Jonathan Isaac

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Why on earth are we singing the national anthem before every sporting event in the first place?

IIRC, its roots trace back to the Cold War. Forced patriotism to help unite the country against the Communists.

[Pakuni]

We need to unify around the realization that our national anthem sucks

Why do you hate America?

[wadesworld]

Frankly, I have no interest in actors and actresses, athletes, and anyone else who feels their unsolicited opinion needs to be heard, pontificating and dominating the media. I do what I can do to oppose such behavior. Namely, I hit them in the pocketbook, hey?

Shut up and dribble, hey doc?

[GB Warrior]

Why do you hate America?

First, I don't think disliking our anthem for having no musically redeeming qualities speaks to disliking America, and that's before you consider FSK's problematic legacy. It's no different than saying our flag is stupid (it's not - it's awesome - though this does the trick for me MUCH more):


Second, I am of the belief that staunch defense of artificial constructs such as the flag, the pledge of allegiance or the national anthem as intrinsically patriotic is misguided and detracts from the ways in which those fake idols can be used as battering rams against people who wish to see some sort of change, progress etc, whatever arena in which those beliefs may fall.

Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

[jficke13]

Where have I remotely demanded anyone not be permitted to exercise their rights?  Nowhere. 

I have an opinion about anthem kneelers.  I have quite a ways to travel to get to a demand.

But you’re just being obtuse to get your gotcha on me.

And people have opinions about those who go out of their way to perform their opinions about anthem kneelers. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you understand that, and also thank you for being transparent about who you are so we can all form our opinions about you more easily.

Unless this is a massive troll, in which case, you got me... but also, read the room man.

[brewcity77]

IIRC, its roots trace back to the Cold War. Forced patriotism to help unite the country against the Communists.

Further back than that. It was popularized with the 1918 World Series between the Cubs and Red Sox, though there were incidents of it before that. The Cubs band played it in the Game 1 seventh inning stretch and it was wildly popular with the players and fans. Not to be outdone, the Sox gave wounded veterans free tickets to Game 6 & played The Star Spangled Banner during the seventh inning stretch to honor them. It became more common then and was named the national anthem in 1931.

It didn't become an every game thing until World War II to boost patriotism in the war effort. Since then, it's been played pretty uniformly across all American sports.

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

First, I don't think disliking our anthem for having no musically redeeming qualities speaks to disliking America, and that's before you consider FSK's problematic legacy. It's no different than saying our flag is stupid (it's not - it's awesome - though this does the trick for me MUCH more):


Second, I am of the belief that staunch defense of artificial constructs such as the flag, the pledge of allegiance or the national anthem as intrinsically patriotic is misguided and detracts from the ways in which those fake idols can be used as battering rams against people who wish to see some sort of change, progress etc, whatever arena in which those beliefs may fall.

Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

https://twitter.com/nbc4i/status/931605656284536833?s=21

[brewcity77]

There is a veterans memorial at a cemetery located about a mile from my house. This monument is displayed at the street side of that cemetery. If kneeling is so disrespectful, why is the soldier in the memorial kneeling? Should we tear this monument down because of the disrespect he is showing fallen veterans?

[Golden Avalanche]

A country’s anthem is meaningless unless to demonstrate one’s honor for that country.  So whether his intention was to honor the flag, that’s what his choosing stand for it accomplished. A nation’s flag is a symbol of that country.  A person’s actions when a country’s anthem is played signifies what’s in their heart, mind, and soul, good or bad.

So those Marquette fans who keep their hats on their heads as they stand in the queue to purchase their beers at the Fiserv when the anthem is played are heartless, mindless, and soulless?

[Lennys Tap]

So those Marquette fans who keep their hats on their heads as they stand in the queue to purchase their beers at the Fiserv when the anthem is played are heartless, mindless, and soulless?

And thirsty.

[dgies9156]

Good for him.   I applaud him exercising his first amendment rights to peacefully stand apart.

Brother Tower, may I make a slight modification to your belief.

The First Amendment outlines the relationship between a citizen and the government. We forget that one has NO First Amendment rights when it comes to any entity other than the government.

If my employer, for example, doesn't like something I said or did, there is no protection based on the First Amendment that I have against my employer taking action that might not be in my best interests. If my action damages the brand, affects our ability to sell to our customers or generally is something my leadership just finds repugnant, they can fire me. They have to honor provisions of any contract but you can't cite the First Amendment as a requirement that your job has to retain you.

Regardless of your position on Colin Kapernick, what the NFL has done since doesn't break any laws. It might have hurt the brand with certain target market segments, but the NFL didn't act illegally.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Second, I am of the belief that staunch defense of artificial constructs such as the flag, the pledge of allegiance or the national anthem as intrinsically patriotic is misguided and detracts from the ways in which those fake idols can be used as battering rams against people who wish to see some sort of change, progress etc, whatever arena in which those beliefs may fall.

Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

+1,000

[rocket surgeon]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.  they know it is going to evoke emotions.  why do they choose to do whatever it is they do during the national anthem?  why not do it during the layup drill, before the national anthem, after games. 

  i am actually surprised by the number of people we have on this board who can't seem to understand those who have strong patriotic emotions and gratitude toward those who gave the ultimate sacrifice allowing us to have the freedoms we have.  too many take for granted the privileges we have that many other countries don't have.  then, when some voice their patriotism and dissent upon those who "disrespect" a long held tradition they are mocked and/or minimalized.  what's next?  people are getting destroyed for holding traditional views on this and that's just wrong.  just ask drew brees 

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.  they know it is going to evoke emotions.  why do they choose to do whatever it is they do during the national anthem?  why not do it during the layup drill, before the national anthem, after games. 

  i am actually surprised by the number of people we have on this board who can't seem to understand those who have strong patriotic emotions and gratitude toward those who gave the ultimate sacrifice allowing us to have the freedoms we have.  too many take for granted the privileges we have that many other countries don't have.  then, when some voice their patriotism and dissent upon those who "disrespect" a long held tradition they are mocked and/or minimalized.  what's next?  people are getting destroyed for holding traditional views on this and that's just wrong.  just ask drew brees 

Kneeling for the anthem has nothing to do with the military.

And why do they do it during the national anthem?  Because you wouldn't pay attention otherwise.

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.  they know it is going to evoke emotions.  why do they choose to do whatever it is they do during the national anthem?  why not do it during the layup drill, before the national anthem, after games. 

  i am actually surprised by the number of people we have on this board who can't seem to understand those who have strong patriotic emotions and gratitude toward those who gave the ultimate sacrifice allowing us to have the freedoms we have.  too many take for granted the privileges we have that many other countries don't have.  then, when some voice their patriotism and dissent upon those who "disrespect" a long held tradition they are mocked and/or minimalized.  what's next?  people are getting destroyed for holding traditional views on this and that's just wrong.  just ask drew brees

Brees took flack because he made those comments during a tinderbox of a situation when his teammates were feeing especially vulnerable.

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

Also, using “dishonoring tradition” is disingenuous BS. It used to be tradition to sacrifice humans for a good harvest.

[Hards Alumni]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.  they know it is going to evoke emotions.  why do they choose to do whatever it is they do during the national anthem?  why not do it during the layup drill, before the national anthem, after games. 

  i am actually surprised by the number of people we have on this board who can't seem to understand those who have strong patriotic emotions and gratitude toward those who gave the ultimate sacrifice allowing us to have the freedoms we have.  too many take for granted the privileges we have that many other countries don't have.  then, when some voice their patriotism and dissent upon those who "disrespect" a long held tradition they are mocked and/or minimalized.  what's next?  people are getting destroyed for holding traditional views on this and that's just wrong.  just ask drew brees

They're misplaced emotions.  The military personnel that I know think that the nationalism is for folks like you.  Not them.  They don't need a 'thank you for your service'.  That's lip service.  They need better access to health and mental care after they're done serving.  So instead of the lip service, fight for them where they need it.

I believe Drew Brees was truly ignorant of his stance.  He found himself learning a lot in a short period of time, and came to understand the reasoning for the protest.

[brewcity77]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.

As usual, you are the one that is trolling. Look at the picture I shared above and tell me why kneeling is okay to memorialize soldiers but not as a silent, respectful protest.

[Jockey]

And thirsty.

Good to see your sense of humor is back. You’ve been awfully serious lately.

[Galway Eagle]

there has been an established decorum for years with regard to our national anthem, God bless America, the pledge of the allegiance and what have you.  for those who desire to change that decorum is trolling.  they know it is going to evoke emotions.  why do they choose to do whatever it is they do during the national anthem?  why not do it during the layup drill, before the national anthem, after games. 

  i am actually surprised by the number of people we have on this board who can't seem to understand those who have strong patriotic emotions and gratitude toward those who gave the ultimate sacrifice allowing us to have the freedoms we have.  too many take for granted the privileges we have that many other countries don't have.  then, when some voice their patriotism and dissent upon those who "disrespect" a long held tradition they are mocked and/or minimalized.  what's next?  people are getting destroyed for holding traditional views on this and that's just wrong.  just ask drew brees

Yeah songs like My Country Tis of Thee deserve our respect. Nothing says America more than taking the British National Anthem, just changing the lyrics and hoping nobody notices.

Also you answered your own question, because it evokes emotion. When you question the patriotism of anyone who doesn't stand and remove their hat that's why you get mocked. When you expect people to be grateful for America but they grew up with stories of Jim crow or slavery, Japanese internment camps during WW2, stealing land from Indians and massive genocide etc. but can't grasp why those groups might not feel as patriotic as a white guy that's also why you get mocked. It has nothing to do with you a white man respecting the rights and liberties that Americans have fought and died for. It has everything to do with pointing out the inequalities and issues that have been brought upon those marginalized groups.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

It used to be tradition to sacrifice humans for a good harvest.

My blackberries and my okra are booming this year. Now you know why.

[Pakuni]

As usual, you are the one that is trolling. Look at the picture I shared above and tell me why kneeling is okay to memorialize soldiers but not as a silent, respectful protest.

And of course what the whole "kneeling is disrespectful to the military" trope ignores is that kneeling was suggested to Kaepernick by former Green Beret/Seahawks long snapper Nate Boyer.
Boyer, who did tours in Iraq and Afghanistan, suggested it as a way to protest while also being respectful to the flag and fellow veterans.

But let's be honest here. Most of those who get upset at the kneeling aren't really bothered by the kneeling. They're bothered by what the protest stands for and puts before them. As 4everwarriors made clear, they just don't want to hear it.

[BM1090]

He’s on topic on a message board. Hardly said anything outlandish.

Just tongue in cheek since he needed to give his opinion that how he doesn't care about the player's opinions.

[buckchuckler]

Nm

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

But let's be honest here. Most of those who get upset at the kneeling aren't really bothered by the kneeling. They're bothered by what the protest stands for and puts before them.

And who's doing it.