BLM/White Privilege/etc

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Where can I send a contribution to BLM the Movement? Who are it’s leaders? What is their mission statement? Where can I find their statements repudiating the goals of BLM the Organization?

When I see a spokesperson on TV or read an article quoting BLM, it’s “organization” leaders and spokespersons, not “movement” ones I see and hear. I sincerely hope that the movement creates its own distinct organization free from the present radical messaging. But until the movement is vocal about their aims and their not being part of BLM the organization I just can’t offer support for anything other than the sentiment.

I'm sure there were people in the 1960s who wouldn't support the Civil Rights movement because Malcolm X and other militant protesters were associated with it. I'm also sure there were people in the 1960s who wouldn't support the Civil Rights movement because MLK made it political by criticizing the US' involvement in Vietnam. Whatever their reasons for not supporting it, they still ended up on the wrong side of history.

This has happened since the beginning of time. Hell, even Jesus was criticized by the Pharisees and Sadducees (and presumably by a large number of the common people) for associating with known sinners and for working on the Sabbath, and any other number  of things that offended their sensibilities.

There will always be reasons or justifications for not supporting social justice. There will always be flawed people and organizations involved in the cause. There will always be leaders in the movement whose views/opinions on other topics don't align with yours. There will always be some who are willing to resort to violence for what they believe in. If you wait for the perfect movement or the perfect leader or the perfect protest then you will never be involved.

This movement is so much bigger than one non-profit and its cause is as Jesuit as they come. We can't afford to let ourselves get distracted by insignificant details. MLK didn't condone rioting or militants but he understood that the only way to get rid of them was to address the injustice that birthed them in the first place. That is what is important.

[wadesworld]

I think a large majority of posters understand what the BLM movement is and support it. The few that don’t support it probably also understand what the BLM movement is but need an excuse to stay within their comfort zone so they claim communism or Marxism. They dug in so hard that they’re just willfully ignorant on the topic, and then claim that they’re really the informed ones and everyone else has their head in the sand. Or they’re Herman who write things for shock value alone.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I'm sure there were people in the 1960s who wouldn't support the Civil Rights movement because Malcolm X and other militant protesters were associated with it. I'm also sure there were people in the 1960s who wouldn't support the Civil Rights movement because MLK made it political by criticizing the US' involvement in Vietnam. Whatever their reasons for not supporting it, they still ended up on the wrong side of history.

This has happened since the beginning of time. Hell, even Jesus was criticized by the Pharisees and Sadducees (and presumably by a large number of the common people) for associating with known sinners and for working on the Sabbath, and any other number  of things that offended their sensibilities.

There will always be reasons or justifications for not supporting social justice. There will always be flawed people and organizations involved in the cause. There will always be leaders in the movement whose views/opinions on other topics don't align with yours. There will always be some who are willing to resort to violence for what they believe in. If you wait for the perfect movement or the perfect leader or the perfect protest then you will never be involved.

This movement is so much bigger than one non-profit and its cause is as Jesuit as they come. We can't afford to let ourselves get distracted by insignificant details. MLK didn't condone rioting or militants but he understood that the only way to get rid of them was to address the injustice that birthed them in the first place. That is what is important.

Yep.

I think a large majority of posters understand what the BLM movement is and support it. The few that don’t support it probably also understand what the BLM movement is but need an excuse to stay within their comfort zone so they claim communism or Marxism. They dug in so hard that they’re just willfully ignorant on the topic, and then claim that they’re really the informed ones and everyone else has their head in the sand. Or they’re Herman who write things for shock value alone.

Yep.

[muwarrior69]

Many blacks fought and died so their right to play MLB could be denied. People of color do not love racism. They don’t love being singled out only because they are black. And they certainly don’t love being murdered for being black.

I do not like racism either nor do I like to be singled out because I'm white. I do not consider myself privileged or supreme yet I'm labeled so because of the color of my skin. I am of Slavic descent. My ancestors were enslaved by the Muslims of Spain in the 9th century so technically I am a descendent of slaves and the 5 police officers who were shot in Dallas certainly did not want to die for being white.

https://abc13.com/soldier-dallas-officer-bradford-glendening/1420187/

How can we bridge the racial divide if we continue to teach our kids that one race is better than another when we know it is not true.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I hope the gang will post the name of their new Usenet board once it is up and running.

[LloydsLegs]

I endorse the OP sentiment. 

IMO the best solution is go back to the crap show that was the Politics thread, do not moderate it at all, and ban anyone who posts anything on politics elsewhere.

That said, I’ll continue to lurk during non BB times and look forward to the mostly BB times which are to come.

[Pakuni]

I do not like racism either nor do I like to be singled out because I'm white. I do not consider myself privileged or supreme yet I'm labeled so because of the color of my skin. I am of Slavic descent. My ancestors were enslaved by the Muslims of Spain in the 9th century so technically I am a descendent of slaves and the 5 police officers who were shot in Dallas certainly did not want to die for being white.

You are privileged because you are white, whether you consider yourself so or not.
And no, your ancestors being enslaved 1,200 years ago on another continent is not remotely akin to the experience of black people in America.

How can we bridge the racial divide if we continue to teach our kids that one race is better than another when we know it is not true.

We should probably stop teaching our kids that one race is better than another.

[Hards Alumni]

I do not like racism either nor do I like to be singled out because I'm white. I do not consider myself privileged or supreme yet I'm labeled so because of the color of my skin. I am of Slavic descent. My ancestors were enslaved by the Muslims of Spain in the 9th century so technically I am a descendent of slaves and the 5 police officers who were shot in Dallas certainly did not want to die for being white.

https://abc13.com/soldier-dallas-officer-bradford-glendening/1420187/

How can we bridge the racial divide if we continue to teach our kids that one race is better than another when we know it is not true.

Then say Black Lives Matter. 

You are privileged, just like I am.  We're both white guys and have had a much easier time, and will continue to have a much easier time in life because of the privilege we are given due SOLELY to the amount of melanin in our skin.  You have the privilege to walk into a store without being suspected of being a thief because you're white.  When you learned about history of the world, you were most likely taught a Eurocentric version, and we get to learn that version because of our privilege.  If you get pulled over by a police officer you can be SURE that you weren't pulled over simply because you're a white guy.

That list goes on, and that's is what is meant by White privilege.  NOT that you had ancestors that were slaves. 

[rocket surgeon]

I'm going to be honest buddy, there is something in topper's post that tells me it isn't 11 guys.  I know you have thicker skin and that is a positive trait.  Best.

as always, i do have to give credit where it's due and i do appreciate your comment here hards

  where's 82?  lose his internet connection?

[vogue65]

True story.

I had a co-worker, African American, Vietnam Marine Corps veteran, he was blown off a 6X6 truck on a bridge repair mission and had his knee crushed. 
I invited him to my home for a fourth of July cookout.
He declined, he was reluctant to come to my neighborhood, he was afraid of the police.  That was twenty five years ago.

Story two.

I used the V.A. for my fathers medical care at his end of life.  He was a combat Second Lt., 103 Infranty Division, 411 Regement.
The V.A. sent a nurse from East Orange for a home visit.
She was a black nurse driving a government car with the blue and white government tags.
The local police spotted her and followed her for five mikes, then drove into the parking lot at my fathers home.  They gave her the, your not welcome around here look.
She was shaking when she got into my parents home.

Amen

[Herman Cain]

If you sincerely want to understand the perspective, read up on Project Zero and the work of Sam Sinyangwe, Deray McKesson, and Britney Packnett-Cunningham. Read Ta-Nehesi Coates, The Case For Reparations is a good place to start. Or the 1619 Project article and podcast. On social media, Rachel Cargle is a solid follow that challenges her followers. If you're looking for other podcasts, Code Switch and Pod Save the People. On demand, watch 13th on Netflix.

Or just go to a march. Listen to the voices there. At this point, if you aren't hearing the message, it's because you're choosing not to listen.

You are not listening to those who have a different opinion than you.

As a community throughout the 30s and 40s and 50s we were actually making meaningful progress our rates of marriage and intact families was high. The industrial north lifted all the boats in the sea. We were building successful businesses. Role models were out there.  Self reliance was the goal.  Life absolutely wasn't perfect but the visibility to a better future was actually there.

The Democrats , via LBJ, then exploited the sympathy of Kennedys death to  created a cynical political  plan , sold it to gullible bleeding heart liberals, and it had the impact of steadily moving our community into social dysfunction.  Sorry but that is the truth as I see it.

Now that there is social dysfunction, the Democrats rallying cry is Racism , because they full well know that todays sons and daughter's  of the same gullible generation in the 60s are susceptible to the same threats and intimidations.

Democrat policies are making it very difficult for the natural forces of progression to occur. My view is I would rather earn my way to something on merit , versus having it handed to me based on my race.  Sorry if that doesn't fit with your story line and narrative. There are some of us out there that just don't subscribe to the victimization script.

 

[forgetful]

Where can I send a contribution to BLM the Movement? Who are it’s leaders? What is their mission statement? Where can I find their statements repudiating the goals of BLM the Organization?

When I see a spokesperson on TV or read an article quoting BLM, it’s “organization” leaders and spokespersons, not “movement” ones I see and hear. I sincerely hope that the movement creates its own distinct organization free from the present radical messaging. But until the movement is vocal about their aims and their not being part of BLM the organization I just can’t offer support for anything other than the sentiment.

Lenny, I really don't want to get bogged down in discussing politics, but I want to add one small piece regarding BLM and what they stand for as a movement. And if you want to contribute to them, it is pretty easy.

Minority students at predominantly white, private institutions, are treated poorly regularly. You can find a number of twitter feeds devoted to this including #blackintheivory. Students have advocated that they just want faculty and administration to care, one recommendation the students have had is for faculty that care about them to post a BLM sticker, so they know they have an ally.

They don't want statues torn down, they don't want violence, they just want to be heard, and for people to care. To them, saying "Black Lives Matter" or putting up a BLM sticker simply means you care about them. That is what they want.

So if you want to contribute in the most meaningful and impactful way, simply say "Black Lives Matter" or post a sticker, and do so recognizing that what they are asking for is your respect and that they aren't part of the violence etc., that has been coopted by political groups on the right and left.

Because the thing is, from your posts (and posts of others that veer politically right), I know that you and they do care, and you do respect them. What we all need is for everyone to take one big step above the political fray and be bold and powerful in stating what we feel, that we agree that "Black Lives Matter" and that we love and respect them, and will advocate for their rights and equity.

[4everwarriors]

You are privileged because you are white, whether you consider yourself so or not.
And no, your ancestors being enslaved 1,200 years ago on another continent is not remotely akin to the experience of black people in America.

We should probably stop teaching our kids that one race is better than another.

This privileged nonsense is bullchit. You don't know any of us or what our backgrounds are. One is not privileged just by being born white.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

This privileged nonsense is bullchit. You don't know any of us or what our backgrounds are. One is not privileged just by being born white.

No.  That's not the point.  It has nothing to do with your background is or what you had to overcome. 

It's just recognition of the fact that in general, racial minorities are treated different by society at large due to the color of their skin.  "White priviledge" is just the opposite way of saying that.

I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand or comprehend.  It is undoubtedly true.  Is it true in every instance, everywhere across the country?  Of course not.

[Hards Alumni]

This privileged nonsense is bullchit. You don't know any of us or what our backgrounds are. One is not privileged just by being born white.

Ah, so you're going with the 'Whoosh' approach.  And yes, one is privileged just by being born white.

[real chili 83]

No.  That's not the point.  It has nothing to do with your background is or what you had to overcome. 

It's just recognition of the fact that in general, racial minorities are treated different by society at large due to the color of their skin.  "White priviledge" is just the opposite way of saying that.

I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand or comprehend.  It is undoubtedly true. Is it true in every instance, everywhere across the country?  Of course not.

Then why paint every white person with that brush?

[Billy Hoyle]

I think a large majority of posters understand what the BLM movement is and support it. The few that don’t support it probably also understand what the BLM movement is but need an excuse to stay within their comfort zone so they claim communism or Marxism. They dug in so hard that they’re just willfully ignorant on the topic, and then claim that they’re really the informed ones and everyone else has their head in the sand. Or they’re Herman who write things for shock value alone.

There's the BLM movement (the people marching peacefully and advocating for reform), BLM Inc. (the leaders making money), and far, far-leftists hijacking the BLM movement to try and combine their agenda with BLM.  In my city, for example, a bunch of white kids (groups who call themselves "Antifa" and the "Youth Liberation Front") have spent the last thirty days organizing the "protests" that result in violence, tearing down statues, vandalism and even promoting destruction. They're the ones spray painting "ACAB" "F--k 12" and, a nice one I saw on my run yesterday "kill all cops." Last week they tried to start their own "autonomous zone" in one of the few Black neighborhoods in our city and engaged in vandalism of black-owned businesses. "Revolution is expensive." When those Black business owners criticized them they white kids lectured them about "leadership" and the like.  They're also putting up signs calling for a "rent strike" and to "end capitalism" (using the BLM fist logo).

Those of us close to the protests know the difference, Those who live in the suburbs where it isn't happening don't. How would one in Orem, UT, or Fargo, ND know that the CHOP is not part of BLM? We need BLM to come out stronger against those who are trying to hijack the movement.

No.  That's not the point.  It has nothing to do with your background is or what you had to overcome. 

It's just recognition of the fact that in general, racial minorities are treated different by society at large due to the color of their skin.  "White priviledge" is just the opposite way of saying that.

I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand or comprehend.  It is undoubtedly true.  Is it true in every instance, everywhere across the country?  Of course not.

you want an example of white privilege: this would not have happened to a white guy. But a black guy who makes $12 million a year...  https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/10/27/9621368/john-henson-wisconsin-jewelry-store-discrimination

[Pakuni]

This privileged nonsense is bullchit. You don't know any of us or what our backgrounds are. One is not privileged just by being born white.

Of course you are privileged just being born white.

I really don't know why some people are so fragile about this. It's not a personal insult. It's not an attack on your character. It doesn't make you a bad person. It doesn't minimize anything you've accomplished.
It's just a simple recognition that you get treated differently in this country because of your skin color. I would venture to guess a woman has never clutched her purse a little more tightly when you walk past her on the street. Or that you've never been followed by an employee while walking through a store. Or that you've never been pulled over by a police officer and asked why you were driving through a certain suburb. Or asked how you can afford a certain car. Or that people assumed that you got into a certain school or landed a certain job because of affirmative action.

But do share your hardscrabble upbringing, if you think it'll persuade us otherwise.

[Pakuni]

Then why paint every white person with that brush?

Because every white person, regardless of their standing, has privileges associated with being white.
That doesn't mean they can't have a hard life. It doesn't mean they're not born into awful circumstances. It doesn't mean they haven't overcome tremendous obstacles.
It's a simple recognition that people are treated differently. Why that's so hard to understand, and why people take that as a personal affront, is mind boggling.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Because every white person, regardless of their standing, has privileges associated with being white.
That doesn't mean they can't have a hard life. It doesn't mean they're not born into awful circumstances. It doesn't mean they haven't overcome tremendous obstacles.
It's a simple recognition that people are treated differently. Why that's so hard to understand, and why people take that as a personal affront, is mind boggling.

It also doesn't mean that all white people are racist.

[Pakuni]

It also doesn't mean that all white people are racist.

Right. That kind of self-defensive reaction I imagine is part of the denial. That and the feeling that one's accomplishments are somehow cheapened if you admit there are benefits to your skin color (see: 4ever).

[Lennys Tap]

Lenny, I really don't want to get bogged down in discussing politics, but I want to add one small piece regarding BLM and what they stand for as a movement. And if you want to contribute to them, it is pretty easy.

Minority students at predominantly white, private institutions, are treated poorly regularly. You can find a number of twitter feeds devoted to this including #blackintheivory. Students have advocated that they just want faculty and administration to care, one recommendation the students have had is for faculty that care about them to post a BLM sticker, so they know they have an ally.

They don't want statues torn down, they don't want violence, they just want to be heard, and for people to care. To them, saying "Black Lives Matter" or putting up a BLM sticker simply means you care about them. That is what they want.

So if you want to contribute in the most meaningful and impactful way, simply say "Black Lives Matter" or post a sticker, and do so recognizing that what they are asking for is your respect and that they aren't part of the violence etc., that has been coopted by political groups on the right and left.

Because the thing is, from your posts (and posts of others that veer politically right), I know that you and they do care, and you do respect them. What we all need is for everyone to take one big step above the political fray and be bold and powerful in stating what we feel, that we agree that "Black Lives Matter" and that we love and respect them, and will advocate for their rights and equity.

Forgetful

Thanks for a thoughtful post.

I’ll state unequivocally that black lives matter, that I love and respect black people and that I support their battle for rights and equity. These are sentiments I’ve always felt and tried to live by.

None of this is inconsistent with being wary of some of the political solutions advocated by BLM - for those who can’t accept that notion, we’ll agree to disagree.

[Billy Hoyle]

Because every white person, regardless of their standing, has privileges associated with being white.
That doesn't mean they can't have a hard life. It doesn't mean they're not born into awful circumstances. It doesn't mean they haven't overcome tremendous obstacles.
It's a simple recognition that people are treated differently. Why that's so hard to understand, and why people take that as a personal affront, is mind boggling.

Things us, as white people, have likely never had to deal with:

-being called an Affirmative Action hire/admit (or, my wife's case, a "Twofer")
-being asked to prepay for a meal at a sit-down restaurant (if you're ever seated)
-being asked "are you sure you belong here?"
-being told "you're so articulate" for your race/ethnicity
-being asked if you speak English
-being followed in a store by an employee
-having the door locked on you as you approach a store
-having women clutch their purse tight when you walk by
-seeing people move to the other side of the street when you are walking towards them on a sidewalk
-having people ask (or sometimes not ask) to touch your skin or hair

Not having this happen to you:  https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/10/27/9621368/john-henson-wisconsin-jewelry-store-discrimination

"White privilege" doesn't mean you get everything handed to you or you don't have to struggle in life. It just means there are certain areas of life where you are given the benefit of the doubt. .

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

This privileged nonsense is bullchit. You don't know any of us or what our backgrounds are. One is not privileged just by being born white.

Yes you are. You may not be privileged in other ways such as socio-economic status, religion, national original, sexual orientation, sex, gender identity, ability status etc....but if you are born white then you are immune from a lot of forms of bigotry that people of color face every day. That's what white privilege is.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Forgetful

Thanks for a thoughtful post.

I’ll state unequivocally that black lives matter, that I love and respect black people and that I support their battle for rights and equity. These are sentiments I’ve always felt and tried to live by.

None of this is inconsistent with being wary of some of the political solutions advocated by BLM - for those who can’t accept that notion, we’ll agree to disagree.

I wholeheartedly agree with the bolded.