Big East job rankings

[panda]

If I were a Georgetown fan, these results would worry me.

This program is losing its cache.

Losing? Or lost years ago

[brewcity77]

If I were a Georgetown fan, these results would worry me.

This program is losing its cache.

I can't believe they're ranked that high. The DMV recruiting isn't worth what it once was with players going all over the country and transfers being a bigger priority than high school recruits. Their location being difficult to reach and fan support at games being low doesn't help either.

There are two distinct Georgetowns. The one that 40+ year old fans remember from their youth and the one that 10-22 year olds have watched for the past decade that has never done anything of note. Unless a family reveres Big John (the way Ed Cooley does) his accomplishments probably carry the same weight with prospective recruits as Al McGuire's do with players Marquette is targeting.

I'd put them behind Providence, though ahead of Xavier (X is too high, their NIL situation is not good, I've heard).

[Vander Blue Man Group]

you take hot steamers on MU hoops a lot. Question. when has MU been a stepping stone school? Crean, but wasn't he here 8 seasons? Majerus encouraged to go to the Bucks. Piano Man canned. KO only bailed because he apparently got a shiit contract offer. Deane? fired. Buzz? He downgraded himself in a tantrum. Woj? Smoked. Where's the stepping stone aspect to MU coaches that I'm missing?

You're kidding, right?

Post-Al, what  coaches that have had success decided to stay longer than 6 years?

One, Crean, who chose to leave after 9 years for what he considered to be a better job.

That's not crapping on the program, that's reality.

[GoFastAndWin]

I love Shaka as our Coach, and hope he modifies his approach, becomes wildly successful here and synonymous with Marquette as our "forever" coach. If he doesn't, any chance he would make a push someday at either becoming AD or President of MU?

He's probably the latter before he's the former, as he seems to have moral issues with the current state of college sports, as do many of us, and you can't really distance yourself from how the sausage is made, and still claim the moral high ground. IOW, I couldn't picture an AD Smart to a new coach: "I will look away, TJ, just get it done however you need to."

However I do feel Shaka would be an outstanding college President. He has the intellect and people skills, and he's an engaging community leader who inspires both school and civic pride.

Again, hope it's a moot point.

[DFW HOYA]

If I were a Georgetown fan, these results would worry me.
This program is losing its cache.

I'd be more worried that a new president walks in the door on July 1 and asks why he wants to spend $17 million a year for 3,000 people to show up to a downtown arena.

[MuggsyB]

I think because the climate has changed dramatically, it's very difficult to know which coaches might be a good fit at MU.  I think it's pretty much inconceivable that Shaka won't pivot and make drastic changes for '26-27.  We know Shaka is a very solid coach with tbe right pieces.

[Heisenberg]

I love Shaka as our Coach, and hope he modifies his approach, becomes wildly successful here and synonymous with Marquette as our "forever" coach. If he doesn't, any chance he would make a push someday at either becoming AD or President of MU?

He's probably the latter before he's the former, as he seems to have moral issues with the current state of college sports, as do many of us, and you can't really distance yourself from how the sausage is made, and still claim the moral high ground. IOW, I couldn't picture an AD Smart to a new coach: "I will look away, TJ, just get it done however you need to."

However I do feel Shaka would be an outstanding college President. He has the intellect and people skills, and he's an engaging community leader who inspires both school and civic pride.

Again, hope it's a moot point.

You're kidding, right?

Post-Al, what  coaches that have had success decided to stay longer than 6 years?

One, Crean, who chose to leave after 9 years for what he considered to be a better job.

That's not crapping on the program, that's reality.

Other than a handful of programs (Michigan State, Gonzaga, Kansas, etc), this description fits 95% of college basketball programs.

And in the portal/NIL era, it's probably going to 98%

[Billy Hoyle]

I can't believe they're ranked that high. The DMV recruiting isn't worth what it once was with players going all over the country and transfers being a bigger priority than high school recruits. Their location being difficult to reach and fan support at games being low doesn't help either.

There are two distinct Georgetowns. The one that 40+ year old fans remember from their youth and the one that 10-22 year olds have watched for the past decade that has never done anything of note. Unless a family reveres Big John (the way Ed Cooley does) his accomplishments probably carry the same weight with prospective recruits as Al McGuire's do with players Marquette is targeting.

I'd put them behind Providence, though ahead of Xavier (X is too high, their NIL situation is not good, I've heard).

Maybe DFW Hoya has more insight, but for many years, Gtown didn't even fully fund scholarships for most of their athletic programs. We know that as an institution, Gtown is flush with cash, but how much of that trickles down to athletics?

I know X as an institution is having decreased enrollment issues due to some strategic changes they made a few years ago (recruit and admit based on retention instead of just getting kids in the door), and I don't know their NIL situation, but they have superior facilities to Gtown and they pack Cintas night after night; they're around 95% capacity this season, and it's a great environment to play at.  Meanwhile, Gtown plays in a cavernous tomb in front of friends, families, and school groups.

[Galway Eagle]

Maybe DFW Hoya has more insight, but for many years, Gtown didn't even fully fund scholarships for most of their athletic programs. We know that as an institution, Gtown is flush with cash, but how much of that trickles down to athletics?

I know X as an institution is having decreased enrollment issues due to some strategic changes they made a few years ago (recruit and admit based on retention instead of just getting kids in the door), and I don't know their NIL situation, but they have superior facilities to Gtown and they pack Cintas night after night; they're around 95% capacity this season, and it's a great environment to play at.  Meanwhile, Gtown plays in a cavernous tomb in front of friends, families, and school groups.

Didn't we make these same changes awhile ago which is why we have an astronomical acceptance rate?

[Hards Alumni]

Common application

[DFW HOYA]

Maybe DFW Hoya has more insight, but for many years, Gtown didn't even fully fund scholarships for most of their athletic programs. We know that as an institution, Gtown is flush with cash, but how much of that trickles down to athletics?

I know X as an institution is having decreased enrollment issues due to some strategic changes they made a few years ago (recruit and admit based on retention instead of just getting kids in the door), and I don't know their NIL situation, but they have superior facilities to Gtown and they pack Cintas night after night; they're around 95% capacity this season, and it's a great environment to play at.  Meanwhile, Gtown plays in a cavernous tomb in front of friends, families, and school groups.

Georgetown has roughly 62 scholarships for 400 male student athletes. Four sports consume 47 of the 62 grants, the other 10 sports share about 15. That 62 number has remained more or less stable since the 1970s. The school is resistant to adding more, as football donors can attest.

It's not exactly flush with cash right now.

https://thehoya.com/news/gu-will-continue-hiring-freeze-budget-cuts-groves-says/

[Billy Hoyle]

Didn't we make these same changes awhile ago which is why we have an astronomical acceptance rate?

For X it wasn't as much concern over the acceptance rate but rather the retention rate - bringing in too many kids (I've heard schools refer to kids as "customers") just to get tuition money then their either A) couldn't pay the bill, or B) couldn't hack it academically. The refer to the strategy as "Recruiting Sophomores."

Our retention rate for 2024 was over 92%. X's most recent was 87%, an increase from 78% the year before. They (along with other smaller schools) are making a big push into the transfer market as well. But, it's going result in lower enrollment, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Our acceptance rate dropped below 80% for the 2025 cycle, the first time that has happened in a long time. Per the university, the enrollment goal was 1950 and we got 1949 (before "summer melt").

[Viper]

You're kidding, right?

Post-Al, what  coaches that have had success decided to stay longer than 6 years?

One, Crean, who chose to leave after 9 years for what he considered to be a better job.

That's not crapping on the program, that's reality.

I asked a simple question...name the coaches that left Marquette...using their MU HC gig as a stepping stone?  I mentioned Crean, but he had been here a while. And, IU is the more prestigious job. Who else? The rest were fired, or in Buzz' case, took a step down out of spite, or whatever it was Buzz felt.

[Billy Hoyle]

I asked a simple question...name the coaches that left Marquette...using their MU HC gig as a stepping stone?  I mentioned Crean, but he had been here a while. And, IU is the more prestigious job. Who else? The rest were fired, or in Buzz' case, took a step down out of spite, or whatever it was Buzz felt.

KO did.

[79Warrior]

Yes, and you're wrong. We've already been over this.
Anyhow, Shaka's probably gone next year to Kentucky. He'll be their first call, or so I've been told.

And yes, if Shaka has another year like this one, he should be fired. How much does the program need to bottom out before you let go of the guy who got you there?

So Kentucky is interested in a coach, who according to some folks, should be fired for poor performance. A coach who does not like dealing with agents, going to a school that drops bags left and right? I find that very hard to believe.

[Hards Alumni]

Georgetown has roughly 62 scholarships for 400 male student athletes. Four sports consume 47 of the 62 grants, the other 10 sports share about 15. That 62 number has remained more or less stable since the 1970s. The school is resistant to adding more, as football donors can attest.

It's not exactly flush with cash right now.

https://thehoya.com/news/gu-will-continue-hiring-freeze-budget-cuts-groves-says/

Honest question.  Why doesn't your alumni base push for admin change.  This feels like they're running a top notch institution into the ground for no reason other than indifference.

[DFW HOYA]

Honest question.  Why doesn't your alumni base push for admin change.  This feels like they're running a top notch institution into the ground for no reason other than indifference.

Administrative change overall, or merely as it relates to scholarships?

[Hards Alumni]

Administrative change overall, or merely as it relates to scholarships?

If they won't budge on scholarships, then overall.  It just seems like administration malpractice. Does no one sound the alarms?

[Scoop Snoop]

So Kentucky is interested in a coach, who according to some folks, should be fired for poor performance. A coach who does not like dealing with agents, going to a school that drops bags left and right? I find that very hard to believe.

I think you missed the sarcasm. Elon made it clear that Shaka would have multiple offers from the P4 if he parted ways with Marquette after this umm...disappointing season.

[Viper]

KO did.

...true...but due to MU taking a dump on him with, as he said, the offer wasn't worth the paper it came on. He would have stayed!!! He had a solid team coming back. Unforced error, MU!

[Pakuni]

So Kentucky is interested in a coach, who according to some folks, should be fired for poor performance. A coach who does not like dealing with agents, going to a school that drops bags left and right? I find that very hard to believe.

You'll have to ask Elon about that. He believes Shaka would be atop the list for every single P4 job.

[brewcity77]

You'll have to ask Elon about that. He believes Shaka would be atop the list for every single P4 job.

If he was available, he would be one of the hotter names on the market. In the past 5 years he'd have 4 NCAA bids, BE title, BET title, two 2-seeds, 3 NCAA wins, and a Sweet 16. Even off a bad season that's a strong resume. Might not be the biggest or most desirable, but there are many P4 programs for whom he would be a big step up.

[panda]

If he was available, he would be one of the hotter names on the market. In the past 5 years he'd have 4 NCAA bids, BE title, BET title, two 2-seeds, 3 NCAA wins, and a Sweet 16. Even off a bad season that's a strong resume. Might not be the biggest or most desirable, but there are many P4 programs for whom he would be a big step up.

I wonder how he would answer this program building question in the interview setting.

"What will you do to take this team and program to the next level"

"I will leave no stone unturned on the high school level. We're going to recruit guys no one has even heard of!"

[Galway Eagle]

If he was available, he would be one of the hotter names on the market. In the past 5 years he'd have 4 NCAA bids, BE title, BET title, two 2-seeds, 3 NCAA wins, and a Sweet 16. Even off a bad season that's a strong resume. Might not be the biggest or most desirable, but there are many P4 programs for whom he would be a big step up.

There's a big difference between being a hot name and on the list for somewhere like Kentucky. Kentucky fans would hone in on early high seed flame out at Texas and MU and say no chance.

While respecting everything else that Shaka has accomplished it's warranted to say he has largely underperformed in the tournament. The next two tiers of jobs above MU aren't going to be that impressed by a sweet 16 as a 2 seed an a Cinderella FF run 15yrs ago.

[Pakuni]

If he was available, he would be one of the hotter names on the market. In the past 5 years he'd have 4 NCAA bids, BE title, BET title, two 2-seeds, 3 NCAA wins, and a Sweet 16. Even off a bad season that's a strong resume. Might not be the biggest or most desirable, but there are many P4 programs for whom he would be a big step up.

Ehhh ... I think it would largely depend on his willingness to engage in the current player market and the realities of present-day college basketball. I don't think many P4 athletic directors and boosters are looking what RGV has brought Marquette, rubbing their palms and saying, "bring me some of that."
And I think you're understating the effects of recency bias when it comes to the coaching carousel. Juwan Howard had a Big 10 title, National Coach of the Year Award, an Elite 8 and a Sweet 16 in a four-year run at Michigan, and he gets no interest.
When the carousel starts spinning in March, the first thing programs are going to see when they look towards Milwaukee is a guy who built a team that lost 20 games this year, not a guy who won a conference championship three seasons ago. And as much as they'd remember a guy who won a conference championship three seasons ago, they'll also remember a guy who washed out at Texas. They wouldn't see only the good parts of Shaka's resume.
But I'll concede, some lesser P4 programs may still be interested. That's a stretch from believing he'd sit atop UNC's list if they get rid of Hubert Davis, or he'd be Kansas' #1 guy if Self retires. That would have been unlikely three years ago, and ludicrous today.

OT, but Scoop's obsession with 2 seeds is so weird. Nobody cares about your seed (except, I guess, Scoop). Nobody hangs a banner for your seed. They don't host 10-year reunions for teams that got a 2 seed. Having a high seed is meaningful only if you play to it, which we've failed to do in four of our last five tournament appearances.