Wojo = Majerus

[Heisenberg]

Back in 1986, MU grew impatient with Majerus and he was gone after a few seasons.  He subsequently went to Ball State and figured it out.  Then had tremendous success at Utah (and eventually St. Louis).

MU was too impatient, they should gave stuck with Big Rick and given him time to figure to out.  Instead, they went with Dukiet and it crushed the program.

I cannot help but thinking that MU might, repeat might, be making the same mistake.  Wojo can recruit, that matters!  Maybe we should have given him more time to figure it out.

That said, I'm always ok with canning a coach.  But that is only half a decision.  Who they replace him with will complete the story.

If MU goes with someone unproven, and everyone leaves, and it's 2014 all over again, I think this will be a mistake.  They would have been better giving Wojo, a proven recruiter, those years to see if he can figure it out.

Instead, I hope they get someone that can keep the nucleus of what we have now, and get the potential of what we have now. No rebuild

1986 looms large and I hope history does not repeat.

[5DollarPitcher]

Anybody with 2 eyes and a functioning brain could tell he couldn't coach.

Could he get better eventually somewhere else? Sure, I guess anything could happen. But his timer was up at MU, we couldn't afford to let him continue to feel out his coaching abilities 8 years into the job.

If he moves on, acknowledges his shortcomings, and gets better at a different program - so be it. But I won't have any FOMO about it. It was never gonna happen here.

[Heisenberg]

Anybody with 2 eyes and a functioning brain could tell he couldn't coach.

Could he get better eventually somewhere else? Sure, I guess anything could happen. But his timer was up at MU, we couldn't afford to let him continue to feel out his coaching abilities 8 years into the job.

If he moves on, acknowledges his shortcomings, and gets better at a different program - so be it. But I won't have any FOMO about it. It was never gonna happen here.

I was around in 1986 and that is EXACTLY what they said about Majerus.

[Shooter Flatch]

If Wojo could be Majerus, you'd have to admit the Moser already is Majerus (Ball St or Utah version). He even learned from Majerus.

[Heisenberg]

If Wojo could be Majerus, you'd have to admit the Moser already is Majerus (Ball St or Utah version). He even learned from Majerus.

agree ... that is why I said I'm out with canning a coach (they all eventually get fired or burn out).  We need to see who replaces Wojo to decide if it was a good move.

[5DollarPitcher]

I was around in 1986 and that is EXACTLY what they said about Majerus.

Ok great.

If Wojo moves on to his version of Ball State, acknowledges his shortcomings, actually improves as a coach, he may go the route of Majerus. But staying at MU it was never gonna happen. Continuing to shake the magic 8-ball was detrimental for both sides and his timer was expired. Like I said - if he eventually gets better, it'll be because he left.

[StillAWarrior]

Just because someone might become a great coach tomorrow doesn't mean it's a mistake to fire him today. Firing Wojo was the right decision today.

[NickelDimer]

This is such an insult the the amazing basketball mind of Majerus. Terrible comparison

[Heisenberg]

Ok great.

If Wojo moves on to his version of Ball State, acknowledges his shortcomings, actually improves as a coach, he may go the route of Majerus. But staying at MU it was never gonna happen. Continuing to shake the magic 8-ball was detrimental for both sides and his timer was expired. Like I said - if he eventually gets better, it'll be because he left.

It took Wojo's mentor, Coach K, 10 years before the light switch flipped on. (remember in the mid-1980s the NCAA was 32, then 48 teams.  So those rounds of 32 were not wins)

1975–76   Army   11–14         
1976–77   Army   20–8         
1977–78   Army   19–9         NIT First Round
1978–79   Army   14–11         
1979–80   Army   9–17         
Duke Blue Devils (Atlantic Coast Conference) (1980–present)
1980–81   Duke   17–13   6–8   T–5th   NIT Quarterfinal
1981–82   Duke   10–17   4–10   T–6th   
1982–83   Duke   11–17   3–11   7th   
1983–84   Duke   24–10   7–7   T–3rd   NCAA Division I Round of 32
1984–85   Duke   23–8   8–6   T–4th   NCAA Division I Round of 32

Then ...

1985–86   Duke   37–3   12–2   1st   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1986–87   Duke   24–9   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Sweet 16
1987–88   Duke   28–7   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1988–89   Duke   28–8   9–5   T–2nd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1989–90   Duke   29–9   9–5   2nd   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1990–91   Duke   32–7   11–3   1st   NCAA Division I Champion
1991–92   Duke   34–2   14–2   1st   NCAA Division I Champion

[5DollarPitcher]

It took Wojo's mentor, Coach K, 10 years before the light switch flipped on. (remember in the mid-1980s the NCAA was 32, then 48 teams.  So those rounds of 32 were not wins)

1975–76   Army   11–14         
1976–77   Army   20–8         
1977–78   Army   19–9         NIT First Round
1978–79   Army   14–11         
1979–80   Army   9–17         
Duke Blue Devils (Atlantic Coast Conference) (1980–present)
1980–81   Duke   17–13   6–8   T–5th   NIT Quarterfinal
1981–82   Duke   10–17   4–10   T–6th   
1982–83   Duke   11–17   3–11   7th   
1983–84   Duke   24–10   7–7   T–3rd   NCAA Division I Round of 32
1984–85   Duke   23–8   8–6   T–4th   NCAA Division I Round of 32

Then ...

1985–86   Duke   37–3   12–2   1st   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1986–87   Duke   24–9   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Sweet 16
1987–88   Duke   28–7   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1988–89   Duke   28–8   9–5   T–2nd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1989–90   Duke   29–9   9–5   2nd   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1990–91   Duke   32–7   11–3   1st   NCAA Division I Champion
1991–92   Duke   34–2   14–2   1st   NCAA Division I Champion

I can see you had this stat word salad copied and pasted in your notes app waiting for someone to take your bait. Congrats.

Long story short - you're not understanding the moral of the story. Wojo might end up being good one day, but he is not good today. Our program is not the type to give coaches a decade to reveal themselves. Frankly, we can't afford to be given how reliant our school is on basketball. If you'd like to cheer for a school like that I'd be happy to point you in the direction of any one of the 15 perennial basement dweller teams that hold onto a mediocre coach too long for every one Villanova / Jay Wright.

[Goose]

That might be the most ridiculous comparison I have ever heard. Truly speechless on this one.

[Heisenberg]

I can see you had this stat word salad copied and pasted in your notes app waiting for someone to take your bait. Congrats.

Long story short - you're not understanding the moral of the story. Wojo might end up being good one day, but he is not good today. Our program is not the type to give coaches a decade to reveal themselves. Frankly, we can't afford to be given how reliant our school is on basketball. If you'd like to cheer for a school like that I'd be happy to point you in the direction of any one of the 15 perennial basement dweller teams that hold onto a mediocre coach too long for every one Villanova / Jay Wright.

It was from a thread on the same subject I started in January on the same subject

https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=61200.msg1295241

And I completely agree with you, Our program is not the type to give coaches a decade to reveal themselves

So, let cut to the chase, everyone that does not have 10 years of experience needs to be eliminated from this list.

1) Beilein
2) Moser
3) Shaka
4) Gates
5) Smith
6) Crean

[Heisenberg]

That might be the most ridiculous comparison I have ever heard. Truly speechless on this one.

Now I know I'm on to somnething

[brewcity77]

Maybe he is, maybe he isn't, but he was never going to win here. Not if he refused to use the tools Marquette gave him and put together a staff that could help him and not just be yes men.

[f/k/a humanlung]

I was around in 1986 and that is EXACTLY what they said about Majerus.

I was around, too.

What they actually said was he got the job too soon.  Not that he couldn't coach.

Comparing Wojo to Majerus is like comparing an apple and a lug nut.

[f/k/a humanlung]

It took Wojo's mentor, Coach K, 10 years before the light switch flipped on. (remember in the mid-1980s the NCAA was 32, then 48 teams.  So those rounds of 32 were not wins)

1975–76   Army   11–14         
1976–77   Army   20–8         
1977–78   Army   19–9         NIT First Round
1978–79   Army   14–11         
1979–80   Army   9–17         
Duke Blue Devils (Atlantic Coast Conference) (1980–present)
1980–81   Duke   17–13   6–8   T–5th   NIT Quarterfinal
1981–82   Duke   10–17   4–10   T–6th   
1982–83   Duke   11–17   3–11   7th   
1983–84   Duke   24–10   7–7   T–3rd   NCAA Division I Round of 32
1984–85   Duke   23–8   8–6   T–4th   NCAA Division I Round of 32

Then ...

1985–86   Duke   37–3   12–2   1st   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1986–87   Duke   24–9   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Sweet 16
1987–88   Duke   28–7   9–5   3rd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1988–89   Duke   28–8   9–5   T–2nd   NCAA Division I Final Four
1989–90   Duke   29–9   9–5   2nd   NCAA Division I Runner-up
1990–91   Duke   32–7   11–3   1st   NCAA Division I Champion
1991–92   Duke   34–2   14–2   1st   NCAA Division I Champion

Are you really including a military service academy?????

You are aware that the "recruiting" involved there is somewhat different, right?

[Goose]

Heisey,

I agree. You should run with this one and prove your basketball knowledge to the masses. This is going to be an overwhelming hit for you.

[5DollarPitcher]

It was from a thread on the same subject I started in January on the same subject

https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=61200.msg1295241

And I completely agree with you, Our program is not the type to give coaches a decade to reveal themselves

So, let cut to the chase, everyone that does not have 10 years of experience needs to be eliminated from this list.

1) Beilein
2) Moser
3) Shaka
4) Gates
5) Smith
6) Crean

Now you're putting words in my mouth. I never said all good coaches need at least a decade of experience to produce. I said our program doesn't allot a mediocre coach 10 years to reveal himself as good. There are many coaches with <10 years experience that are very good. Let's just say Buzz for instance.

You're trying hard, but it's not going great.

[Heisenberg]

Are you really including a military service academy?????

You are aware that the "recruiting" involved there is somewhat different, right?

Are you also aware that in the 1970s and 1980s a popular destination for McD AAs was ... community colleges.  Recruiting was far different back then.

The fact is the Duke faithful were inches away from sending K packing in the mid-1980s.  They thought he was a terrible coach.

[Goose]

Heisey

What was recruiting like back then?

[Heisenberg]

Heisey

What was recruiting like back then?

You're the basket genius and I'm the mouth breather.  Why don't you tell us what recruiting was like in the 1970s when there was no internet, only one game a week on national TV, and Street and Smith once a month.

[Johnny B]

Hes been fired. hasnt he had enough? jeez

[Goose]

I sincerely was following up on your post. As for my being a basket genius, far from it. Pretty knowledgeable on MU history and likely have outdated view of how the game should be played. I have noted several times this week that I do not follow the game as closely as I once did.

[Lennys Tap]

Wojo = Majerus?

LOL

We gave Wojo 7 years. He still doesn't know what he's doing. In year 5 as a HC, Majerus was 29-3 at Ball St. In year 6, he was30-4 at Utah.

There's as much resemblance between them as coaches as there is between them in appearance.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Wojo would be lucky to get hired by Testicle U.