Oso planning to go pro
Well, 10-5. but still ...they were the 12th-ranked passing offense with Cassell, after being 1st the year before with Brady and third the year after with Brady.4,731 yards passing in 20073,569 yards passing in 20084,436 yards passing in 2009.QB no matta?Brissett was thoroughly mediocre, throwing for zero TDs and 400 yards in about 10+ quarters of football.Jimmy G played 1+ games and was good, but way too small of a sample size. and his success in SF indicates he's a pretty good QB and not a product of the New England system, which sorta wrecks your argument.Why not talk about McDaniels' 28 games in Denver, or Brian Daboll's five seasons as an NFL coordinator, or Bill O'Brien's five seasons in Houston, in which his offenses have ranked 17th, 19th, 29th, 20th and 15th? Or the Charlie Weis' one season as OC in Kansas City, when they had the league's 30th ranked offense?
Brady doesn't get touched because he gets the ball out.Let's keep in mind that Mahomes took a sack to take the Chiefs out of field goal range in a game that went to overtime. And it wasn't just some 3 yard, he stepped up in the pocket to try to keep them in field goal range but there was just nothing there. He got pressured up the middle and tried to run backwards and took a 10+ yard sack while they were in field goal range. Brady doesn't do that, the Pats get the points, and this is why they're champions. Discipline is part of being a great quarterback.
But, Mahoney was the better QB yesterday.
Brady threw downfield many times with no pressure whatsoever. Mahoney faced constant pressure - even on quick throws. I also never said Brady wasn’t a great QB. Just said Mahomes was the better QB in this game. Brady needed a bogus call to help him win. LA needed a bogus call in order to win. That does not mean they were the better teams.
Bill O'Brien had scrubs at QB until this years.
Lets see, Brian Daboll isn't a good coordinator. He was never an OC with the Pats, he was so bad he was brought in as an offensive assistant after being in the league 12 years. Josh McDaniels lit a franchise on fire the minute he walked in and never had any respect or buy-in. And I don't even know what to say about Weis who has been a joke since the debacle at ND.
The funny thing is, the Patriots don't really have a single offensive scheme. A huge part of their success has been their ability to adapt what they do to the talent on the field. When they had Moss and Stallworth, they were one of the greatest vertical passing teams the league's ever seen. When they had Gronk in his prime paired with pre-murder Hernandez, they killed you with double tight end sets. Now with Edelman and White, they're masters of the dink and dunk.
So quarterbacks make a difference?I read somewhere it was the scheme.So, basically Tom Brady has had a bunch of clowns as his offensive coaches over the years, and his success is a result of the schemes and playcalling implemented by a bunch of clowns?The funny thing is, the Patriots don't really have a single offensive scheme. A huge part of their success has been their ability to adapt what they do to the talent on the field. When they had Moss and Stallworth, they were one of the greatest vertical passing teams the league's ever seen. When they had Gronk in his prime paired with pre-murder Hernandez, they killed you with double tight end sets. Now with Edelman and White, they're masters of the dink and dunk.This, of course, takes an exceptionally talented and versatile quarterback to pull off. Maybe one of these days they'll find one. For now, they're stuck with a system guy.
This, of course, takes an exceptionally talented and versatile quarterback to pull off. Maybe one of these days they'll find one. For now, they're stuck with a system guy.
To be fair, anyone and everyone that has had to fill in for him over the years has had tremendous success, leading to mega deals elsewhere in some cases, where in most cases they flopped.
Are you purposefully ignoring where Ive NEVER said Brady wasn't a great QB? My only contention is he's not the best of all time cause he plays in a scheme where others would be successful. I could have the most perfect scheme ever but I'm gonna run it better with an above average QB than I am with Nathan Peterman.
Others haven't been nearly as successful in the same scheme, whether it be in New England or elsewhere.But fine, I'm fairly certain you could make a similar argument for any great QB. Who's your greatest, then?
This isn't true.In the Brady era, here are the QB ratings of guys other than Brady who have thrown 50+ passes Patriots:Matt Cassel: 88.2Brian Hoyer: 80.1Jimmy Garoppolo: 106.2Jacoby Brissett: 83.9Brady's career QBR = 97.6.So, only one had anything close to tremendous success, and the others were wholly average or worse. And given Jimmy G's success in a different system with a different team, its fair to argue that he had tremendous success because he's good.
I think Rodgers is probably the most talented. I think there is a grouping of Brady, Brees, Montana, Manning, and Rodgers that you could all make arguments for. I think this open and closed, unquestioned GOAT label always put on Brady is overdone, thats all.
Cassell's Pats passer rating would be in the top 25 career passer ratings.
But OK, he was 9th one season, with an 89.4 rating. He threw 21 TDs and 11 INTs.The year before, with the same supporting cast, Brady posted a 117.2 rating. He threw 50 TDs and 8 INTs.Same system, same coaches, same offensive weapons .... not the same production.
Bears in London next year. First time Mack will have to face the Raiders as well. Gruden better draft about five offensive linemen this go around, cause it could get ugly.Great excuse to go visit some of my friends from grad school.
Haven't seen a single argument yet that comes close to proving that Brady is anything but the greatest ever.Opinions are opinions. We all have 'em, and that's cool. My opinion is that the guy who has won 5 SBs (perhaps going on 6), has competed in (now) 4 others, has passed for 70K yards and 500+ TDs in the regular season, and has led some of the most remarkable, memorable postseason drives in history ... that guy is the best ever. All despite playing under a variety of offensive coordinators and alongside dozens of "skill" position players, some of whom might never have been any good at all had other QBs throwing to them.And I say all this as a guy who hates the Patriots.I'm open-minded. If somebody can make a convincing, "Oh, Brady's only the 6th best ever" argument, I'm open to it. But lots of folks are throwing out all kinds of stuff so far that doesn't come anywhere near convincing me.
Very well said, Mike. Five years ago my opinion was that Joe Montana was the GOAT. What Brady has accomplished when most would be retired or greatly diminished has convinced me otherwise.
No question Brady is the GOAT.The better question is who overtakes him for this moniker? Mahomes? Trevor Lawrence? Someone else? Or no one currently on the radar?
Dude, for the last time. Ive never said Brady was an average QB or just another guy. And I'm not saying Kirk Cousins comes in and has the same career. But the system definitely made an average at best guy, like Cassell, above average. That doesn't mean Brady=Cassell.