Frustrating but Fresh Start

[Mu8891]

91114 ...

I agree w / your post.  Remember at the start of the year when ( most ) posters were saying...

" let's hope they improve and play better at end of the year " ?

They have not improved.  They are playing worse ... and spinning out of control

[MuggsyB]

The worst part is that we've shown little improvement as the season has progressed.
- Last road win was Jan 26.
- 0-6 on the road since
- haven't beat a tournament team since 2/2
- dropped out of the top 25
- Defense has dropped well outside top 40
- and WORST of all the team has zero fight and is playing selfish iso basketball.

I'll give Shaka a C for the season, but it has certainly been a tale of two halves.

Why do you think we have regressed?

[goldeneagle91114]

Why do you think we have regressed?

I'm not a basketball expert, but my personal belief is that there was not enough scouting/tape on Marquette (both as a team and on individual players) to begin the year, and shaka's high-pressure Defense surprised  a lot of teams. However, As the season carried on, teams found our weaknesses, and we have not been able to adapt. The lack of adaptation could be due to the current players on the roster (many have pointed out that this year's starters were nothing more than role players on previous teams) BUT It could also be due to coaching

[Viper]

Our seed makes zero difference. The first round game is completely just based on matchups. The 6 to 11s are all almost the exact same talent wise.

Worrying about a marginally better second round opponent is silly. The first round is Marquette's super bowl. We haven't beaten a tournament team in a month and a half.

heck, last ncaa tourney win was when, 2012?

[mugrad_89]

I'm not a basketball expert, but my personal belief is that there was not enough scouting/tape on Marquette (both as a team and on individual players) to begin the year, and shaka's high-pressure Defense surprised  a lot of teams. However, As the season carried on, teams found our weaknesses, and we have not been able to adapt. The lack of adaptation could be due to the current players on the roster (many have pointed out that this year's starters were nothing more than role players on previous teams) BUT It could also be due to coaching

We don't seem to have a Plan B when they take the pick and roll away from Tyler.  Kur has regressed as a defensive stopper on the back end when we try to press.  And if the other team is good at rebounding, we are toast.

[CTWarrior]

Why do you think we have regressed?

Because our drive and long kick out game is now defended and the defense knows who can shoot and who can't.  I don't think it is lack of adjustments by Shaka, but rather lack of complete or close to complete players.  We have a couple three point shooters, but they aren't hard to take away when you don't have to worry about other three point shooters or a low post scorer.  Once you realize our penetrators are not finishers, you don't have to leave your man and the passing lanes are gone.  The only consistent offense we've been able to muster since the passing lanes have been denied are Lewis and Morsell getting into the lane for mid range jumpers or rim attacks.  We desperately need a C who can play basketball in the Big East, and penetrators who can finish, because that will result in the ball movement we saw during our best stretch.

[MuggsyB]

Because our drive and long kick out game is now defended and the defense knows who can shoot and who can't.  I don't think it is lack of adjustments by Shaka, but rather lack of complete or close to complete players.  We have a couple three point shooters, but they aren't hard to take away when you don't have to worry about other three point shooters or a low post scorer.  Once you realize our penetrators are not finishers, you don't have to leave your man and the passing lanes are gone.  The only consistent offense we've been able to muster since the passing lanes have been denied are Lewis and Morsell getting into the lane for mid range jumpers or rim attacks.  We desperately need a C who can play basketball in the Big East, and penetrators who can finish, because that will result in the ball movement we saw during our best stretch.

Fair enough but why has our defense also been a disaster?  I don't disagree with your points but do think we could make a few adjustments.   Imo  it's not particularly smart for Lewis to launch so many threes.  I think we can play through him much more in the high or wide post.  If he's patient and understands where the double is coming from I feel we can move the ball and create far more open shots in the half-court.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

Muggsy, I kept waiting for Lewis to do exactly that   work out of the low or high post and look for cutters but previous posters have noted we have devolved into individual BB.  With absolutely no post presence we are easy to contain.  Does anyone work with Oso or KK? they both seem to be lost on the court

[MuggsyB]

Muggsy, I kept waiting for Lewis to do exactly that   work out of the low or high post and look for cutters but previous posters have noted we have devolved into individual BB.  With absolutely no post presence we are easy to contain.  Does anyone work with Oso or KK? they both seem to be lost on the court

Well....all I can say us right now we are not better on either end of the floor or on the glass playing our 5's.  And they were pretty effective earlier in the season.  We may have to go small depending on who we match up with.

[CTWarrior]

Fair enough but why has our defense also been a disaster?  I don't disagree with your points but do think we could make a few adjustments.   Imo  it's not particularly smart for Lewis to launch so many threes.  I think we can play through him much more in the high or wide post.  If he's patient and understands where the double is coming from I feel we can move the ball and create far more open shots in the half-court.

Well I do agree with you that we need to do the work to test the defense and get the ball in the paint and not take so many, many long jumpers so early. 

I think the defense suffers some because Oso is not good down low, nor can Kuath guard a big man without help jus t from lack of strength.  Kuath is a good help defender and teams have realized not to challenge him and either go to the post man who can muscle him or make the dump off pass when he challenges the driver.  Teams are attacking Kolek more in the latter half of the season.

Our turnovers and poor shot selection lead to a lot of opportunities in transition, and we are not good defensive rebounders.  For some reason we are getting beat down the court on occasion where we did not take a bad shot or turn the ball over, too.  Despite all of what I just said, I still think our halfcourt defense through the opponent's initial shot is still very good.

[Big Papi]

Well I do agree with you that we need to do the work to test the defense and get the ball in the paint and not take so many, many long jumpers so early. 

I think the defense suffers some because Oso is not good down low, nor can Kuath guard a big man without help jus t from lack of strength.  Kuath is a good help defender and teams have realized not to challenge him and either go to the post man who can muscle him or make the dump off pass when he challenges the driver.  Teams are attacking Kolek more in the latter half of the season.

Our turnovers and poor shot selection lead to a lot of opportunities in transition, and we are not good defensive rebounders.  For some reason we are getting beat down the court on occasion where we did not take a bad shot or turn the ball over, too.  Despite all of what I just said, I still think our halfcourt defense through the opponent's initial shot is still very good.

Agree with all your points.  Spot on.  The biggest deficiency on this team is the 5 spot.  Oso looks like a lost puppy out there more time than not.  Kur struggles when he can't block shots.  Neither is a good rebounder.  Neither can score from 4 feet out.  They commit too many silly turnovers.  They get backed down way too easily forcing us to have to double down low.  Hard to play 4 on 5 for 40 minutes, every single game.

The other players have deficiencies as well, but they have a lot of strong attributes to compensate.  Getting 2 decent bigs next year is mandatory.

[mileskishnish72]

Agree that the 5 spot is the biggest problem. Kur looked great when TK could P&R, but that's been gone for a long time. He gets bodied and isn't a factor. Sadly, Oso no improvement. 39-27 on rebounds today, and unless that changes, we're not going anywhere.

It was a miserable showing, with little if any evidence of energy. The picture that sticks in my mind was one, when we were coming back and the end, had momentum, and it was truly a competitive game. We got a TO near the Creighton bench. Ordinarily, you'd expect college kids to be psyched! The camera angle show JL walking deliberately back to the other half of the court, and he could not have looked more disinterested. If he's not gowne, I'm the Queen of Sheba.

And if that's the case, it's going to take an All-American performance by Shaka in the transfer portal to keep us from being worse next year than this. Don't get me wrong, I thought that this year was far more successful than what I expected, and Kudos to SS for that. But if we lose JL, KK, DM, and who knows who else, I don't think the frosh we've signed will change the course of history.

He's fooled me once. Here's hoping he can do it again, and not emulate Wojo.

[MuggsyB]

Agree that the 5 spot is the biggest problem. Kur looked great when TK could P&R, but that's been gone for a long time. He gets bodied and isn't a factor. Sadly, Oso no improvement. 39-27 on rebounds today, and unless that changes, we're not going anywhere.

It was a miserable showing, with little if any evidence of energy. The picture that sticks in my mind was one, when we were coming back and the end, had momentum, and it was truly a competitive game. We got a TO near the Creighton bench. Ordinarily, you'd expect college kids to be psyched! The camera angle show JL walking deliberately back to the other half of the court, and he could not have looked more disinterested. If he's not gowne, I'm the Queen of Sheba.

And if that's the case, it's going to take an All-American performance by Shaka in the transfer portal to keep us from being worse next year than this. Don't get me wrong, I thought that this year was far more successful than what I expected, and Kudos to SS for that. But if we lose JL, KK, DM, and who knows who else, I don't think the frosh we've signed will change the course of history.

He's fooled me once. Here's hoping he can do it again, and not emulate Wojo.

This is a terrifying thought.  I think we can find some guys.

Have we taken a charge on a downhill drive all season? 

[Shooter McGavin]

No offense or defense out of the 5  spot. Oso is all alone 10 ft from the basket and doesn't even look to shoot. Playing 4 on 5 or 3 on 5 when Kolek doesn't look to shoot is not a recipe for success .  Offense breaks down to one on one

This is 100% correct. That and unforced turnovers kill us. 

[Shooter McGavin]

Because our drive and long kick out game is now defended and the defense knows who can shoot and who can't.  I don't think it is lack of adjustments by Shaka, but rather lack of complete or close to complete players.  We have a couple three point shooters, but they aren't hard to take away when you don't have to worry about other three point shooters or a low post scorer.  Once you realize our penetrators are not finishers, you don't have to leave your man and the passing lanes are gone.  The only consistent offense we've been able to muster since the passing lanes have been denied are Lewis and Morsell getting into the lane for mid range jumpers or rim attacks.  We desperately need a C who can play basketball in the Big East, and penetrators who can finish, because that will result in the ball movement we saw during our best stretch.

Yep

[NCMUFan]

Why do you think we have regressed?

Our downslope started the week that Marquette announced the large donation by the Smarts.
Coincidence, maybe.

[Uncle Rico]

Our downslope started the week that Marquette announced the large donation by the Smarts.
Coincidence, maybe.

That's it

[GoldenDieners32]

Considering we will most likely be in the 7-10 seed range, what teams in that range would we rather play?

[MuggsyB]

Considering we will most likely be in the 7-10 seed range, what teams in that range would we rather play?

Iowa St?  Rutgers?  I coukd see an MU/Loyola match-up?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Agree that the 5 spot is the biggest problem. Kur looked great when TK could P&R, but that's been gone for a long time. He gets bodied and isn't a factor. Sadly, Oso no improvement. 39-27 on rebounds today, and unless that changes, we're not going anywhere.

It was a miserable showing, with little if any evidence of energy. The picture that sticks in my mind was one, when we were coming back and the end, had momentum, and it was truly a competitive game. We got a TO near the Creighton bench. Ordinarily, you'd expect college kids to be psyched! The camera angle show JL walking deliberately back to the other half of the court, and he could not have looked more disinterested. If he's not gowne, I'm the Queen of Sheba.

And if that's the case, it's going to take an All-American performance by Shaka in the transfer portal to keep us from being worse next year than this. Don't get me wrong, I thought that this year was far more successful than what I expected, and Kudos to SS for that. But if we lose JL, KK, DM, and who knows who else, I don't think the frosh we've signed will change the course of history.

He's fooled me once. Here's hoping he can do it again, and not emulate Wojo.

Ummmm, no. He was nodding his head. Also, you may have noticed, JL is hardly ever demonstrative.

Not saying he is not gone, just that he was far from disinterested.

[panda]

Our downslope started the week that Marquette announced the large donation by the Smarts.
Coincidence, maybe.

Good point - less philanthropy more film room.