World Cup 2026

[BM1090]

No clown - we self imploded against a team who is not light years ahead of us.

Which happens in all sports. It's like saying NC State was light years ahead of MU in 2024.

[panda]

Which happens in all sports. It's like saying NC State was light years ahead of MU in 2024.

Yes exactly

[pbiflyer]

Landon Donovan says America is missing soccer talent because kids can't afford to play.

"Only 2% of kids playing organized soccer in America came from households that made less than $50,000."

"If you don't make $50,000, your kid cannot play organized soccer."

"Think about how many kids you're missing out on in this country because they can't afford to play the game."

"There is zero chance I could have played club soccer."

"My mom made $34,000 a year, single mom raising three kids."

"She couldn't pay $4,000 for me to play club. Are you kidding? She couldn't pay $400."

"That's not a good system to create good players."

https://x.com/EtanBoss/status/2074503299009524092?s=20

[MU82]

the Swiss win in PKs. I'm neutral on the outcome.

During regulation time, the best of the Swiss knifed through the Colombia defense. Then came the penalty kicks; after a Swiss miss or two, they came through like clockwork.

[Pakuni]

During regulation time, the best of the Swiss knifed through the Colombia defense. Then came the penalty kicks; after a Swiss miss or two, they came through like clockwork.

Cheesy post.

[Scoop Snoop]

During regulation time, the best of the Swiss knifed through the Colombia defense. Then came the penalty kicks; after a Swiss miss or two, they came through like clockwork.

Packets of powdered hot chocolate don't have anything to do with this.

[Billy Hoyle]

During regulation time, the best of the Swiss knifed through the Colombia defense. Then came the penalty kicks; after a Swiss miss or two, they came through like clockwork.

[Jockey]

No clown - we self imploded against a team who is not light years ahead of us.

Ah. The same way we implode every time on the World stage.

[Jockey]

Which happens in all sports. It's like saying NC State was light years ahead of MU in 2024.

Except MU won a couple years later. The US team is not even in the same universe as most Euro teams.

[BM1090]

Except MU won a couple years later. The US team is not even in the same universe as most Euro teams.

What did MU win a couple of years later?

And sorry, you're wrong. They aren't in the universe of the top Euro teams. And even then they managed world cup draws against England in 2010 and 2022 in the world cup. Drew Portugal in 2014 and dominated that match.

Spain, France -- leagues ahead of us.
England, Portugal, Germany -- better than us but we can and have compete against them. 3 draws in four tries against them in the last four world cups.
Everyone else (basically) - at or near our level.

Terrible performance at a terrible time. That's it.

[panda]

Ah. The same way we implode every time on the World stage.

The way we imploded against Belgium and Ghana in extra time when we had chances to equalize in extra time? Is that an implosion clown?

Do me a favor and please come correct next time

[Uncle Rico]

Brazil is blaming Protestantism and evangelicalism for their World Cup showing.

I tend to agree.

[jesmu84]

You're not wrong, but it's hardly exclusive to soccer.
Travel soccer costs are a pittance compared to hockey, and they're no worse than the costs of high-level youth volleyball, football, baseball, golf, swimming, tennis, etc. Even basketball is expensive, unless you're good enough for a program that gets shoe money.
Pay-for-play absolutely is part of the problem, but it's not THE problem.

The hockey comparison is interesting to me considering how good the US is on the global stage for hockey.

I assume that's more of a function of less global competition, but not sure

[WhiteTrash]

It is obvious to me that the US is poor at soccer because we are not on the metric system.

[Jockey]

What did MU win a couple of years later?

And sorry, you're wrong. They aren't in the universe of the top Euro teams. And even then they managed world cup draws against England in 2010 and 2022 in the world cup. Drew Portugal in 2014 and dominated that match.

Spain, France -- leagues ahead of us.
England, Portugal, Germany -- better than us but we can and have compete against them. 3 draws in four tries against them in the last four world cups.
Everyone else (basically) - at or near our level.

Terrible performance at a terrible time. That's it.

Mu won free fries from McDonalds.     Are you really this ignorant?

So you have us as high as 6th in the world? After probably the worst spanking of the entire tournament to a team who is no better than us, we obviously need an investigation into whether they lost the game on purpose.

[Pakuni]

The hockey comparison is interesting to me considering how good the US is on the global stage for hockey.

I assume that's more of a function of less global competition, but not sure

I'm sure that's part of it.
Also imagine that some of the reasons hockey is expensive and exclusionary here - namely the cost of ice time and equipment- make it expensive and exclusionary in other hockey-playing countries.

[Billy Hoyle]

What did MU win a couple of years later?

maybe he meant 1974?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

England, Portugal, Germany -- better than us but we can and have compete against them. 3 draws in four tries against them in the last four world cups.
Everyone else (basically) - at or near our level.

I'm admittedly not a soccer fan, world cup bandwagoner. So I'm open to being wrong. But I'm struggling with this. "Compete with them" to me means that we are near a .500 record or better with them and it certainly doesn't seem like that's the case.

Since 1985:
France 0-1-1
Argentina 2-4-2
Spain 1-3-0
England 1-5-2
Brazil 1-17-1
Morocco 1-3
Portugal 2-3-3
Belgium 0-7-0
Mexico 23-16-13
Columbia 2-14-4
Germany 4-9
Croatia 0-0-0
Switzerland 1-4-4
Italy 1-4-2

In the current top 15 of the FIFA rankings, we have a winning record against Mexico and a tie record against Croatia (who we've never played). Everyone else has a winning record against us, with some teams like Brazil, Columbia, and Belgium dominating the series. What evidence is there that we are only far behind France and Spain, competitive with Portugal, Germany, and England, and basically on level with everyone else?

[JWags85]

Mu won free fries from McDonalds.     Are you really this ignorant?

So you have us as high as 6th in the world? After probably the worst spanking of the entire tournament to a team who is no better than us, we obviously need an investigation into whether they lost the game on purpose.

Where did 6th in the World come from?  South American national teams exist.  Morocco exists.  And even still, going back to college basketball comparison, the US is a top 15/20 team.  Those teams usually aren't VASTLY different than a top 10 team.  They can compete with them and often beat them.  There is usually a gulf between them and a top 3, #1 seed type team, but teams in the 7/8-15/20 range beat each other all the time, sometimes handily.

Brazil lost 7-1 at Germany at home in 2014.  Absolutely DEMOLISHED in the first half.  Nobody outside of hysterical Brazilian fans/commentators were saying Germany was in a different world than Brazil.  Sometimes good teams beat down other good teams.

I'm admittedly not a soccer fan, world cup bandwagoner. So I'm open to being wrong. But I'm struggling with this. "Compete with them" to me means that we are near a .500 record or better with them and it certainly doesn't seem like that's the case.

Since 1985:
France 0-1-1
Argentina 2-4-2
Spain 1-3-0
England 1-5-2
Brazil 1-17-1
Morocco 1-3
Portugal 2-3-3
Belgium 0-7-0
Mexico 23-16-13
Columbia 2-14-4
Germany 4-9
Croatia 0-0-0
Switzerland 1-4-4
Italy 1-4-2

In the current top 15 of the FIFA rankings, we have a winning record against Mexico and a tie record against Croatia (who we've never played). Everyone else has a winning record against us, with some teams like Brazil, Columbia, and Belgium dominating the series. What evidence is there that we are only far behind France and Spain, competitive with Portugal, Germany, and England, and basically on level with everyone else?

Since 1985 might as well be comparing 2 different sports.  As late as the 1994 World Cup in the US, you had 80% of the roster who didn't even play professional soccer.  Guys who became household names for soccer fans like Cobi Jones, Claudio Reyna, and everyone's favorite Lalas...were unattached former college players who wouldn't sign professional contracts until after the success of the 94 WC.  Its crazy to think, but it wasn't until the late 90s that the US national team was full of professional players and was more like the smaller countries where players had full time jobs and played soccer on the side.

I'm sure that's part of it.
Also imagine that some of the reasons hockey is expensive and exclusionary here - namely the cost of ice time and equipment- make it expensive and exclusionary in other hockey-playing countries.

Also, despite the fact that is clearly #4 in the major sports hierarchy in the US, the best hockey league in the world is still in the US.  I think that matters.  Proximity and facilities and culture around the NHL benefits the US greatly compared to other nations where hockey is more of a priority.

Not to mention friendlies aren't always a great barometer (as evidenced by how terrible the US looked in friendlies under Poch as he was trying out new players/placating the MLS with some of his roster selection).  The best 25 guys the US has competes favorably with those nations.  The B/C teams that often play in friendlies depending on timing and opponent...doesn't compete with the second tier talents from those counties, IMO.

The US record in World Cups against those types of squads in the last 20 years has been quite good, which is where BM is coming from.

[BM1090]

Mu won free fries from McDonalds.     Are you really this ignorant?

So you have us as high as 6th in the world? After probably the worst spanking of the entire tournament to a team who is no better than us, we obviously need an investigation into whether they lost the game on purpose.

What? I'm talking about the S16 loss in 2024.

No of course not. There are some teams in South America that are significantly better than us too. ~15th in the world is probably about right. At this tournament we were playing well above that ranking.

[BM1090]

I'm admittedly not a soccer fan, world cup bandwagoner. So I'm open to being wrong. But I'm struggling with this. "Compete with them" to me means that we are near a .500 record or better with them and it certainly doesn't seem like that's the case.

Since 1985:
France 0-1-1
Argentina 2-4-2
Spain 1-3-0
England 1-5-2
Brazil 1-17-1
Morocco 1-3
Portugal 2-3-3
Belgium 0-7-0
Mexico 23-16-13
Columbia 2-14-4
Germany 4-9
Croatia 0-0-0
Switzerland 1-4-4
Italy 1-4-2

In the current top 15 of the FIFA rankings, we have a winning record against Mexico and a tie record against Croatia (who we've never played). Everyone else has a winning record against us, with some teams like Brazil, Columbia, and Belgium dominating the series. What evidence is there that we are only far behind France and Spain, competitive with Portugal, Germany, and England, and basically on level with everyone else?

I'm just talking about current team strength and responding to Jockey's words specifically. If you're looking at history we're obviously well behind. In the future we will probably be well behind too unless we overhaul our development model.

At this tournament the only teams that I'd put well above us were France and Spain. England and Argentina too but a level below the other two. And maybe Colombia, but I haven't got to watch them much in the last couple months

[MU82]

About 44 million people watched the England-Mexico game on Fox and Telemundo - more even than watched Belgium-U.S. - to be the most-viewed soccer game in U.S. history.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Since 1985 might as well be comparing 2 different sports.  As late as the 1994 World Cup in the US, you had 80% of the roster who didn't even play professional soccer.  Guys who became household names for soccer fans like Cobi Jones, Claudio Reyna, and everyone's favorite Lalas...were unattached former college players who wouldn't sign professional contracts until after the success of the 94 WC.  Its crazy to think, but it wasn't until the late 90s that the US national team was full of professional players and was more like the smaller countries where players had full time jobs and played soccer on the side.
Also, despite the fact that is clearly #4 in the major sports hierarchy in the US, the best hockey league in the world is still in the US.  I think that matters.  Proximity and facilities and culture around the NHL benefits the US greatly compared to other nations where hockey is more of a priority.

Gotcha, that's good context I don't know as a WC bandwagon fan. I went with 85 because as someone born in the 80s I was going off my experience with the USMNT, which has felt like a liftime of watching them get pantsed.

I'm just talking about current team strength and responding to Jockey's words specifically. If you're looking at history we're obviously well behind. In the future we will probably be well behind too unless we overhaul our development model.

At this tournament the only teams that I'd put well above us were France and Spain. England and Argentina too but a level below the other two. And maybe Colombia, but I haven't got to watch them much in the last couple months

Got it. Is there any evidence for this or is it an eye test thing? Because since Poch took over, it seems like we have dominated teams outside the top 45 (10-0-0), been competitive with teams between 15 and 45 (8-5-1), and have been trounced by the top 15 (0-7-0). Of those 7 top 15 losses, 5 were by multiple goals, 3 of them by 3 or more.

Wins
#17 Japan
#18 Senegal
#20 Uruguay
#28 Australia x2
#34 Paraguay X2
#44 Panama
#47 Venezuela
#51 Costa Rica x2
#58 Saudi Arabia
#61 Bosnia & Herzegovina
#71 Jamaica x2
#88 Haiti
#97 Guatemala
#102 Trinidad & Tobago

Losses
#7 Portugal
#8 Belgium x2
#10 Mexico x2
#12 Germany
#14 Switzerland
#27 Turkey x2
#30 Canada
#32 South Korea
#44 Panama

Draw
#25 Ecuador

Again, others in this thread are way better judges than I am. I just want to understand why we are so certain that this team could compete with anyone outside of France and Spain, but the results have been nothing but losses against the top tier.

[JWags85]

Got it. Is there any evidence for this or is it an eye test thing? Because since Poch took over, it seems like we have dominated teams outside the top 45 (10-0-0), been competitive with teams between 15 and 45 (8-5-1), and have been trounced by the top 15 (0-7-0). Of those 7 top 15 losses, 5 were by multiple goals, 3 of them by 3 or more.

Wins
#17 Japan
#18 Senegal
#20 Uruguay
#28 Australia x2
#34 Paraguay X2
#44 Panama
#47 Venezuela
#51 Costa Rica x2
#58 Saudi Arabia
#61 Bosnia & Herzegovina
#71 Jamaica x2
#88 Haiti
#97 Guatemala
#102 Trinidad & Tobago

Losses
#7 Portugal
#8 Belgium x2
#10 Mexico x2
#12 Germany
#14 Switzerland
#27 Turkey x2
#30 Canada
#32 South Korea
#44 Panama

Draw
#25 Ecuador

Again, others in this thread are way better judges than I am. I just want to understand why we are so certain that this team could compete with anyone outside of France and Spain, but the results have been nothing but losses against the top tier.

I sort of alluded to this earlier, but its part of the reason when friendlies can be so hard to gauge (both good and bad).  I had pretty low expectations for the US (and Poch) due to the friendlies and other matches.  But once the rosters/lineups came out and we saw the first matches (both Senegal in the final warm up and Paraguay), it was a completely different mentality and realization of level.

So some of it is indeed eye test, but also assessing data/results with context.  For example, the US lost 4-0 to Switzerland last year with a starting 11 that featured 1 player (Berhalter) that got meaningful minutes in the WC.

[The Sultan]

I think two things can be true:

1. We performed fine at this World Cup. We are a top 16 program and finished in the 8-16 range.

2. We expected at this point to be better, especially with the "golden generation" talk and us hosting this year. That was naive in retrospect.