Colton Crowdis committed.

[Small Orange Soda]

You're missing the point.  It's not about the money not being available.  It's about throwing your entire compensation structure out of whack by hypothetically paying a back-up big who might play 8 - 14 MPG as much or more than Royce or Adrien are making.

I think people are clinging to the Sheek situation and trying to apply it everywhere. Like you said, SLU panicked, threw a huge bag at him along with a starting spot and a chance to go home.

Marquette isn't a poverty program and it's not a charity either. Royce would've been a hot commodity in the portal. He's getting paid. Bigs may be a commodity, but all possible backups aren't screwing up the pay structure.

I'm not sure why it's so hard to just acknowledge Shaka thinks Caedin is a lot better than those of us on this board do, and that played into his decision. His minutes diminished down the stretch the year before too.

[Pakuni]

You cannot know this for a fact.  You can and are presuming it.

You're right. I cannot know for an absolute fact. I think given the facts we know, the circumstantial evidence overwhelmingly says I'm right. You're free to be the "well actually" guy here.

I mean, when I wake up in the morning and the ground outside is soaking wet, I can't say for an absolute fact that it rained overnight. Maybe one of those forest-firefighting planes dumped a load over my block. But I'd feel pretty safe going with rain as the explanation.

[Pakuni]

Since it is an argument you enjoy using, which coach has said they're relying on 10ish minutes a game from Caedin?

Ignoring that I presented that as a hypothetical (notice the first word of my sentence?) ...
They relied on Caedin for 10ish minutes a game down the stretch last year. Given that the only difference among the post options between last season and this upcoming season is swapping Gold for Fru, it stands to reason that relying on Caedin for 10ish minutes a game remains a possibility.

But yes, you are correct, no coach has outlined exactly how many minutes Caedin will play next year. You got me there.

[Pakuni]

It's crazy if people think Fru is making the same money Ethan is.  Or Caedin is making more than Nigel.

These are things no one here has ever written.

[wadesworld]

Maybe because back end players like Josh Clark are rolling around in $135,000 BMW X5 M competition SUVs with a license plate that says "0.3 GPA".

Maybe that has something to do with it?

I don't know what cars players are rolling around in, or what their license plates read.  But I think I remember hearing all the players got BMWs.  I'm guessing that's not coming out of their pocket from their NIL/rev share money that MU is offering them.

[MU82]

These are things no one here has ever written.

Pretty sure wades was being hyperbolic and referring to the fact that, in the past, some Scoopers claimed that Shaka's pay scale was based on seniority - hence Hamilton (a redshirt junior to be) making more than James (a sophomore to be).

In other words, there has been a ton of misinformation here about who gets paid what.

[wadesworld]

You're right. I cannot know for an absolute fact. I think given the facts we know, the circumstantial evidence overwhelmingly says I'm right. You're free to be the "well actually" guy here.

I mean, when I wake up in the morning and the ground outside is soaking wet, I can't say for an absolute fact that it rained overnight. Maybe one of those forest-firefighting planes dumped a load over my block. But I'd feel pretty safe going with rain as the explanation.

It's highs of 80s consistently right now where I live.  It hasn't rained the last few nights, but the ground is still wet when I wake up.  Plenty of dew in the morning which make the ground very wet without rain.

[wadesworld]

These are things no one here has ever written.

Literally typed out?  Maybe not.  But are you really going to argue there weren't posters on MUScoop who were claiming that Shaka/Marquette had a pay structure that paid players based on the number of years they were in the program?  And that Shaka would not negotiate with that, wouldn't work with agents, etc. and the only difference in pay players on the team had would be deals players found on their own outside of what Marquette set up for them?  That there weren't constantly posters who were claiming that because of this structure, there was no chance Sean Jones or Tre Norman would leave as their pay at Marquette wasn't going to get cut, they were going to be in their 4th/5th year in the program, and there was no way in hell they'd get as much money to play in another program as they would get paid by Marquette because there's no chance Marquette was cutting their funds?

When your argument is "Marquette pays players based on years in the program and does not stray from that pay structure, which is why nobody in their right mind would leave if you're Sean/Tre," you don't need someone to type out the words, "Caedin Hamilton is a 4th year player so he will get more money than Nigel James because he's a second year player."  Either Marquette pays players based on years in the program and Hamilton/Clark are getting more than James/Fru, or they don't pay players based on years in the program.

[Pakuni]

Literally typed out?  Maybe not.  But are you really going to argue there weren't posters on MUScoop who were claiming that Shaka/Marquette had a pay structure that paid players based on the number of years they were in the program? 

No, not maybe not. Definitely not.
You wrote that people - plural - think Fru and Ethan Johnston are making the same, and that Caedin is making more than Nigel. Nobody here has written that.
The rest is a bunch of goalpost shifting.
And quite a swing after moments earlier getting super pedantic over dewy grass (to which, I suppose, I could have pedantically pointed out that sidewalks, streets and driveways also count as the ground outdoors).

[wadesworld]

No, not maybe not. Definitely not.
You wrote that people - plural - think Fru and Ethan Johnston are making the same, and that Caedin is making more than Nigel. Nobody here has written that.
The rest is a bunch of goalpost shifting.
And quite a swing after moments earlier getting super pedantic over dewy grass (to which, I suppose, I could have pedantically pointed out that sidewalks, streets and driveways also count as the ground outdoors).

Is it goalpost shifting?  Or is it using logic?  I'll make it simple and you can either avoid the questions, or give honest answers?

Were there not Scoopers who claimed Shaka/Marquette paid players based on years in the program?
Were there not Scoopers who claimed Sean and Tre would not be leaving the program based on this, because they would get paid a lot at Marquette as 5th/4th year players, and nobody else would pay them close to what 5th/4th year players at MU would get?
How many years have Fru and Johnston been at Marquette?
How many years have Caedin and Nigel been at Marquette?

And when the answers inevitably come down to "Yeah, Marquette doesn't pay based on years in the program like posters claimed," then the next question, again, is why do people think we're paying Josh and Caedin so much that we can't land transfers (despite landing one of the top players at the most premium positions)?

[Hards Alumni]

Ignoring that I presented that as a hypothetical (notice the first word of my sentence?) ...
They relied on Caedin for 10ish minutes a game down the stretch last year. Given that the only difference among the post options between last season and this upcoming season is swapping Gold for Fru, it stands to reason that relying on Caedin for 10ish minutes a game remains a possibility.

But yes, you are correct, no coach has outlined exactly how many minutes Caedin will play next year. You got me there.

Correct.  And the roster is objectively different this year, and has been discussed players were dealing with injuries. 

Would it be great to have more options at the 5?  Yes, of course.  I'm not sure anyone is excited about the lack of depth.  Furthermore, I still would love to add a big.

Some names (no one wants to talk names, they just want to piss and moan).

Robert Miller III (So) - I'd love it as a replacement for Sheek, but he has been real quiet.
Jerald Colonel (Sr) - great idea, but will want to play a lot, which cuts into Fru's minutes
Emeka Opurum (So) - possible medical issue
Once you get this far down the available guys you are looking at are PROJECTS

The trouble is most of the guys still around in the portal are seniors and are going to be looking for a pay day and/or starting minutes.  We don't have those things available so we are going to roll it out with what we have.

[MUbiz]

I don't know what cars players are rolling around in, or what their license plates read.  But I think I remember hearing all the players got BMWs.  I'm guessing that's not coming out of their pocket from their NIL/rev share money that MU is offering them.

#fakenews #lies

Multiple players got other cars than BMWs - D Owens still rolling around in a Dodge Charger.

NIL deals or not - it gives the appearance that the backend players are getting paid extremely well.

[wadesworld]

#fakenews #lies

Multiple players got other cars than BMWs - D Owens still rolling around in a Dodge Charger.

NIL deals or not - it gives the appearance that the backend players are getting paid extremely well.

So they probably have a deal with a local dealership and get to pick a car to drive.

We should have Josh and Caedin sell theirs, kick them off the team, and then we could land a competent big.

[Small Orange Soda]

Literally typed out?  Maybe not.  But are you really going to argue there weren't posters on MUScoop who were claiming that Shaka/Marquette had a pay structure that paid players based on the number of years they were in the program?  And that Shaka would not negotiate with that, wouldn't work with agents, etc. and the only difference in pay players on the team had would be deals players found on their own outside of what Marquette set up for them?  That there weren't constantly posters who were claiming that because of this structure, there was no chance Sean Jones or Tre Norman would leave as their pay at Marquette wasn't going to get cut, they were going to be in their 4th/5th year in the program, and there was no way in hell they'd get as much money to play in another program as they would get paid by Marquette because there's no chance Marquette was cutting their funds?

When your argument is "Marquette pays players based on years in the program and does not stray from that pay structure, which is why nobody in their right mind would leave if you're Sean/Tre," you don't need someone to type out the words, "Caedin Hamilton is a 4th year player so he will get more money than Nigel James because he's a second year player."  Either Marquette pays players based on years in the program and Hamilton/Clark are getting more than James/Fru, or they don't pay players based on years in the program.

I remember someone once saying Shaka didn't like the idea of a transfer coming in and making as much or more money as someone who had invested years into the program already.

Well, Fru's here now and he's making more than almost every player on the roster I'd imagine. Whoever said that must be an idiot, right?

Oh wait, Shaka said that.

Things change. So no, nobody claimed Caedin is making more than Nigel because things don't work like that anymore. Shaka himself has said when they made the decision to not take transfers the landscape of college basketball was much different. This offseason, he's changing with the times. 12-20 will do that to you.

[Hards Alumni]

#fakenews #lies

Multiple players got other cars than BMWs - D Owens still rolling around in a Dodge Charger.

NIL deals or not - it gives the appearance that the backend players are getting paid extremely well.

Or, like a lot of 18-21 year olds, they're bad with their money. 

[#UnleashThePortal]

I don't read the bullcrap. But I still have to scroll to see if I can find the information I was after.

You'll eventually figure out the wonders of the word finder built into every browser.

[wadesworld]

I remember someone once saying Shaka didn't like the idea of a transfer coming in and making as much or more money as someone who had invested years into the program already.

Well, Fru's here now and he's making more than almost every player on the roster I'd imagine. Whoever said that must be an idiot, right?

Oh wait, Shaka said that.

Things change. So no, nobody claimed Caedin is making more than Nigel because things don't work like that anymore. Shaka himself has said when they made the decision to not take transfers the landscape of college basketball was much different. This offseason, he's changing with the times. 12-20 will do that to you.

Correct!  Things change!  Thanks for finally getting to the point!

Once again, why are you or others on Scoop so steadfast that we're paying Josh and Caedin some crazy money and if they weren't on the roster we could go get a stud 5 to come be a backup?

[brewcity77]

Pretty sure wades was being hyperbolic and referring to the fact that, in the past, some Scoopers claimed that Shaka's pay scale was based on seniority - hence Hamilton (a redshirt junior to be) making more than James (a sophomore to be).

In other words, there has been a ton of misinformation here about who gets paid what.

In the past, I'm pretty confident at least the floor was based on seniority. And looking back, it would've made sense.

2026 - Highest paid seniors Chase Ross and Ben Gold, followed by juniors Zaide Lowery, Sean Jones, and Caedin Hamilton (expected to be high-impact starters)
2025 - Highest paid seniors Kam Jones, Stevie Mitchell, David Joplin, followed by juniors Chase Ross and Ben Gold.
2024 - Highest paid seniors Tyler Kolek and Oso Ighodaro, followed by Kam, Stevie, and Jop

For the past three years, the seniors were expected to be the stars, the juniors were generally expected to start and contribute significantly, everyone else was expected to be in more of a rotation role.

It isn't crazy at all to not just think base NIL payments were preferenced by seniority, but that it was totally rational to do so.

[Pakuni]

Correct!  Things change!  Thanks for finally getting to the point!

Once again, why are you or others on Scoop so steadfast that we're paying Josh and Caedin some crazy money and if they weren't on the roster we could go get a stud 5 to come be a backup?

I don't think anyone has those players are getting "crazy money."
The better question is, why spend any money on players who won't play, if it could be instead be invested in recruiting players who will play.

[wadesworld]

I don't think anyone has those players are getting "crazy money."
The better question is, why spend any money on players who won't play, if it could be instead be invested in recruiting players who will play.

I'd think if they're making enough that we're not able to invest in players who play because of them being on the roster, they're making (what I could consider to be) crazy money.

[Small Orange Soda]

Correct!  Things change!  Thanks for finally getting to the point!

Once again, why are you or others on Scoop so steadfast that we're paying Josh and Caedin some crazy money and if they weren't on the roster we could go get a stud 5 to come be a backup?

Because no one is insisting they got crazy money. I very much doubt the third year player who started at center last year was making back of the bench money, though. Point is, if we're worried about overpaying guys, we're already doing that with our backup 5s anyway.

And nobody said they need to get a 'stud 5'. You know that, but replacing 'stud' with 'competent' renders your argument moot.

You keep twisting yourself into knots to defend this. "14th or 15th guy on the roster", "Averaged 8.5 minutes down the stretch", "We can just play other players out of position", "He's not making crazy money". If Tre, Zaide, and Sean leaving says something about how things are run now then Caedin still being around says something too.

He's the longest tenured player on the team. He's not making more than Fru, or Nigel, or Royce. But he's definitely making more than several other guys. It's been a poor use of time and resources. You can brush that off if you want, but it's the truth.

[SchnitzelBoy]

As much as I wish Sheek hadn't been poached, SLU is the one making desperation moves that might not make sense to a Marquette team. I do not know the specific amount of $$, but even if it was close to what Marquette was paying him I think he bolted mostly because of playing time. Fru is going to start and play 25-30 minutes every game unless he's hurt. Sheek would bounce between the 4 and 5 and get 15-20 minutes max.

The long-term plan for Sheek was awesome on Marquette's part because he would have slowly ramped up to being the starter next season. SLU missed out on another prospect and threw funny money at the kid. It was equally smart for MU not to match, if they even had the chance. Because if you drop a huge bag on your backup center in 26-27, then you might not have as much dough to play with next offseason. Even worse, you might upset the apple cart because other pieces on the roster might start demanding more $$$ using similar tactics.

Some Scoopers are freaking out because we didn't throw funny money at a backup big but the market would not have yielded an efficient ROI with who was still in the portal.

For next season, we'll have 10-15 minutes a night to figure out if Caedin and Josh can cut it. If it goes the way some of you fear it will, then Shaka SHOULD be forced to have some tough conversations (Tre Norman and Al Amadou). Best-case scenario for the backcourt is we see huge strides out of Josh Clark because he's 7'1" and moves pretty well. I do think we can get Royce some minutes at center because Alex Egbuonu and Damarius (maybe even MPIII and Ian) can cover the 4

[wadesworld]

Because no one is insisting they got crazy money. I very much doubt the third year player who started at center last year was making back of the bench money, though. Point is, if we're worried about overpaying guys, we're already doing that with our backup 5s anyway.

And nobody said they need to get a 'stud 5'. You know that, but replacing 'stud' with 'competent' renders your argument moot.

You keep twisting yourself into knots to defend this. "14th or 15th guy on the roster", "Averaged 8.5 minutes down the stretch", "We can just play other players out of position", "He's not making crazy money". If Tre, Zaide, and Sean leaving says something about how things are run now then Caedin still being around says something too.

He's the longest tenured player on the team. He's not making more than Fru, or Nigel, or Royce. But he's definitely making more than several other guys. It's been a poor use of time and resources. You can brush that off if you want, but it's the truth.

If Caedin and Josh aren't making crazy money, then how are we unable to land capable players in the portal?

I keep asking this and can't get an answer from you or Pak.

Heck, we have Sheek's money to play with.  So we have Sheek's money, we have an open roster spot, yet the issue is that we're paying Josh and Caedin.  But not paying them a ton, but enough that we can't land a competent portal big.

Makes sense...

[Small Orange Soda]

If Caedin and Josh aren't making crazy money, then how are we unable to land capable players in the portal?

I keep asking this and can't get an answer from you or Pak.

Because Shaka thinks Caedin is capable. There ya go!

[wadesworld]

Because Shaka thinks Caedin is capable. There ya go!

He obviously did not.  Caedin's minutes dwindled despite having Ben Gold and Royce Parham as the only other options on the team, he had Sheek signed up for another year, and he went out and got Fru in the portal.  Everything Shaka did in the offseason says you're wrong.  The reality is, we got into the portal game like everyone wanted, and now people are freaking out because the portal game went against us.  Which was always going to happen once you start playing that game.

And now, apparently, Josh and Caedin getting paid are making it impossible for us to sign contributors, even though they aren't making big money.