are correct that no one knows, but if you think everyone else was going to stay had the Hausers not left, I am not sure what to tell you.  Would you want to be teammates with Joey Hauser? His attitude would have most likely been even worse as a sophomore. The team would have had a much different look than this years team had they stayed and others left and most likely been much less athletic and worse defensively.  So when people say that we would have been better this year if the Hausers had stayed, that is just a guess, since like you said, no one know what would have happened with other players.
You know what they say about opinions.
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 24, 2020, 08:24:25 PM
You know what they say about opinions.


Your’s is usually really odd?
Title: Re: The Impact of The Hauser's Departure In One Chart
Post by: MU1980 on January 24, 2020, 09:06:16 PM
You know what they say about opinions.
[/quote

Many of us enjoy seeing the opinions of their fellow scoopers, but in my opinion very few people have any desire to hear your opinions. I rarely post so my opinion is probably irrelevant.
Title: Re: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on February 19, 2020, 04:14:16 PM
Through the Creighton loss

(https://snipboard.io/1CNdwL.jpg)
Title: Re: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on February 22, 2020, 11:54:04 PM
MU went into today's game rated 26 and left rated 30
Georgetown will be game 27.

(https://snipboard.io/TwJv5L.jpg)
Title: Re: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: asdfasdf on February 23, 2020, 09:19:51 AM
MU went into today's game rated 26 and left rated 30
Georgetown will be game 27.

(https://snipboard.io/TwJv5L.jpg)

What is the y axis on these charts? Ken pom ranking?
Title: Re: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: Heisenberg v2.0 on February 23, 2020, 06:43:12 PM
yes
Title: Re: Charting This Year Versus Last Year
Post by: asdfasdf on February 23, 2020, 11:06:56 PM
yes

Was Marquette really ranked #12 in kenpom after the 3rd game of the season? I don't remember us being that highly regarded at the beginning of the season.