WOJO HAS TO GOJO

[brewcity77]

Did you say this publicly on Scoop at the time? Did you go on the record and say, "Wojo has to go. Now!"

Not in those words, but here's what I said:

Personally, that's not good enough. It may seem contradictory, but from my perspective, the need to meet next year's pre-Hauser news expectations went up this week, not down. If the Hausers come back and we are slightly better than last year, fringe top-25, 4-seed, win a game or two in the NCAAs, it's disappointing but you accept it and move on.

This situation is of Wojo's creation. There is no other way to view it. If the problem was Markus' usage, that was Wojo's system. If you think the problem was team chemistry, Wojo recruited these guys. If you think the problem was Hauser selfishness, again, Wojo brought them in. Ultimately, whatever led to this week's transfers lays at Wojo's feet because it was his job to assemble this team and keep the team member happy once they were on campus.

Wojo created the expectation of a top-10 team & Wojo was overseeing the program whose Twitter account spent the past two weeks retweeting every top-10 projection for Marquette, reinforcing to the fanbase that a top-10 team & all the accolades & results that accompany such a lofty position is what we should expect for next year. In that regard, nothing has changed & if anything, it only became more important that the team we put on the court deliver the results Wojo & the program have been pushing out to the fanbase since the 2018-19 season ended.

I agree there needs to be flexibility. If we finish 3rd in the AP Poll, win the Big East, make a BET title game, earn a 1-seed, and lose on a buzzer beater to an 8-seed, that shouldn't result in a firing. But if we're nowhere close to the expectations the program has been pushing for the past two weeks? Say being ranked 24th, 3rd in the league, losing in the second round as a 6-seed, and generally not being close to the team we were projected to be 5 days ago? Then the accountability should result in a firing.

As I said before, I wrote administration then and as I knew Marquette wasn't going to fire him for transfers, I stated that no expectations should change and that anything less than the top-10 expectations we had was fireable.

You said Villanova had poor NCAA seeds if they made the tourney. And you said they had a poor trajectory.

They had seeds of 2,3,1,5.

They had a couple of 9 seed seasons.

Then they had seeds of 2,1,2,1,1.

I don’t see the crappy seeds/poor trajectory as anything other than a reach. Not surprisingly, neither did Villanova.

At the same time MU had a celebrated coach that had an 11 seed and missed NCAA’s that surrounded two top 5 seeded teams.

It's interesing you are decrying the value of fans on message boards...on a message board.

And you're repeatedly moving the goal posts I set out to start the discussion. You have three years of Villanova to work with, the three years before the start of the new league. Not 6 years, not 10 years, and not the period after November 2013. I'm talking very specifically about the time directly leading into the formation of the league and the perceptions at the time the league was formed. That's it. That's the discussion point. Because when people were talking about the new league, that's what they were focused on and that's what the 2013-14 preseason projections were based on.

[swoopem]

So you fire Wojo, that’s fine, but who are you bringing in to replace him? Secondly, you guys all blame Wojo, isn’t MU paying 4 other coaches as well? Does Rob Judson bring anything to the table? Or is Wojo such a control freak they bring nothing to the table? Al had Hank, does it not work that way any more?

IMO his assistant coaching hires have been terrible. Yeah, he brought in Stan and Killings who are good recruiters but then what do the other guys do? We promoted a video coordinator and brought back our ex DOBO who have both shown they bring nothing to the table (expect they probably pass Wojo the ball during lunchtime scrimmages). I don’t know what hell Judson does and if his big claim to fame is he was Air Force’s (I think that’s the school) coach then that’s pretty weak. I’m guessing it was in the 90s but either way Air Force sucks so I’m not sure why we’d hire someone with that resume.

We need experienced coaches not yes men. I know this would never happen but I’d love if we brought in Jim Calhoun just to strictly coach. Let Wojo/his top assistant (killings for now) recruit and be the face of the program but let the old guy who can actually coach...coach

P.S I was a big fan of Brett Nelson’s player development but that seems to be long gone 

[shoothoops]

Not in those words, but here's what I said:

As I said before, I wrote administration then and as I knew Marquette wasn't going to fire him for transfers, I stated that no expectations should change and that anything less than the top-10 expectations we had was fireable.

It's interesing you are decrying the value of fans on message boards...on a message board.

And you're repeatedly moving the goal posts I set out to start the discussion. You have three years of Villanova to work with, the three years before the start of the new league. Not 6 years, not 10 years, and not the period after November 2013. I'm talking very specifically about the time directly leading into the formation of the league and the perceptions at the time the league was formed. That's it. That's the discussion point. Because when people were talking about the new league, that's what they were focused on and that's what the 2013-14 preseason projections were based on.

I didn't say anything about the value of a message board. What I said was, it is teeny tiny compared to a fan base. The vast majority of fans are not on message boards or social media. You see this often with sports media types on Twitter for example. They get tunnel vision because that's where they are much of the time. Twitter is very small compared to what's going on away from social media. We can surely agree on this, yes. That doesn't have anything to do with my presence on here for example. Yes, we all here on this message board, represent a small faction of the MU fan base.

I believe you are the one moving the goal posts. It's not okay to cherry pick a few years without comparing and contrasting what happened immediately prior to those few years.

You have repeatedly mentioned Jay Wright's success the past 7 years, without metioning the fact his success at Villanova prior to that was better than not Wojo, but better than Buzz' MU success too.

Another example here is your predicted success for MU in 2014. Well, we know in 2014, Villanova was:

29-5 (16-2) 1st place, NCAA 2 seed.

I included all of the years, the totality. Because they matter, and are taken into account. And since you are determined to cherry pick those few years, Nova's years immediately prior were better than what Buzz did at MU. I am happy to discuss how it took Jay Wright his 4th season at Nova to make the NCAA's and rebuild their program, It's the same amount of years as it tool Coach K at Duke for example.

Again, we all (at least many of us) believe Buzz was successful at MU, and, many of us would have liked for that to keep going. But your posts come across as if MU was going to be better than Villanova. That's quite a reach there. One's success isn't going to take away from the other. You later changed to say MU could have reached Nova's success, and, unlike some may do here, I actually agreed with you.

Had you talked more about school President, AD, things like that, there would likely have been more agreement.

But no I can't sit here and say MU was better positioned than Nova coming off of a 17-14 no NCAA season jist two seasons removed from a 9th place league finish.

MU had two 3 seeds in NCAA's under Buzz. Those were their only top 5 seeds under him. Again I most certainly believe Buzz could have bounced back after the lost Vander Blue season. It would have taken 1-2 years of not so great to get there. But sure he could have done that and got MU back into a better mix. I just don't see how that is relevant to Villanova.

And, again, I have agreed with your overall Wojo assessment. Unless MU makes the NCAA's and wins a game or two this season in it, I am just fine with MU moving on from him. But he is there now, and he has a good chance to get a win over Madison tonight, and to turn it around and save his job this season. His seat is hot. (yes he may get financial pandemic season for next year either way)

[Galway Eagle]

You said Villanova had poor NCAA seeds if they made the tourney. And you said they had a poor trajectory.

They had seeds of 2,3,1,5.

They had a couple of 9 seed seasons.

Then they had seeds of 2,1,2,1,1.

I don’t see the crappy seeds/poor trajectory as anything other than a reach. Not surprisingly, neither did Villanova.

At the same time MU had a celebrated coach that had an 11 seed and missed NCAA’s that surrounded two top 5 seeded teams.

9, miss, 9.

To me 9's are crappy seeds, there's 16 seeds you're on the lower half so it's crappy. They missed the tournament (you have not listed that interestingly)  so that make the "if they made the tournament" true. Then wrap that with an embarrassing very public humiliation as a 2 seed (seriously imagine how upset people are still about our 5 seed embarrassment but then imagine if it was as a 2). That's where the line's drawn. As Brew stated and what I popped in to reiterate is that circa 2013, VU fans were extremely frustrated. 2013-14 season was the new conference so it has zero to do with what the mental state of VUBB was in spring summer and fall of 2013.

Jay even went and did an interview when he righted the ship explaining that he stopped recruiting guys based on his system and more on their ranking. You can sit here and say they were a great three years all you want but does a coach who thinks that give a candid explanation who why they disappointed so much? I agree with your overall point that VU 02-13 was better than our 02-13. But that's not what I popped in to say, merely that VU fans were upset and frustrated.

[shoothoops]

9, miss, 9.

To me 9's are crappy seeds, there's 16 seeds you're on the lower half so it's crappy. They missed the tournament (you have not listed that interestingly)  so that make the "if they made the tournament" true. Then wrap that with an embarrassing very public humiliation as a 2 seed (seriously imagine how upset people are still about our 5 seed embarrassment but then imagine if it was as a 2). That's where the line's drawn. As Brew stated and what I popped in to reiterate is that circa 2013, VU fans were extremely frustrated. 2013-14 season was the new conference so it has zero to do with what the mental state of VUBB was in spring summer and fall of 2013.

Jay even went and did an interview when he righted the ship explaining that he stopped recruiting guys based on his system and more on their ranking. You can sit here and say they were a great three years all you want but does a coach who thinks that give a candid explanation who why they disappointed so much? I agree with your overall point that VU 02-13 was better than our 02-13. But that's not what I popped in to say, merely that VU fans were upset and frustrated.

Again, we'll just have to move on as you refuse to acknowledge all of the great NCAA seeds, Final Four, Elite 8, Sweet 16's immediately prior to this period. As I previously said, their University did obviously. Those things matter with regard to job security, program projections, program evaluation for a coach. It isn't just about a couple of seasons over the course of his 20 seasons there, or even as Wright accomplished all of the above during his first decade there.

Coach K finished 5th in back to back seasons in ACC a few years ago. Bill Self lost in NCAA first round multiple times in  a row a few years ago etc...Roy Williams had a losing record last year at UNC, and he didn't finish in ACC top 2 three years in a row at one point.

None of it compares to, or is relevant to Marquette with Buzz or Wojo.

[5DollarPitcher]

Would Diener have any interest in being head coach?  That's an experiment I would have some newfound patience for.

[GoldenWarrior11]

Would Diener have any interest in being head coach?  That's an experiment I would have some newfound patience for.

Because it has worked out so well for guys like Drexler, Mullin, Ewing and Hardaway.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Would Diener have any interest in being head coach?  That's an experiment I would have some newfound patience for.

I mean...why?  Because he's an alum?  There are plenty of good candidates out there versus hiring someone just because we like him and was a good player.

[Galway Eagle]

Again, we'll just have to move on as you refuse to acknowledge all of the great NCAA seeds, Final Four, Elite 8, Sweet 16's immediately prior to this period. As I previously said, their University did obviously. Those things matter with regard to job security, program projections, program evaluation for a coach. It isn't just about a couple of seasons over the course of his 20 seasons there, or even as Wright accomplished all of the above during his first decade there.

Coach K finished 5th in back to back seasons in ACC a few years ago. Bill Self lost in NCAA first round multiple times in  a row a few years ago etc...Roy Williams had a losing record last year at UNC, and he didn't finish in ACC top 2 three years in a row at one point.

None of it compares to, or is relevant to Marquette with Buzz or Wojo.

Yeah you're right I completely refused to acknowledge all of his previous success when I said "

I agree with your overall point that VU 02-13 was better than our 02-13. But that's not what I popped in to say, merely that VU fans were upset and frustrated.

"

Lmao this is comical.

[brewcity77]

I didn't say anything about the value of a message board. What I said was, it is teeny tiny compared to a fan base. The vast majority of fans are not on message boards or social media. You see this often with sports media types on Twitter for example. They get tunnel vision because that's where they are much of the time. Twitter is very small compared to what's going on away from social media. We can surely agree on this, yes. That doesn't have anything to do with my presence on here for example. Yes, we all here on this message board, represent a small faction of the MU fan base.

Last year, going to games, taking shuttles with other Marquette fans, it was clear that the opinions expressed on this message board are even stronger among the general populace of Marquette fans. The difference between this board and the people paying money to sit in the stands is that in the stands, I'm one of the most vocal Wojo supporters, and I've been off that wagon for about a year. The program has support, the coach doesn't really seem to.

I believe you are the one moving the goal posts. It's not okay to cherry pick a few years without comparing and contrasting what happened immediately prior to those few years.

No, I set the goalposts by making the argument. You are trying to move the confines of the argument I made. And 3 years + the expectations set for a fourth are a full recruiting cycle, so not a small sample size.

You have repeatedly mentioned Jay Wright's success the past 7 years, without metioning the fact his success at Villanova prior to that was better than not Wojo, but better than Buzz' MU success too.

And his failures the three years prior to the new league had fans calling for his head. Which is the point of the discussion you ignore.

Another example here is your predicted success for MU in 2014. Well, we know in 2014, Villanova was:

29-5 (16-2) 1st place, NCAA 2 seed.

Results after the league started are irrelevant to a discussion of where the programs were situated before the league started. I don't know how that is difficult.

I included all of the years, the totality. Because they matter, and are taken into account. And since you are determined to cherry pick those few years, Nova's years immediately prior were better than what Buzz did at MU. I am happy to discuss how it took Jay Wright his 4th season at Nova to make the NCAA's and rebuild their program, It's the same amount of years as it tool Coach K at Duke for example.

You're arguing in circles with points that aren't part of the argument. When your only argument is to go outside the confines of the argument, it's not a strong argument. Coaches have gone to Final Fours and later been maligned by fans or fired for a lack of success. Barnes, Ollie, Hewitt, Davis, Brady.

Again, we all (at least many of us) believe Buzz was successful at MU, and, many of us would have liked for that to keep going. But your posts come across as if MU was going to be better than Villanova. That's quite a reach there. One's success isn't going to take away from the other. You later changed to say MU could have reached Nova's success, and, unlike some may do here, I actually agreed with you.

My argument is and has been that we were better positioned than anyone else in the Big East to ascend to that next level. Honestly, at the time, I didn't think any of the NBE would get there. But in terms of recent success, incoming recruits, & expectations, we were at the top of the heap as of November 2013.

Had you talked more about school President, AD, things like that, there would likely have been more agreement.

But no I can't sit here and say MU was better positioned than Nova coming off of a 17-14 no NCAA season jist two seasons removed from a 9th place league finish.

November 2013. Neither team was coming off 17-14, no NCAA. Marquette was picked first in the Big East, Georgetown second.

MU had two 3 seeds in NCAA's under Buzz. Those were their only top 5 seeds under him. Again I most certainly believe Buzz could have bounced back after the lost Vander Blue season. It would have taken 1-2 years of not so great to get there. But sure he could have done that and got MU back into a better mix. I just don't see how that is relevant to Villanova.

You keep using the 2014 results as evidence against 2013 expectations. That makes no sense.

And, again, I have agreed with your overall Wojo assessment. Unless MU makes the NCAA's and wins a game or two this season in it, I am just fine with MU moving on from him. But he is there now, and he has a good chance to get a win over Madison tonight, and to turn it around and save his job this season. His seat is hot. (yes he may get financial pandemic season for next year either way)

I expect Wojo to be here until the end of 2022 at the minimum. I disagree with that plan, but understand a change may not be financially viable.

[brewcity77]

Would Diener have any interest in being head coach?  That's an experiment I would have some newfound patience for.

From what I've heard, no. That's why he went back to playing. If it's an alum you want, Wardle's the best candidate. Unless someone can convince Doc.

[5DollarPitcher]

I mean...why?  Because he's an alum?  There are plenty of good candidates out there versus hiring someone just because we like him and was a good player.

I obviously understand there are significant differences, but wasn't he player-coach for the TBT team?  I get it, I get it, NCAA basketball is a completely different game of chess.  But, to me, it shows he knows how to earn the respect of his team.  He does sit on Wojo's bench so he's been at least familiar with day-to-day operations for a few years.  He's played PG internationally meaning he probably has experience with many different offensive and defensive schemes and has developed his own personal philosophy.  I'm not saying he's the next Jay Wright, just that it's an experiment I'd try.  I like Wardle too.

[Hards Alumni]

I obviously understand there are significant differences, but wasn't he player-coach for the TBT team?  I get it, I get it, NCAA basketball is a completely different game of chess.  But, to me, it shows he knows how to earn the respect of his team.  He does sit on Wojo's bench so he's been at least familiar with day-to-day operations for a few years.  He's played PG internationally meaning he probably has experience with many different offensive and defensive schemes and has developed his own personal philosophy.  I'm not saying he's the next Jay Wright, just that it's an experiment I'd try.  I like Wardle too.

But he isn't really interested in coaching.

[shoothoops]

Last year, going to games, taking shuttles with other Marquette fans, it was clear that the opinions expressed on this message board are even stronger among the general populace of Marquette fans. The difference between this board and the people paying money to sit in the stands is that in the stands, I'm one of the most vocal Wojo supporters, and I've been off that wagon for about a year. The program has support, the coach doesn't really seem to.

No, I set the goalposts by making the argument. You are trying to move the confines of the argument I made. And 3 years + the expectations set for a fourth are a full recruiting cycle, so not a small sample size.

And his failures the three years prior to the new league had fans calling for his head. Which is the point of the discussion you ignore.

Results after the league started are irrelevant to a discussion of where the programs were situated before the league started. I don't know how that is difficult.

You're arguing in circles with points that aren't part of the argument. When your only argument is to go outside the confines of the argument, it's not a strong argument. Coaches have gone to Final Fours and later been maligned by fans or fired for a lack of success. Barnes, Ollie, Hewitt, Davis, Brady.

My argument is and has been that we were better positioned than anyone else in the Big East to ascend to that next level. Honestly, at the time, I didn't think any of the NBE would get there. But in terms of recent success, incoming recruits, & expectations, we were at the top of the heap as of November 2013.

November 2013. Neither team was coming off 17-14, no NCAA. Marquette was picked first in the Big East, Georgetown second.

You keep using the 2014 results as evidence against 2013 expectations. That makes no sense.

I expect Wojo to be here until the end of 2022 at the minimum. I disagree with that plan, but understand a change may not be financially viable.

You keep mentioning 2013-2014 expectations. So I will keep mentioning the actual results of 2013-2014. Why? It's to show that Villanova had elite results that season, something you have ignored.

You also dismiss the entire first decade of Jay Wright's success at Villanova, including Final Four, Elite 8, Sweet 16's etc...as if a few year period of 9 seeds was all that mattered. I don't agree with you. Villanova also didn't agree with you.

You also have repeatedly discussed MU expectations 2013-2014...without of course mentioning that MU went 17-15 (9-9) no NCAA with Buzz against those expectations. But other times when expectations were less or regular season results were not so great for Buzz...as long as he had a good NCAA you count that. Picking here, not choosing that there.

Only expectations matter here, only results matter there etc...only these results not those results etc...

What I did was happily, objectively take the totality of the situations.

It's a bit odd to say MU was well positioned one year if they hadn't just finished 17-15 (9-9). Why not say the same for Villanova. Well Jay Wright was certainly well positioned the year they had a 9 seed etc...

[5DollarPitcher]

But he isn't really interested in coaching.

And that's fine.  That was my original question.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

But he isn't really interested in coaching.

It appears to be true about our current coach too!

[shoothoops]

Yeah you're right I completely refused to acknowledge all of his previous success when I said ""

Lmao this is comical.

I'm sure UNC's poor results last year didn't thrill UNC fans. Let's just forget all about Roy Williams' success there prior to that.

[Silent Verbal]

I obviously understand there are significant differences, but wasn't he player-coach for the TBT team?  I get it, I get it, NCAA basketball is a completely different game of chess.  But, to me, it shows he knows how to earn the respect of his team.  He does sit on Wojo's bench so he's been at least familiar with day-to-day operations for a few years.  He's played PG internationally meaning he probably has experience with many different offensive and defensive schemes and has developed his own personal philosophy.  I'm not saying he's the next Jay Wright, just that it's an experiment I'd try.  I like Wardle too.

I like the enthusiasm, but Marquette has taken a huge step back under Wojo and cannot afford the potentially disastrous results an "experiment" hire might bring.  The next guy MU hires needs to have experience running his own program at the college level.  Some of the embers from the Crean and Buzz years are still burning, but one more bad hire and we risk going down to Wake Forest type depths.

By the time MU is ready to part ways with Wojo, Wardle might be ready.  He's made his bones at the mid-major level and I wouldn't be opposed to him coaching here, which is shocking because I never thought I'd say that.  But at least from a bench coaching standpoint, he'd be an upgrade from our current coach.  My #1 choice would be Thad Matta, if he wants to get back in the game.  I'd take either of those guys over Doc Rivers.  He has zero experience coaching at the college level and has grown fat and happy in the NBA.  I just can't picture him flying to bumblef*ck Minnesota on a Tuesday night to watch a game in a high school gym and kiss a$$ to a 17 year old and his parents.

[brewcity77]

You keep mentioning 2013-2014 expectations. So I will keep mentioning the actual results of 2013-2014. Why? It's to show that Villanova had elite results that season, something you have ignored.

Yes, because we are talking about where the programs were positioned when the league started. You're making an intellectually dishonest argument.

[GoldenWarrior11]

There have been many firings in recent college basketball memory where coaches have had success but simply did not meet expectations at said school.  Firings are not as simple as having a losing season or having a scandal.  Certain schools simply have higher expectations that the results that were being met. 

Tubby Smith, Memphis (went 19-13 and 21-13 over two years, no NCAA Tournament appearances).  Six of eight players transferred out of program in last year, in addition to declining ticket sales. 

Ben Howland, UCLA (233-107 over 10 years, NCAA Runner-up, NCAA Final Four, 7 NCAA Appearances).  Blown out by 11th seed, Minnesota, by 20 points in last year, which led to firing.

John Thompson III, Georgetown (278-151 over 13 years, NCAA Final Four, NCAA Sweet 16, 8 NCAA Appearances.  Back-to-back losing seasons, and one NCAA appearance over final four seasons.  Fired after a losing year.

Tommy Amaker, Michigan (108-84 over 6 years, zero NCAA Tournament appearances).  Fired after a 22-win year.

Johnny Dawkins, Stanford (156-115 over 8 seasons, NCAA Sweet 16).  Fired after a .500 year. 

Mike Anderson, Arkansas (169-102 over 8 seasons, Three NCAA appearances).  Fired after an 18-win year. 

Tom Crean, Indiana (166-135 over 9 seasons, Four NCAA Appearances, Three NCAA Sweet 16s).  Fired after an 18-win year.  Taking away his first two years at IU (while leaving in the third, which was still not good), his overall record is 150-89. 

To be clear, Marquette is not an Indiana or UCLA, nor is it a Stanford or Memphis.  However, in terms of prestige and history, Marquette matches favorably with the likes of Michigan, Georgetown and Arkansas.  Each of those schools made difficult coaching changes when it became clear that their respective programs was at risk of losing their status as a top-25, historically, program.  When you go for a long stretch of not meeting or reaching the levels that the program is usually known for, the school has no choice but to make a decision like that.  And, in regards to Georgetown and Arkansas, both of those coaches easily got further and attained higher success than the Wojo era has had.  Michigan, under Amaker, was, too, simply not reaching the NCAAs and in danger of digging itself into a long-term hole (which led to them hiring Beilein). 

I'm not sure how the rest of year goes, and I am confident Wojo is back next year, but there is definitely precedent for top-35 schools making tough coaching changes, without a losing season and/or scandal, that leads to a change. 

[shoothoops]

Yes, because we are talking about where the programs were positioned when the league started. You're making an intellectually dishonest argument.

Buzz was at MU only five seasons. In those five seasons, he was top 4 in the league twice. It's quite rose colored glasses leap you are making there. On the other hand, if Jay Wright had not accomplished a Final Four, Elite 8 Sweet 16's etc...and then had a few 9 NCAA seeds, perhaps there would be more to discuss there.

Wojo is in his 7th season at MU. He does not have the previous above mentioned success, and is therefore on the hot seat, deservedly so.

When Buzz went 17-15 (9-9) when some picked MU as a Final Four team had Vander stayed...even with no Vander, it wasn't a good season obviously. Buzz took some heat from some fans. Was his job in jeopardy based on that season alone? No. Buzz had won enough prior to that, and he was deserving of a chance to take a year or two to get back to that level. And as I said, I believe he could have done that. But that would have meant a couple of rebuilding years there.

Apparently Creighton was better positioned than MU in the New Big East because they finished 2nd to Villanova that first season while MU finished 6th.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

There have been many firings in recent college basketball memory where coaches have had success but simply did not meet expectations at said school.  Firings are not as simple as having a losing season or having a scandal.  Certain schools simply have higher expectations that the results that were being met. 

Tubby Smith, Memphis (went 19-13 and 21-13 over two years, no NCAA Tournament appearances).  Six of eight players transferred out of program in last year, in addition to declining ticket sales. 

Ben Howland, UCLA (233-107 over 10 years, NCAA Runner-up, NCAA Final Four, 7 NCAA Appearances).  Blown out by 11th seed, Minnesota, by 20 points in last year, which led to firing.

John Thompson III, Georgetown (278-151 over 13 years, NCAA Final Four, NCAA Sweet 16, 8 NCAA Appearances.  Back-to-back losing seasons, and one NCAA appearance over final four seasons.  Fired after a losing year.

Tommy Amaker, Michigan (108-84 over 6 years, zero NCAA Tournament appearances).  Fired after a 22-win year.

Johnny Dawkins, Stanford (156-115 over 8 seasons, NCAA Sweet 16).  Fired after a .500 year. 

Mike Anderson, Arkansas (169-102 over 8 seasons, Three NCAA appearances).  Fired after an 18-win year. 

Tom Crean, Indiana (166-135 over 9 seasons, Four NCAA Appearances, Three NCAA Sweet 16s).  Fired after an 18-win year.  Taking away his first two years at IU (while leaving in the third, which was still not good), his overall record is 150-89. 

I would suggest that only one of these worked out well in retrospect - Belein hired at Michigan.

The rest either flopped (UCLA, Stanford, Georgetown) or are too early to tell (the rest)

[Galway Eagle]

I'm sure UNC's poor results last year didn't thrill UNC fans. Let's just forget all about Roy Williams' success there prior to that.

Cant admit you were wrong that I acknowledged his prior success?

Should Georgetown have fired JT3? He had a final four sweet 16, 3 BE Championships, a big East tournament championship, a couple years removed from a second place finish.

[brewcity77]

The parameters are clear. You choose to ignore them because your argument holds no merit by staying within them.

[Viper]

I like the enthusiasm, but Marquette has taken a huge step back under Wojo and cannot afford the potentially disastrous results an "experiment" hire might bring.  The next guy MU hires needs to have experience running his own program at the college level.  Some of the embers from the Crean and Buzz years are still burning, but one more bad hire and we risk going down to Wake Forest type depths.

By the time MU is ready to part ways with Wojo, Wardle might be ready.  He's made his bones at the mid-major level and I wouldn't be opposed to him coaching here, which is shocking because I never thought I'd say that.  But at least from a bench coaching standpoint, he'd be an upgrade from our current coach.  My #1 choice would be Thad Matta, if he wants to get back in the game.  I'd take either of those guys over Doc Rivers.  He has zero experience coaching at the college level and has grown fat and happy in the NBA.  I just can't picture him flying to bumblef*ck Minnesota on a Tuesday night to watch a game in a high school gym and kiss a$$ to a 17 year old and his parents.

i forgot about Matta. He had success at Ohio State. Not sure why he left...burn-out, maybe? I agree that getting a nba guy to drop down to college and chase HS kids in Hicktown ain’t happening.  Hitting a home run on a college coach seems more difficult than on initial glance. Greg Gard has a top 5 team? Dang. Wojo of Duke pedigree can’t garner a ‘also receiving votes’ vote? Annual flameouts? I have no idea where MU turns...if MU even cares. All I know is getting the bend-over rubber glove tonight won’t be fun.