Hydroxychloroquinine updates (and other potential treatments)

[GooooMarquette]

I don’t have the energy to try and find it. My recollection is that estimates on the U Wash model were maybe 67,000 by August and the numbers were approaching 60,000. One poster for sure (maybe more) opined they’d like to go to Vegas and take the over. Ghoulish.

Edit: I’m old, not proficient on copy/pasting. Page 188 of the covid thread:

MU 82 reports that the IHME is projecting 74,073 covid deaths by July 15.

pbiflyer responds: If Vegas reopens I’m taking the over on those numbers. We’ll be at 67000 in less than a week and over 74000 by mid May....

GOOO Marquette: Yep. Wonder if the casino will take bets on that.

Yep - a form of gallows humor. A way of dealing with stress in a stressful situation. The concept of ‘betting’ was simply a proxy for discussing what we ’thought’ was going to happen. At least it was for me.

It would indeed be ghoulish if anyone actually bet money on something as serious as this.

By the way, you are better at copying and pasting than you give yourself credit for. 

[pbiflyer]

I don’t have the energy to try and find it. My recollection is that estimates on the U Wash model were maybe 67,000 by August and the numbers were approaching 60,000. One poster for sure (maybe more) opined they’d like to go to Vegas and take the over. Ghoulish.

Edit: I’m old, not proficient on copy/pasting. Page 188 of the covid thread:

MU 82 reports that the IHME is projecting 74,073 covid deaths by July 15.

pbiflyer responds: If Vegas reopens I’m taking the over on those numbers. We’ll be at 67000 in less than a week and over 74000 by mid May....

GOOO Marquette: Yep. Wonder if the casino will take bets on that.

That was me, but it was a way to emphasis that the people making these predictions were way off. And if you take it in the larger context of the thread, it was a response to people that were claiming it wasn't that bad and wasn't that bad for younger people.
So in the whole context, a bet seems far less ghoulish than what I was responding to, which was basically "Who gives a crap if a bunch of old people die?". I think that is obscene. My WWII vet dad, who is 95 agrees.

 

[tower912]

Stem cell treatment in Miami.  Look it up.

[GooooMarquette]

Stem cell treatment in Miami.  Look it up.

Still early with a very small sample size, but the initial report of the three critical patients who recovered looks promising.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Stem cell treatment in Miami.  Look it up.

Source?   

[tower912]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242388196.html


Of course, stem cells can open a whole different can of worms.   

[forgetful]

Stem cell treatment in Miami.  Look it up.

Looks similar to a number of approaches using the same strategy, including the one Ners was pushing previously, from the company he was invested in. Here is a recent review article on a lot of the different trials using the same approach.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7152513/

[StillAWarrior]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242388196.html


Of course, stem cells can open a whole different can of worms.

Why?  These are umbilical cord stem cells. That’s not controversial, is it?

[tower912]

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2020/05/08/michigan-doctors-split-using-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus/3093146001/

The big test in Detroit appears to be a (sad trombone)

[pacearrow02]

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2020/05/08/michigan-doctors-split-using-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus/3093146001/

The big test in Detroit appears to be a (sad trombone)

Definitely not turning out to be the silver bullet we all hoped for but fingers crossed they find more of a benefit in its use with healthcare workers in helping prevent from even obtaining the virus.  Otherwise back to the drawing board I guess.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Duuuuuuuude…

Cannabis shows promise blocking coronavirus infection: Alberta researcher
https://calgaryherald.com/cannabis/cannabis-shows-promise-blocking-coronavirus-infection-alberta-researcher/

[GooooMarquette]

Duuuuuuuude…

Cannabis shows promise blocking coronavirus infection: Alberta researcher
https://calgaryherald.com/cannabis/cannabis-shows-promise-blocking-coronavirus-infection-alberta-researcher/

Time to go pick up my meds....

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Duuuuuuuude…

Cannabis shows promise blocking coronavirus infection: Alberta researcher
https://calgaryherald.com/cannabis/cannabis-shows-promise-blocking-coronavirus-infection-alberta-researcher/

Alright, alright, alright.

[D'Lo Brown]

Duuuuuuuude…

Cannabis shows promise blocking coronavirus infection: Alberta researcher
https://calgaryherald.com/cannabis/cannabis-shows-promise-blocking-coronavirus-infection-alberta-researcher/

I know this is about extracts but it's still worrisome to me, as acute or chronic smoke inhalation (lung damage) of any kind is a risk factor for severe COVID. People should be taking this opportunity to be less addicted to drugs, not more... I won't be bothered to check but I'm sure there's plenty of hucksterism across the internet that weed inhibits COVID & to buy buy buy

[D'Lo Brown]

Some ivermectin updates, I know there is more solid evidence for other compounds as of today but tracking this one has become a pet project of mine.

1. Moderately sized cohort study:

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3580524

Of those requiring mechanical ventilation fewer patients died in the ivermectin group (7.3% versus 21.3%) and overall death rates were lower with ivermectin (1.4% versus 8.5%; HR 0.20 CI 95% 0.11-0.37, p<0.0001).

Conclusions and Relevance: The administration of ivermectin during COVID-19 illness in hospitalized patients is associated with a lower mortality and hospital length of stay. These findings require confirmation in randomized controlled trials.

Many other countries are resorting to research on existing cheap compounds because those countries are low in the food chain (as in, they are susceptible to shortages on the "hot" pharmaceuticals)... We (the US) will be well behind as billions are being spent on boutique treatments that cost thousands per dose & show modest benefits (reinforcing the need to spend a ton). Useful COVID drugs that cost pennies will probably be identified elsewhere. There is no money to be made - why would any pharma company spend $100 million on a drug they can't monopolize?

2. UK studying top 4 promising COVID drugs

https://www.wtvq.com/2020/05/07/uk-covid-19-clinical-trial-seeks-new-treatment-options/

3. Physicians in Peru & Dominican Republic have success in treating with ivermectin (but mixed results translating their study to English)





PDF link to study:
https://filebin.net/94gles12pjkihe7y

[WarriorDad]

NYU Medical School promising study on HCQ when used early and with Zinc. 

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2020/05/12/nyu-study-looks-at-hydroxychloroquine-zinc-azithromycin-combo-on-decreasing-covid-19-deaths

[forgetful]

NYU Medical School promising study on HCQ when used early and with Zinc. 

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2020/05/12/nyu-study-looks-at-hydroxychloroquine-zinc-azithromycin-combo-on-decreasing-covid-19-deaths

From their paper "In univariate analysis, the addition of zinc sulfate to hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin was not associated with a decrease in length of hospital stay, duration of mechanical ventilation, maximum oxygen flow rate, average oxygen flow rate, average fraction of inspired oxygen, or maximum fraction of inspired oxygen during hospitalization"

They also state in their paper, that they do not even know if the patients were administered the drugs, just that drugs were ordered. They readily acknowledge that their data doesn't prove anything, because of a long list of flaws in their study. Not their fault, as it was a retrospective analysis and not a planned controlled study.

[D'Lo Brown]

NYU Medical School promising study on HCQ when used early and with Zinc. 

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2020/05/12/nyu-study-looks-at-hydroxychloroquine-zinc-azithromycin-combo-on-decreasing-covid-19-deaths

That study is not specific for HCQ. It's being reported due to the political implications & shiny object syndrome of the press. No reasonable clinician would draw a conclusion from it.

Politics aside, I am hopeful about HCQ.

[🏀]

From their paper "In univariate analysis, the addition of zinc sulfate to hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin was not associated with a decrease in length of hospital stay, duration of mechanical ventilation, maximum oxygen flow rate, average oxygen flow rate, average fraction of inspired oxygen, or maximum fraction of inspired oxygen during hospitalization"

They also state in their paper, that they do not even know if the patients were administered the drugs, just that drugs were ordered. They readily acknowledge that their data doesn't prove anything, because of a long list of flaws in their study. Not their fault, as it was a retrospective analysis and not a planned controlled study.

Oooph. Cheeks is just rolling down the mountain, hitting every rock edge on the way.

[tower912]

Does it ever get embarrassing?   Posting a link and claiming it says the opposite of what it actually says?   

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Does it ever get embarrassing?   Posting a link and claiming it says the opposite of what it actually says?   

It could always be performance art.

[tower912]

I was about to come back and suggest that it is just part of his schtick.    But performance art says it just as well.   

[Hards Alumni]

Does it ever get embarrassing?   Posting a link and claiming it says the opposite of what it actually says?   

When you have no shame, how can you be embarrassed?

[forgetful]

Does it ever get embarrassing?   Posting a link and claiming it says the opposite of what it actually says?   

To be fair, the non-peer reviewed study contradicts itself 3-times in their current published article. But I do applaud the authors in writing up all their flaws and cautioning in interpretation.

Their study absolutely did not state that starting Zinc earlier is better. They actually address as one of their flaws that they don't know when the medications were administered, and that "the point in clinical disease at which patients received those medications could have differed between our two groups."

It's really a bizarre article. It reads like two different authors wrote different parts and completely disagreed on what the data says...that's likely true.

[rocket surgeon]

if you guys are still arguing about the efficacy of hydroxychloroquine, it's the first drug i am requesting from my doctor.  i have read many and heard multiple interview with docs who have been prescribing this drug for years, written papers, have success after success story, saving lives, keeping patients off ventilators, decreasing the length of the illness.  some were seeing improvements in patients conditions within 24-48 hours. 

   if my mom or dad were showing the early signs of coming down with COVID-19, i would either insist the doctor start them on the usual regimine of hydroxychl plus z-pak or i would find a doctor who does treat his patients with this drug.  there was a doctor in dallas who was using hydroxy on her patients A LOT, patients coming from all over to be treated by her.  then, guess what?  the pharmacies(CVS) she is calling her Rx's into told her they refuse to fill the Rx?  china?  russia?  nope, dallas, tx.  this is what gubmint healthcare looks like. 

   its interesting when you google "successful hydroxy studies" it seems the first 10 or more all "poo-poo" the studies, then you get to some of the successful cases.  when google makes you scroll to page 2 or 3 to find the credible treatments, this alone causes me to pause.   i just find it so interesting that doctors are being admonished, prohibited and even sanctioned for even saying the word hydroxychloroquine by the government, but when one wants to argue about abortion-oh no no no no, that's between a doctor and the patient.  they are not going to get in between THAT procedure.

funny how it seems a segment of our population just doesn't want to see us get too successful too fast treating this nasty virus.  let's see, maybe in 5-6-7 mos we will have better results, but watch out for that rebound spike.  if they are going on yet another "model" from the "experts",  better start sounding alarm bells by now.  we are taking our eye off of all the collateral damage.  you see what they are doing here?  under the guise of "you just want to see people die" mantra, well, little secret; many more are dying right now and moving forward-undiagnosed cancers, heart, liver, kidney disease, drug over doses, alcoholism, depression.  oh, they know exactly what they are doing-gubmit wack-a-mole.  hey!  crisis?  can't let er go to waste, eyn'a?