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Author Topic: 2022 World Cup Thread  (Read 6713 times)

Its DJOver

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2022 World Cup Thread
« on: November 09, 2022, 04:27:21 PM »
So much of the build up has been focused on the off field issues (and deservedly so), so it will be nice to actually see a ball kicked.

USMNT roster just dropped.

https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1590469664211374081/photo/1

Discussion about Pepi seems obvious but I think it's the right call. 

CB depth went from a strength to a weakness with Miles Robinson and Chris Richards out.

Can't wait to see how we line up match one.  Still don't think we get out of the group.

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2022, 04:59:20 PM »
Kind of wild to not see Steffen there, but I don't think its the wrong choice.  Turner is gonna be the man regardless.

Glad we are bringing Jordan Morris and his 7 MLS goals last year and no meaningful USMNT goals instead of Jordan Pefok who is playing fantastic for one of the best teams in Germany.  Him being frozen out of the US team in favor of someone like Morris, is baffling.

Hopefully Aaron Long and Tim Ream stay glued to the bench.

Golden Avalanche

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2022, 08:39:01 PM »
So much of the build up has been focused on the off field issues (and deservedly so), so it will be nice to actually see a ball kicked.

USMNT roster just dropped.

https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1590469664211374081/photo/1

Discussion about Pepi seems obvious but I think it's the right call. 

CB depth went from a strength to a weakness with Miles Robinson and Chris Richards out.

Can't wait to see how we line up match one.  Still don't think we get out of the group.

He's been great in the Netherlands and is much more impressive than either Wright or Ferreira. 

panda

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2022, 08:53:02 PM »
He's been great in the Netherlands and is much more impressive than either Wright or Ferreira.

This - he leaves mls to prove himself. Fails at Augsburg (bad situation for a young 9) and seeks out a move to better his situation at Groningen. Brutal for him after he worked so hard to improve his stock, all while Feriera sits pretty in MLS.

Its DJOver

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2022, 09:15:31 PM »
He's been great in the Netherlands and is much more impressive than either Wright or Ferreira.

Both Ferreira and Wright have been much more consistent than Pepi. We're what? 6 weeks removed from talking about if Pepi's goal scoring drought would hit a full year.  Ended at only 345 days. I have no problem taking either of them over Pepi.

panda

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2022, 09:20:39 PM »
Ferreira isn’t a 9 and has played terribly for the national team. He’s GGG’s guy but that doesn’t mean others are more qualified.

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2022, 12:19:55 AM »
This - he leaves mls to prove himself. Fails at Augsburg (bad situation for a young 9) and seeks out a move to better his situation at Groningen. Brutal for him after he worked so hard to improve his stock, all while Feriera sits pretty in MLS.

Both Ferreira and Wright have been much more consistent than Pepi. We're what? 6 weeks removed from talking about if Pepi's goal scoring drought would hit a full year.  Ended at only 345 days. I have no problem taking either of them over Pepi.

Pepi has been better but also remember the Eredivise is a goalfest and not much higher than MLS outside of PSV, Ajax, and Feyenoord.  Altidore scored 40 goals in 2 seasons there and never broke 15 again, even in MLS.  It’s not like Pepi is suddenly a revelation in a tough league.  He’s had a decent month in a soft league after a brutal year.

Meanwhile, Haji Wright had a really nice loan spell in Turkey.  Then he follows it up by starting absolutely scorching this year.  8 goals in his last 10 matches.  9 in the first 12.  He’s the epitome of in form and poaching.  He’s absolutely the right call over Pepi at this moment.

I totally forgot Ferreira only is relevant because he scored 4 goals in a USMNT…against f-ing Grenada.  Both him and Morris over Pefok crushing it in the 2nd or 3rd best league in the world is grating on me.

Also, just me personally, I have no use for Roldan on that roster, would have much rather seen Cardoso or Tillman brought for youth and experience.  I think both of them are playing Europa/Champions League football by the next WC

panda

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2022, 09:00:34 AM »
The injury bug hit jozy hard and frankly didn’t make a ton of great club choices on his way up. Hello sunderland.

Pepi has scored for the usmnt in real games during qualifiers while ferreira has looked terrible against any semblance of real competition.

I have a real problem with Ferreira as he’s proven time and time again w usmnt he’s nowhere near the quality but continues to get the call.

Oh well.

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2022, 10:01:00 AM »
The injury bug hit jozy hard and frankly didn’t make a ton of great club choices on his way up. Hello sunderland.

Pepi has scored for the usmnt in real games during qualifiers while ferreira has looked terrible against any semblance of real competition.

I have a real problem with Ferreira as he’s proven time and time again w usmnt he’s nowhere near the quality but continues to get the call.

Oh well.

It wasn't meant to be a dig on Jozy, more a commentary on the dynamics of the Dutch League.  Jozy at his peak was a great hold up/target forward, never a super prolific scorer or poacher.  I almost brought up Aron Johanssen's prolific time with AZ as well.

If we're talking Pepi vs Ferreira, then I don't have any disagreement at all.  Pepi all the way.  I just really like Haji Wright too and think he gets overlook by many fans.

I called out Morris instead of Ferreira cause he's shied away from top competition his entire career and hasn't even been all that special in MLS in awhile.  Not to mention he hasn't scored a meaningful USMNT in 5+ years.  If the manager wasn't an MLS guy like GREGGGG then neither would have been selected.


Golden Avalanche

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2022, 10:20:15 AM »
Both Ferreira and Wright have been much more consistent than Pepi. We're what? 6 weeks removed from talking about if Pepi's goal scoring drought would hit a full year.  Ended at only 345 days. I have no problem taking either of them over Pepi.

Ferreira hasn't scored in months yet he's more consistent than Pepi? Dude couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat.

Thinking Wright provides something that can't be found in Pepi (a guy who had a large hand in qualifying the USA) because he's scoring for a mid-table team in an irrelevant league where he's punking the likes of Sivasspor and Gazientap is fantastical.

Its DJOver

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2022, 10:39:46 AM »
Ferreira hasn't scored in months yet he's more consistent than Pepi? Dude couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat.

Thinking Wright provides something that can't be found in Pepi (a guy who had a large hand in qualifying the USA) because he's scoring for a mid-table team in an irrelevant league where he's punking the likes of Sivasspor and Gazientap is fantastical.

I mean, statistics disagree with you.  Pepi hasn't scored in 2022 for country.  Sure 4 of Ferreira's 5 this year came from one game against Grenada, but he also scored 18 goals for club this past year.

One hot/cold 6 week stretch will not make/break your WC place.  Look at England, Kalvin Phillips was never in danger of losing his spot on the plane even though he's only had 2 appearances for a combined hour of play this season.  Why? Because he's a player that Southgate trusts and was key for them in the Euros. 

Pepi had plenty of opportunities, playing for Gregggg this year to earn his spot on the roster.  He didn't seize those and thus he's at home for the next month.  He's 19, he'll get other chances that he'll hopefully take advantage of.

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2022, 10:46:51 AM »
Ferreira hasn't scored in months yet he's more consistent than Pepi? Dude couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat.

Thinking Wright provides something that can't be found in Pepi (a guy who had a large hand in qualifying the USA) because he's scoring for a mid-table team in an irrelevant league where he's punking the likes of Sivasspor and Gazientap is fantastical.

Pepi literally plays for a club that is 2 points clear of relegation in a league that is no better than the Super Lig. 

The Eredivisie has 5 clubs in the top 125 in Europe.  Super Lig has 6.  As I said, PSV and Ajax are very good, the rest of the league is as pedestrian as it gets.  Those 2 clubs have won 35 of the last 40 league titles.  Feyenoord won the other 5.  Pepi scoring against Waaljiwk, Dordtrecht, and Sparta Rotterdam isn't some huge own against Wright's competition.

As I said before, there are 2 lame ass MLS strikers that should give way to someone like Pepi before going after a guy like Wright scoring in bunches in a league that features a bunch of players who will play prominent roles on actual World Cup squads.

Tortuga94

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2022, 11:15:23 AM »
Jordan Morris doesn't deserve a spot over Pepi or Pefok, not sure what Berhalter's mindset is there. Pepi got royally screwed here, there was a ton of pressure on him to choose between the US and el Tri, and one of the carrots that was dangled in front of him was a spot at the WC which from everything I've read was pretty much implied that would he be there.
He comes in against Honduras and saves Berhalter's job, because if they don't get a result there, I believe Berhalter gets canned. I believe Pepi also scored soon after that against Jamaica too. He goes to the Bundesliga to an Augsburg team that was fighting relegation and really struggled to score, not the best move for him, but one that was also encouraged by Berhalter.
You can call up 26 players this year and you have zero Mexican-American players on the roster. Will Brandon Vasquez, Jonathan Gomez or any other dual national take that into account when it is time for them to pick which team they'll represent?

Tortuga94

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2022, 11:20:43 AM »
Pepi literally plays for a club that is 2 points clear of relegation in a league that is no better than the Super Lig. 

The Eredivisie has 5 clubs in the top 125 in Europe.  Super Lig has 6.  As I said, PSV and Ajax are very good, the rest of the league is as pedestrian as it gets.  Those 2 clubs have won 35 of the last 40 league titles.  Feyenoord won the other 5.  Pepi scoring against Waaljiwk, Dordtrecht, and Sparta Rotterdam isn't some huge own against Wright's competition.

As I said before, there are 2 lame ass MLS strikers that should give way to someone like Pepi before going after a guy like Wright scoring in bunches in a league that features a bunch of players who will play prominent roles on actual World Cup squads.

The Eredivisie is top heavy but it is better than the Turkish Super Lig top to bottom and I would take, PSV, Ajax and Feyenoord over their top teams.

BM1090

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2022, 11:26:32 AM »
Berhalter values XG and the USMNT typically has their highest XG games when Ferreira is in the XI. His movement is good and he's almost always in the right spot. Obviously, he needs to finish more. But I can understand why he's the preferred choice. He's also been in poor form lately so hopefully he can turn it around.

I couldn't care less about Wright/Pepi/Morris. Neither was going to play more than 10 minutes per game. But Morris is the most baffling inclusion to me. His late Nations League goal at El Salvador in June must be carrying a lot of weight.

Rest of the roster is fine.

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2022, 11:47:20 AM »
The Eredivisie is top heavy but it is better than the Turkish Super Lig top to bottom and I would take, PSV, Ajax and Feyenoord over their top teams.

Nobody is questioning the bolded.  Those 3 are better than the Galatasaray, Fenerbache, or Besiktas.  But after those top 3, there is nothing statistically to separate the rest from the rest of the Super Lig.  Golden can mock Sivasspor but they are playing in Europa the last few years and would thump a Groningen club who isn't competing at the top of the Eredivisie.  There are plenty of solid clubs who aren't household names and they are attracting talent who just miss out on the top 4 Euro leagues

Tortuga94

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2022, 11:54:39 AM »
Nobody is questioning the bolded.  Those 3 are better than the Galatasaray, Fenerbache, or Besiktas.  But after those top 3, there is nothing statistically to separate the rest from the rest of the Super Lig.  Golden can mock Sivasspor but they are playing in Europa the last few years and would thump a Groningen club who isn't competing at the top of the Eredivisie.  There are plenty of solid clubs who aren't household names and they are attracting talent who just miss out on the top 4 Euro leagues

BTW, I do think Haji Wright should be part of the roster, if it were up to me, Pepi and Pefok are in, Morris and Ferreira are out.

panda

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2022, 11:57:53 AM »
It wasn't meant to be a dig on Jozy, more a commentary on the dynamics of the Dutch League.  Jozy at his peak was a great hold up/target forward, never a super prolific scorer or poacher.  I almost brought up Aron Johanssen's prolific time with AZ as well.

If we're talking Pepi vs Ferreira, then I don't have any disagreement at all.  Pepi all the way.  I just really like Haji Wright too and think he gets overlook by many fans.

I called out Morris instead of Ferreira cause he's shied away from top competition his entire career and hasn't even been all that special in MLS in awhile.  Not to mention he hasn't scored a meaningful USMNT in 5+ years.  If the manager wasn't an MLS guy like GREGGGG then neither would have been selected.

Never understood the Morris infatuation dating all the way back to Klinsy. Nowhere near dynamic enough to play at the top level. 

jesmu84

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2022, 12:38:30 PM »
Is there pressure to take MLS players, all else being equal?

JWags85

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2022, 01:07:50 PM »
Never understood the Morris infatuation dating all the way back to Klinsy. Nowhere near dynamic enough to play at the top level.

I understood it a bit circa 2014-15.  He was great in college, strong in the U23s, made sense.  However, when he turned down Werder Bremen and made it very clear he was happy and content to play at home for Seattle indefinitely, I was over him.  He hit his ceiling at 22-23.  How he's stayed in favor is baffling to me.  I was always hard on Donovan for being an MLS safety player, but at least he went on loan to Europe and the stature of Americans in Europe wasn't what it is now.  Morris had no excuse but being soft.

Is there pressure to take MLS players, all else being equal?

Maybe a bit from US Soccer, but I think thats dissipated since this generation is becoming notable and prolific for Champions League clubs.  Gregggg is very much a piece of the MLS machine since he went back to the Crew and clearly likes to favor guys from a league he knows well.  He's been better at times for the USMNT than I expected, but his MLS bias is one of his worst traits IMO.

MLS has grown a ton and they deserve credit for that.  But its still very much a developmental league.  If you under 25 and good enough to be getting National Team caps, you have zero business playing in MLS, IMO.

panda

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2022, 01:41:41 PM »
I understood it a bit circa 2014-15.  He was great in college, strong in the U23s, made sense.  However, when he turned down Werder Bremen and made it very clear he was happy and content to play at home for Seattle indefinitely, I was over him.  He hit his ceiling at 22-23.  How he's stayed in favor is baffling to me.  I was always hard on Donovan for being an MLS safety player, but at least he went on loan to Europe and the stature of Americans in Europe wasn't what it is now.  Morris had no excuse but being soft.

Maybe a bit from US Soccer, but I think thats dissipated since this generation is becoming notable and prolific for Champions League clubs.  Gregggg is very much a piece of the MLS machine since he went back to the Crew and clearly likes to favor guys from a league he knows well.  He's been better at times for the USMNT than I expected, but his MLS bias is one of his worst traits IMO.

MLS has grown a ton and they deserve credit for that.  But its still very much a developmental league.  If you under 25 and good enough to be getting National Team caps, you have zero business playing in MLS, IMO.

At least donovan succeeded on the international level. Morris has done nothing.

jesmu84

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2022, 03:03:05 PM »
Does aaronsons name listed as MF matter?

Is this roster locked into 4 at the back? I don't think they have any decent wingbacks

jesmu84

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #22 on: November 10, 2022, 03:07:08 PM »
What would your starting lineup look like?

Turner
Dest-zimmerman-ream-robinson
Adams
Musah-weston
Aaronson-sargent-pulisic


What is greggggs lineup going to look like?

Turner
Dest-zimmerman-long-robinson
Musah-adams-weston
Weah-fereria-pulisic
« Last Edit: November 10, 2022, 03:11:12 PM by jesmu84 »

jesmu84

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2022, 03:08:59 PM »
What should the expectations be?

I think the talent is there for a quarterfinal finish, regardless of opponent.

Not getting out of the group is hugely disappointing.

BM1090

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Re: 2022 World Cup Thread
« Reply #24 on: November 10, 2022, 03:14:57 PM »
What should the expectations be?

I think the talent is there for a quarterfinal finish, regardless of opponent.

Not getting out of the group is hugely disappointing.

I don't know the updated numbers, but the US had the youngest average age in the WC by two full years prior to Ream's addition. I think getting out of the group should be the expectation. The talent is there. Iran and Wales won't be cakewalks, but the US should be the 2nd best team in the group.

Drawing Qatar, Netherlands, Ecuador or Senegal in the Round of 16 isn't the worst thing either. Those teams are beatable. I don't see a path beyond that since they'd likely draw France or Argentina in the QF.