Another mass shooting

[Lennys Tap]

I forgot who said it but I liked it. Essentially:

“Increase gun control and send thoughts and prayers to the gun crowd.”

Great bumper sticker. Sadly, competing bumper stickers are about as far as we get on these issues.

[brewcity77]

The escalation of shootings started long before the current adminstrstion, the lack of cooperation has also been lacking for years.  Leave the national politics out of it.  This is more a local issue here, Baltimore and a few other cities than most.  Other cities are managing much better than we are, some of them larger than here.

I trust you are pushing for harsher gun control measures in Indiana, Iowa, Wisconsin, Mississippi, and the other states where 60% of the recovered guns used in Chicago are coming from?

[tower912]

Gosh, these arguments seem so familiar.

[WarriorDad]

I trust you are pushing for harsher gun control measures in Indiana, Iowa, Wisconsin, Mississippi, and the other states where 60% of the recovered guns used in Chicago are coming from?

I am mostly concerned about the people pulling the trigger.  There are states and cities that have more guns then we do, but not the carnage we do.  There are also those that have worse statistics then we do.  We are not the worst, but I would like to know why we have this problem.  Some of the states or locales doing better have stricter laws than us, but that isn’t universally the case either.  There are those deemed to have laxer laws but doing better than we are.

  Somehow their citizens are better than ours in this area.  That doesn’t change Emanuel’s correct statement that there are people that know and refuse to do anything about it.  We can talk about laws forever, but good police work also requires some cooperation from the citizenry in capturing criminals.  Do you disagree with this?  Do you think the police and their frustration from lack of cooperation is incorrect and they are merely incompetent? 

[wadesworld]

I am mostly concerned about the people pulling the trigger.  There are states and cities that have more guns then we do, but not the carnage we do.  There are also those that have worse statistics then we do.  We are not the worst, but I would like to know why we have this problem.  Some of the states or locales doing better have stricter laws than us, but that isn’t universally the case either.  There are those deemed to have laxer laws but doing better than we are.

  Somehow their citizens are better than ours in this area.  That doesn’t change Emanuel’s correct statement that there are people that know and refuse to do anything about it.  We can talk about laws forever, but good police work also requires some cooperation from the citizenry in capturing criminals.  Do you disagree with this?  Do you think the police and their frustration from lack of cooperation is incorrect and they are merely incompetent?

Lol at all the “we” and “our.” That’s the stuff people say for their sports teams. I’ve never heard that for somone’s city. Hilarious the depths Chico’s will go to prove he isn’t Chico’s and is really the mayor or police chief of Chicago.

[Pakuni]

  Somehow their citizens are better than ours in this area.  That doesn’t change Emanuel’s correct statement that there are people that know and refuse to do anything about it.  We can talk about laws forever, but good police work also requires some cooperation from the citizenry in capturing criminals.  Do you disagree with this?  Do you think the police and their frustration from lack of cooperation is incorrect and they are merely incompetent?

This goes down in the annals of bad takes.
Bad citizens are the problem.
Not the massive growth of the heroin/opiate market (funded primarily by white kids from the suburbs).
Not the easy access to guns.
Not the breakdown of gang hierarchies.
Not the closing of dozens of neighborhood schools.
Not the systemic (and deserving) mistrust of police and the legal system, which leads people to seek extra-judicial resolutions to beefs.
Not the lack of opportunities outside the drug trade.
Not the teenage pregnancies and childbirth.
Not the breakdown of families, caused in part by the mass incarceration of males.

Nope, the big problem is that the victims of violence aren't putting their lives in even more jeopardy by cooperating with a police force and justice system that been historically indifferent - and at times hostile - to their well-being.

[GGGG]

Nope, the big problem is that the victims of violence aren't putting their lives in even more jeopardy by cooperating with a police force and justice system that been historically indifferent - and at times hostile - to their well-being.

Chicos has systematically ignored this point about a half dozen times now.

[Babybluejeans]

Lol at all the “we” and “our.” That’s the stuff people say for their sports teams. I’ve never heard that for somone’s city. Hilarious the depths Chico’s will go to prove he isn’t Chico’s and is really the mayor or police chief of Chicago.

He's really lost his mind. Doesn't benefit anyone to respond.

[MU82]

Wait ... what's a chicos?

[WarriorDad]

Another kid that was treated for mental illness multiple times, on psychotic drugs since he was 12.  We have a mental illness epidemic in this country and we do to little to address it. People afraid of the stigma?  How he was allowed to legally buy guns is an outrage and those laws have to be changed. We also must do something about people that are mentally ill.

https://triblive.com/usworld/world/14017115-74/jacksonville-shooting-suspect-david-katz-had-history-of-mental-illness

[WarriorDad]

Lol at all the “we” and “our.” That’s the stuff people say for their sports teams. I’ve never heard that for somone’s city. Hilarious the depths Chico’s will go to prove he isn’t Chico’s and is really the mayor or police chief of Chicago.

You have never heard people say that?  Our police, our town, our community, our nation, our teachers?  It isn't only a sports reference.  This is how we were raised. I still hear it often, and see it often.  Don't be upset at me because you aren't seeing it. Happy to help you out.

[WarriorDad]

This goes down in the annals of bad takes.

It is all of the above, but as mentioned other cities have this too, and are more cooperative.  Our own mayor is saying this! Our own police superintendent (Eddie Johnson) has said this, don't listen to me, listen to them.  They are pleading for the citizenry to stand up because everyone knows they have the information, but aren't willing to cooperate.  If it is a bad take, then please let Mr. Emanuel and Mr. Johnson.

“You all know who these individuals are,” a frustrated Johnson said at one point.

“People, they’re under the no-snitching act,” Davis said. “Whoever did this is pretending to go on with their life.”

No snitching is part of the problem. It is not the only part. We cannot ignore it.  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/08/07/chicago-gun-violence-homicide-clearance/925630002/

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yeah I have to agree with Wades here. I've never seen someone use the first person this often when referring to hometown and political party. Sure it happens in specific contexts, but using it exclusively on a message board is something I haven't seen before. Must be a Chicago thing.

[Galway Eagle]

I am mostly concerned about the people pulling the trigger.  There are states and cities that have more guns then we do, but not the carnage we do.  There are also those that have worse statistics then we do.  We are not the worst, but I would like to know why we have this problem.  Some of the states or locales doing better have stricter laws than us, but that isn’t universally the case either.  There are those deemed to have laxer laws but doing better than we are.

  Somehow their citizens are better than ours in this area.  That doesn’t change Emanuel’s correct statement that there are people that know and refuse to do anything about it.  We can talk about laws forever, but good police work also requires some cooperation from the citizenry in capturing criminals.  Do you disagree with this?  Do you think the police and their frustration from lack of cooperation is incorrect and they are merely incompetent?

Have you ever sat back and wondered why none of the locals would turn the mobsters in back in their hay day? Many of the gangs on the street have taken a similar approach of fear and intimidation at a smaller localized level to ensure the neighborhood cooperates with them. That and some of pakunis points about general mistrust and such.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

You have never heard people say that?  Our police, our town, our community, our nation, our teachers?  It isn't only a sports reference.  This is how we were raised. I still hear it often, and see it often.  Don't be upset at me because you aren't seeing it. Happy to help you out.

Do political cartoons next.

[brewcity77]

Another kid that was treated for mental illness multiple times, on psychotic drugs since he was 12.  We have a mental illness epidemic in this country and we do to little to address it. People afraid of the stigma?  How he was allowed to legally buy guns is an outrage and those laws have to be changed. We also must do something about people that are mentally ill.

https://triblive.com/usworld/world/14017115-74/jacksonville-shooting-suspect-david-katz-had-history-of-mental-illness

Interesting. When talking about Chicago shootings, you point toward a problem with the citizens, indicating people outside Chicago are "better".

Yet when it comes to the Jacksonville shooter, you immediately talk about mental illness.

Now what is the difference between those shooters in Chicago and the Jacksonville shooter? Why do you immediately attack the character of one group and try to show compassion and deflect to a psychological problem for the other?

Things that make you go hmm...

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Interesting. When talking about Chicago shootings, you point toward a problem with the citizens, indicating people outside Chicago are "better".

Yet when it comes to the Jacksonville shooter, you immediately talk about mental illness.

Now what is the difference between those shooters in Chicago and the Jacksonville shooter? Why do you immediately attack the character of one group and try to show compassion and deflect to a psychological problem for the other?

Things that make you go hmm...

That's how things roll at White Lives Matter Ranch.

[tower912]

Beating up on Chico's/warriordad is not making things better.   I think most can agree that there are many facets to this issue and any solution has to be multi-pronged.   Mental health, culture, rebuilding trust between the police and the public, and yes, guns.   Registration, taxing guns and ammo heavily, banning AR-15  and similar style weapons.  All of them.

To actually do these things requires money and will.

[Pakuni]

It is all of the above, but as mentioned other cities have this too, and are more cooperative.  Our own mayor is saying this! Our own police superintendent (Eddie Johnson) has said this, don't listen to me, listen to them.  They are pleading for the citizenry to stand up because everyone knows they have the information, but aren't willing to cooperate.  If it is a bad take, then please let Mr. Emanuel and Mr. Johnson.

“You all know who these individuals are,” a frustrated Johnson said at one point.

“People, they’re under the no-snitching act,” Davis said. “Whoever did this is pretending to go on with their life.”

No snitching is part of the problem. It is not the only part. We cannot ignore it.  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/08/07/chicago-gun-violence-homicide-clearance/925630002/

It's easy to blame "bad" citizens from behind the comfort of your keyboard. But I wonder how eager you'd be to cooperate when doing so puts you and your family in the crosshairs of gang members who have shown no reluctance to use violence as a means to their ends. And when police have a proven inability to protect you and your family from reprisals.
If you put on your thinking cap for a moment, you'd understand that staying quiet is, unfortunately, the rational decision.

[JWags85]

It's easy to blame "bad" citizens from behind the comfort of your keyboard. But I wonder how eager you'd be to cooperate when doing so puts you and your family in the crosshairs of gang members who have shown no reluctance to use violence as a means to their ends. And when police have a proven inability to protect you and your family from reprisals.
If you put on your thinking cap for a moment, you'd understand that staying quiet is, unfortunately, the rational decision.

People get shot in broad daylight ALL the time.  You have a score to settle, you roll up on your target and shoot them, whenever.  That level of DGAF and wanton violence in an openly public setting is usually reserved for active war zones.  But sure, expect the citizens (who already are leery of the police for a myriad of reasons) to be the ones to stop the violence with cooperation and testifying.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Beating up on Chico's/warriordad is not making things better. 

In one sense I disagree.  You are right that it does nothing directly; however, letting Chicos racist arguments go unchallenged only makes things worse.  Blacks and other PoC who shoot each other in gang violence are horrible people, but the white mass murderer is just suffering from lack of mental health care?  Typical loathsome chicos.

[wadesworld]

In one sense I disagree.  You are right that it does nothing directly; however, letting Chicos racist arguments go unchallenged only makes things worse.  Blacks and other PoC who shoot each other in gang violence are horrible people, but the white mass murderer is just suffering from lack of mental health care?  Typical loathsome chicos.

Good point.

[jesmu84]

In one sense I disagree.  You are right that it does nothing directly; however, letting Chicos racist arguments go unchallenged only makes things worse.  Blacks and other PoC who shoot each other in gang violence are horrible people, but the white mass murderer is just suffering from lack of mental health care?  Typical loathsome chicos.

I would agree, to a point. I think it's important to call out incorrect viewpoints. Less as an attack and more to hopefully correct the position. That way we have less people with incorrect viewpoints. It's a lot easier/more direct with things like flat Earth, vaccines, etc. But should still be done.

Granted, easier said than done. And there comes a point where correction is impossible/banging your head against a wall.

[tower912]

He is an easy target, as he has a long history, granted.  And we all know about the positions and the demagoguing of issues.    But it is time for all of us to realize that demonizing 'the other' isn't working.    It is easy, it makes us feel better in the short term, but it isn't the answer.     

[MUDPT]

Chico’s, wonder what you think about this thread about your “city”:

https://mobile.twitter.com/eveewing/status/1018506163128856578