DJ Carton, Justin Lewis, Dawson Garcia: How many transfer?

[MU82]

OK, of the Big 3, none will leave if Wojo stays. If he leaves, I would gather all would rather wait and see who would be the head coach.

Of our team, I suspect Akanno and Torrence probably are gone. Perez is a total unknown and Oso depends on whether he and his handlers feel he is better off elsewhere. I can't see Oso going to another Power 6 team at this time.

Elliott is an unknown as well. He is a role player with us. If he wants to start and contribute, I suspect he'll be looking at a mid-major, like Loyola or SIU.

Elliott has been a "contributor" in several games this season, and he was a major reason we beat Creighton and St. John's. Now, he might want more run (and perhaps a starting gig), and if that's true he probably will have to step down a level as you say.

I definitely could see Torrence moving down a level, too ... though if DJ goes he probably would be motivated to stay.

Akanno, it's totally unfair to judge him due to his unique situation, and obviously he is ahead of Oso and Perez, so I hope he comes back so we can see how good he really can be. People have compared him to Sacar; if that's an accurate comparison, folks need to remember that Sacar didn't get meaningful playing time until his third year at Marquette, and didn't really become a Big East player until his fourth year.

[The Sultan]

Not like this one. This board is over the top on their negativity and criticism like few others that is not warranted. What do you expect in a year like this? And believe me I am not one to make excuses.

The recruits should be fired up to come here next year, and the MU Brand is all over the NBA. The would be nuts to waver now. And no they should not let Wojo go! There is improvement.

Next season if all goes well LOOK OUT! High energy, play hard on both ends, coaches are invest in their development and they look hungry and have worked on their games.

Not only that I think the isolation and pandemic has made them stronger and tighter as a unit. All things an A.D should want to see. I stand encouraged. . . even after tough losses. In fact, I welcome them for a few of the underclassmen.

But next year, oh wait. Then you can start to judge, not now.   

Sorry, but I can't judge now if I want to.  There is nothing in Wojo's history here that leads me to believe that your statement above is anything but over-the-top optimism.

[Silent Verbal]

delusional. I swear by Wojo. he was hit by some early defections from kids who left early and is an excellent coach. You fans would whine about any coach they bring in here.

THIS IS NOT A BLUE BLOOD UNIVERSITY PEOPLE...you have to take time to work up to it!

Wojo is not an "excellent coach".  Seven years of poor to middling results bear that out, and so does our most recent three game swoon against the bottom half of a bad conference.  No one on here has said Marquette is a blue blood.  What most seem to expect is a team that's consistently ranked in the Top 25, competes for Big East titles, and makes the tournament every year, with the occasional mulligan once every 5 or 6 seasons brought on by early defections or injuries.  That's what we had under Crean and Buzz, and any coach worth his salt could attain it given the resources at hand.

[Galway Eagle]

delusional. I swear by Wojo. he was hit by some early defections from kids who left early and is an excellent coach. You fans would whine about any coach they bring in here.

THIS IS NOT A BLUE BLOOD UNIVERSITY PEOPLE...you have to take time to work up to it!

You trolling or serious? I genuinely can't tell

[brewcity77]

Wojo posting from his Scoop burner at midnight after another disastrous loss feels on brand.

[goldeneagle91114]

Wojo posting from his Scoop burner at midnight after another disastrous loss feels on brand.

Haha! +1

[The Sultan]

I am actually starting to believe that next year could actually be worse without a transfer in of some sort.  Theo, Koby and Jamal aren't super stars by any stretch but that's a lot of minutes to replace with unproven players.

[panda]

I am actually starting to believe that next year could actually be worse without a transfer in of some sort.  Theo, Koby and Jamal aren't super stars by any stretch but that's a lot of minutes to replace with unproven players.

Exactly three freshmen incoming along with Akanno, Oso and perez who have barely played. Add in Symir who looks in over his head. Why would it get much better?

[brewcity77]

I am actually starting to believe that next year could actually be worse without a transfer in of some sort.  Theo, Koby and Jamal aren't super stars by any stretch but that's a lot of minutes to replace with unproven players.

I was having this discussion yesterday. Sure, you get DJ, Justin, & Dawson back, but what else? And if even one of those leaves, you're really in trouble.

They will need significant immediate impact from Aidoo & Mitchell or some serious immediate impact level transfers. In addition, the three returning players are all streaky. At the moment, I think next year MU is most likely bottom three in the league.

[The Sultan]

Right.  Who's going to be that first forward off the bench assuming Lewis starts?  Osa?  Jose?

Is Aidoo starting immediately in Theo's role?

Say Greg starts next to DJ in the backcourt, you have Sy, Stevie or Kam as back ups.

None of this sounds very good to me.

[cheebs09]

I am actually starting to believe that next year could actually be worse without a transfer in of some sort.  Theo, Koby and Jamal aren't super stars by any stretch but that's a lot of minutes to replace with unproven players.

Yea. The one thing that could be a game changer is if Lewis, Garcia, and Carton are more consistent from 3. The Garcia and Lewis shooting has really come back down to earth after a pretty good start. At least from my eye test.

But we are only going 7.5 deep, and even that is pretty iffy. The drop off after that group must be really big if with Lewis out, we only get a few minutes from Akanno.

Other than Carton and maybe Theo, it feels like most guys are a step slow or really methodical. Or when they try and go fast, it ends in a turnover. I don't know how an extra year of development fixes that. I don't know if the recruits we have coming in are goi by to be ready to play like Lewis, or need some time like Osa and Akanno.

[cheebs09]

Right.  Who's going to be that first forward off the bench assuming Lewis starts?  Osa?  Jose?

Is Aidoo starting immediately in Theo's role?

Say Greg starts next to DJ in the backcourt, you have Sy, Stevie or Kam as back ups.

None of this sounds very good to me.

Agreed. That's why I push back with Gato's assertion that we have to run this back. The closest Wojo built to a complete team was 2019. Other than that, we've had talent, but it just doesn't seem to be a unit out there. It seems to be 5 individuals rather than a team.

I think if I had to bet, what would be the best route to a Final Four in 10 years, it would be Wojo moving on after this year and hiring a new coach to implement their system.

Heck, it's likely we'd have another coaching change within that 10 years. We've seen 7 years from Wojo and the best I can come up with is the Herb Kohl Bucks. Good enough to be an 8 seed, but not really a threat.

[BigWilly77]

Agreed. That's why I push back with Gato's assertion that we have to run this back. The closest Wojo built to a complete team was 2019. Other than that, we've had talent, but it just doesn't seem to be a unit out there. It seems to be 5 individuals rather than a team.

I think if I had to bet, what would be the best route to a Final Four in 10 years, it would be Wojo moving on after this year and hiring a new coach to implement their system.

Heck, it's likely we'd have another coaching change within that 10 years. We've seen 7 years from Wojo and the best I can come up with is the Herb Kohl Bucks. Good enough to be an 8 seed, but not really a threat.

Do we really need to be talking about another man's job right now? Where is the class by this fan base? We should be focused on supporting this team as best we can. None of us are in a position to shake up things at the top so it's best for us to fulfill our role as fans and support the team!

[panda]

Do we really need to be talking about another man's job right now? Where is the class by this fan base? We should be focused on supporting this team as best we can. None of us are in a position to shake up things at the top so it's best for us to fulfill our role as fans and support the team!

How many burners do you have?

[Silent Verbal]

How many burners do you have?

Yep.  Exact same writing style as MUHoopsFan2.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Wojo posting from his Scoop burner at midnight after another disastrous loss feels on brand.

Ha, MUHoopsFan has been around for awhile, long before Wojo. His MO is to post 6-7 times in the middle of the night on multiple threads, usually with a very Pollyanna lens before disappearing for weeks to a month.

[Galway Eagle]

Do we really need to be talking about another man's job right now? Where is the class by this fan base? We should be focused on supporting this team as best we can. None of us are in a position to shake up things at the top so it's best for us to fulfill our role as fans and support the team!

It's not like we're talking about the hard working blue collar guy that worries how he's going to feed his family and pay the mortgage. Wojo is a multimillionaire and essentially the CEO of basketball. We're the shareholders, he's not performing so it's our job to talk about it without the "another mans job" concern.

What do you mean the "class" yes a billboard is classless, but an anonymous board of fans talking about how frustrated they are after years of frustration is not classless, berating a players family on social media is.

What does it mean to "support this team" bottom line is without being in the stands there's nothing we can do except not be d*cks on social media. None of us owe this team our time and tears to watch bad basketball. There are a handful of posters here that are a step or two away from people who could make a shakeup happen and if word gets to those individuals then good.

[MU82]

Exactly three freshmen incoming along with Akanno, Oso and perez who have barely played. Add in Symir who looks in over his head. Why would it get much better?

Well, theoretically anyway, those three would get quite a bit better, just as Markus, Sam, Vander, Jimmy, etc, etc (name any good player) got much better as sophomores and/or juniors. Garcia would get stronger. All would improve aspects of their games.

I mean, Sam and Markus were role players as freshmen, averaging 9 and 6 shots per game, respectively. Vander was an offensive bust his first 2 seasons. Jimmy averaged fewer than 20 mpg his first season at MU, and again that was after being a Juco standout. And so on and so on.

That doesn't mean Dawson, Justin and DJ will improve to the degree that Markus, Sam, Vander, Jimmy and so many others did. But it's certainly not ridiculous to think they will be quite a bit better next season.

If they do become consistently very good players, it immediately makes next season more hopeful. Their supporting cast would be either young, unproven or both, but if the "big 3" come back and get any support at all, I don't think we'd be doomed to failure like some here do.

Having said all that, I'd fire Wojo because I no longer trust that he could put 'em all together to make for a contending team ... even though a ProJo could argue otherwise based on how the 2018-19 team gelled until the Hausershima Mutiny.

[BigWilly77]

Yep.  Exact same writing style as MUHoopsFan2.

While I'm sure MUHoopsFan2 enjoys the support. I am not him/her.

I fully support fans wanting a new coach. I just don't like seeing it on such a public forum like this.

Don't you think current players, recruits, coaches, parents, etc. are reading this? I'm sure a lot of the conversation on here isn't helping with their perception of MU.

I don't think Dawson, DJ and others like to see themselves being written out of being a part of the team.

We have to take some responsibility as MU fans (and for most on here, alumni) to protect MU's reputation and foster an environment of support.

[The Sultan]

While I'm sure MUHoopsFan2 enjoys the support. I am not him/her.

I fully support fans wanting a new coach. I just don't like seeing it on such a public forum like this.

Don't you think current players, recruits, coaches, parents, etc. are reading this? I'm sure a lot of the conversation on here isn't helping with their perception of MU.

I don't think Dawson, DJ and others like to see themselves being written out of being a part of the team.

We have to take some responsibility as MU fans (and for most on here, alumni) to protect MU's reputation and foster an environment of support.

Sorry but that's part of what these forums are about.  Complaining about that isn't going to change anything.

[BigWilly77]

It's not like we're talking about the hard working blue collar guy that worries how he's going to feed his family and pay the mortgage. Wojo is a multimillionaire and essentially the CEO of basketball. We're the shareholders, he's not performing so it's our job to talk about it without the "another mans job" concern.

What do you mean the "class" yes a billboard is classless, but an anonymous board of fans talking about how frustrated they are after years of frustration is not classless, berating a players family on social media is.

What does it mean to "support this team" bottom line is without being in the stands there's nothing we can do except not be d*cks on social media. None of us owe this team our time and tears to watch bad basketball. There are a handful of posters here that are a step or two away from people who could make a shakeup happen and if word gets to those individuals then good.

An online message board is quite the same as a billboard in my opinion.

Sure you don't have Joe Schmo driving to work seeing a billboard that says "Fire Wojo", but was he ever the target audience in the first place?

Instead, on this message board you have an audience of people from hardcore fans to someone stopping by to get a little more insight into MUBB.  The latter is the most impressionable in my opinion and for them to be exposed to this rhetoric against Wojo, the players and the administration is not a good look. We are turning off new fans from becoming more interested in the program!

[MUfan12]

We are turning off new fans from becoming more interested in the program!

The program's doing a great job of that on its own.

[panda]

Well, theoretically anyway, those three would get quite a bit better, just as Markus, Sam, Vander, Jimmy, etc, etc (name any good player) got much better as sophomores and/or juniors. Garcia would get stronger. All would improve aspects of their games.

I mean, Sam and Markus were role players as freshmen, averaging 9 and 6 shots per game, respectively. Vander was an offensive bust his first 2 seasons. Jimmy averaged fewer than 20 mpg his first season at MU, and again that was after being a Juco standout. And so on and so on.

That doesn't mean Dawson, Justin and DJ will improve to the degree that Markus, Sam, Vander, Jimmy and so many others did. But it's certainly not ridiculous to think they will be quite a bit better next season.

If they do become consistently very good players, it immediately makes next season more hopeful. Their supporting cast would be either young, unproven or both, but if the "big 3" come back and get any support at all, I don't think we'd be doomed to failure like some here do.

Having said all that, I'd fire Wojo because I no longer trust that he could put 'em all together to make for a contending team ... even though a ProJo could argue otherwise based on how the 2018-19 team gelled until the Hausershima Mutiny.

I'm not saying you personally, but fans generally overestimate their own teams talent/depth level. If none of the covid seniors return, it's going to be a slog.

[Galway Eagle]

An online message board is quite the same as a billboard in my opinion.

Sure you don't have Joe Schmo driving to work seeing a billboard that says "Fire Wojo", but was he ever the target audience in the first place?

Instead, on this message board you have an audience of people from hardcore fans to someone stopping by to get a little more insight into MUBB.  The latter is the most impressionable in my opinion and for them to be exposed to this rhetoric against Wojo, the players and the administration is not a good look. We are turning off new fans from becoming more interested in the program!

Pretty sure the product on the court is doing the turning off new fans from becoming more interested in the program fine enough.

You're right that some people may or may not come to this board, outside of John Dawson's dad and cousin we'll never know how many. But that is part of playing big time sports. You become a public figure and open to criticism that you wouldn't at a small school or less major sport. I do agree with you about not going too hard on the players and I try to avoid that (except for Buycks missed layup against Louisville) but the coach is the highest paid employee and should be held to accountable and certainly is open for criticism on a fan board, even more so when this is what he has given us to cheer for.

That being said you're right that this board is hardly a friendly place for new posters, old posters, and everything in between but that's the internet for you

[Silent Verbal]

An online message board is quite the same as a billboard in my opinion.

Sure you don't have Joe Schmo driving to work seeing a billboard that says "Fire Wojo", but was he ever the target audience in the first place?

Instead, on this message board you have an audience of people from hardcore fans to someone stopping by to get a little more insight into MUBB.  The latter is the most impressionable in my opinion and for them to be exposed to this rhetoric against Wojo, the players and the administration is not a good look. We are turning off new fans from becoming more interested in the program!

Sometimes in baseball a batter will hit a long home run and upset the opposing team and pitcher by flipping his bat, admiring his shot, or styling it around the bases.  Crusty old baseball guys might call this showboating, but the simple solution is, if you don't want the guy to flip his bat or admire his homer, don't give up the home run in the first place.

That's sort of the situation here.  If Wojo was actually getting the job done, no one would be complaining.  As it stands right now, he's lost three games in a row to teams in the bottom half of the conference during a crucial stretch of the season.  We're currently ranked #93 in Net, which is dreadful.  He has never won an NCAA tournament game and it looks like we'll be on the outside looking in this year.

And finally, the only "Willy" on this board is the one who talks about slurpers and phony lonesome cowboys.  You're either Chico, or someone associated with the MU athletic department or administration.  Fans will keep complaining about Wojo until he either wins or is shown the door, and there's nothing you personally can do to stop it.  Unless of course you're Lovell or Scholl.