https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/big-east-assistants-form-coaches-for-action-push-for-black-lives-matter-patches-on-uniforms/amp/
21 assistant coaches from the Big East have formed a group called "Coaches for Action".
A lot of good ideas here and great to see Coach Killings represent Marquette in such a positive way. Has full support of the conference
Love the idea behind the 3.0 scholarship fund. Sadly the vast majority of MPS, CPS and other BE city schools that aren't the random elite ones will graduate students with a 3.0 and they'll still be extremely unprepared for quality universities that make up the Big East.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on June 22, 2020, 03:10:36 PM
Love the idea behind the 3.0 scholarship fund. Sadly the vast majority of MPS, CPS and other BE city schools that aren't the random elite ones will graduate students with a 3.0 and they'll still be extremely unprepared for quality universities that make up the Big East.
At least Marquette has a program (EOP) that they could ramp up to help these students if necessary. I am not sure if any of the other BEast schools have a similar program.
Quote from: warriorchick on June 22, 2020, 03:16:35 PM
At least Marquette has a program (EOP) that they could ramp up to help these students if necessary. I am not sure if any of the other BEast schools have a similar program.
A few do, but not most. MU is also looking to expand their tutorial program (in planning for the last two years) to help get disadvantaged students up to speed on STEM courses
This is pretty awesome. Way to go Coach Killings!
Way to go, Coach! A very positive way to bring people together for a great cause.
A few fans might not like the patches and other BLM references, but that's life.
Quote from: mu03eng on June 22, 2020, 04:24:46 PM
A few do, but not most. MU is also looking to expand their tutorial program (in planning for the last two years) to help get disadvantaged students up to speed on STEM courses
That's good to hear. If a person has a good academic work ethic I believe they just need the resources to succeed.
This No-Jo has been very, very impressed with the way Wojo, his staff and players have reacted to the civil rights movement following George Floyd's murder. They are walking the walk. It's really impressive to see. My attitude on Wojo has turned a bit. I have seen some depth to him that I wasn't expecting. Killings spearheading this task force and the Big East's response has also been fantastic to see.
I appreciate the sentiment. However, it is truly misguided. I wish people would stop trying to help people of color by lowering the standard by which we have to compete. We are good enough to make it on our own.
I am older, so I had to earn everything the hard way. I had to get better grades ,and work harder , to overcome what in those days the pundits called prejudice or stereotyping. It was not easy but at the end of the day I was much better off. I had to suffer through tremendous indignities along the way. Today they call that subtle condescending attitude micro aggression's. I use to hate the way the country club whites always looked down at me at first blush, but at the end of the day when I made them money that changed their outlook. My experience is that hard work driven success cures most ills.
I am actually saddened to see what is happening to our country right now. We were making great strides economically and those at the bottom rung of the ladder were finally getting their day in the sun. When unemployment was at record low levels it was opening all kinds of doors that affirmative action could never do. Once this pandemic is over, I hope we can get right back on that track.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PM
I appreciate the sentiment. However, it is truly misguided. I wish people would stop trying to help people of color by lowering the standard by which we have to compete. We are good enough to make it on our own.
I am older, so I had to earn everything the hard way. I had to get better grades ,and work harder , to overcome what in those days the pundits called prejudice or stereotyping. It was not easy but at the end of the day I was much better off. I had to suffer through tremendous indignities along the way. Today they call that subtle condescending attitude micro aggression's. I use to hate the way the country club whites always looked down at me at first blush, but at the end of the day when I made them money that changed their outlook. My experience is that hard work driven success cures most ills.
I am actually saddened to see what is happening to our country right now. We were making great strides economically and those at the bottom rung of the ladder were finally getting their day in the sun. When unemployment was at record low levels it was opening all kinds of doors that affirmative action could never do. Once this pandemic is over, I hope we can get right back on that track.
With you all the way here HC. Hopefully we can get to those pre-Covid days. If not, hopefully we can all work together for our common good. Not going to be easy, but we all have to work o it whatever race or creed or whatever.
Strong statement by HC. While I respect Coach Killings efforts and am confident they are made with the best intentions, I think care should be exercised by his group and the conference. Allingning themselves with BLM is politicizing the team and that will alienate some of the fan base. I don't believe that too many people understand the tenets of BLM; they are very political and go way beyond racial equalities, which are a justified cause.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PM
I appreciate the sentiment. However, it is truly misguided. I wish people would stop trying to help people of color by lowering the standard by which we have to compete. We are good enough to make it on our own.
I am older, so I had to earn everything the hard way. I had to get better grades ,and work harder , to overcome what in those days the pundits called prejudice or stereotyping. It was not easy but at the end of the day I was much better off. I had to suffer through tremendous indignities along the way. Today they call that subtle condescending attitude micro aggression's. I use to hate the way the country club whites always looked down at me at first blush, but at the end of the day when I made them money that changed their outlook. My experience is that hard work driven success cures most ills.
I am actually saddened to see what is happening to our country right now. We were making great strides economically and those at the bottom rung of the ladder were finally getting their day in the sun. When unemployment was at record low levels it was opening all kinds of doors that affirmative action could never do. Once this pandemic is over, I hope we can get right back on that track.
Most impressive post I have seen on this forum in A LONG TIME. Thank you, Herman!
Quote from: mufvr on June 22, 2020, 09:33:06 PM
I don't believe that too many people understand the tenets of BLM; they are very political and go way beyond racial equalities, which are a justified cause.
This.
I support the sentiment "Black Lives Matter"
I support the phrase "Black Lives Matter"
But I'm suspicious of organizations or political movements in general, and BLM (the organization/movement), especially given some of its history, is no exception. If we're honoring or even supporting a political movement on our basketball uniforms I think it's a mistake. The fact that the idea comes from a well meaning desire to make a statement doesn't change that IMO.
One of the reasons I choose Marquette is because making political statements in the name of social justice is a huge part of its history. To criticize this is to criticize Jesuit teachings and what it means to be an alum of Marquette. I applaud what Coach Killings is doing here as well as the statements and actions from the rest of the coaches and players. My personal favorite:
https://twitter.com/Theojohn123/status/1268335482305425413
We are about change. If you can't support us here. I ask you Please don't support us on the court. #mubb #BlackLivesMatter
A few of the facts about BLM and why affliiating the team with this organization should matter:
Their founders describe themselves as "trained marxists". Four of their primary objectives: disrupting the western "nuclear traditional family structure", immediately removing Trump from office, reparations due to slavery and retention of all non-American convicted criminals in the U.S. and bringing those that were deported back to the U.S. All of this and other information is publicized on their website and other posts.
Great work by DK.
The rest ... ::)
Quote from: mufvr on June 22, 2020, 10:32:04 PM
A few of the facts about BLM and why affliiating the team with this organization should matter:
Their founders describe themselves as "trained marxists". Four of their primary objectives: disrupting the western "nuclear traditional family structure", immediately removing Trump from office, reparations due to slavery and retention of all non-American convicted criminals in the U.S. and bringing those that were deported back to the U.S. All of this and other information is publicized on their website and other posts.
I hope you understand that there is a difference between the organization Black Lives Matter and the Black Lives Matter movement and that Marquette is supporting the latter, not the former.
There's a simple solution for those who don't like it. Find another program to be a fan of. Our players and coaches, most of whom are black, are speaking up. I'll trust that the players and coaches who entertain me and have to deal with things in their day to day life that I don't because of their skin pigmentation are supporting the cause for a reason.
Good for Coach Killings. Good for MU. Instead of being outraged that our coaches or players are supporting an extremist group, maybe listen and you'll understand what they're really supporting. I've seen plenty of white people with BLM signs, shirts, and chanting BLM. Maybe they're all trying to disrupt the western nuclear family tradition. People want peaceful protests. Then when they get peaceful protests they claim they're doing it wrong.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 22, 2020, 10:51:59 PM
I hope you understand that there is a difference between the organization Black Lives Matter and the Black Lives Matter movement and that Marquette is supporting the latter, not the former.
I'm going to show my ignorance on this subject, TAMU. My experience has always been that an organization and a movement of the same name are connected and that the movement is in sync with the organizations goals and purposes. I had no idea that the BLM organization had nothing to do with and was totally separate from the BLM movement. And that Marquette had made it clear it was in no way, shape or form in support of the organization but only in support of the movement. Please link Marquette's statement that clarifies this. Thanks in advance.
I think and hope that all of us support the notion that we should all be treated equal, regardless of our skin color. But to stamp the label on our uniforms of an organization whose members march down the street chanting "pigs in a blanket, fry them like bacon" is highly offensive. I seriously doubt that many people understand who the founders of BLM are and what their motives are. Turn on TV and watch the carniage that's occurring and you willl also notice the BLM is not ashamed to be in the forefront of that. Racial equality is a just and noble cause. Unfortunately, BLM stands for a lot more than that.
Quote from: mufvr on June 22, 2020, 10:32:04 PM
A few of the facts about BLM and why affliiating the team with this organization should matter:
Their founders describe themselves as "trained marxists". Four of their primary objectives: disrupting the western "nuclear traditional family structure", immediately removing Trump from office, reparations due to slavery and retention of all non-American convicted criminals in the U.S. and bringing those that were deported back to the U.S. All of this and other information is publicized on their website and other posts.
I am looking right at the BLM website and I don't see any of the "scary black people" stuff you are trying to portray.
For example, what you shortened to
disrupting the western "nuclear traditional family structure," actually is this:
We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and "villages" that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.In other words, they reject being looked down upon just because they might not fit YOUR definition of what a family has to be, and they aim to support everybody in their community. If you don't see the difference between what you were suggesting and what they actually say, that's on
you.
Here is the entirety of their "marxist" platform:
The Black Lives Matter Global Network is as powerful as it is because of our membership, our partners, our supporters, our staff, and you. Our continued commitment to liberation for all Black people means we are continuing the work of our ancestors and fighting for our collective freedom because it is our duty.
Every day, we recommit to healing ourselves and each other, and to co-creating alongside comrades, allies, and family a culture where each person feels seen, heard, and supported.
We acknowledge, respect, and celebrate differences and commonalities.
We work vigorously for freedom and justice for Black people and, by extension, all people.
We intentionally build and nurture a beloved community that is bonded together through a beautiful struggle that is restorative, not depleting.
We are unapologetically Black in our positioning. In affirming that Black Lives Matter, we need not qualify our position. To love and desire freedom and justice for ourselves is a prerequisite for wanting the same for others.
We see ourselves as part of the global Black family, and we are aware of the different ways we are impacted or privileged as Black people who exist in different parts of the world.
We are guided by the fact that all Black lives matter, regardless of actual or perceived sexual identity, gender identity, gender expression, economic status, ability, disability, religious beliefs or disbeliefs, immigration status, or location.
We make space for transgender brothers and sisters to participate and lead.
We are self-reflexive and do the work required to dismantle cisgender privilege and uplift Black trans folk, especially Black trans women who continue to be disproportionately impacted by trans-antagonistic violence.
We build a space that affirms Black women and is free from sexism, misogyny, and environments in which men are centered.
We practice empathy. We engage comrades with the intent to learn about and connect with their contexts.
We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work "double shifts" so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.
We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and "villages" that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.
We foster a queer‐affirming network. When we gather, we do so with the intention of freeing ourselves from the tight grip of heteronormative thinking, or rather, the belief that all in the world are heterosexual (unless s/he or they disclose otherwise).
We cultivate an intergenerational and communal network free from ageism. We believe that all people, regardless of age, show up with the capacity to lead and learn.
We embody and practice justice, liberation, and peace in our engagements with one another.
Yep, that is a real radical outfit! They actually want justice, liberation and peace? They want their women to be treated with respect? They want equal rights for gay and transgender people, religious people and atheists, and old people?
What a bunch of thugs!
Have individual members of the organization said and/or done some bad things? I don't know enough about them, but I wouldn't doubt they have. Which makes them different from members of many other organizations ... how?
I mean, the current presidential administration includes several people who have stated they are looking forward to the End Times. That's a lot more scary to me.
The next thing you know these BLM folks will be threatening to use the military against peacefully protesting Americans, encouraging the police to use violence whenever they have the opportunity, and using political rallies to champion confederate traitors who were fighting for the right to own slaves.
Oh wait ... those aren't Black Lives Matter leaders ... that's the supposed leader of our nation. And that's really effen scary.
Alicia Garza is one of the founders of BLM who boasted that she and her co-founders are trained marxists. She also said one of its goals is the removal of President Trump from office. "Trump not only needs to not be in office in November, but he should resign now," Black Lives Matter Global Network co-founder Patrisse Cullors told CNN's Jake Tapper on Friday. "Trump needs to be out of office. He is not fit for office. And so, what we are going to push for is a move to get Trump out."
You obviously dislike Trump and that's your right. Go vote in November. But half of the country disagrees with you. I agree that we should be careful who we/our team publicly embraces. BLM markets themselves with a justified cause but when you dig deeper into the organization there's some bad stuff there. If MU or any team wants to climb into the political field then be prepared to pay the consequences. Personally, I get sick of all the divisiveness in society and the identity politics. I enjoy watching sports. If sports teams want to get political they will turn off, and probably lose, a lot of their fans.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 22, 2020, 11:15:59 PM
I'm going to show my ignorance on this subject, TAMU. My experience has always been that an organization and a movement of the same name are connected and that the movement is in sync with the organizations goals and purposes. I had no idea that the BLM organization had nothing to do with and was totally separate from the BLM movement. And that Marquette had made it clear it was in no way, shape or form in support of the organization but only in support of the movement. Please link Marquette's statement that clarifies this. Thanks in advance.
I know your being sarcastic but I'll choose to give a serious response. Nowhere did I say "it had nothing to do with or was totally separate." The organization is one of dozens (hundreds?) of organizations and thousands (millions?) of private citizens who make up a movement that believes in ending police brutality against black people. The Black Lives Matter organization is the most recognizable entity in the movement because they were the ones that came up with the hashtag back in 2013. When businesses, sports teams, students, etc post #blacklivesmember or wear BLM shits or go to BLM protests, maybe a select few (I'd guess less than 0.25%) are making the statement that they are "trained marxists" who want to "disrupt the western nuclear traditional family structure". The vast majority of them are expressing support for the crazy idea that police who kill and/or brutalize black people should be held accountable.
You don't have to agree. You don't have to like it. But our student athletes and coaches have made it pretty clear where they stand. And if you believe that supporting the BLM movement is wrong because it is associated with the BLM organization, I suggest finding another team because by that logic, supporting our team also means supporting the BLM movement.
I don't know if you are religious person or not but if you are, when I reflect on the New Testament and how Jesus is portrayed, I see a champion for the oppressed. Someone who stood up for those pushed to the margins of society: women, foreigners, the disabled, the impoverished. I have to imagine that if Jesus were walking among us today, he would be walking with the BLM protesters rather than those opposing them or even those turning up their noses at them.
Quote from: mufvr on June 22, 2020, 11:44:33 PM
I think and hope that all of us support the notion that we should all be treated equal, regardless of our skin color. But to stamp the label on our uniforms of an organization whose members march down the street chanting "pigs in a blanket, fry them like bacon" is highly offensive. I seriously doubt that many people understand who the founders of BLM are and what their motives are. Turn on TV and watch the carniage that's occurring and you willl also notice the BLM is not ashamed to be in the forefront of that. Racial equality is a just and noble cause. Unfortunately, BLM stands for a lot more than that.
So because of the bad acts of a few in a movement of millions, we should disenfranchise the entire group?
Should Marquette disaffiliate from the Catholic Church given the systematic cover up of pedophilia by the church?
Should the democratic party be eliminated because of their historical ties with the KKK? Should the Republican party be eliminated because of their more recent ties with the KKK?
Should we dismantle our country given the numerous acts of genocide committed against indigenous peoples and our participation in the institution of slavery?
These are extreme examples, but I refuse to accept the idea that a movement or a protest, or an organization must be perfect in order to be accepted. The same tactics were used on MLK in the 1960s. People tried to disenfranchise his movement because of MLK's views on Vientam or because of mistakes MLK himself had made in his life. It's an effective tactic but don't let it distract you from what's important.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 22, 2020, 10:51:59 PM
I hope you understand that there is a difference between the organization Black Lives Matter and the Black Lives Matter movement and that Marquette is supporting the latter, not the former.
This thread is gonna get locked isn't it? I'm seriously considering cancelling my season tickets over this and leaning heavily towards yes if they do. I would not feel good with myself knowing I'm helping increase the BLM brand and therefore directly be responsible for promoting Marxism. The organization most definitely lives off the fact that people don't realize there is a difference and I'm not going to personally help them. More power to anyone that does though, it's up to you who you want to support. Same with me.
Quote from: MU82 on June 22, 2020, 11:45:01 PM
I am looking right at the BLM website and I don't see any of the "scary black people" stuff you are trying to portray.
For example, what you shortened to disrupting the western "nuclear traditional family structure," actually is this:
We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and "villages" that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.
In other words, they reject being looked down upon just because they might not fit YOUR definition of what a family has to be, and they aim to support everybody in their community. If you don't see the difference between what you were suggesting and what they actually say, that's on you.
Here is the entirety of their "marxist" platform:
The Black Lives Matter Global Network is as powerful as it is because of our membership, our partners, our supporters, our staff, and you. Our continued commitment to liberation for all Black people means we are continuing the work of our ancestors and fighting for our collective freedom because it is our duty.
Every day, we recommit to healing ourselves and each other, and to co-creating alongside comrades, allies, and family a culture where each person feels seen, heard, and supported.
We acknowledge, respect, and celebrate differences and commonalities.
We work vigorously for freedom and justice for Black people and, by extension, all people.
We intentionally build and nurture a beloved community that is bonded together through a beautiful struggle that is restorative, not depleting.
We are unapologetically Black in our positioning. In affirming that Black Lives Matter, we need not qualify our position. To love and desire freedom and justice for ourselves is a prerequisite for wanting the same for others.
We see ourselves as part of the global Black family, and we are aware of the different ways we are impacted or privileged as Black people who exist in different parts of the world.
We are guided by the fact that all Black lives matter, regardless of actual or perceived sexual identity, gender identity, gender expression, economic status, ability, disability, religious beliefs or disbeliefs, immigration status, or location.
We make space for transgender brothers and sisters to participate and lead.
We are self-reflexive and do the work required to dismantle cisgender privilege and uplift Black trans folk, especially Black trans women who continue to be disproportionately impacted by trans-antagonistic violence.
We build a space that affirms Black women and is free from sexism, misogyny, and environments in which men are centered.
We practice empathy. We engage comrades with the intent to learn about and connect with their contexts.
We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work "double shifts" so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.
We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and "villages" that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.
We foster a queer‐affirming network. When we gather, we do so with the intention of freeing ourselves from the tight grip of heteronormative thinking, or rather, the belief that all in the world are heterosexual (unless s/he or they disclose otherwise).
We cultivate an intergenerational and communal network free from ageism. We believe that all people, regardless of age, show up with the capacity to lead and learn.
We embody and practice justice, liberation, and peace in our engagements with one another.
Yep, that is a real radical outfit! They actually want justice, liberation and peace? They want their women to be treated with respect? They want equal rights for gay and transgender people, religious people and atheists, and old people?
What a bunch of thugs!
Have individual members of the organization said and/or done some bad things? I don't know enough about them, but I wouldn't doubt they have. Which makes them different from members of many other organizations ... how?
I mean, the current presidential administration includes several people who have stated they are looking forward to the End Times. That's a lot more scary to me.
The next thing you know these BLM folks will be threatening to use the military against peacefully protesting Americans, encouraging the police to use violence whenever they have the opportunity, and using political rallies to champion confederate traitors who were fighting for the right to own slaves.
Oh wait ... those aren't Black Lives Matter leaders ... that's the supposed leader of our nation. And that's really effen scary.
Wow.
Mike, yes, Marxism sounds anything but dangerous on a website or in a pamphlet or book. After all, why should Utopia be threatening to anyone. Problem is, it hasn't worked so well in the "real world".
I think it's great that Coach Killings and the players want to show support for positive change. And it's OK by me if you or anybody else think wearing a patch supporting a Marxist organization is an effective way to accomplish that. Why is it not OK by you, TAMU and Wades if I think they should have chosen something less politically charged? For that I have to relinquish my "fan of the program" card? Sounds like tyranny to me. Thankfully you guys don't get to pick who can or can't cheer for Marquette, at least not yet. Maybe in Utopia.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 23, 2020, 12:15:14 AM
So because of the bad acts of a few in a movement of millions, we should disenfranchise the entire group?
Should Marquette disaffiliate from the Catholic Church given the systematic cover up of pedophilia by the church?
Should the democratic party be eliminated because of their historical ties with the KKK? Should the Republican party be eliminated because of their more recent ties with the KKK?
Should we dismantle our country given the numerous acts of genocide committed against indigenous peoples and our participation in the institution of slavery?
These are extreme examples, but I refuse to accept the idea that a movement or a protest, or an organization must be perfect in order to be accepted. The same tactics were used on MLK in the 1960s. People tried to disenfranchise his movement because of MLK's views on Vientam or because of mistakes MLK himself had made in his life. It's an effective tactic but don't let it distract you from what's important.
TAMU
These are not the "bad acts of a few in the group". Marxism is part of BLM's mission statement. And the original mission statement is recent and from all I know current.
If you can find the protection of pedophiles as part of the Catholic Church's original reason for being, you have a point.
If either the Democrat or Republican Party was organized to promote and protect racism you have a point. If they still did the analogy would be perfect.
MLK's "imperfections" had nothing to do with the goals of the organization/movement he led. If one of the purposes of his movement was to promote "Imperfections" you would have a point.
Look, I'm not saying that BLM wasn't formed with good intentions. I'm sure their leaders sincerely believe that promoting Marxism is a good thing. I don't, so logically I can't back what is an essential goal as they themselves see it. The fact that most of the people who are in support of the movement don't know what the organization who started the movement stands for isn't mitigating in my view.
As I said previously, I support the sentiment, I support the slogan. I don't support the organization. And for you or anyone else to opine that someone who feels that way should find another team to root for is the very definition of bigotry - something I know you would be against.
Wow
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 12:29:28 AM
Wow.
Mike, yes, Marxism sounds anything but dangerous on a website or in a pamphlet or book. After all, why should Utopia be threatening to anyone. Problem is, it hasn't worked so well in the "real world".
I think it's great that Coach Killings and the players want to show support for positive change. And it's OK by me if you or anybody else think wearing a patch supporting a Marxist organization is an effective way to accomplish that. Why is it not OK by you, TAMU and Wades if I think they should have chosen something less politically charged? For that I have to relinquish my "fan of the program" card? Sounds like tyranny to me. Thankfully you guys don't get to pick who can or can't cheer for Marquette, at least not yet. Maybe in Utopia.
Here is what CapX, a center-right British news aggregation site, says about BLM (which also is very active there):
The perception that BLM is on the whole a radical neo-Marxist political movement is just not backed up by evidence. The biggest concern cited is the campaign to 'Defund the Police', but once you dig into what this means in practice it becomes a lot less about abolishing state security services and a lot more about police forces having more accountability and transparency, and being more rooted in the communities they are tasked with protecting. The slogan might not help, but since when did libertarians and conservatives disagree with these aims? In fact, libertarians have been making similar arguments for a long time.
Being motivated by an instinctive distrust of protests leads many on the right to jump on minority actions to discredit whole movements, which limits their ability to listen to and work with protestors who they agree with, to help make the world a better place. Lenny, you've been a Marquette fan for decades and I always like our basketball discussions. You are knowledgeable and you care. But ultimately, each of us has many choices to make in life. For example, I know two guys who were super-diehard baseball fans. They played when they were kids, would have sold their souls for the Red Sox to win, and raised their kids to be Red Sox fans. And yet, after the 1994 lockout, they gave it up and literally have not watched an inning of MLB since; they didn't even give a damn when the Red Sox finally won. It was a difficult choice for them, but one they ultimately felt good about making.
Being a Marquette fan is a choice. If you
really feel that because one of its co-founders said "we are trained Marxists" that "Marxism is part of BLM's mission statement" -- despite there being no evidence of that in the way they have gone about their business these last 6-7 years, and despite it not being included within their actual mission statement -- and you do not want Marxism represented by the athletes on the team you support, the school you graduated from and the Big East overall, how could you possibly continue to support the team, the school and the league?
Nobody is telling you that you have to relinquish anything. I actually hope you continue to be a Marquette fan, but it's a choice. Just as there is no "tyranny" forcing you to give up your Warrior fandom, there is no "tyranny" forcing you to remain a fan. If only we all had a 100% personal choice like this over everything that affects us in our lives.
I think that's all TAMU is saying, and I agree with him.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 12:25:48 AM
I'm seriously considering cancelling my season tickets over this and leaning heavily towards yes if they do. I would not feel good with myself knowing I'm helping increase the BLM brand and therefore directly be responsible for promoting Marxism. The organization most definitely lives off the fact that people don't realize there is a difference and I'm not going to personally help them. More power to anyone that does though, it's up to you who you want to support. Same with me.
Exactly. It's your own free will. Again, if despite the evidence you think BLM is "Marxist," and that MU is now supporting Marxism, you gotta do what you gotta do.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 23, 2020, 12:03:09 AM
When I reflect on the New Testament and how Jesus is portrayed, I see a champion for the oppressed. Someone who stood up for those pushed to the margins of society: women, foreigners, the disabled, the impoverished. I have to imagine that if Jesus were walking among us today, he would be walking with the BLM protesters rather than those opposing them or even those turning up their noses at them.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 23, 2020, 12:15:14 AM
Should Marquette disaffiliate from the Catholic Church given the systematic cover up of pedophilia by the church?
As an atheist, I didn't feel I could bring up points like these, so I'm glad you did.
While it's highly debatable that BLM is a "Marxist" organization, it is indisputable that thousands of Catholic priests were child molesters and that the Catholic Church covered up that abuse for decades.
As a non-Catholic, it would have been especially easy for me to give up any affiliation with Marquette after all of that became common knowledge. I could have stopped rooting for the basketball team, stopped sending my annual check to the school, stopped attending and/or arranging MU events, etc. But I looked at the overall good of Marquette, at what the school is trying to accomplish in the world, and at the way it goes about its business to fulfill its actual mission statement. So I am proud to say
We Are Marquette despite its affiliation with an organization that had an extremely evil side for decades.
I see no evidence that BLM has done anything anywhere near as evil so far in its short existence, and I doubt it will in the coming years. I happen to agree that the Jesus I have learned about would protest right along with BLM, while he would have condemned the church.
But sure, if the BLM thing freaks out MU basketball fans because a uniform patch means the school is supporting Marxism ... oh well ... we all have choices to make in life.
Black Lives Matter. We Are Marquette!
Can we please stop with the absolute BS about "don't make this political"? Racism is not and should never be a political issue. Valuing human life is not a political issue.
If your response to BLM is "oh, the POLITICS of it all" then maybe you need to take a good long look in the mirror and think about what you really believe in. The people that believe systemic racism is a "political" problem are the ones that feel threatened because they are tying their politics to that racism. If racism is your politics, that's the real problem.
And for all the praise of HC's post, it justifies implicit racism:
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PMI use to hate the way the country club whites always looked down at me at first blush, but at the end of the day when I made them money that changed their outlook. My experience is that hard work driven success cures most ills.
An individual's value and simply being treated as an equal human being shouldn't require one to prove they are a monetary asset first. That's a clear problem of systemic racism. And the bolded is a lie. It doesn't "cure most ills" it reinforces them as acceptable.
I love what Dwayne Killings is doing and I love how he is helping Marquette figure prominently on the right side of history. And like Theo John said, "If you can't support us here, I ask you please don't support us on the court."
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 01:07:01 AM
TAMU
These are not the "bad acts of a few in the group". Marxism is part of BLM's mission statement. And the original mission statement is recent and from all I know current.
If you can find the protection of pedophiles as part of the Catholic Church's original reason for being, you have a point.
If either the Democrat or Republican Party was organized to promote and protect racism you have a point. If they still did the analogy would be perfect.
MLK's "imperfections" had nothing to do with the goals of the organization/movement he led. If one of the purposes of his movement was to promote "Imperfections" you would have a point.
Look, I'm not saying that BLM wasn't formed with good intentions. I'm sure their leaders sincerely believe that promoting Marxism is a good thing. I don't, so logically I can't back what is an essential goal as they themselves see it. The fact that most of the people who are in support of the movement don't know what the organization who started the movement stands for isn't mitigating in my view.
As I said previously, I support the sentiment, I support the slogan. I don't support the organization. And for you or anyone else to opine that someone who feels that way should find another team to root for is the very definition of bigotry - something I know you would be against.
Again Lenny, there is a difference between the organization and the movement. The movement is a lot older than the organization and has nothing to do with Marxism. That is what MU is choosing to support.
Im not telling you to cheer for another team. Im pointing out that if you can't separate support for the BLM movement from the BLM organization, then im not sure how you can separate support for MU and support for the BLM movement.
Quote from: mufvr on June 22, 2020, 11:44:33 PM
I think and hope that all of us support the notion that we should all be treated equal, regardless of our skin color. But to stamp the label on our uniforms of an organization whose members march down the street chanting "pigs in a blanket, fry them like bacon" is highly offensive. I seriously doubt that many people understand who the founders of BLM are and what their motives are. Turn on TV and watch the carniage that's occurring and you willl also notice the BLM is not ashamed to be in the forefront of that. Racial equality is a just and noble cause. Unfortunately, BLM stands for a lot more than that.
Black Lives Matter the movement should be supported. Sorry it makes you uncomfortable or offended. Perhaps that's the point.
Black Lives Matter the non-profit is a train wreck.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 01:07:01 AM
TAMU
These are not the "bad acts of a few in the group". Marxism is part of BLM's mission statement. And the original mission statement is recent and from all I know current.
If you can find the protection of pedophiles as part of the Catholic Church's original reason for being, you have a point.
If either the Democrat or Republican Party was organized to promote and protect racism you have a point. If they still did the analogy would be perfect.
MLK's "imperfections" had nothing to do with the goals of the organization/movement he led. If one of the purposes of his movement was to promote "Imperfections" you would have a point.
Look, I'm not saying that BLM wasn't formed with good intentions. I'm sure their leaders sincerely believe that promoting Marxism is a good thing. I don't, so logically I can't back what is an essential goal as they themselves see it. The fact that most of the people who are in support of the movement don't know what the organization who started the movement stands for isn't mitigating in my view.
As I said previously, I support the sentiment, I support the slogan. I don't support the organization. And for you or anyone else to opine that someone who feels that way should find another team to root for is the very definition of bigotry - something I know you would be against.
As I said, BLM, Inc. is a trainwreck.
But really, people need to stop looking for every, f*cking flaw, whitewashing the memory of MLK, and understand that no movement is perfect. Fix the problem.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on June 23, 2020, 12:15:14 AM
These are extreme examples, but I refuse to accept the idea that a movement or a protest, or an organization must be perfect in order to be accepted. The same tactics were used on MLK in the 1960s. People tried to disenfranchise his movement because of MLK's views on Vientam or because of mistakes MLK himself had made in his life. It's an effective tactic but don't let it distract you from what's important.
Amen.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PM
I appreciate the sentiment. However, it is truly misguided. I wish people would stop trying to help people of color by lowering the standard by which we have to compete. We are good enough to make it on our own.
Nothing in the article indicated anything about "lowering the standard" or mentioned hiring practices of any sort.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 12:25:48 AM
This thread is gonna get locked isn't it? I'm seriously considering cancelling my season tickets over this and leaning heavily towards yes if they do. I would not feel good with myself knowing I'm helping increase the BLM brand and therefore directly be responsible for promoting Marxism. The organization most definitely lives off the fact that people don't realize there is a difference and I'm not going to personally help them. More power to anyone that does though, it's up to you who you want to support. Same with me.
Remember when some people would b*tch about "snowflakes" and the "cancel culture?"
Yeah....
Moved to the top of Scoop's summer reading list.
https://www.amazon.com/White-Fragility-People-About-Racism/dp/0807047414
Leaders lead. Good job Coach DK.
Wow seems like a group of people here only get their information from Fox News, Breitbart, OANN, Candace Owens. Funny how so many agree with the fake persona HC seems to be.
Seriously, I am looking back on this and shaking my head in disbelief...
Black Lives Matter has become a worldwide movement that highlights the systemic racism that exists in the world today. I think most people would agree that we should recognize where that racism exists, educate, and fix the problems. I mean, we have had thousands of people of all types march in the streets in support of this movement.
Yet because some whack-jobs have co-opted the name, formed a non-profit, and labelled themselves as "Marxist," you're going to cancel your season tickets if Marquette puts a BLM patch on their uniform? Not representing BLM, Inc., but the larger, worldwide movement?
That my friends is the classic excuse for inaction. It allows you to stay comfortable. It allows you not to be introspective. It allows you not to change or to ask others to change.
Be bigger than that.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:14:14 AM
Seriously, I am looking back on this and shaking my head in disbelief...
Black Lives Matter has become a worldwide movement that highlights the systemic racism that exists in the world today. I think most people would agree that we should recognize where that racism exists, educate, and fix the problems. I mean, we have had thousands of people of all types march in the streets in support of this movement.
Yet because some whack-jobs have co-opted the name, formed a non-profit, and labelled themselves as "Marxist," you're going to cancel your season tickets if Marquette puts a BLM patch on their uniform? Not representing BLM, Inc., but the larger, worldwide movement?
That my friends is the classic excuse for inaction. It allows you to stay comfortable. It allows you not to be introspective. It allows you not to change or to ask others to change.
Be bigger than that.
Be the difference....?
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 12:29:28 AM
Wow.
Mike, yes, Marxism sounds anything but dangerous on a website or in a pamphlet or book. After all, why should Utopia be threatening to anyone. Problem is, it hasn't worked so well in the "real world".
I think it's great that Coach Killings and the players want to show support for positive change. And it's OK by me if you or anybody else think wearing a patch supporting a Marxist organization is an effective way to accomplish that. Why is it not OK by you, TAMU and Wades if I think they should have chosen something less politically charged? For that I have to relinquish my "fan of the program" card? Sounds like tyranny to me. Thankfully you guys don't get to pick who can or can't cheer for Marquette, at least not yet. Maybe in Utopia.
You can do what you want. Just like the players can do what they want. And the coaches can. And they can support what they want or who they want, too! That's the freaking point lol. While you're crying about supporting the wrong movement, you're also crying that somebody tells you you're supporting the wrong team then. Do you not see that? It's perfectly fine for you to tell other people who/what they should be supporting, but you get butthurt the second someone tells you that maybe your support should be shifted elsewhere. Lenny's way or the highway, boys.
The team can support BLM. If that upsets you, you can support a different team. That's life.
Proud of coach DK and the University. Less proud (although not surprised) with some of the responses here. If something like this is a deal breaker for you, you can certainly choose not to support the team/University, but you may find it tough to find a new team to support as situations like this are likely coming to every sport.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 23, 2020, 06:41:26 AM
Can we please stop with the absolute BS about "don't make this political"? Racism is not and should never be a political issue. Valuing human life is not a human issue.
If your response to BLM is "oh, the POLITICS of it all" then maybe you need to take a good long look in the mirror and think about what you really believe in. The people that believe systemic racism is a "political" problem are the ones that feel threatened because they are tying their politics to that racism. If racism is your politics, that's the real problem.
And for all the praise of HC's post, it justifies implicit racism:
An individual's value and simply being treated as an equal human being shouldn't require one to prove they are a monetary asset first. That's a clear problem of systemic racism. And the bolded is a lie. It doesn't "cure most ills" it reinforces them as acceptable.
I love what Dwayne Killings is doing and I love how he is helping Marquette figure prominently on the right side of history. And like Theo John said, "If you can't support us here, I ask you please don't support us on the court."
You said it perfectly.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:14:14 AM
Seriously, I am looking back on this and shaking my head in disbelief...
Black Lives Matter has become a worldwide movement that highlights the systemic racism that exists in the world today. I think most people would agree that we should recognize where that racism exists, educate, and fix the problems. I mean, we have had thousands of people of all types march in the streets in support of this movement.
Yet because some whack-jobs have co-opted the name, formed a non-profit, and labelled themselves as "Marxist," you're going to cancel your season tickets if Marquette puts a BLM patch on their uniform? Not representing BLM, Inc., but the larger, worldwide movement?
That my friends is the classic excuse for inaction. It allows you to stay comfortable. It allows you not to be introspective. It allows you not to change or to ask others to change.
Be bigger than that.
And you nailed it.
I'd encourage people who haven't to attend at least one march. It's been awesome to see people from all walks of life come together for a common goal. It's also been awesome that the organizers have planned marches from the inner city into the suburbs. They need to be heard. And that's resulted in people joining them that wouldn't go out of their way to join them otherwise.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:14:14 AM
Seriously, I am looking back on this and shaking my head in disbelief...
Black Lives Matter has become a worldwide movement that highlights the systemic racism that exists in the world today. I think most people would agree that we should recognize where that racism exists, educate, and fix the problems. I mean, we have had thousands of people of all types march in the streets in support of this movement.
Yet because some whack-jobs have co-opted the name, formed a non-profit, and labelled themselves as "Marxist," you're going to cancel your season tickets if Marquette puts a BLM patch on their uniform? Not representing BLM, Inc., but the larger, worldwide movement?
That my friends is the classic excuse for inaction. It allows you to stay comfortable. It allows you not to be introspective. It allows you not to change or to ask others to change.
Be bigger than that.
The status quo and whatever there was before BLM was not working so this is a different approach forward.
I'll be supporting the Marquette basketball team.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PM
I appreciate the sentiment. However, it is truly misguided. I wish people would stop trying to help people of color by lowering the standard by which we have to compete. We are good enough to make it on our own.
I am older, so I had to earn everything the hard way. I had to get better grades ,and work harder , to overcome what in those days the pundits called prejudice or stereotyping. It was not easy but at the end of the day I was much better off. I had to suffer through tremendous indignities along the way. Today they call that subtle condescending attitude micro aggression's. I use to hate the way the country club whites always looked down at me at first blush, but at the end of the day when I made them money that changed their outlook. My experience is that hard work driven success cures most ills.
I am actually saddened to see what is happening to our country right now. We were making great strides economically and those at the bottom rung of the ladder were finally getting their day in the sun. When unemployment was at record low levels it was opening all kinds of doors that affirmative action could never do. Once this pandemic is over, I hope we can get right back on that track.
Brother Herm, I absolutely agree with your sentiment. Hard work and profitability builds acceptance far faster. Look at basketball, for example. When those bigots down in the SEC saw teams like Marquette reach the pinnacle of success with African-American athletes, guess what! The SEC integrated.
All that said, I know nothing of your background, but if I had to guess, you and I had something in common -- parents, teachers and other community elders who weren't afraid to compliment when we did well but put a foot in our ass when we didn't. That mentoring, parenting and leading by example is critical and something that all too frequently is lacking in our social and educational structures.
I don't see EOP as dumbing down the curriculum. I see it as a way by which smart folks who didn't get what they needed in high school to succeed at Marquette can get additional support to do the same work we all were and are required to do.
My own children participated in a program called Achieve at SIU, because both had learning disabilities. They did the same work everyone else at SIU did, but they received assistance in dealing with and working around their learning disabilities. My daughter received her degree and my son is on track to do so in December. The latter will be a police officer next year, somewhere, and will be fine one!
Quote from: dgies9156 on June 23, 2020, 09:14:07 AM
Brother Herm, I absolutely agree with your sentiment. Hard work and profitability builds acceptance far faster. Look at basketball, for example. When those bigots down in the SEC saw teams like Marquette reach the pinnacle of success with African-American athletes, guess what! The SEC integrated.
Yes, I am sure the Civil Rights Act of 1964 had nothing to do with integration in the SEC. The Blacks just started working harder and were accepted.
Honestly the way some people try to whitewash history is something else.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 22, 2020, 08:33:30 PM
I am actually saddened to see what is happening to our country right now. We were making great strides economically and those at the bottom rung of the ladder were finally getting their day in the sun. When unemployment was at record low levels it was opening all kinds of doors that affirmative action could never do. Once this pandemic is over, I hope we can get right back on that track.
This is completely untethered to reality. Total fiction.
Good initiative and happy to be a part of a family that takes action instead of blowing smoke rings of bellicose bull$hit.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 07:53:56 AM
Funny how so many agree with the fake persona HC seems to be.
This.
Quote from: Golden Avalanche on June 23, 2020, 09:32:57 AM
This is completely untethered to reality. Total fiction.
Good initiative and happy to be a part of a family that takes action instead of blowing smoke rings of bellicose bull$hit.
And this.
Are Scoopers really cheering on a guy who bragged about Cosby-ing women and who only recently proposed bringing back the effen Poll Tax?
9-9-9 is good fun when he's posting countless "research reports" about stuff few care about, but when he talks about anything that actually matters, he's either pretending to be a caricature of an online d-bag, or he is a horrible human being.
And if it's the latter ... some Scoopers are willing to throw in with somebody who boasts about drugging women even as they are outraged that our team will wear a BLM patch? Really? A lot of selective morality here sometimes.
Black Lives Matter. We Are Marquette!
Quote from: dgies9156 on June 23, 2020, 09:14:07 AM
Brother Herm, I absolutely agree with your sentiment. Hard work and profitability builds acceptance far faster. Look at basketball, for example. When those bigots down in the SEC saw teams like Marquette reach the pinnacle of success with African-American athletes, guess what! The SEC integrated.
Ha!
If wanting to win was the driving force behind integration in college athletics, and the SEC in particular, it would have happened decades earlier.
College programs weren't ignorant to the fact that they were denying themselves talent through their discrimination. They just didn't care about that as much as they cared about appeasing their racist boosters.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 08:33:35 AMI'd encourage people who haven't to attend at least one march. It's been awesome to see people from all walks of life come together for a common goal. It's also been awesome that the organizers have planned marches from the inner city into the suburbs. They need to be heard. And that's resulted in people joining them that wouldn't go out of their way to join them otherwise.
+100
Completely spot on. Needs to be experienced to be understood.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 23, 2020, 06:41:26 AM
Can we please stop with the absolute BS about "don't make this political"? Racism is not and should never be a political issue. Valuing human life is not a human issue.
If your response to BLM is "oh, the POLITICS of it all" then maybe you need to take a good long look in the mirror and think about what you really believe in. The people that believe systemic racism is a "political" problem are the ones that feel threatened because they are tying their politics to that racism. If racism is your politics, that's the real problem.
And for all the praise of HC's post, it justifies implicit racism:
An individual's value and simply being treated as an equal human being shouldn't require one to prove they are a monetary asset first. That's a clear problem of systemic racism. And the bolded is a lie. It doesn't "cure most ills" it reinforces them as acceptable.
I love what Dwayne Killings is doing and I love how he is helping Marquette figure prominently on the right side of history. And like Theo John said, "If you can't support us here, I ask you please don't support us on the court."
Except it absolutely
is political in my opinion. Unless you think the solution lies in more HR training seminars and more individuals being nice to each other (not that that would be a bad thing). But systemic issues need to address the system, or nothing will change in any meaningful/substantive way. So it
has to be political.
Anyone saying "don't make this political" is really just saying "please do not make me reflect upon the fact that my political stances potentially prop up racist systems."
Quote from: warriorchick on June 22, 2020, 03:16:35 PM
At least Marquette has a program (EOP) that they could ramp up to help these students if necessary. I am not sure if any of the other BEast schools have a similar program.
Most if not all colleges already have a minority first generation program.
#BLM
I can't believe Marquette and the Big East are working against the best interest of so many of their athletes and students. The far left wing BLM organization and their agenda is in direct conflict with so many prominent people of color including:
Herschel Walker
Daryl Strawberry
Candace Owens
Brandon Tatum
Katrina Pierson
Doreen Borelli
David Harris Junior
David Webb
Sen. Tim Scott
Dr. Ben Carson
Col Allen West
Larry Elder
Diamond and Silk
Dinesh D'Souza
Kanye West
Dr. Shiva
Thomas Sowell
etc., etc.
Why would the Big East and Marquette work against these people of color who have been working vehemently to change the cycle of poverty that they blame on the same policies/party that control all the country's inner cities.
I in turn will be voting with my dollars and not supporting either Marquette or the Big East until they start to support all people with just policies that foster prosperity and freedom for all.
^This guy listed a felon who isn't black as one of the great Americans and wants to be taken seriously.
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 11:21:51 AM
I can't believe Marquette and the Big East are working against the best interest of so many of their athletes and students. The far left wing BLM organization and their agenda is in direct conflict with so many prominent people of color including:
Herschel Walker
Daryl Strawberry
Candace Owens
Brandon Tatum
Katrina Pierson
Doreen Borelli
David Harris Junior
David Webb
Sen. Tim Scott
Dr. Ben Carson
Col Allen West
Larry Elder
Diamond and Silk
Dinesh D'Souza
Kanye West
Dr. Shiva
Thomas Sowell
etc., etc.
Why would the Big East and Marquette work against these people of color who have been working vehemently to change the cycle of poverty that they blame on the same policies/party that control all the country's inner cities.
I in turn will be voting with my dollars and not supporting either Marquette or the Big East until they start to support all people with just policies that foster prosperity and freedom for all.
If this means you will no longer be posting to Scoop, I think you are making the right decision.
As we move forward in our nation, young African-American athletes are beginning to understand their worth and value. Universities and conferences that are ahead of the curve will be the ones that benefit.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 11:37:27 AM
If this means you will no longer be posting to Scoop, I think you are making the right decision.
+1
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 08:21:11 AM
You can do what you want. Just like the players can do what they want. And the coaches can. And they can support what they want or who they want, too! That's the freaking point lol. While you're crying about supporting the wrong movement, you're also crying that somebody tells you you're supporting the wrong team then. Do you not see that? It's perfectly fine for you to tell other people who/what they should be supporting, but you get butthurt the second someone tells you that maybe your support should be shifted elsewhere. Lenny's way or the highway, boys.
The team can support BLM. If that upsets you, you can support a different team. That's life.
Total misrepresentation of what I posted. It's what you do.
Quote from: Ellenson Family Reunion on June 23, 2020, 09:59:51 AM
Except it absolutely is political in my opinion. Unless you think the solution lies in more HR training seminars and more individuals being nice to each other (not that that would be a bad thing). But systemic issues need to address the system, or nothing will change in any meaningful/substantive way. So it has to be political.
Anyone saying "don't make this political" is really just saying "please do not make me reflect upon the fact that my political stances potentially prop up racist systems."
Can you explain this like I'm 5? How is being against racism a political issue?
In my head, it would be like saying being against murder is a political issue.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 12:02:21 PM
Total misrepresentation of what I posted. It's what you do.
Good idea to back down.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 09:19:09 AM
Yes, I am sure the Civil Rights Act of 1964 had nothing to do with integration in the SEC. The Blacks just started working harder and were accepted.
Honestly the way some people try to whitewash history is something else.
The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was promulgated in early July. The first African American basketball players in the SEC were Perry Wallace of Vanderbilt and Henry Harris of Auburn in 1966.
It was not until the 1970s that the SEC fully integrated. One of the moments that changed things was in 1971, when Ray Mears and the Tennessee Volunteers came to Milwaukee for a game against us. Mears brought his lily white team to play MU, which was integrated with Jim Chones, Dean Meminger, "Sugar" Frazier and Bob Lackey. It was 12-0 before Tennessee managed to cross the mid-court line, because of Marquette swarming, full-court pressure, quickness and agility. We won 56-30 and it could have been 100-30 if Marquette had turned up the throttle.
The next year, we went to Knoxville. Mears began recruiting African-Americans and took us into double overtime before losing 84-82.
Other than Kentucky, nobody in the SEC was any good until they stopped discriminating on the basis of skin color. Teams saw what more open-minded schools like UCLA, North Carolina, Marquette, Kansas and San Francisco had done and thought many of the great ballplayers from the south should stay closer to home than Milwaukee or Los Angeles.
Quote from: dgies9156 on June 23, 2020, 12:13:41 PM
The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was promulgated in early July. The first African American basketball players in the SEC were Perry Wallace of Vanderbilt and Henry Harris of Auburn in 1966.
It was not until the 1970s that the SEC fully integrated. One of the moments that changed things was in 1971, when Ray Mears and the Tennessee Volunteers came to Milwaukee for a game against us. Mears brought his lily white team to play MU, which was integrated with Jim Chones, Dean Meminger, "Sugar" Frazier and Bob Lackey. It was 12-0 before Tennessee managed to cross the mid-court line, because of Marquette swarming, full-court pressure, quickness and agility. We won 56-30 and it could have been 100-30 if Marquette had turned up the throttle.
The next year, we went to Knoxville. Mears began recruiting African-Americans and took us into double overtime before losing 84-82.
Nice story but a bunch of innaccuracies.
Marquette played Tennessee at the Arena in December of 1972. Tennessee already had a Black player at the time. (Larry Robinson) The next year Marquette did go to Tennessee but they won - against a team that had two Black players. Both freshmen who rarely played.
While Robinson was their first Black player, UT already had a number of Black football players at the time and signed Spencer Haywood to play basketball in the late 1960s but he failed to qualify academically.
Marquette had little to do with Tennessee's integration as a basketball program.
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 11:21:51 AM
I in turn will be voting with my dollars and not supporting either Marquette or the Big East until they start to support all people with just policies that foster prosperity and freedom for all.
See ya. Enjoy your team from Madison.
Black Lives Matter. We Are Marquette!
As I learned throughout my catholic upbringing we are ALL God's children. So when someone says all lives matter I believe that is what Marquette should stand for. We should be forgiving the sins of the past and reaching out to our brethren to make sure we treat all people with the dignity and respect. Now people are considered racist for believing such a thing. Marquette should be commended for programs such as EOP instead it doesn't go far enough because it doesn't get the attention it needs to prove the university is not racist. As a son of a minority who had to overcome obstacles in his life to provide for his family I take exception to the notion that you can't do things because of your skin color.... but that's what the underlying message of BLM is...with an objective so vague that it will linger without end. Wearing BLM on jerseys may make some people feel good, but in reality does more to divide than to make people equal.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 12:40:30 PM
Nice story but a bunch of innaccuracies.
Marquette played Tennessee at the Arena in December of 1972. Tennessee already had a Black player at the time. (Larry Robinson) The next year Marquette did go to Tennessee but they won - against a team that had two Black players. Both freshmen who rarely played.
While Robinson was their first Black player, UT already had a number of Black football players at the time and signed Spencer Haywood to play basketball in the late 1960s but he failed to qualify academically.
Marquette had little to do with Tennessee's integration as a basketball program.
Failed to qualify academically at the University of Tennessee? C'mon Fluff, did you ever live in Tennessee? Anyone with a discernible brain wave could have entered the University of Tennessee at that time. Literally anyone. You needed a 16 on the ACT and a Tennessee high school degree to get in. You might not have lasted, but you could get in. If Spencer Haywood could not get into UT, well, I don't think it was intellectual capability! Especially given the intellectual capacity of more than a few of their football players -- regardless of race -- over the past five decades!
One -- and I mean one -- African-American ballplayer in 1971. Even Vanderbilt did better than that! Say what you want, but the fact is that night in Milwaukee was incredibly embarrassing to Mears, who supposedly was one of the more respected SEC coaches at the time. Was it the only reason he recruited two African American athletes at UT? Maybe not, but it sure helped push the ball down the road.
As for football, that's a different world. I watched Vanderbilt football growing up and I couldn't tell who played whom. The players I saw were Orange, Red, Crimson, Blue, Gold and Black. I do know that one of the pioneers among African American football players in the mid 1970s was Conridge Hollaway, who quarterbacked the Vols. That was huge in the south and a game changer.
Quote from: jt92 on June 23, 2020, 01:18:26 PM
As I learned throughout my catholic upbringing we are ALL God's children. So when someone says all lives matter I believe that is what Marquette should stand for. We should be forgiving the sins of the past and reaching out to our brethren to make sure we treat all people with the dignity and respect. Now people are considered racist for believing such a thing. Marquette should be commended for programs such as EOP instead it doesn't go far enough because it doesn't get the attention it needs to prove the university is not racist. As a son of a minority who had to overcome obstacles in his life to provide for his family I take exception to the notion that you can't do things because of your skin color.... but that's what the underlying message of BLM is...with an objective so vague that it will linger without end. Wearing BLM on jerseys may make some people feel good, but in reality does more to divide than to make people equal.
Regarding this all lives matter statement. The term black lives matter implies that they as black individuals are forgotten and matter too. America is a white society the expectation is white lives matter, the response is Black lives matter too.
Nobody has says someone can't do something because of their skin. There is institutional racism and leftover effects of previous generations from things like redlining. Seriously if you live in a once redlined suburb is it any wonder your schools are great and that property values kept rising while they dropped due to white flight in other areas thus making smaller budgets for schools? That then puts the students at a disadvantage to move up in the world even once everything is made "equal"
If the term divides people then they're too wrapped up in the "what about me" mindset to understand what the movement means
Quote from: jt92 on June 23, 2020, 01:18:26 PM
As I learned throughout my catholic upbringing we are ALL God's children. So when someone says all lives matter I believe that is what Marquette should stand for. We should be forgiving the sins of the past and reaching out to our brethren to make sure we treat all people with the dignity and respect. Now people are considered racist for believing such a thing. Marquette should be commended for programs such as EOP instead it doesn't go far enough because it doesn't get the attention it needs to prove the university is not racist. As a son of a minority who had to overcome obstacles in his life to provide for his family I take exception to the notion that you can't do things because of your skin color.... but that's what the underlying message of BLM is...with an objective so vague that it will linger without end. Wearing BLM on jerseys may make some people feel good, but in reality does more to divide than to make people equal.
OK, I am going to address this in a way that I hope will be helpful. Black lives matter is hardly meant to exclude. It is meant to draw attention to systemic racism. Everyone should be in favor of that! And everyone should be happy to proclaim that.
Of course all lives matter. No one really says they don't. But when people say that in reaction to "black lives matter," it serves to minimize what black lives matter stands for.
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 11:21:51 AM
I can't believe Marquette and the Big East are working against the best interest of so many of their athletes and students. The far left wing BLM organization and their agenda is in direct conflict with so many prominent people of color including:
Herschel Walker
Daryl Strawberry
Candace Owens
Brandon Tatum
Katrina Pierson
Doreen Borelli
David Harris Junior
David Webb
Sen. Tim Scott
Dr. Ben Carson
Col Allen West
Larry Elder
Diamond and Silk
Dinesh D'Souza
Kanye West
Dr. Shiva
Thomas Sowell
etc., etc.
Why would the Big East and Marquette work against these people of color who have been working vehemently to change the cycle of poverty that they blame on the same policies/party that control all the country's inner cities.
I in turn will be voting with my dollars and not supporting either Marquette or the Big East until they start to support all people with just policies that foster prosperity and freedom for all.
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!! You got me.
Quote from: jt92 on June 23, 2020, 01:18:26 PM
As I learned throughout my catholic upbringing we are ALL God's children. So when someone says all lives matter I believe that is what Marquette should stand for. We should be forgiving the sins of the past and reaching out to our brethren to make sure we treat all people with the dignity and respect. Now people are considered racist for believing such a thing. Marquette should be commended for programs such as EOP instead it doesn't go far enough because it doesn't get the attention it needs to prove the university is not racist. As a son of a minority who had to overcome obstacles in his life to provide for his family I take exception to the notion that you can't do things because of your skin color.... but that's what the underlying message of BLM is...with an objective so vague that it will linger without end. Wearing BLM on jerseys may make some people feel good, but in reality does more to divide than to make people equal.
All lives don't matter until Black lives matter.
Get it?
If you can't say Black lives matter, then you're saying all lives don't matter.
This isn't hard.
"It's Breast Cancer Awareness Month."
"To hell with that! All cancers matter!"
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 01:34:28 PM
OK, I am going to address this in a way that I hope will be helpful. Black lives matter is hardly meant to exclude. It is meant to draw attention to systemic racism. Everyone should be in favor of that! And everyone should be happy to proclaim that.
Of course all lives matter. No one really says they don't. But when people say that in reaction to "black lives matter," it serves to minimize what black lives matter stands for.
So perhaps you can provide some examples of the programs that the trained Marxists who started BLM are proposing to eliminate what you call systemic racism? Are their any laws currently on the books now that racially favor one group of U.S. Citizens over another?
My problem here is that everyone on this board has no problem with the idea of equal justice under the law. Many people here attempt to treat everyone in society with respect. JT92 is right with the statement of BLM's objective which is intentionally vague. It will never cease because the true intentions of the BLM movement and that of the Marxists who founded it are to divide this country and people. Only through division can they succeed. The "you're either with us or against us" mantra has to go. One can support black lives while also supporting all lives and one can support equal justice under the law without supporting factions (Maxists) who's intent is to subvert our rule of law and take away our liberty and way of life.
Quote from: jt92 on June 23, 2020, 01:18:26 PM
As I learned throughout my catholic upbringing we are ALL God's children. So when someone says all lives matter I believe that is what Marquette should stand for. We should be forgiving the sins of the past and reaching out to our brethren to make sure we treat all people with the dignity and respect. Now people are considered racist for believing such a thing. Marquette should be commended for programs such as EOP instead it doesn't go far enough because it doesn't get the attention it needs to prove the university is not racist. As a son of a minority who had to overcome obstacles in his life to provide for his family I take exception to the notion that you can't do things because of your skin color.... but that's what the underlying message of BLM is...with an objective so vague that it will linger without end. Wearing BLM on jerseys may make some people feel good, but in reality does more to divide than to make people equal.
Saying Black Lives Matters does not mean some other lives don't matter. All lives can't matter until black lives matter. You're living with your head in the sand if you don't think a person's skin color changes their life experiences.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on June 23, 2020, 02:06:41 PM
All lives don't matter until Black lives matter.
Get it?
If you can't say Black lives matter, then you're saying all lives don't matter.
This isn't hard.
Anybody who still doesn't understand doesn't care to understand.
https://people.com/sports/premier-league-teams-wear-black-lives-matter-uniforms-as-the-season-starts-after-covid-19-hiatus/
England wants Trump gone ASAP! Awesome!
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on June 23, 2020, 02:06:41 PM
All lives don't matter until Black lives matter.
Get it?
If you can't say Black lives matter, then you're saying all lives don't matter.
This isn't hard.
You are right, it isn't hard but it doesn't make any sense.
If you already believe black, white, brown, yellow, etc... lives matter, saying all lives matter includes each of those groups to the same extent. All, meaning everyone, no one group over the other. It's basic English. All lives have mattered for a while. Black, White, Brown, Yellow, etc... Saying all means that I'm not favoring any group over the other. In essence Equality which is the whole marching point here. This is why it isn't hard to say All and why it doesn't make much sense to only single out black or any other color if you are pushing equality.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 02:26:00 PM
https://people.com/sports/premier-league-teams-wear-black-lives-matter-uniforms-as-the-season-starts-after-covid-19-hiatus/
England wants Trump gone ASAP! Awesome!
Last I looked they ceded control of this land to the people in 1781.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 02:29:04 PM
You are right, it isn't hard but it doesn't make any sense.
If you already believe black, white, brown, yellow, etc... lives matter, saying all lives matter includes each of those groups to the same extent. All, meaning everyone, no one group over the other. It's basic English. All lives have mattered for a while. Black, White, Brown, Yellow, etc... Saying all means that I'm not favoring any group over the other. In essence Equality which is the whole marching point here. This is why it isn't hard to say All and why it doesn't make much sense to only single out black or any other color if you are pushing equality.
No see the bolded is wrong in reality. That's the whole point. We have not come to full grips with understanding how systemic racism impacts our society in various ways.
Saying "Black Lives Matter" hardly indicates that no one else's lives don't. It's a symbolic statement that drawns attention to, recognizes and attempts to correct the racism in our society.
Jesus: Blessed are the poor...
Half of Scoop: No, Jesus. Blessed are people of all income levels. Why are you trying to divide us?
Quote from: Pakuni on June 23, 2020, 02:41:42 PM
Jesus: Blessed are the poor...
Half of Scoop: No, Jesus. Blessed are people of all income levels. Why are you trying to divide us?
This actually got me laughing and is so true
Quote from: Pakuni on June 23, 2020, 02:41:42 PM
Jesus: Blessed are the poor...
Half of Scoop: No, Jesus. Blessed are people of all income levels. Why are you trying to divide us?
You win scoop for the day
(https://preview.redd.it/g26khzaqvc151.jpg?width=960&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=cd6b8acbc4b3ffe1269715524d01fa7f76b0eff8)
(https://preview.redd.it/mujlkcfmih351.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8fec6c0948fdbf33af8be2c5c99738cd37cd2acd)
Quote from: Pakuni on June 23, 2020, 02:41:42 PM
Jesus: Blessed are the poor...
Half of Scoop: No, Jesus. Blessed are people of all income levels. Why are you trying to divide us?
Outstanding.
I honestly cannot comprehend how people do not understand this. It's willingly sticking your head in the sand because you're on the beneficial end of the inequalities that are very, very obvious in this country.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 02:34:44 PM
Saying "Black Lives Matter" hardly indicates that no one else's lives don't. It's a symbolic statement that drawns attention to, recognizes and attempts to correct the racism in our society.
It does though. I believe police brutality is a huge issue in America and I've been told countless times in the last month that I cannot talk about the 75% of non-black people that are gunned down unarmed each year by our police. I weep for everyone that dies needlessly, not just for the ones with a certain amount of melanin in their skins. I refuse to be racial prejudiced in my actions or charity, you all are free to do that though. I love Marquette and have been a season ticket owner and donated yearly since graduation almost 20 years ago. I never thought I would ever give up my season tickets, but this will do it for me. I will not be racially prejudiced and refuse to support anyone that is...even one of my most favorite things in the world which is Marquette Basketball.
The latter part of this discussion is very entertaining.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 02:54:23 PM
It does though. I believe police brutality is a huge issue in America and I've been told countless times in the last month that I cannot talk about the 75% of non-black people that are gunned down unarmed each year by our police. I weep for everyone that dies needlessly, not just for the ones with a certain amount of melanin in their skins. I refuse to be racial prejudiced in my actions or charity, you all are free to do that though. I love Marquette and have been a season ticket owner and donated yearly since graduation almost 20 years ago. I never thought I would ever give up my season tickets, but this will do it for me. I will not be racially prejudiced and refuse to support anyone that is...even one of my most favorite things in the world which is Marquette Basketball.
You're focusing wayyy too small on deaths. Add shootings, arrests, and stops. Hell a neighbor of mine who's married to a white woman wont go to the in-laws up in Barrington because he was violently arrested while on a walk one day. They claimed there was a violent criminal who fit his description... in Barrington. Tell me when you go for a walk around a suburb do the police come and violently arrest you?
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 02:54:23 PM
It does though. I believe police brutality is a huge issue in America and I've been told countless times in the last month that I cannot talk about the 75% of non-black people that are gunned down unarmed each year by our police. I weep for everyone that dies needlessly, not just for the ones with a certain amount of melanin in their skins. I refuse to be racial prejudiced in my actions or charity, you all are free to do that though. I love Marquette and have been a season ticket owner and donated yearly since graduation almost 20 years ago. I never thought I would ever give up my season tickets, but this will do it for me. I will not be racially prejudiced and refuse to support anyone that is...even one of my most favorite things in the world which is Marquette Basketball.
<shrug> If you think Black Lives Matter implies that no one else's lives do, that is your own logical fault. I seemingly can't show you the fallacy. So if you have to end your association with Marquette basketball it's probably best for all parties involved.
(https://scontent-msp1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/103549897_10220025245733891_948322451376714463_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_sid=1480c5&_nc_ohc=cRujhBr0CLoAX_pi2IU&_nc_ht=scontent-msp1-1.xx&oh=5c8320116c4a7cd0c82dbcaee00545c6&oe=5F18CBF4)
My new favorite meme - WTF Jesus
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 02:54:23 PM
It does though. I believe police brutality is a huge issue in America and I've been told countless times in the last month that I cannot talk about the 75% of non-black people that are gunned down unarmed each year by our police. I weep for everyone that dies needlessly, not just for the ones with a certain amount of melanin in their skins. I refuse to be racial prejudiced in my actions or charity, you all are free to do that though. I love Marquette and have been a season ticket owner and donated yearly since graduation almost 20 years ago. I never thought I would ever give up my season tickets, but this will do it for me. I will not be racially prejudiced and refuse to support anyone that is...even one of my most favorite things in the world which is Marquette Basketball.
One more thing. The phrase "Black Lives Matter" doesn't imply "Only Black Lives Matter," it implies "Black Lives Matter Too."
And you truly care about the bolded, you will see that that's exactly what the movement is about. Ridding society of racial prejudice in actions and charity.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 03:05:06 PM
<shrug> If you think Black Lives Matter implies that no one else's lives do, that is your own logical fault. I seemingly can't show you the fallacy. So if you have to end your association with Marquette basketball it's probably best for all parties involved.
I don't think that and didn't think that at the beginning, I've been told that we can only focus on them right now though. I want all police brutality and injustices to stop, not just 25% of it. Dividing people by their skin color only stops that from happening.
The founding fathers had a great mantra. Beware the men of faction. As soon as you divide people, you allow division and dissolve unity. We are all in this together, stop dividing people based on the color of their skin.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 03:23:48 PM
I don't think that and didn't think that at the beginning, I've been told that we can only focus on them right now though.
No that's not true. That is what you are choosing to believe.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 03:23:48 PM
The founding fathers had a great mantra. Beware the men of faction. As soon as you divide people, you allow division and dissolve unity. We are all in this together, stop dividing people based on the color of their skin.
That is what you are choosing to do because you are misinterpreting a few words. Think abut that for a minute. You are engaging in division because you don't understand what a few words are implying. That's on you.
It's hard to get past all the violence and looting associated with BLM. It would be perceived to be more legitimate if it were a peaceful protest and I sure would like to see them show up in places like Chicago were Black Lives Matter just as much. I feel for those poor folks who have to endure so much tragedy in my home town.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 03:23:48 PM
I don't think that and didn't think that at the beginning, I've been told that we can only focus on them right now though. I want all police brutality and injustices to stop, not just 25% of it. Dividing people by their skin color only stops that from happening.
The founding fathers had a great mantra. Beware the men of faction. As soon as you divide people, you allow division and dissolve unity. We are all in this together, stop dividing people based on the color of their skin.
Did they say that before or after Jefferson and Madison conspired to obstruct Hamilton's financial program, one they considered dangerous and divisive for the new union?
You are actively choosing not to get "Black lives matter." That's 100% on you.
"We are Marquette!"
"Why aren't we all colleges and universities?"
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on June 23, 2020, 03:39:11 PM
It's hard to get past all the violence and looting associated with BLM. It would be perceived to be more legitimate if it were a peaceful protest and I sure would like to see them show up in places like Chicago were Black Lives Matter just as much. I feel for those poor folks who have to endure so much tragedy in my home town.
The vast majority of protests have been peaceful and much of the violence has been perpetrated by people who aren't there to protest. Don't let it distract you.
Wait I'm all confused.
Through the last century alone much bloodshed has been shed. For example:
The English and French hated the Germans. The Irish have hated the English and the southern Irish have even hated the northern Irish. All the same race.
Meanwhile in Asia the Chinese and Japanese hated each other and probably still do. The same race.
Africa - Hutus and Tutsis killed each other. The same race.
The Iraqis hated the Iranians. The same race.
The Indians have sparred with Pakistan. Mostly the same race.
Now we're supposed to believe in fancy terms like systematic racism as to why man has been inclined to disagree, vote differently, spar politically, fight and even wage war over such issues as economics, land disputes, ambition, propaganda, and even secret alliances related to some guy named Franz Ferdinand?
Or perhaps it's in our human DNA and these types of intense disagreements have manifested themselves in an ugly manner since the beginning of time and will most certainty continue in our future as well.
I have dated girls of other races that I have a had a much stronger mental/political connection than girls of my own race. The world is a complicated place and even people within the same family will see issues completely differently.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 03:23:48 PM
I don't think that and didn't think that at the beginning, I've been told that we can only focus on them right now though. I want all police brutality and injustices to stop, not just 25% of it. Dividing people by their skin color only stops that from happening.
The founding fathers had a great mantra. Beware the men of faction. As soon as you divide people, you allow division and dissolve unity. We are all in this together, stop dividing people based on the color of their skin.
What's funny is this has been the most unifying thing I can remember in my lifetime in the USA. Yes there are people like you, Lenny, and a few others who burry their head in the sand so they can claim that Marquette is making a political statement rather than understanding that Marquette is speaking out against the oppression that minorities have faced in this country since Christopher Columbus invaded the Native Americans and their land. But I've never seen white, black, brown, and any other skin colors come together across America...and then entire world!...and walk together as one. You can hole up in your home and refuse to acknowledge the cause, but that doesn't make you right.
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 03:42:22 PM
Wait I'm all confused.
Through the last century alone much bloodshed has been shed. For example:
The English and French hated the Germans. The Irish have hated the English and the southern Irish have even hated the northern Irish. All the same race.
Meanwhile in Asia the Chinese and Japanese hated each other and probably still do. The same race.
Africa - Hutus and Tutsis killed each other. The same race.
The Iraqis hated the Iranians. The same race.
The Indians have sparred with Pakistan. Mostly the same race.
Now we're supposed to believe in fancy terms like systematic racism as to why man has been inclined to disagree, vote differently, spar politically, fight and even wage war over such issues as economics, land disputes, ambition, propaganda, and even secret alliances related to some guy named Franz Ferdinand?
Or perhaps it's in our human DNA and these types of intense disagreements have manifested themselves in an ugly manner since the beginning of time and will most certainty continue in our future as well.
I have dated girls of other races that I have a had a much stronger mental/political connection than girls of my own race. The world is a complicated place and even people within the same family will see issues completely differently.
I agree with this analysis.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 02:34:44 PM
Saying "Black Lives Matter" hardly indicates that no one else's lives don't. It's a symbolic statement that drawns attention to, recognizes and attempts to correct the racism in our society.
Ahh, but here is where the problem is and many fall into this category. For those that have always viewed people from the same platform, they say All lives matter and yes, they really do. The problem is that in today's back and forth, the All lives matter crowd are the ones being viewed as the racists. To be honest, that pisses a lot of people off. They are merely acceding the black lives crowd what it has always wanted and deserved which is equality. Anything more would be considered favoritism. Unfortunately, the "All lives won't matter until Black lives matter" statement in itself provides no end in their eyes. When do you ever reach that as a whole? Why is someone who already believes everyone is equal under the law a racist? In the end, there's really no policing it. As far as systemic, I do not know of one law currently on the books that blatantly favors one group of citizens over another. As I mentioned before, the BLM group was founded by Maxists. Marxists' stated goal is to divide. They will always keep coming up with new ways to continue to divide. You solve the Systemic Racism and then you move on to Systemic Oppression, then something else. When your goal is to divide, you don't stop until the country is so fractured, it can't be governed. Then you have anarchy which is followed by communism which in the end, it doesn't matter whether you care about black, brown, yellow or white because all that matters is the state and if the state wants to eliminate you, they will. Which is why, the best way to view this is to hold dear that All lives matter equally under the law and you try to build forward from there. Hard to divide when all means everyone.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 03:43:25 PM
What's funny is this has been the most unifying thing I can remember in my lifetime in the USA. Yes there are people like you, Lenny, and a few others who burry their head in the sand so they can claim that Marquette is making a political statement rather than understanding that Marquette is speaking out against the oppression that minorities have faced in this country since Christopher Columbus invaded the Native Americans and their land. But I've never seen white, black, brown, and any other skin colors come together across America...and then entire world!...and walk together as one. You can hole up in your home and refuse to acknowledge the cause, but that doesn't make you right.
Marquette is making a political statement. Not everyone agrees with their statement. That includes people with white, black, brown and other skin colors who have a completely different world view.
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on June 23, 2020, 03:39:11 PM
It's hard to get past all the violence and looting associated with BLM. It would be perceived to be more legitimate if it were a peaceful protest and I sure would like to see them show up in places like Chicago were Black Lives Matter just as much. I feel for those poor folks who have to endure so much tragedy in my home town.
Do you believe that the bad actions of some cops make the entire idea of police bad?
I'm going to assume your answer to that question is "No."
Then why are you making a blanket indictment of BLM based on the actions of a few?
But I am glad to know that you will fully support all of the athletes who are going to peacefully protest by taking a knee during the national anthem.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 03:46:35 PM
Ahh, but here is where the problem is and many fall into this category. For those that have always viewed people from the same platform, they say All lives matter and yes, they really do. The problem is that in today's back and forth, the All lives matter crowd are the ones being viewed as the racists. To be honest, that pisses a lot of people off. They are merely acceding the black lives crowd what it has always wanted and deserved which is equality. Anything more would be considered favoritism. Unfortunately, the "All lives won't matter until Black lives matter" statement in itself provides no end in their eyes. When do you ever reach that as a whole? Why is someone who already believes everyone is equal under the law a racist? In the end, there's really no policing it. As far as systemic, I do not know of one law currently on the books that blatantly favors one group of citizens over another. As I mentioned before, the BLM group was founded by Maxists. Marxists' stated goal is to divide. They will always keep coming up with new ways to continue to divide. You solve the Systemic Racism and then you move on to Systemic Oppression, then something else. When your goal is to divide, you don't stop until the country is so fractured, it can't be governed. Then you have anarchy which is followed by communism which in the end, it doesn't matter whether you care about black, brown, yellow or white because all that matters is the state and if the state wants to eliminate you, they will. Which is why, the best way to view this is to hold dear that All lives matter equally under the law and you try to build forward from there. Hard to divide when all means everyone.
Look, the difference between BLM the movement and BLM, Inc. has been explained repeatedly.
Again, no one disputes that "all lives matter." It is when you use that phrase in response to "black lives matter" that it serves to downplay the issues it is meant to address.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 03:46:35 PM
Ahh, but here is where the problem is and many fall into this category. For those that have always viewed people from the same platform, they say All lives matter and yes, they really do. The problem is that in today's back and forth, the All lives matter crowd are the ones being viewed as the racists. To be honest, that pisses a lot of people off. They are merely acceding the black lives crowd what it has always wanted and deserved which is equality. Anything more would be considered favoritism. Unfortunately, the "All lives won't matter until Black lives matter" statement in itself provides no end in their eyes. When do you ever reach that as a whole? Why is someone who already believes everyone is equal under the law a racist? In the end, there's really no policing it. As far as systemic, I do not know of one law currently on the books that blatantly favors one group of citizens over another. As I mentioned before, the BLM group was founded by Maxists. Marxists' stated goal is to divide. They will always keep coming up with new ways to continue to divide. You solve the Systemic Racism and then you move on to Systemic Oppression, then something else. When your goal is to divide, you don't stop until the country is so fractured, it can't be governed. Then you have anarchy which is followed by communism which in the end, it doesn't matter whether you care about black, brown, yellow or white because all that matters is the state and if the state wants to eliminate you, they will. Which is why, the best way to view this is to hold dear that All lives matter equally under the law and you try to build forward from there. Hard to divide when all means everyone.
Black Lives Matter=Communists.
Communists nothing more than a vehicle for a select few to oppress an entire population.
I prefer capitalism. The power of capitalism enabled me to over come the social challenges I faced in life.
People need to look inward to solve their problems. Intestinal Fortitude is not an easy thing to have. When the schools started on the grievance based society, those in the bottom rung of society were hurt the most. Taught them to blame others rather than working harder.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 03:47:06 PM
Marquette is making a political statement. Not everyone agrees with their statement. That includes people with white, black, brown and other skin colors who have a completely different world view.
Yeah they're really not. And in fact the entire Big East is making the same statement, that they're going to speak out against systemic racism and police brutality against black people. If you want to disagree with their statement then you probably shouldn't be a fan of a sport where the majority of its players are black.
And come November it won't be just the Big East that makes this statement, either.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 03:58:31 PM
Black Lives Matter=Communists.
Communists nothing more than a vehicle for a select few to oppress an entire population.
I prefer capitalism. The power of capitalism enabled me to over come the social challenges I faced in life.
People need to look inward to solve their problems. Intestinal Fortitude is not an easy thing to have. When the schools started on the grievance based society, those in the bottom rung of society were hurt the most. Taught them to blame others rather than working harder.
Lol. What an idiot.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 03:46:35 PM
Ahh, but here is where the problem is and many fall into this category. For those that have always viewed people from the same platform, they say All lives matter and yes, they really do. The problem is that in today's back and forth, the All lives matter crowd are the ones being viewed as the racists. To be honest, that pisses a lot of people off. They are merely acceding the black lives crowd what it has always wanted and deserved which is equality. Anything more would be considered favoritism. Unfortunately, the "All lives won't matter until Black lives matter" statement in itself provides no end in their eyes. When do you ever reach that as a whole? Why is someone who already believes everyone is equal under the law a racist? In the end, there's really no policing it. As far as systemic, I do not know of one law currently on the books that blatantly favors one group of citizens over another. As I mentioned before, the BLM group was founded by Maxists. Marxists' stated goal is to divide. They will always keep coming up with new ways to continue to divide. You solve the Systemic Racism and then you move on to Systemic Oppression, then something else. When your goal is to divide, you don't stop until the country is so fractured, it can't be governed. Then you have anarchy which is followed by communism which in the end, it doesn't matter whether you care about black, brown, yellow or white because all that matters is the state and if the state wants to eliminate you, they will. Which is why, the best way to view this is to hold dear that All lives matter equally under the law and you try to build forward from there. Hard to divide when all means everyone.
But all lives don't matter equally in the USA. Maybe you'll pull your head out of the sand someday. Maybe you won't. My guess is you'll keep telling yourself that in the great USA all lives matter equally, despite all the evidence that suggests that's not the case. And you'll be on the wrong side of history while people actually make attempts to move towards the equality you somehow have told yourself there is in this country and you'll call people communists for it. Which is insane.
I'd tell you to go and watch "Thirteenth" on Netflix, but I know you'd rather remain ignorant to the problems in this country and say, "Well, there are no laws that are blatantly racist so we're good here! Equality for all!" It's not reality, but that won't stop people from claiming equality is a real thing in this country.
9-9-9, you see yourself as a very influential, self-made man.
Pick up the effen phone, call Lovell, and tell him exactly what Marquette should and shouldn't be doing re those commies from BLM. I'm sure he'll listen to you.
And if he balks even a little, I highly recommend countering with, "Do you know who I am?"
There's a line that always works, at least according to the research reports I read.
And failing that, you should sit down all those big-necked pogo sticks and tell them exactly how young black men today should really think. They'd be very receptive to advice from a man of your status. Make sure you tell 'em how to make a roofie, too. Good life skill.
Here's my question, and i ask because I really don't know...Why is it that the many prominent black people that have spoken out AGAINST the BLM movement and what it stands for are disregarded and "who cares what they say/think"?? I've heard comments from many blacks that have said just that and all of a sudden those black people aren't important. Why?? Who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports BLM are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of this big movement about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent black people being "listened" to?? That's where I get confused.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 04:13:33 PM
Here's my question, and i ask because I really don't know...Why is it that the many prominent black people that have spoken out AGAINST the BLM movement and what it stands for are disregarded and "who cares what they say/think"?? I've heard comments from many blacks that have said just that and all of a sudden those black people aren't important. Why?? Who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports BLM are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of this big movement about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent black people being "listened" to?? That's where I get confused.
Because the overwhelming collective voice is pushing against them. Because they have found ways to benefit from the systemic racism that has generally oppressed black people in America and choose to speak in favor only of themselves and not the greater whole.
People can advocate for systems that disenfranchise them just as easily as other people can advocate against systems that help them. Change generally comes when people who have influence and privilege are willing to speak out against that privilege even if it will cost them in the long run but will also help more people than themselves.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 04:13:33 PM
Here's my question, and i ask because I really don't know...Why is it that the many prominent black people that have spoken out AGAINST the BLM movement and what it stands for are disregarded and "who cares what they say/think"?? I've heard comments from many blacks that have said just that and all of a sudden those black people aren't important. Why?? Who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports BLM are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of this big movement about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent black people being "listened" to?? That's where I get confused.
I ask this because I really don't know ... please provide a couple of links to articles about all the prominent black people who are AGAINST the BLM movement.
While I wait, guru, I'll think about all the Republicans who are against the current president, spending big bucks and making a huge effort to get his opponent elected. Who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports the current president are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of being a Republican about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent Republicans being "listened" to by Trump supporters like you?? That's where I get confused.
Thanks!
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 03:42:22 PM
Wait I'm all confused.
Through the last century alone much bloodshed has been shed. For example:
The English and French hated the Germans. The Irish have hated the English and the southern Irish have even hated the northern Irish. All the same race.
Meanwhile in Asia the Chinese and Japanese hated each other and probably still do. The same race.
Africa - Hutus and Tutsis killed each other. The same race.
The Iraqis hated the Iranians. The same race.
The Indians have sparred with Pakistan. Mostly the same race.
Now we're supposed to believe in fancy terms like systematic racism as to why man has been inclined to disagree, vote differently, spar politically, fight and even wage war over such issues as economics, land disputes, ambition, propaganda, and even secret alliances related to some guy named Franz Ferdinand?
Or perhaps it's in our human DNA and these types of intense disagreements have manifested themselves in an ugly manner since the beginning of time and will most certainty continue in our future as well.
I have dated girls of other races that I have a had a much stronger mental/political connection than girls of my own race. The world is a complicated place and even people within the same family will see issues completely differently.
Some of your examples of "the same race" is only accurate if you meant human race.
(https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2020/06/PSDT_06.12.20_protests-00-1.png?resize=310,416)
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 04:00:02 PM
Lol. What an idiot.
Actually Herman is extremely on point here. For a guy who is excited about England supposedly wanting to get rid of Trump; as if that means anything, the idiot comment is priceless. Apparently with you as a small exception, most Americans don't give 2 sh!ts about what other countries feel about America.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 04:31:29 PM
Actually Herman is extremely on point here. For a guy who is excited about England supposedly wanting to get rid of Trump; as if that means anything, the idiot comment is priceless. Apparently with you as a small exception, most Americans don't give 2 sh!ts about what other countries feel about America.
This is part of the problem. We as a nation used to pride ourselves on being leaders in the world. We led with our economy, we led with our morals, we led with our strength. Now that we've crashed our economy twice in little over a decade, walked away from our morals, and appear weak, suddenly we don't want to hear what the rest of the world thinks. It might be from a fictional show, but this hasn't stopped being true from the first moment it aired:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTjMqda19wk
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 03:42:22 PM
Wait I'm all confused.
Through the last century alone much bloodshed has been shed. For example:
The English and French hated the Germans. The Irish have hated the English and the southern Irish have even hated the northern Irish. All the same race.
Meanwhile in Asia the Chinese and Japanese hated each other and probably still do. The same race.
Africa - Hutus and Tutsis killed each other. The same race.
The Iraqis hated the Iranians. The same race.
The Indians have sparred with Pakistan. Mostly the same race.
Now we're supposed to believe in fancy terms like systematic racism as to why man has been inclined to disagree, vote differently, spar politically, fight and even wage war over such issues as economics, land disputes, ambition, propaganda, and even secret alliances related to some guy named Franz Ferdinand?
Or perhaps it's in our human DNA and these types of intense disagreements have manifested themselves in an ugly manner since the beginning of time and will most certainty continue in our future as well.
I have dated girls of other races that I have a had a much stronger mental/political connection than girls of my own race. The world is a complicated place and even people within the same family will see issues completely differently.
That's not how race works. In our American/Western mindset we might see Indians and Pakistanis as the same "race" but Indians and Pakistanis don't see it that way. Hutus and Tutsis did not see each other as the same race. Hell, European-Americans in the 1800s didn't see the Irish as the same race. Race is a social construct and is dependent on the society you live in.
Quote from: MU82 on June 23, 2020, 04:08:19 PM
9-9-9, you see yourself as a very influential, self-made man.
Pick up the effen phone, call Lovell, and tell him exactly what Marquette should and shouldn't be doing re those commies from BLM. I'm sure he'll listen to you.
And if he balks even a little, I highly recommend countering with, "Do you know who I am?"
There's a line that always works, at least according to the research reports I read.
And failing that, you should sit down all those big-necked pogo sticks and tell them exactly how young black men today should really think. They'd be very receptive to advice from a man of your status. Make sure you tell 'em how to make a roofie, too. Good life skill.
Yep a fake persona a troll. 9-9-9
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 03:46:35 PM
As far as systemic, I do not know of one law currently on the books that blatantly favors one group of citizens over another.
The laws might not favor one group over another (I'd argue that they do, but that's another point entirely). However, the SYSTEMS and INSTITUTIONS still do. Sure, the penalty for smoking dope might be the same for Whites and Blacks "under the law," but the reality is that many many more Blacks are in jail for marijuana possession that Whites. That's a SYSTEMIC issue.
Read the New Jim Crow. Then we can talk about systemic racism.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 03:58:31 PM
Black Lives Matter=Communists.
Communists nothing more than a vehicle for a select few to oppress an entire population.
I prefer capitalism. The power of capitalism enabled me to over come the social challenges I faced in life.
People need to look inward to solve their problems. Intestinal Fortitude is not an easy thing to have. When the schools started on the grievance based society, those in the bottom rung of society were hurt the most. Taught them to blame others rather than working harder.
Typical talking points of alt-right
Colonel West represents my view point on the matter
https://youtu.be/RqGaTPNoKRU
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 04:31:29 PM
Actually Herman is extremely on point here. For a guy who is excited about England supposedly wanting to get rid of Trump; as if that means anything, the idiot comment is priceless. Apparently with you as a small exception, most Americans don't give 2 sh!ts about what other countries feel about America.
Herman is not even real
Quote from: MU82 on June 23, 2020, 04:21:58 PM
I ask this because I really don't know ... please provide a couple of links to articles about all the prominent black people who are AGAINST the BLM movement.
While I wait, guru, I'll think about all the Republicans who are against the current president, spending big bucks and making a huge effort to get his opponent elected. Who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports the current president are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of being a Republican about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent Republicans being "listened" to by Trump supporters like you?? That's where I get confused.
Thanks!
Okay I will start with this one...this is Muhammad Ali's son who says his dad would be against the BLM AND The protests over George Floyd's death... https://news.yahoo.com/muhammad-alis-son-said-dad-174437494.html
Here's Candace Owens...https://heavy.com/news/2020/06/candace-owens-george-floyd/
Terrence Williams...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ4QCtXsSpQ
This is from 4 years ago but still relevant to the topic...Milwaukee's own Sheriff David Clarke https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/sheriff-david-clarke-its-time-to-stand-up-to-black-lives-matter
Florida police officer Jay Stalien...https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-36777582
Professor Carol Swain...https://www.cnn.com/2016/07/09/politics/carol-swain-black-lives-matter-smerconish/index.html
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 04:59:31 PM
Colonel West represents my view point on the matter
https://youtu.be/RqGaTPNoKRU
Of course you would. A guy who had to leave the military in disgrace for beating an Iraqi policeman and faking his execution. Your kind of person.....
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 23, 2020, 04:44:24 PM
This is part of the problem. We as a nation used to pride ourselves on being leaders in the world. We led with our economy, we led with our morals, we led with our strength. Now that we've crashed our economy twice in little over a decade, walked away from our morals, and appear weak, suddenly we don't want to hear what the rest of the world thinks. It might be from a fictional show, but this hasn't stopped being true from the first moment it aired:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTjMqda19wk
Great powerful moment in tv
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 05:03:29 PM
Okay I will start with this one...this is Muhammad Ali's son who says his dad would be against the BLM AND The protests over George Floyd's death... https://news.yahoo.com/muhammad-alis-son-said-dad-174437494.html
Here's Candace Owens...https://heavy.com/news/2020/06/candace-owens-george-floyd/
Terrence Williams...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ4QCtXsSpQ
This is from 4 years ago but still relevant to the topic...Milwaukee's own Sheriff David Clarke https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/sheriff-david-clarke-its-time-to-stand-up-to-black-lives-matter
Florida police officer Jay Stalien...https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-36777582
Professor Carol Swain...https://www.cnn.com/2016/07/09/politics/carol-swain-black-lives-matter-smerconish/index.html
This is cool and all but you do realize this represents a minority view in the Black community.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 04:03:19 PM
But all lives don't matter equally in the USA. Maybe you'll pull your head out of the sand someday. Maybe you won't. My guess is you'll keep telling yourself that in the great USA all lives matter equally, despite all the evidence that suggests that's not the case. And you'll be on the wrong side of history while people actually make attempts to move towards the equality you somehow have told yourself there is in this country and you'll call people communists for it. Which is insane.
I'd tell you to go and watch "Thirteenth" on Netflix, but I know you'd rather remain ignorant to the problems in this country and say, "Well, there are no laws that are blatantly racist so we're good here! Equality for all!" It's not reality, but that won't stop people from claiming equality is a real thing in this country.
Unfortunately, do yourself a favor and move away from Netflix as your primary source of news. The leaders of BLM stated they are Marxists. You can check other news sites or wait a year and half for the Netflix special to come out on it. By the way, this country was founded on Liberty, not equality. The founders of the country specifically did not view the "Equality" model the French based their system on was a system that promoted what was the true focus of their dream which was Liberty or Freedom. Can you have Liberty with Equality? Actually, you can't and they recognized this right away. I think most people would rather have the freedom. You know what form of system also favors Equality? Communism. Look it up, or I'm sure there's a Netflix movie on it extolling all its virtues which is why it's generally failed everywhere it's been implemented. As far as me telling myself All lives matter. I'm asking you but maybe I shouldn't because you've already proven yourself to be of suspect intelligence, if I take that viewpoint in my daily actions, doesn't that solve the problem one person at a time? I think it does. Or is the head in the sand approach the one you have, fueled by some guilt that a group has been oppressed (it has) and you have to do something about it by virtue signalling others how to think. Trillions of dollars have been spent to solve the problem you are speaking of today and yet it's just gotten worse. The reason is the same people patting you on the back for being such a useful idiot are the same people who have dumped all that money down a rabbit hole only to see the groups that money was intended to help fall further behind, all the while they have gotten wealthy on your guilt and victim politics. The strong majority of blacks want school choice, yet the same people you likely support at the polls are against this idea.
BTW, the fact that there are in fact NO (0) laws on the books that favor one group of citizens over another group is not just a statement that nothing can be done. It simply states that the "systemic racism" angle is not easily provable. You also can't have a functioning society if the opposite were the case. Equal justice under the law is what ALL people want. Equal outcomes is not guaranteed through Liberty and while everyone thinks it would be just peachy to have it, they would grow to hate such a system. My guess is if you do some research - Netflix for you, and find out who has mostly benefited from or hijacked the trillions of dollars that have been spent to fight poverty, you'll find that many of them have alleged support of black community but have done nothing for them. But what do I know, I'm just a guy with head in the sands dreams of treating everyone the way I want to be treated, while knowing that the problem you are looking to solve starts there. Not pitting one group against another. I also know that if this country was so bad, why does everyone in the world of all races, cultures and creeds still want to come here. It's because this is still the best place in the world - despite the efforts of fools like you.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 05:29:39 PM
Unfortunately, do yourself a favor and move away from Netflix as your primary source of news. The leaders of BLM stated they are Marxists. You can check other news sites or wait a year and half for the Netflix special to come out on it. By the way, this country was founded on Liberty, not equality. The founders of the country specifically did not view the "Equality" model the French based their system on was a system that promoted what was the true focus of their dream which was Liberty or Freedom. Can you have Liberty with Equality? Actually, you can't and they recognized this right away. I think most people would rather have the freedom. You know what form of system also favors Equality? Communism. Look it up, or I'm sure there's a Netflix movie on it extolling all its virtues which is why it's generally failed everywhere it's been implemented. As far as me telling myself All lives matter. I'm asking you but maybe I shouldn't because you've already proven yourself to be of suspect intelligence, if I take that viewpoint in my daily actions, doesn't that solve the problem one person at a time? I think it does. Or is the head in the sand approach the one you have, fueled by some guilt that a group has been oppressed (it has) and you have to do something about it by virtue signalling others how to think. Trillions of dollars have been spent to solve the problem you are speaking of today and yet it's just gotten worse. The reason is the same people patting you on the back for being such a useful idiot are the same people who have dumped all that money down a rabbit hole only to see the groups that money was intended to help fall further behind, all the while they have gotten wealthy on your guilt and victim politics. The strong majority of blacks want school choice, yet the same people you likely support at the polls are against this idea.
BTW, the fact that there are in fact NO (0) laws on the books that favor one group of citizens over another group is not just a statement that nothing can be done. It simply states that the "systemic racism" angle is not easily provable. You also can't have a functioning society if the opposite were the case. Equal justice under the law is what ALL people want. Equal outcomes is not guaranteed through Liberty and while everyone thinks it would be just peachy to have it, they would grow to hate such a system. My guess is if you do some research - Netflix for you, and find out who has mostly benefited from or hijacked the trillions of dollars that have been spent to fight poverty, you'll find that many of them have alleged support of black community but have done nothing for them. But what do I know, I'm just a guy with head in the sands dreams of treating everyone the way I want to be treated, while knowing that the problem you are looking to solve starts there. Not pitting one group against another. I also know that if this country was so bad, why does everyone in the world of all races, cultures and creeds still want to come here. It's because this is still the best place in the world - despite the efforts of fools like you.
AKA I'd rather have my head in the sand and call people Communists than actually educate myself on the issues.
Sounds about right. MAGA!
PS Thanks for stopping by Ners.
Marquette is on the right side of history and young African-American athletes are beginning to assert their power. A lot of people are terrified. Marquette isn't. The Big East isn't. Nor should they be
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 23, 2020, 04:44:24 PM
This is part of the problem. We as a nation used to pride ourselves on being leaders in the world. We led with our economy, we led with our morals, we led with our strength. Now that we've crashed our economy twice in little over a decade, walked away from our morals, and appear weak, suddenly we don't want to hear what the rest of the world thinks. It might be from a fictional show, but this hasn't stopped being true from the first moment it aired:
Brew, it's from a fictional show which while it's point is all nice and warm, it's from Hollywood and it's a written script. It's not real. May feel real to you and it may be what most of the mainstream press corps feels and it might have some ring to it. But it's not what the majority of Americans feel because many people share the values that he speaks of when he says we used to be. When I say America is the best, it's the best because when the chips are down, we work together to fix the problems. This country is far from perfect but still better than all. In this day where everything seems to be polarizing the one thing to take pride in is that there is still a debate on how to become better. When that debate stops, that is when all is truly lost.
Quote from: joparks on June 23, 2020, 05:48:47 PM
Brew, it's from a fictional show which while it's point is all nice and warm, it's from Hollywood and it's a written script. It's not real. May feel real to you and it may be what most of the mainstream press corps feels and it might have some ring to it. But it's not what the majority of Americans feel because many people share the values that he speaks of when he says we used to be. When I say America is the best, it's the best because when the chips are down, we work together to fix the problems. This country is far from perfect but still better than all. In this day where everything seems to be polarizing the one thing to take pride in is that there is still a debate on how to become better. When that debate stops, that is when all is truly lost.
I always have to ask myself...if America is such a racist country, why do so many immigrants want to come here then?? Doesn't that kind of defeat the argument?
A lot of ignorance here. Denying that racism is a problem in America is absolutely insane. But hey some people living in Yemen would rather come to America than live in their war torn country so obviously racism isn't an issue here!
I honestly can't believe Marquette graduates are this ignorant.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 05:46:08 PM
AKA I'd rather have my head in the sand and call people Communists than actually educate myself on the issues.
Sounds about right. MAGA!
PS Thanks for stopping by Ners.
I mean, he is NOT wrong...facts do matter..the founder did say they are trained marxists. Now, people in America are really and truly okay with Marxism in this country?? I would certainly hope not, and if you are, maybe you need to really ask yourself if you belong in America.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdpIIiBe7Wc
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 05:46:08 PM
AKA I'd rather have my head in the sand and call people Communists than actually educate myself on the issues.
Sounds about right. MAGA!
PS Thanks for stopping by Ners.
That's literally what I was going to say.
You can also highlight cliches in his post and get an alt-right BINGO
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 05:54:01 PM
I always have to ask myself...if America is such a racist country, why do so many immigrants want to come here then?? Doesn't that kind of defeat the argument?
Because the US in Latin America is depicted as a perfect utopia, they find the myth is not true once here. Others leave totalitarian governments (we are on our way), others leave because they're threatened by gangs etc. If you are lucky to have a degree in many of the professions that there is more demand than available workforce you can obviously make more money, the US will welcome you with open arms (that changed today), but once here you will be treated differently by many of your peers.
Quote from: jesmu84 on June 23, 2020, 06:13:29 PM
That's literally what I was going to say.
You can also highlight cliches in his post and get an alt-right BINGO
You can read many posters here and clearly understand that they are part of the radical left as well. Those in glass houses...
Quote from: jesmu84 on June 23, 2020, 06:13:29 PM
That's literally what I was going to say.
You can also highlight cliches in his post and get an alt-right BINGO
Alt-right Bingo? Cliches in the post. Rather than trying to break it down word for word trying to find hidden clues, how about taking the whole post together. If you guys don't think your "mainstream" posts in this echo chamber aren't filled with cliches from the Democrat party, please, feel free to come down from your ivory tower.
This is a great moment for Marquette and the Big East. Say what you will about Wojo but he's identified coaches that are leaders of young men. Brett Nelson and Stan Johnson have head jobs. Coach Killings will be a head coach one day, too.
Quote from: WithoutBias on June 23, 2020, 06:01:19 PM
A lot of ignorance here. Denying that racism is a problem in America is absolutely insane. But hey some people living in Yemen would rather come to America than live in their war torn country so obviously racism isn't an issue here!
I honestly can't believe Marquette graduates are this ignorant.
Of course if you don't agree with me you are a racist. Come on..you are the ignorant one. No one is denying racism..please what a disgusting thing to say. Cheap political shot. What a shame.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 05:03:29 PM
Okay I will start with this one...this is Muhammad Ali's son who says his dad would be against the BLM AND The protests over George Floyd's death... https://news.yahoo.com/muhammad-alis-son-said-dad-174437494.html
Here's Candace Owens...https://heavy.com/news/2020/06/candace-owens-george-floyd/
Terrence Williams...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ4QCtXsSpQ
This is from 4 years ago but still relevant to the topic...Milwaukee's own Sheriff David Clarke https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/sheriff-david-clarke-its-time-to-stand-up-to-black-lives-matter
Florida police officer Jay Stalien...https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-36777582
Professor Carol Swain...https://www.cnn.com/2016/07/09/politics/carol-swain-black-lives-matter-smerconish/index.html
Thanks, guru. I could make talk down each of those, would be very easy to do, but I won't. I asked for some links and you provided them, so I'll thank you and let them stand on their own.
Given that the vast, vast, vast majority of black Americans support BLM (see the poll I posted) -- and, indeed, the vast majority of Americans, period, regardless of race, support BLM -- it was good you were able to find some clips of some black people who don't. Maybe can make you and Ners/jo and a few other queasy white folks feel better about yourselves.
Marquette's black players and coaches appear to be siding with the vast majority of those who support BLM. Same seems true of those from other Big East teams. So when they get those BLM patches on their uniforms, and talk about BLM at press conferences, and maybe take a knee during the anthem, you, like others who are opposed to this "Marxist" movement, will have a tough decision to make. We'll see if you have the same courage of your conviction as our Marquette student-athletes do.
Now, I look forward to you responding to the rest of my post and giving similar thought to the voices from Republican Voters Against Trump, The Lincoln Project and other similar conservative groups that truly include some prominent names (yes, even more prominent than Ali's son that nobody has ever heard of). As you asked, who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports the current president are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of being a Republican about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent Republicans being "listened" to by Trump supporters like you?? That's where I get confused.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 05:26:32 PM
This is cool and all but you do realize this represents a minority view in the Black community.
You were extremely generous. I mean not the best examples. And Ali's son somehow didn't really know who he was. The guy was willing to go to jail to protest racism over Vietnam wall and joined Malcom X. Very doubtful he would be against BLM and pro Trump. Candace Owens I doubt muguru knows the real story of the mercenary nut. MKE's ex-police chief LOL he would have joined the KKK if they accepted him. The more I read guru's posts the more I feel for him totally out of touch.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 06:53:49 PM
You were extremely generous. I mean not the best examples. And Ali's son somehow didn't really know who he was. The guy was willing to go to jail to protest racism over Vietnam wall and joined Malcom X. Very doubtful he would be against BLM and pro Trump. Candace Owens I doubt muguru knows the real story of the mercenary nut. MKE's ex-police chief LOL he would have joined the KKK if they accepted him. The more I read guru's posts the more I feel for him totally out of touch.
Newsie there are many people that support your view here.
For those that want more info I would look to Theo and Sacar's stories/interviews. I would also ask MU to have the coaches and team to continue to communicate why this is important. Just listen before judging.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 04:52:51 PM
Yep a fake persona a troll. 9-9-9
After all these years, it's amazing how many people here fail to realize that Herman is as real as Santa Claus.
Quote from: duanewade on June 23, 2020, 03:42:22 PM
Wait I'm all confused.
May be the only accurate sentence you've ever written here
And congrats. Admitting you have a problem is a crucial first step.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 06:03:20 PM
I mean, he is NOT wrong...facts do matter..the founder did say they are trained marxists. Now, people in America are really and truly okay with Marxism in this country?? I would certainly hope not, and if you are, maybe you need to really ask yourself if you belong in America.
I guess you missed the dozen explanations above about the difference between the BLM movement and the nonprofit that co-opted the name.
One more time.
I concede that racism is a real problem in the US. Fighting it is a noble and just cause.
I believe that Black Lives Matter and see nothing wrong with the idea, the sentiment or the slogan.
I support all who march peacefully in hopes of producing a more just society.
I don't, however, support people with their heads in the sand. BLM is not a movement/organization co-opted by a few crazy Marxists. It is an organization/movement formed by and still led by committed Marxists. The only path they see to black equality is the worldwide adoption of Marxist principles. The people who do not know this (and I suspect it's the vast majority of those who have recently joined the movement) are the ones with their heads in the sand. To date, I have seen nothing anywhere about members or leaders of the "movement" repudiating the goals of the founders and leaders of the "organization". I'll gladly support a movement to end systemic racism. I'd even (perish the thought) march arm in arm with Wades in its pursuit. But not if Marxism is the end game.
Quote from: MU82 on June 23, 2020, 06:36:59 PM
Thanks, guru. I could make talk down each of those, would be very easy to do, but I won't. I asked for some links and you provided them, so I'll thank you and let them stand on their own.
Given that the vast, vast, vast majority of black Americans support BLM (see the poll I posted) -- and, indeed, the vast majority of Americans, period, regardless of race, support BLM -- it was good you were able to find some clips of some black people who don't. Maybe can make you and Ners/jo and a few other queasy white folks feel better about yourselves.
Marquette's black players and coaches appear to be siding with the vast majority of those who support BLM. Same seems true of those from other Big East teams. So when they get those BLM patches on their uniforms, and talk about BLM at press conferences, and maybe take a knee during the anthem, you, like others who are opposed to this "Marxist" movement, will have a tough decision to make. We'll see if you have the same courage of your conviction as our Marquette student-athletes do.
Now, I look forward to you responding to the rest of my post and giving similar thought to the voices from Republican Voters Against Trump, The Lincoln Project and other similar conservative groups that truly include some prominent names (yes, even more prominent than Ali's son that nobody has ever heard of). As you asked, who decides that what they say is irrelevant, and everyone that supports the current president are right?? Can't they also have valid points and views on it?? Isn't part of being a Republican about "listening"? Why aren't those prominent Republicans being "listened" to by Trump supporters like you?? That's where I get confused.
Here's how I will answer that...Those "republicans"(I use that term loosely) are no different than most people that are representative in this poll....Now as you can see, a vast majority of democrats(and I'm willing to bet you and most here) if they are honest will admit they are part of the category that will vote for Biden, simply because they HATE Trump. Let's be honest, no one can say what Biden stands for, and let's also be further honest, he's a terrible candidate, but again the left will vote for him because they HATE Trump. That's simply fact(and this poll bears that out).
My particular views are, I vote for Presidents based on their policies(I'm a big policy guy, that's what should matter), and too many people especially on the left are good listeners...too good of listeners, as particularly with Trump, they listen to what he says, and ignore what he does. Yes, he's unconventional and not Presidential in the truest sense, and he needs to stay off twitter, but honest people know and can see, he really does care about America, his policies have been good. Most people don't care to admit that because it doesn't fit their agendas.
I've voted for Dems before(on down ballot) and I would have no problems voting for a Dem again IF I was a fan of their policies. The problem is, your party has become the radical left, and I just can't support that. If there were ever a Dem candidate that wasn't as progressive and as radical left as they have all become, I would consider voting for them if their policies and beliefs represented mine. For Example, I was a Joe Lieberman fan. I am also not a fan of all Republicans.
Look, I personally will NEVER vote for a candidate simply because I HATE the other one for whatever reason. That's not what I believe in. To me that's not how it's supposed to work. I will use this analogy. If MU ever hired a Coach I absolutely couldn't stand personally. If he was a winner, I would support him because that's what would benefit MU basketball the most. Doesn't matter if I like the guy or not.
I know this will fall on deaf ears, but it's something i have to say and ask of my fellow scoopers and all Americans...I want you to dig deep inside your soul, and ask yourself at this point in time in America where hatred is being condemned(and with good reason) Should you really and truly be casting your vote because of...hatred?? Isn't that going against everything we are told not to do and what you believe?? I also know(whether you will admit it or not) 99% of you here that are voting for Biden, are simply voting AGAINST Trump and NOT for Biden. I know that you know that's true. No one can honestly say they like Joe Biden. Not even a lot of Dems can.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 07:19:49 PM
One more time.
I concede that racism is a real problem in the US. Fighting it is a noble and just cause.
I believe that Black Lives Matter and see nothing wrong with the idea, the sentiment or the slogan.
I support all who march peacefully in hopes of producing a more just society.
I don't, however, support people with their heads in the sand. BLM is not a movement/organization co-opted by a few crazy Marxists. It is an organization/movement formed by and still led by committed Marxists. The only path they see to black equality is the worldwide adoption of Marxist principles. The people who do not know this (and I suspect it's the vast majority of those who have recently joined the movement) are the ones with their heads in the sand. To date, I have seen nothing anywhere about members or leaders of the "movement" repudiating the goals of the founders and leaders of the "organization". I'll gladly support a movement to end systemic racism. I'd even (perish the thought) march arm in arm with Wades in its pursuit. But not if Marxism is the end game.
You still don't get it. Do you really think that's what people are marching for? Why people are saying Black Lives Matter? That they are Marxists or sympathizing with Marxist ideology?
This is just a distraction. Don't be distracted.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 06:53:49 PM
You were extremely generous. I mean not the best examples. And Ali's son somehow didn't really know who he was. The guy was willing to go to jail to protest racism over Vietnam wall and joined Malcom X. Very doubtful he would be against BLM and pro Trump. Candace Owens I doubt muguru knows the real story of the mercenary nut. MKE's ex-police chief LOL he would have joined the KKK if they accepted him. The more I read guru's posts the more I feel for him totally out of touch.
Now this is exactly what I'm talking about..because you don't want to listen to these people(because they don't share your radical points of view) you complete dismiss them and blast them for being this or that. Why?? You say Candace Owens is a "mercenary nut", You make a claim that you know who Muhhamad Ali was better than his own son and that David Clarke would have joined the KKK. These are the views of a radical leftist. You know none of this to be true. Not a single thing of it. But that doesn't stop you from trying to portray these people as being disingenuous and showing your discontent for them. That's as harmful of a view/ thought as racism is whether you want to believe it or not.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 07:19:49 PM
One more time.
I concede that racism is a real problem in the US. Fighting it is a noble and just cause.
I believe that Black Lives Matter and see nothing wrong with the idea, the sentiment or the slogan.
I support all who march peacefully in hopes of producing a more just society.
I don't, however, support people with their heads in the sand. BLM is not a movement/organization co-opted by a few crazy Marxists. It is an organization/movement formed by and still led by committed Marxists. The only path they see to black equality is the worldwide adoption of Marxist principles. The people who do not know this (and I suspect it's the vast majority of those who have recently joined the movement) are the ones with their heads in the sand. To date, I have seen nothing anywhere about members or leaders of the "movement" repudiating the goals of the founders and leaders of the "organization". I'll gladly support a movement to end systemic racism. I'd even (perish the thought) march arm in arm with Wades in its pursuit. But not if Marxism is the end game.
Lenny ... which BLM do you believe Marquette University and hundreds of other schools, hundreds of corporations, thousands of religious groups and tens of millions of Americans have spoken out in support of in recent weeks:
A) The concept that the lives of black people are no less valuable than that of anyone else and systemic racism is an evil that must be ended.
B) A neo-Marxist organization that seeks to destroy the capitalistic system, end the traditional family structure and rid the country of law enforcement.
If you choose B, you're either lying or clearly not paying attention.
If you choose A, then what's your point other than to distract from the real issues* and discredit a phrase that's become emblematic of the entire movement? Why is it so important for you to conflate what are obviously two different ideas?
* Memo: America is not embracing Marxism anytime soon, you Chicken Little, fear-mongering, Sean Hannity wannabes. Amazing how easy some people frighten.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 07:19:49 PM
One more time.
I concede that racism is a real problem in the US. Fighting it is a noble and just cause.
I believe that Black Lives Matter and see nothing wrong with the idea, the sentiment or the slogan.
I support all who march peacefully in hopes of producing a more just society.
I don't, however, support people with their heads in the sand. BLM is not a movement/organization co-opted by a few crazy Marxists. It is an organization/movement formed by and still led by committed Marxists. The only path they see to black equality is the worldwide adoption of Marxist principles. The people who do not know this (and I suspect it's the vast majority of those who have recently joined the movement) are the ones with their heads in the sand. To date, I have seen nothing anywhere about members or leaders of the "movement" repudiating the goals of the founders and leaders of the "organization". I'll gladly support a movement to end systemic racism. I'd even (perish the thought) march arm in arm with Wades in its pursuit. But not if Marxism is the end game.
Lenny sums it up beautifully...for some reason Sultan etc want to totally dismiss this...that they are COMMITTED Marxists. The radical left simply wants to ignore this and I would ask why?. It isn't some non profit "co opting" the name, it is the ACTUAL view of the BLM. the video doesn't lie. I can support standing against racism, I can/do support peaceful protests, I support the black MU athletes and all black athletes in trying to use their voice for change(They are the leaders of tomorrow) but I cannot and will not support anything that leads to Marxism as Lenny said. Do we really need to change the name of Aunt Jemima syrup(the family is against it) or Uncle Ben's rice, or Eskimo pies, or the City of Columbus(ohio's name). None of this is REAL change. I don't know how any of that will make the black community suddenly say "okay I feel so much better now". It's things like that, and the violent protests, the desecrating of historical statues etc that are going to divide the country more than bring it together. That concerns me greatly.
Yup. Just willingly keeping your heads in the sand. Which is your right. But you'll be on the wrong side of history. A history that's been a long time coming.
Communism here we come!
Quote from: Pakuni on June 23, 2020, 07:33:30 PM
Lenny ... which BLM do you believe Marquette University and hundreds of other schools, hundreds of corporations, thousands of religious groups and tens of millions of Americans have spoken out in support of in recent weeks:
A) The concept that the lives of black people are no less valuable than that of anyone else and systemic racism is an evil that must be ended.
B) A neo-Marxist organization that seeks to destroy the capitalistic system, end the traditional family structure and rid the country of law enforcement.
If you choose B, you're either lying or clearly not paying attention.
If you choose A, then what's your point other than to distract from the real issues* and discredit a phrase that's become emblematic of the entire movement? Why is it so important for you to conflate what are obviously two different ideas?
* Memo: America is not embracing Marxism anytime soon, you Chicken Little, fear-mongering, Sean Hannity wannabes. Amazing how easy some people frighten.
Talk about having their head buried in the sand...or just being argumentative to be argumentative because i honestly can't believe you would be this ignorant. If you don't believe that the radical left(which Biden is a part of) doesn;t want to end Capitalism and make this a progressive socialist country you're flat out ignorant. That's FACTUAL. If you don't actually believe that the radical left doesn't want to completely abolish police departments you're ignorant(people have said this is what they want) if you don't believe that the radical left isn't attacking religion and traditional family structure you're ignorant. What have you been paying attention to? There's examples of this all over. Turn on your TV and watch. Wow.
One of the most baffling things to me on scoop is how many of you radical left have spoken out before that you SUPPORT capitalism(using NIL as an Example) yet are going to turn around and vote for a candidate that will move this country closer t socialism than we have ever been. FACT. Makes no sense, but also proves it out that you're not voting FOR Biden you're voting against Trump. Terrible way to vote.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 07:45:32 PM
Talk about having their head buried in the sand...or just being argumentative to be argumentative because i honestly can't believe you would be this ignorant. If you don't believe that the radical left(which Biden is a part of) doesn;t want to end Capitalism and make this a progressive socialist country you're flat out ignorant. That's FACTUAL. If you don't actually believe that the radical left doesn't want to completely abolish police departments you're ignorant(people have said this is what they want) if you don't believe that the radical left isn't attacking religion and traditional family structure you're ignorant. What have you been paying attention to? There's examples of this all over. Turn on your TV and watch. Wow.
One of the most baffling things to me on scoop is how many of you radical left have spoken out before that you SUPPORT capitalism(using NIL as an Example) yet are going to turn around and vote for a candidate that will move this country closer t socialism than we have ever been. FACT. Makes no sense, but also proves it out that you're not voting FOR Biden you're voting against Trump. Terrible way to vote.
Lol. I think guru thinks any person who's ever voted for a democrat is a "radical left" who wants all these things.
Seriously, stick to Twitter updates on recruits. You've proven to be entirely clueless on any other topic here.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 07:45:22 PM
Yup. Just willingly keeping your heads in the sand. Which is your right. But you'll be on the wrong side of history. A history that's been a long time coming.
Communism here we come!
You're the one with your head in the sand...you're voting for Biden, if you don't think he won;t bring this country closer to socialism and communism then you're completely ignorant. You're not voting for him, you're voting against Trump(like many other Americans) because you HATE him. Thought we aren't supposed to hate in this country??
You're also one of the best here at deflection when you cannot dispute FACTS. Like BLM's founder openly admitting they are practicing Marxists. The video has been posted. It's not having our heads "in the sand" It's factual video from the founder. No matter how much you want to ignore it or spin it, you simply can't run from it. She said it. Accept it. What is with you radical leftists anyway??
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 07:45:32 PM
Talk about having their head buried in the sand...or just being argumentative to be argumentative because i honestly can't believe you would be this ignorant. If you don't believe that the radical left(which Biden is a part of) doesn;t want to end Capitalism and make this a progressive socialist country you're flat out ignorant. That's FACTUAL. If you don't actually believe that the radical left doesn't want to completely abolish police departments you're ignorant(people have said this is what they want) if you don't believe that the radical left isn't attacking religion and traditional family structure you're ignorant. What have you been paying attention to? There's examples of this all over. Turn on your TV and watch. Wow.
One of the most baffling things to me on scoop is how many of you radical left have spoken out before that you SUPPORT capitalism(using NIL as an Example) yet are going to turn around and vote for a candidate that will move this country closer t socialism than we have ever been. FACT. Makes no sense, but also proves it out that you're not voting FOR Biden you're voting against Trump. Terrible way to vote.
OK, Tucker.
You should probably leave the country before you're forced into a re-education camp.
Congratulations to Coach Killings and his fellow assistant coaches
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 07:27:03 PM
Now this is exactly what I'm talking about..because you don't want to listen to these people(because they don't share your radical points of view) you complete dismiss them and blast them for being this or that. Why?? You say Candace Owens is a "mercenary nut", You make a claim that you know who Muhhamad Ali was better than his own son and that David Clarke would have joined the KKK. These are the views of a radical leftist. You know none of this to be true. Not a single thing of it. But that doesn't stop you from trying to portray these people as being disingenuous and showing your discontent for them. That's as harmful of a view/ thought as racism is whether you want to believe it or not.
LoL. First off I'm hardly radical left. Yes, she is a mercenary going where she can make a buck, do you know her real history? Do the research but not only Fox News research. Fact is Ali was totally anti Vietnam war, went to prison and was pro Malcom X, followed Islam and change his name to Ali. Sometimes sons don't really know their parents and viceversa. By his interviews I could always tell Clark hates being black. And here is how he can be best remembered
"In Clarke's final term, at least four people, including a newborn, died at the Milwaukee County Jail under his watch.
The county has agreed to pay nearly $7 million to the family of one of those who died. Three workers at the jail have been charged criminally in connection with that inmate's death. "
You live in a cocoon guru and I sincerely feel bad for you.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on June 23, 2020, 07:51:12 PM
Congratulations to Coach Killings and his fellow assistant coaches
Too bad they're Marxists.
I hope none of the snowflakes that will be fleeing the communist country we will have if Biden is elected president are paying attention to any of the Big East programs and the people involved with them on Instagram. A LOT of support coming from the biggest names in the conference. Sad!
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 07:50:07 PM
You're the one with your head in the sand...you're voting for Biden, if you don't think he won;t bring this country closer to socialism and communism then you're completely ignorant. You're not voting for him, you're voting against Trump(like many other Americans) because you HATE him. Thought we aren't supposed to hate in this country??
You're also one of the best here at deflection when you cannot dispute FACTS. Like BLM's founder openly admitting they are practicing Marxists. The video has been posted. It's not having our heads "in the sand" It's factual video from the founder. No matter how much you want to ignore it or spin it, you simply can't run from it. She said it. Accept it. What is with you radical leftists anyway??
Early 90's was in a group as a consultant that confronted Trump and took him down. He is as real as 9-9-9. He is a made up much about nothing that is why there is no real policy in the US government right now. Trump only cares about Trump.
:P
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 07:55:17 PM
Too bad they're Marxists.
I'm serious. The goals of what they are trying to accomplish are impressive. As coaches, they could tell their players to shut up and dribble but they want to help educate them and make them engage with their community in positive ways. That is more than can be said for most of us arguing about it on a message board. It's a great thing he's coaching at Marquette and is in my Milwaukee community.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 07:47:35 PM
Lol. I think guru thinks any person who's ever voted for a democrat is a "radical left" who wants all these things.
Seriously, stick to Twitter updates on recruits. You've proven to be entirely clueless on any other topic here.
Mmmk...you're the clueless one. Why won't you acknowledge the BLM founder saying they are practicing Marxists?? I know why...because you're a total hypocrite. You are part of the radical left, it's obvious, and it's also obvious to anyone that pays attention, that is what the left has become. It didn't use to be that way.
So you'll admit you aren't voting FOR Biden, but rather against Trump?? Because a vote for Biden means you ARE "radical left". Let's put it this way...and I'm going to need to shower after saying this..it grosses me out, but sometimes the truth is hard to accept..but as terrible of a candidate as she was..Hillary Clinton would do a better job of running this country than Joe Biden would. That's simply the truth. That's really saying something. I'm going to go throw up now, but at least I'm willing to acknowledge facts even if they aren't what I want to believe or admit.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on June 23, 2020, 07:51:12 PM
Congratulations to Coach Killings and his fellow assistant coaches
+1000
Quote from: Uncle Rico on June 23, 2020, 08:00:36 PM
:P
I'm serious. The goals of what they are trying to accomplish are impressive. As coaches, they could tell their players to shut up and dribble but they want to help educate them and make them engage with their community in positive ways. That is more than can be said for most of us arguing about it on a message board. It's a great thing he's coaching at Marquette and is in my Milwaukee community.
Exactly. This "BLM IS MARXIST" bullsh*t just gives closed minded people a reason to keep their minds closed.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 07:21:16 PM
You still don't get it. Do you really think that's what people are marching for? Why people are saying Black Lives Matter? That they are Marxists or sympathizing with Marxist ideology?
This is just a distraction. Don't be distracted.
Ummm... it's not a distraction. People who have a firm grasp of Marxist priciples are the ideal people to lead the movement IMO. Maybe listen to what they're saying and learn something from them rather than be scared by conservatives trying to boogeyman the term and subsequently erase what the leaders themselves are saying. They mean what they are saying, and that, to me, is a very good thing!
BLM is not just about everyone being nicer to each other, reading White Fragility and feeling properly guilty, or cops getting more sensitivity training. It's about understanding that the current system, as constructed, necessarily requires a permanent underclass, and the overpolicing of black people is one of many planks power uses in keeping them a permanent underclass.
The multi-generational systematic theft/suppression of black wealth is the real overarching issue, and current capitalism with more woke phrasing is not going to move the needle on that.
Lenny's is correct, but he disagrees with their goal. You, on the other hand, are trying to deny that the leaders of the movement are saying what they are actually saying, and that's a big part of the problem too.
Your heart seems to be in the right place, so I encourage you and others in a similar spot to listen to what the leaders are saying and try to understand why they are saying it!
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 03:58:31 PM
Black Lives Matter=Communists.
Never mind. Not worth it.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 07:57:45 PM
I hope none of the snowflakes that will be fleeing the communist country we will have if Biden is elected president are paying attention to any of the Big East programs and the people involved with them on Instagram. A LOT of support coming from the biggest names in the conference. Sad!
How come all these hollywood elites and others that said they would leave this country if Trump was elected never did?? Can you answer that?? I always tell anyone, if you're THAT unhappy with America and it's leader, then leave. Go someplace else. I don;t care who you are. me, you, anyone. If you're gong to say you will, then do it. It's really that simple. I say the same thing about people that constantly bitch about their job...if you're that unhappy, leave. No one is stopping you. I just don't get people that bitch and bitch and bitch but then don't do anything to change their unhappiness. Does that make any sense?? A simple concept...why stay someplace that you're unhappy?? Is bitching about it constantly going to change anything? Nope. That goes for living in America, being in an unhappy relationship, or working a job you don't like. Simply leave, make yourself happier. Its simple.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:08:19 PM
How come all these hollywood elites and others that said they would leave this country if Trump was elected never did?? Can you answer that?? I always tell anyone, if you're THAT unhappy with America and it's leader, then leave. Go someplace else. I don;t care who you are. me, you, anyone. If you're gong to say you will, then do it. It's really that simple. I say the same thing about people that constantly bitch about their job...if you're that unhappy, leave. No one is stopping you. I just don't get people that bitch and bitch and bitch but then don't do anything to change their unhappiness. Does that make any sense?? A simple concept...why stay someplace that you're unhappy?? Is bitching about it constantly going to change anything? Nope. That goes for living in America, being in an unhappy relationship, or working a job you don't like. Simply leave, make yourself happier. Its simple.
Or you can change and make it better. Which is not the real policy right now.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:08:19 PM
How come all these hollywood elites and others that said they would leave this country if Trump was elected never did?? Can you answer that?? I always tell anyone, if you're THAT unhappy with America and it's leader, then leave. Go someplace else. I don;t care who you are. me, you, anyone. If you're gong to say you will, then do it. It's really that simple. I say the same thing about people that constantly bitch about their job...if you're that unhappy, leave. No one is stopping you. I just don't get people that bitch and bitch and bitch but then don't do anything to change their unhappiness. Does that make any sense?? A simple concept...why stay someplace that you're unhappy?? Is bitching about it constantly going to change anything? Nope. That goes for living in America, being in an unhappy relationship, or working a job you don't like. Simply leave, make yourself happier. Its simple.
I would rather improve it.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:08:19 PM
How come all these hollywood elites and others that said they would leave this country if Trump was elected never did?? Can you answer that?? I always tell anyone, if you're THAT unhappy with America and it's leader, then leave. Go someplace else. I don;t care who you are. me, you, anyone. If you're gong to say you will, then do it. It's really that simple. I say the same thing about people that constantly bitch about their job...if you're that unhappy, leave. No one is stopping you. I just don't get people that bitch and bitch and bitch but then don't do anything to change their unhappiness. Does that make any sense?? A simple concept...why stay someplace that you're unhappy?? Is bitching about it constantly going to change anything? Nope. That goes for living in America, being in an unhappy relationship, or working a job you don't like. Simply leave, make yourself happier. Its simple.
Says the guy constantly whining that MU isn't a blue blood.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 07:59:56 PM
Early 90's was in a group as a consultant that confronted Trump and took him down. He is as real as 9-9-9. He is a made up much about nothing that is why there is no real policy in the US government right now. Trump only cares about Trump.
A typical lib talking point about Trump. The problem with people and Trump is they only listen to what he says and don't pay attention to what he does. There has been a TON of great policy under Trump and I also think another big problem people have with him is he has done the things he has said he would do. Liberals aren't used to that from a President on their side. #promisesmadepromiseskept
Tell me what Biden is about..I'm being honest. Do you actually know?? Does anyone know?? He won't come out of his basement. tell me one good policy you think Biden will implement as President. The guy has mental faculty problems, serious mental faculty problems. Again, I would have a lot of respect for anyone here that willingly admits they aren't voting FOR Biden, but rather against Trump. Because that's what people will be doing. I posted a FOX poll that shows an overwhelming majority of democrats will vote against Trump as opposed to FOR Biden. Is that really what we as Americans should be advocating?? Hatred??
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:02:12 PM
Exactly. This "BLM IS MARXIST" bullsh*t just gives closed minded people a reason to keep their minds closed.
Close minded?? Fluffy, the co founder of BLM ADMITS openly they are "practicing Marxism". I don't know why you are trying to act like someone is making that up. They aren't. Why won't you acknowledge this, and why are you just dismissing it so easily?? Because you don't want to accept something FACTUAL as being true?? I don't get it.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:14:59 PM
A typical lib talking point about Trump. The problem with people and Trump is they only listen to what he says and don't pay attention to what he does. There has been a TON of great policy under Trump and I also think another big problem people have with him is he has done the things he has said he would do. Liberals aren't used to that from a President on their side. #promisesmadepromiseskept
Tell me what Biden is about..I'm being honest. Do you actually know?? Does anyone know?? He won't come out of his basement. tell me one good policy you think Biden will implement as President. The guy has mental faculty problems, serious mental faculty problems. Again, I would have a lot of respect for anyone here that willingly admits they aren't voting FOR Biden, but rather against Trump. Because that's what people will be doing. I posted a FOX poll that shows an overwhelming majority of democrats will vote against Trump as opposed to FOR Biden. Is that really what we as Americans should be advocating?? Hatred??
LOL I was face to face with him for several weeks with a group of other consultants. Actually I feel terrible because that is why he ended up owning his soul to the Russian Oligarchs. Tell which great policies have been implemented in this administration?
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:14:59 PM
A typical lib talking point about Trump. The problem with people and Trump is they only listen to what he says and don't pay attention to what he does. There has been a TON of great policy under Trump and I also think another big problem people have with him is he has done the things he has said he would do. Liberals aren't used to that from a President on their side. #promisesmadepromiseskept
Tell me what Biden is about..I'm being honest. Do you actually know?? Does anyone know?? He won't come out of his basement. tell me one good policy you think Biden will implement as President. The guy has mental faculty problems, serious mental faculty problems. Again, I would have a lot of respect for anyone here that willingly admits they aren't voting FOR Biden, but rather against Trump. Because that's what people will be doing. I posted a FOX poll that shows an overwhelming majority of democrats will vote against Trump as opposed to FOR Biden. Is that really what we as Americans should be advocating?? Hatred??
Why the flying eff does this have to do with the BLM movement?
I didn't know guru could get more unhinged than he normally is but wow.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 23, 2020, 08:12:26 PM
Says the guy constantly whining that MU isn't a blue blood.
Has nothing to do with what I said...I have you so up against the ropes and staggering to stay on your feet and I love it. I'm about to deliver the knock out blow. The spin from you is absolutely incredible. Won't answer my question..because you KNOW it "outs" you as a radical left. You can deny it, spin it all you want, but you have outed yourself many times with your posts. I mean, if you are THAT embarrassed to admit it...that should say something, doesn't it?? 8-)
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:23:39 PM
Has nothing to do with what I said...I have you so up against the ropes and staggering to stay on your feet and I love it. I'm about to deliver the knock out blow. The spin from you is absolutely incredible. Won't answer my question..because you KNOW it "outs" you as a radical left. You can deny it, spin it all you want, but you have outed yourself many times with your posts. I mean, if you are THAT embarrassed to admit it...that should say something, doesn't it?? 8-)
Lol.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 07:21:16 PM
You still don't get it. Do you really think that's what people are marching for? Why people are saying Black Lives Matter? That they are Marxists or sympathizing with Marxist ideology?
This is just a distraction. Don't be distracted.
Of course that's not what people are marching for. Most of them have no idea what the agenda of BLM's leadership is. But I do, and I can't "unknow" it. When you march with BLM you are mainstreaming the organization. The funding for their non profit grows. Those dollars will be spent pursuing a goal I think is dangerous. For me that's more than a distraction. When and if the "movement" speaks out and clarifies that they reject the "organization" and its goals, I'm in. Until then, for me everything that the movement does (whether consciously or not) supports the organization.
Quote from: Newsdreams on June 23, 2020, 08:22:07 PM
LOL I was face to face with him for several weeks with a group of other consultants. Actually I feel terrible because that is why he ended up owning his soul to the Russian Oligarchs. Tell which great policies have been implemented in this administration?
See you can't tell me what Biden is about can you?? And you openly admit that you're not voting FOR Biden, you're voting against Trump. This post pretty much admits that. Russian oligarchs, the libs like to cling to that with all they have. No collusion no obstruction. I cannot wait until the Durham probe is finished and MANY MANY lefties are charged(and they will be). I suspect it will start with Schiff. How will you radical lefties spin that??
Quote from: BLM on June 23, 2020, 08:28:02 PM
Lol.
There it is...the knockout blow. Thanks for playing!! So so easy. 8-) Anytime you want more, I will be here. Until then I'm done dealing with hypocrites and all the spin from the radical left like you. Have a good night ;D
Well, if this isn't the typical MU Scoop circle jerk with all the usual tuggers.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:28:56 PM
See you can't tell me what Biden is about can you?? And you openly admit that you're not voting FOR Biden, you're voting against Trump. This post pretty much admits that. Russian oligarchs, the libs like to cling to that with all they have. No collusion no obstruction. I cannot wait until the Durham probe is finished and MANY MANY lefties are charged(and they will be). I suspect it will start with Schiff. How will you radical lefties spin that??
Coach Killings and his fellow Big East coaches are trying to make the world a better place. Thanks for your input on the topic
Quote from: Pakuni on June 23, 2020, 07:33:30 PM
Lenny ... which BLM do you believe Marquette University and hundreds of other schools, hundreds of corporations, thousands of religious groups and tens of millions of Americans have spoken out in support of in recent weeks:
A) The concept that the lives of black people are no less valuable than that of anyone else and systemic racism is an evil that must be ended.
B) A neo-Marxist organization that seeks to destroy the capitalistic system, end the traditional family structure and rid the country of law enforcement.
If you choose B, you're either lying or clearly not paying attention.
If you choose A, then what's your point other than to distract from the real issues* and discredit a phrase that's become emblematic of the entire movement? Why is it so important for you to conflate what are obviously two different ideas?
* Memo: America is not embracing Marxism anytime soon, you Chicken Little, fear-mongering, Sean Hannity wannabes. Amazing how easy some people frighten.
Pakuni
Not ignoring you, please see my reply to Fluffy.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 08:28:36 PM
Of course that's not what people are marching for. Most of them have no idea what the agenda of BLM's leadership is. But I do, and I can't "unknow" it. When you march with BLM you are mainstreaming the organization. The funding for their non profit grows. Those dollars will be spent pursuing a goal I think is dangerous. For me that's more than a distraction. When and if the "movement" speaks out and clarifies that they reject the "organization" and its goals, I'm in. Until then, for me everything that the movement does (whether consciously or not) supports the organization.
No truer words have ever been spoken. More people need to listen to Lenny, Lenny knows what he's talking about. Listen to the man, we'll all be smarter for it.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:19:06 PM
Close minded?? Fluffy, the co founder of BLM ADMITS openly they are "practicing Marxism". I don't know why you are trying to act like someone is making that up. They aren't. Why won't you acknowledge this, and why are you just dismissing it so easily?? Because you don't want to accept something FACTUAL as being true?? I don't get it.
I have explained it multiple times in this topic. Go back and read it.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:28:56 PM
See you can't tell me what Biden is about can you?? And you openly admit that you're not voting FOR Biden, you're voting against Trump. This post pretty much admits that. Russian oligarchs, the libs like to cling to that with all they have. No collusion no obstruction. I cannot wait until the Durham probe is finished and MANY MANY lefties are charged(and they will be). I suspect it will start with Schiff. How will you radical lefties spin that??
Nobody is answering because it has nothing to do with the subject. Take your unhinged BS elsewhere.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 23, 2020, 08:28:36 PM
Of course that's not what people are marching for. Most of them have no idea what the agenda of BLM's leadership is. But I do, and I can't "unknow" it. When you march with BLM you are mainstreaming the organization. The funding for their non profit grows. Those dollars will be spent pursuing a goal I think is dangerous. For me that's more than a distraction. When and if the "movement" speaks out and clarifies that they reject the "organization" and its goals, I'm in. Until then, for me everything that the movement does (whether consciously or not) supports the organization.
Here society is dealing with a serious issue that has flared up multiple times in the last decade, but you're fixated on the Marxist views of a non profit.
Congrats on being the white moderate that MLK was so concerned about.
I just find it funny that all the anti BLM people have varied reasons they are apprehensive about adopting that symbol into our culture. The pro BLM people just basically say nope, it's a nice thing to do. Why is it good to do? Just because it feels nice? Study after study shows that using BLM or talking about white privilege actually makes MORE people racist. This is why using racial loaded language like BLM is such an effective weapon for cultural Marxists. It divides us instantly. Please read Saul Alinksy or read up on the Franfurt School. This is all following their plans to a T.
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 08:42:58 PM
I just find it funny that all the anti BLM people have varied reasons they are apprehensive about adopting that symbol into our culture. The pro BLM people just basically say nope, it's a nice thing to do. Why is it good to do? Just because it feels nice? Study after study shows that using BLM or talking about white privilege actually makes MORE people racist. This is why using racial loaded language like BLM is such an effective weapon for cultural Marxists. It divides us instantly. Please read Saul Alinksy or read up on the Franfurt School. This is all following their plans to a T.
BLM =Communist
Actually they are an illegal organization.
Communist Control Act of 1954 applies.
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title50/chapter23/subchapter4&edition=prelim
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:42:18 PM
Here society is dealing with a serious issue that has flared up multiple times in the last decade, but you're fixated on the Marxist views of a non profit.
Congrats on being the white moderate that MLK was so concerned about.
LOL, MLK was a socialist. Left-leaning people trying to overlook that fact are the white moderates MLK was talking about. MSNBC/CNN Deomcrats are what he was talking about in that quote.
As someone who presents himslef as sympathetic with/open to listening to these leaders, I'm begging you, please actually listen to what they are saying! You might find yourself persuaded!
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on June 23, 2020, 08:42:18 PM
Congrats on being the white moderate that MLK was so concerned about.
I supported MLK when you were just a kid. He wasn't a Marxist.
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 08:28:56 PM
See you can't tell me what Biden is about can you?? And you openly admit that you're not voting FOR Biden, you're voting against Trump. This post pretty much admits that. Russian oligarchs, the libs like to cling to that with all they have. No collusion no obstruction. I cannot wait until the Durham probe is finished and MANY MANY lefties are charged(and they will be). I suspect it will start with Schiff. How will you radical lefties spin that??
Again tell me what great policy has been implemented by this administration? Well Muller didn't really say that. He said this in his testimony "if we had had confidence that the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so." So wrong again guru. Give me the policy? By the way I have voted Republican. I am an independent.
Like Theo said, if you can't support the players off the court then they don't want your support on it.
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 08:46:42 PM
BLM =Communist
Actually they are an illegal organization.
Communist Control Act of 1954 applies.
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title50/chapter23/subchapter4&edition=prelim
More Performance Art from the admitted troll Texas Western/MU Fan in New York/Gas Ganakas/Herman Cain. I can't believe anyone takes the guy seriously after singing the praises of Bill Cosby, waxing poetic about drugging woman and sexually assaulting them, and reinstituting the poll tax.
I blame it on a Benny charade carried too far, but I'm sure Benny has much better things to do with his time, unlike the fake persona Herman.
Quote from: TSmith34 on June 23, 2020, 09:01:41 PM
More Performance Art from the admitted troll Texas Western/MU Fan in New York/Gas Ganakas/Herman Cain. I can't believe anyone takes the guy seriously after singing the praises of Bill Cosby, waxing poetic about drugging woman and sexually assaulting them, and reinstituting the poll tax.
I blame it on a Benny charade carried too far, but I'm sure Benny has much better things to do with his time, unlike the fake persona Herman.
You mean to tell me Quentin Grimes didn't have him along for his official visit and a Utah coach didn't happen to be sitting in the same airport as him and tell him Wojo lied to Jayce to get him to MU? Come on man, cut the crap!
Quote from: TSmith34 on June 23, 2020, 09:01:41 PM
More Performance Art from the admitted troll Texas Western/MU Fan in New York/Gas Ganakas/Herman Cain. I can't believe anyone takes the guy seriously after singing the praises of Bill Cosby, waxing poetic about drugging woman and sexually assaulting them, and reinstituting the poll tax.
I blame it on a Benny charade carried too far, but I'm sure Benny has much better things to do with his time, unlike the fake persona Herman.
Forgot the all important 9-9-9
Quote from: kryza on June 23, 2020, 08:42:58 PM
I just find it funny that all the anti BLM people have varied reasons they are apprehensive about adopting that symbol into our culture. The pro BLM people just basically say nope, it's a nice thing to do. Why is it good to do? Just because it feels nice? Study after study shows that using BLM or talking about white privilege actually makes MORE people racist. This is why using racial loaded language like BLM is such an effective weapon for cultural Marxists. It divides us instantly. Please read Saul Alinksy or read up on the Franfurt School. This is all following their plans to a T.
No it doesn't make more people racist, brings out those that are racist out, just because they're afraid and insecure.
Yeah anybody who is claiming that the current events are dividing people are intentionally ignoring reality. This has unquestionably brought people together that never would have imagined coming together in the past.
Question...is the scholarship initiative that's being implemented for black athletes that commit to BE schools, is that something that needs to be cleared by the NCAA first?? And I honestly don't know, will this be even a small recruiting advantage??
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 09:18:42 PM
Question...is the scholarship initiative that's being implemented for black athletes that commit to BE schools, is that something that needs to be cleared by the NCAA first?? And I honestly don't know, will this be even a small recruiting advantage??
Who cares?
Quote from: BLM on June 23, 2020, 08:23:21 PM
Why the flying eff does this have to do with the BLM movement?
I didn't know guru could get more unhinged than he normally is but wow.
Isn't he the same guy who was complaining some months back that he couldn't find a decent woman?
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 09:46:27 PM
A bunch of thugs shrouded in words. That is all that is going on here. It is all leading away from the real issues which have nothing to do with racism and everything to do with personal responsibility .
Let me ask you a theoretical question Mr. Fluffy. Lets just assume for a second you were working in a high position at a theoretical college in northern Wisconsin that was ranked 2,110th in racial diversity in the United States. That college logging in at 1 percent black students. Given your theoretical high position in this theoretical school, do you feel that makes you a party to systemic racism. By virtue of your affiliation with this theoretical institution are you a racist are the white kids that go to that school racists?
The fake troll account keeps trolling
Quote from: muguru on June 23, 2020, 07:20:02 PM
Here's how I will answer that...Those "republicans"(I use that term loosely) are no different than most people that are representative in this poll....Now as you can see, a vast majority of democrats(and I'm willing to bet you and most here) if they are honest will admit they are part of the category that will vote for Biden, simply because they HATE Trump. Let's be honest, no one can say what Biden stands for, and let's also be further honest, he's a terrible candidate, but again the left will vote for him because they HATE Trump. That's simply fact(and this poll bears that out).
My particular views are, I vote for Presidents based on their policies(I'm a big policy guy, that's what should matter), and too many people especially on the left are good listeners...too good of listeners, as particularly with Trump, they listen to what he says, and ignore what he does. Yes, he's unconventional and not Presidential in the truest sense, and he needs to stay off twitter, but honest people know and can see, he really does care about America, his policies have been good. Most people don't care to admit that because it doesn't fit their agendas.
I've voted for Dems before(on down ballot) and I would have no problems voting for a Dem again IF I was a fan of their policies. The problem is, your party has become the radical left, and I just can't support that. If there were ever a Dem candidate that wasn't as progressive and as radical left as they have all become, I would consider voting for them if their policies and beliefs represented mine. For Example, I was a Joe Lieberman fan. I am also not a fan of all Republicans.
Look, I personally will NEVER vote for a candidate simply because I HATE the other one for whatever reason. That's not what I believe in. To me that's not how it's supposed to work. I will use this analogy. If MU ever hired a Coach I absolutely couldn't stand personally. If he was a winner, I would support him because that's what would benefit MU basketball the most. Doesn't matter if I like the guy or not.
I know this will fall on deaf ears, but it's something i have to say and ask of my fellow scoopers and all Americans...I want you to dig deep inside your soul, and ask yourself at this point in time in America where hatred is being condemned(and with good reason) Should you really and truly be casting your vote because of...hatred?? Isn't that going against everything we are told not to do and what you believe?? I also know(whether you will admit it or not) 99% of you here that are voting for Biden, are simply voting AGAINST Trump and NOT for Biden. I know that you know that's true. No one can honestly say they like Joe Biden. Not even a lot of Dems can.
guru:
First, here is a very interesting factoid from the most recent Fox News poll:
Among those who dislike both of them, Biden is preferred over Trump in the presidential matchup by 63 points. And those who view both Biden and Trump negatively pick Biden by 32 points. In 2016, voters with unfavorable views of both Clinton and Trump voted for Trump by 17 points.In 2016, most voters did not like either candidate. Trump won because more voters hated Clinton. It's what got your emperor elected, it's what got the Dems the House in 2018, and if Biden wins in November, it will be what will have gotten your hero out of office. You might not "like" people who vote like that, but it happens ALL the time in politics.
Second, you dismissed real Republicans -- men and women who have spent their entire lives as conservative Republicans -- even more casually than I dismissed the 5 black people you could dig up who don't support BLM. Are you saying that George Will and Rick Wilson and George Bush AREN'T Republicans? They've been Republicans a hell of a lot longer than your hero has been. When Bill Kristol was a mover and a shaker in national Republican circles, your emperor was a New York liberal. Your hero still isn't a Republican. He's a Trumplican. No matter what, he turns everything back to himself.
Third, Biden stands for a lot of things, including decency, honor, sacrifice and science over "gut." He stands for appointing qualified people and listening to them. He stands for putting others before himself -- an outrageous concept for your emperor.
He stands from knowing he isn't perfect, admitting his mistakes and learning from them. Humility. The impeached President Quid Pro Quo might want to try that once in his life.
What does he stand for? His two speeches after George Floyd was murdered were better than any speech your emperor has made in his entire life. Honest, empathetic, heartfelt, beautiful.
What does Biden stand for? Ask Lindsey Graham.
"If you can't admire Joe Biden as a person, you've got a problem. You need to do some self-evaluation, 'cause, what's not to like? He is as good a man as God ever created. He's the nicest person I think I've ever met in politics."And Biden stands for "normalcy" -- something this country desperately needs after 4 years of horrific POLICIES from your emperor.
Yep ... policies. Let's talk about them.
"When the looting starts, the shooting starts" IS policy. So was stealing money from military families to build a wall that he claimed 1,000 times Mexico would pay for. So was the entirely new welfare program for farmers that he had to start because he had personally crushed them with his "easy to win" trade wars. So was having his militia attack peaceful protesters just so he could have a photo-op. I could go on and on with his delightful policies.
Saying he is the ally of all peaceful protesters just hours before criticizing NFL players for protesting peacefully
IS policy.
One of his first policy statements came before he even got elected:
"Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on." As unconstitutional as it was horrible.
Signaling cops that they shouldn't worry about being over-the-top violent in performing their jobs
IS policy.
Telling everybody to take an unvetted, dangerous drug because "what the hell do you have to lose?"
IS policy. Telling governors they have to re-open their states only hours after issuing guidelines for re-opening that none of those states had met ... that
IS policy.
He has used cruelty for the sake of cruelty in his policies against gay people, transgenders, DACA residents, Mexicans, Asians, Latinos, and of course black people.
His own defense secretary, Mark Esper, publicly rebuked one of President Bone Spur's most recent policy initiatives: invoking the Insurrection Act, which would activate the military to use against those protesting systemic racism.
His first defense secretary, Jim Mattis, said:
"Donald Trump is the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people -- does not even pretend to try. Instead, he tries to divide us. We are witnessing the consequences of three years of this deliberate effort."Making a deliberate effort to divide our great democratic republic
IS policy.
You like his policies. You know who LOVES his policies? David Duke, Jason Kessler, Richard Spencer and white supremacists everywhere. After his third crack at a post-Charlottesville speech, when he decided to really go all-in on saying there were very fine people marching with torches and chanting anti-Semitic slogans, Duke and Spencer THANKED him. Duke said that's why he was their choice. They LOVE his effen policies. You're afraid of BLM being associated with Marquette, but you have no problem associating yourself with a man beloved by white supremacists.
Everybody knew Trump's character before the election. He is a reprehensible human being with few (if any) redeeming qualities -- a pathological liar who has spent decades chiseling contractors, stealing from his own charity, cheating on three wives, swindling college students, treating women only as sex objects, stiffing creditors and making racist statements.
He spent 8 years trying (and failing) to prove that a president who was elected in a landslide and re-elected in another landslide was not a U.S. citizen; it's no coincidence that the subject of Trump's obsessive attacks is black. During the campaign, he viciously attacked his GOP rivals, even going after their families; now, disgustingly and inexplicably, most of them kiss his rump.
I give him credit for signing the First Step Act. I'm not sure how Ivanka, Kanye and Kim Kardashian convinced him to do it, but he did, and it's good policy. Maybe I could find another one or two of his policies to like if I really put on my thinking cap.
Otherwise, as Jim Mattis says, we are seeing the effect of 3+ years of his cruel, inept, corrupt, self-promoting, hateful policies, of his ignoring the Constitution to enrich his ego and his personal wealth.
Or as Lindsey Graham said before losing his mind, his conscience, his moral compass and his soul:
"He's a race-baiting, xenophobic religious bigot. You know how you make America great again? Tell Donald Trump to go to Hell."[/i]
Quote from: Herman Cain on June 23, 2020, 09:46:27 PM
A bunch of thugs shrouded in words. That is all that is going on here. It is all leading away from the real issues which have nothing to do with racism and everything to do with personal responsibility .
Let me ask you a theoretical question Mr. Fluffy. Lets just assume for a second you were working in a high position at a theoretical college in northern Wisconsin that was ranked 2,110th in racial diversity in the United States. That college logging in at 1 percent black students. Given your theoretical high position in this theoretical school, do you feel that makes you a party to systemic racism. By virtue of your affiliation with this theoretical institution are you a racist are the white kids that go to that school racists?
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/l0HlR8p1q3JS06EaA/giphy.gif)
I think anyone who thinks Coach Killings is a Marxist should so go hell. I support coach Killings. This is done.