The perfect 10 man MU roster for 2021?

[The Sultan]

Mmm-hmm

What does it tell you about the NBA when even super efficient post up players simply don't post up very often?

[bilsu]

Unpopular opinion, but those guys at their prime would not beat most MU teams from the past two decades. Just like science and technology have come a long ways since the 70s, so has athletics. The players are bigger, stronger, faster, the coaches understand the game better, athletic training/coaching/nutrition are at entirely different levels. Kids are in youth leagues from the time they are 3 learning the game. It's why comparing players from different eras doesn't work. Those 10 were more dominant at their time than any other MU players have been at theirs besides Wade and maybe Jae.

I am assuming they would be able to take advantage of the today's facilities and training. Talent is talent and they would only benefit from today's facilities.

[bilsu]

Dean Meminger wouldn't have been as effective in today's college basketball as, say, Jalen Brunson was for Nova? Please.

Our current team would have a lot less turnovers, if Meminger was our point guard.

[bilsu]

I would've picked George over Toone.

Toone could shoot from the outside. George in college was mostly a driver. I did not need an inside scorer when I already had Chones, Lucas and Ellis.

[bilsu]

I wonder how many of the posters that are arguing Al's players would not be as good in today's game were even around to see them play.

[muwarrior69]

LMAO indeed.

George played forward in college because he played so much bigger than his actual size. In the pros (5 years ABA, 1 year NBA) he played mostly SG and some PG. one year he averaged 27 points, 5 rebounds and 3.7 assists. He regularly made fools out of players much better than Theo John.

I remember Blanton Simmons and IIRC was only 6'4" or 6'5" was our starting center. Al's guys were undersized but they could go after it on the boards.

[MU82]

What does it tell you about the NBA when even super efficient post up players simply don't post up very often?

So if 21-year-old Shaq were coming out of college today for the draft, every NBA general manager would pass on him twice, right?

I mean, he'd be so inefficient! Who would even want him?

[Herman Cain]

Cause everyone is just underselling him due to Wojo hate and lack of success with him on the team.  One of the best shooters and scorers in NCAA history who excelled in today's game is being deemed a "specialist".  Meanwhile, people are suggesting George Thompson or Don Kojis who were inside players while being shorter than most good SGs in the modern game.  It's just over weighting history and ignoring the question.  Kojis given his style and size wouldn't even be high major player in 2021.

Howard, with a very good PG like Butch Lee, or even Diener, with some of the excellent forwards mentioned behind him, would be absolutely deadly.  He shot 42% from 3 while being the sole focal point of the offense, having all the attention, and no PG to get him the ball.  Imagine him if he had space and other offensive weapons around him.

Kojis was a fantastic player . I saw him play live several times in the NBA where he was an All Star. He would be a force in any era . 

George Thompson was the second best player in New York  City after Lee Alcindor . He would be a dominant player in any era as well.

[MuggsyB]

Kojis was a fantastic player . I saw him play live several times in the NBA where he was an All Star. He would be a force in any era . 

George Thompson was the second best player in New York  City after Lee Alcindor . He would be a dominant player in any era as well.

How good was Mannigault in NYC Herman?  That story that he took quarters off the top of the backboard and had a 50 inch vert?  Is that fact or fiction?  I believe there was another playground legend that got called for 3 secs in the lane while he was in the air. 

[JWags85]

Kojis was a fantastic player . I saw him play live several times in the NBA where he was an All Star. He would be a force in any era . 

George Thompson was the second best player in New York  City after Lee Alcindor . He would be a dominant player in any era as well.

Was that Lou's cousin?

And again, nobody is saying they weren't great players deserving of all their accolades, but name me a "dominant" 6'2 G/F who scored the majority of their points inside or within 15 feet within the last 10-15 years.  Cause that's what Kojis and Thompson were.

The argument naturally becomes "oh well if they played now they would have an outside shot/better fitness/stronger due to training and nutrition, etc... but that's not what this is about. It's the style and type of player that they were in their prime.

[79Warrior]

I wonder how many of the posters that are arguing Al's players would not be as good in today's game were even around to see them play.

Exactly.

[The Sultan]

So if 21-year-old Shaq were coming out of college today for the draft, every NBA general manager would pass on him twice, right?

I mean, he'd be so inefficient! Who would even want him?

We're you this intellectually dishonest as a reporter?  You keep making up arguments no one is suggesting. Of course he would be drafted. He would be drafted very high. I am saying he would not have the same impact offensively as he did unless he changed his game.

[The Sultan]

Kojis was a fantastic player . I saw him play live several times in the NBA where he was an All Star. He would be a force in any era . 

George Thompson was the second best player in New York  City after Lee Alcindor . He would be a dominant player in any era as well.

Thompson wouldn't be dominant unless he expanded his game.

I don't think people understand how much the game has changed in 50 years.

[Hards Alumni]

Anyone not putting Markus Howard in their 10 man roster should not be taken seriously.

[The Sultan]

I wonder how many of the posters that are arguing Al's players would not be as good in today's game were even around to see them play.

I did.

The whole premise is about putting that team, as is, into today's game.  They would struggle.  Now if they grew up in today's game and would develop as current players have, they would undoubtedly be very good. 

But that's not the premise of the topic.

[MU82]

We're you this intellectually dishonest as a reporter?  You keep making up arguments no one is suggesting. Of course he would be drafted. He would be drafted very high. I am saying he would not have the same impact offensively as he did unless he changed his game.

I was being facetious, Sultan, and I have always thought you were a pretty intelligent reader.

Of course, in this year's draft, 21-year-old Shaq wouldn't just be taken "very high." He would go No. 1. And the owner, GM, coach and fans of the team that drafted him would be thrilled beyond words to get an incredibly skilled big man -- even if he doesn't take 3s.

And you know it, so you please be intellectually honest about it.

What a bunch of silly arguments we -- and I mean all of us here, including me -- are having about stuff that can never be proven.

[The Sultan]

I think Cade Cunningham would be drafted ahead of Shaq if the latter were coming out of LSU today.

[MU82]

I think Cade Cunningham would be drafted ahead of Shaq if the latter were coming out of LSU today.

I will respectfully disagree.

Anybody else you think would go before a 21-year-old Shaq?

[The Sultan]

I will respectfully disagree.

Anybody else you think would go before a 21-year-old Shaq?

Haven't done the research but a can't miss guy who can score from all levels would be more valuable than a guy who is dominant down low but can't score from deep.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I will respectfully disagree.

Anybody else you think would go before a 21-year-old Shaq?

A center who can't take threes hasn't been drafted #1 overall since when? KAT (2015), Anthony Davis (2012), and Blake Griffin (2009) were terrible 3P shooters in college but they showed promise and were able to add that to their games after a few years in the NBA. I think the last one with no ability to hit the 3 that was drafted #1 overall was Greg Oden in 2007.

[JWags85]

I was gonna say, Dwight Howard and Andrew Bogut were both consensus no doubt #1 picks in their drafts. Would they be now? Even top 3?

[brewcity77]

I will respectfully disagree.

Anybody else you think would go before a 21-year-old Shaq?

I don't think a 21-year old Shaq would go top-5. Cunningham, Suggs, Mobley, Green, and Kuminga are all the more athletic, mobile players the modern NBA favors & all have the ability to stretch the floor. They are also all at least 2 years younger than 21-year-old Shaq.

Shaq was great, but players like that are a relic of their time. I still think he'd play and be a quality contributor, but with the league how it is, he would never dominate like he did.

[wadesworld]

I don't think a 21-year old Shaq would go top-5. Cunningham, Suggs, Mobley, Green, and Kuminga are all the more athletic, mobile players the modern NBA favors & all have the ability to stretch the floor. They are also all at least 2 years younger than 21-year-old Shaq.

Shaq was great, but players like that are a relic of their time. I still think he'd play and be a quality contributor, but with the league how it is, he would never dominate like he did.

I don't know.  Shaq coming out of LSU was not some big lumbering dude.  He was plenty athletic and ran the floor well.  He was Zion before Zion (who, by the way, went 1 overall and has shown no willingness - or need - to shoot from further than 8 feet out).

I also don't think Shaq would've spent 3 years in college if he was a freshman in the 2020s.  It was not nearly as common to be one and done as it is now.  And bulking up and dominating with his back to the basket was how the game was played then, so it was the best thing for him.  In today's game, with all of the training and focus on what you're eating, etc., he would've had no incentive to bulk up like that.  Sure, he still could've.  But like Zion, that would be his choice.  I don't think he would've had trouble staying thinner and running the court like he did in his Magic days if he was playing today.

[CTWarrior]

I'm sorry but your opinion is crazy. Our national championship team would have been lucky to be a tournament team in today's NCAA. They were dominant in their time, more dominant than any other MU players besides Wade and maybe Jae and deserve all the praise and honors, but the game is different now. Jim Chones was the most dominant center to ever play at Marquette and he would have been considered a stick amongst current big men with no ability to stretch the floor and he's one of the two guys  (Lucas) of your 10 who I think could have a role today.

They did all play in the NBA/ABA but again it was a different era and other than Chones and Lucas, most of them had limited success at the pro levels. Most were career backups and only a few of them had the occasional season as starters. Wade is a top 15 NBA player all time and Jimmy is an All Star in today's game.

True, but those guys would be heavier and stronger if they played today and would have different skill sets.  If you can play, you can play.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

True, but those guys would be heavier and stronger if they played today and would have different skill sets.  If you can play, you can play.

For sure. I think people in this thread are having two different conversations. The conversation I'm having is taking a time machine, picking up players from past eras and plopping them into the NCAA/NBA today, not a what if greats from past eras had grown up in the current era.