COVID Economy

[Hards Alumni]

you "assure me, it's not working"?  ok, assure me

the minimum wage jobs are meant to be entry level positions, not necessarily provide for a family of four.  the way to move up is education, which we already throw a $hit ton of money into, show up for you job, take it seriously, be a good person, watch for better positions, apply for them rinse wash repeat.  the weird thing is, many small businesses already pay more than min to the employees they value and want to keep.  the big businesses may be the ones who drag their feet, but same applies.  they pay the people they want to keep and move up.  the ones who demand the $15/hr or more, are usually your worst employees.  you know the good ones when ya see them

Low hanging fruit then okay.  Do you understand what inflation is?  I'm guessing no, otherwise you wouldn't try to make this argument.

The federal minimum wage was last raised on July 24, 2009, when it rose from $6.55 to $7.25 per hour, the last step of a three-step increase approved by Congress in 2007. Before 2007, the minimum wage had been stuck at $5.15 per hour for 10 years.

So you seem to want to keep the federal minimum wage where it is... at $7.25.  I'm sure in 2009 your hair was on fire because it had just gone up to that level from the 2007 level of $5.15. 

So the last increase was over a decade ago. 

$100 in 2009 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $121.93 today, an increase of $21.93 over 12 years. The dollar had an average inflation rate of 1.67% per year between 2009 and today, producing a cumulative price increase of 21.93%

Are you saying that it is okay to keep the minimum wage stagnant regardless of what the value of a dollar is?  Are you actively advocating for everyone that makes minimum wage to make LESS money every year? 

Defend your position.

[Galway Eagle]

you "assure me, it's not working"?  ok, assure me

the minimum wage jobs are meant to be entry level positions, not necessarily provide for a family of four.  the way to move up is education, which we already throw a $hit ton of money into, show up for you job, take it seriously, be a good person, watch for better positions, apply for them rinse wash repeat.  the weird thing is, many small businesses already pay more than min to the employees they value and want to keep.  the big businesses may be the ones who drag their feet, but same applies.  they pay the people they want to keep and move up.  the ones who demand the $15/hr or more, are usually your worst employees.  you know the good ones when ya see them

I just want to point out that the education systems broken. My fiancé is told by the district, people with advanced degrees, to pass kids who cannot graph basic points in geometry. A kid in high school algebra cannot add 5+9. Sometime these kids are going to become adults and are going to need those minimum wage jobs to stay off the street.

[shoothoops]

The public cost of a low minimum "living" wage:

https://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/release-the-public-cost-of-a-low-federal-minimum-wage/

[GooooMarquette]

very commonly you will find small business paying more than minimum wage because they appreciate good hard working people and realize the cost of finding a replacement.

And even more commonly, you will find small businesses paying the least possible amount.

[forgetful]

I just want to point out that the education systems broken. My fiancé is told by the district, people with advanced degrees, to pass kids who cannot graph basic points in geometry. A kid in high school algebra cannot add 5+9. Sometime these kids are going to become adults and are going to need those minimum wage jobs to stay off the street.

I didn't fully grasp how broken our educational system was until I was teaching in college. Students at that stage that couldn't even write a single proper sentence, yet graduated high school with honors. Students who couldn't do elementary school type math, yet graduated high school with good grades. And let's forget about science. The number of students who told me that they put the football coach in charge of science classes, because no one else could teach those classes anyways, is sad.

They were set up for failure before they ever stepped foot on campus. And those are the ones that at least made it to college. Others gave up way before then, because their schools had given up on even trying to get them an education.

[Warriors4ever]

I can see this and I don’t teach college. I groan and grimace inside when I see the lack of an ability to put a sentence together, or spell, etc.
Yes we’ve all dealt with autocorrect goofiness, but that’s not what I am talking about. I used to make myself nuts over our church bulletin alone.
Just now I got an email from the president of a professional group I belong to, and I see spelling errors that jump out at me. Always double-check, especially with names!

[Jockey]

The federal minimum wage was last raised on July 24, 2009, when it rose from $6.55 to $7.25 per hour, the last step of a three-step increase approved by Congress in 2007. Before 2007, the minimum wage had been stuck at $5.15 per hour for 10 years.

The answer to the minimum wage seems so easy -- indexing. Why can't it be based on the cost of living per state? $15/hr. is a lot different in N. Dakota that it is in NY or Cali. You move the lowest CoL state to $10/hr. You place the highest at $15/hr; then slot in each state depending on where it lands.

Ok, now someone tell me why this is a bad idea.

Incidentally, I am disagreeing with you in any way here - just referencing the subject. I think you and I agree on this issue.

[warriorchick]

I can see this and I don’t teach college. I groan and grimace inside when I see the lack of an ability to put a sentence together, or spell, etc.
Yes we’ve all dealt with autocorrect goofiness, but that’s not what I am talking about. I used to make myself nuts over our church bulletin alone.
Just now I got an email from the president of a professional group I belong to, and I see spelling errors that jump out at me. Always double-check, especially with names!

I belong to a Facebook group where a frequent contributor has spelling and grammar mistakes in nearly every post she makes.  In general, seeing that type of thing is like fingernails on a blackboard to me, but  I  didn't know her background, so I try not to judge.  But then, she posted that she was looking for a new job.  When she was asked what she did for a living, and she replied, "I'm a teacher".

[Jockey]

I belong to a Facebook group where a frequent contributor has spelling and grammar mistakes in nearly every post she makes.  In general, seeing that type of thing is like fingernails on a blackboard to me, but  I  didn't know her background, so I try not to judge.  But then, she posted that she was looking for a new job.  When she was asked what she did for a living, and she replied, "I'm a teacher".

I am exactly the same way - as is my daughter who is a teacher. My wife is the opposite on emails, texts, etc - often, looking as though they were written by a 6th grade dropout. Yet, she has journaled since she was a teen and the prose/spelling is exquisite.

So, I try to go easy on the illiterate texts or emails that I so often receive.

[warriorchick]

I am exactly the same way - as is my daughter who is a teacher. My wife is the opposite on emails, texts, etc - often, looking as though they were written by a 6th grade dropout. Yet, she has journaled since she was a teen and the prose/spelling is exquisite.

So, I try to go easy on the illiterate texts or emails that I so often receive.

There is a difference between a short text between two people and a paragraph that is going to live in infinity on the interwebs.

Also, seeing someone use "U" instead of "you" in an online post makes me want to drive to their house and stab them.  But then again, they must save hours of typing time over the course of a year doing that.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

There is a difference between a short text between two people and a paragraph that is going to live in infinity on the interwebs.

Also, seeing someone use "U" instead of "you" in an online post makes me want to drive to their house and stab them.  But then again, they must save hours of typing time over the course of a year doing that.

Leftover from the flip phone text days...

[Warriors4ever]

I do text in shorthand fashion, but write sentences otherwise.
I hang on TripAdvisor forums  a lot, and many people asking questions these days do so in text speak, or in run-on sentences that never end, one or the other. Various regulars will remind them that this is not a text message forum, and that paragraphs and sentences are your friend, if only to make understanding the question easier.

[jesmu84]

you "assure me, it's not working"?  ok, assure me

the minimum wage jobs are meant to be entry level positions, not necessarily provide for a family of four.  the way to move up is education, which we already throw a $hit ton of money into, show up for you job, take it seriously, be a good person, watch for better positions, apply for them rinse wash repeat.  the weird thing is, many small businesses already pay more than min to the employees they value and want to keep.  the big businesses may be the ones who drag their feet, but same applies.  they pay the people they want to keep and move up.  the ones who demand the $15/hr or more, are usually your worst employees.  you know the good ones when ya see them

Sources for the above?

[rocket surgeon]

Low hanging fruit then okay.  Do you understand what inflation is?  I'm guessing no, otherwise you wouldn't try to make this argument.

The federal minimum wage was last raised on July 24, 2009, when it rose from $6.55 to $7.25 per hour, the last step of a three-step increase approved by Congress in 2007. Before 2007, the minimum wage had been stuck at $5.15 per hour for 10 years.

So you seem to want to keep the federal minimum wage where it is... at $7.25.  I'm sure in 2009 your hair was on fire because it had just gone up to that level from the 2007 level of $5.15. 

So the last increase was over a decade ago. 

$100 in 2009 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $121.93 today, an increase of $21.93 over 12 years. The dollar had an average inflation rate of 1.67% per year between 2009 and today, producing a cumulative price increase of 21.93%

Are you saying that it is okay to keep the minimum wage stagnant regardless of what the value of a dollar is?  Are you actively advocating for everyone that makes minimum wage to make LESS money every year? 

Defend your position.

sorry-been gone most of the day-hards, but i'm just a free market guy.  criticize me all you want, but i've  been in the private sector my whole life as both an employee and an employer.

   as an employee, i sure did want to make more money.  what i found out was, become really good at what you do, create a demand for yourself and either force your present employer to pay you more or move on to something that pays more.   

  as an employer,(over 30 years) find and hire the best person for your position and PAY THEM!  i've had to fire very few people.  as the saying goes, they usually fire themselves; none of them brought me any pleasure.  once you find the right person(s) make them want to work for you; make it fun.    i'm a really easy going guy and i make things work by communicating right now as opposed to weekly, bi-weekly...meetings.  if you are honest with people, show them you are more than about the money, good things happen and the success just follows.  do not compromise those core beliefs.  being honest means you don't have to try to remember what you said

[jesmu84]

sorry-been gone most of the day-hards, but i'm just a free market guy.  criticize me all you want, but i've  been in the private sector my whole life as both an employee and an employer.

   as an employee, i sure did want to make more money.  what i found out was, become really good at what you do, create a demand for yourself and either force your present employer to pay you more or move on to something that pays more.   

  as an employer,(over 30 years) find and hire the best person for your position and PAY THEM!  i've had to fire very few people.  as the saying goes, they usually fire themselves; none of them brought me any pleasure.  once you find the right person(s) make them want to work for you; make it fun.    i'm a really easy going guy and i make things work by communicating right now as opposed to weekly, bi-weekly...meetings.  if you are honest with people, show them you are more than about the money, good things happen and the success just follows.  do not compromise those core beliefs.  being honest means you don't have to try to remember what you said

Can you define this?

[pbiflyer]

There is a difference between a short text between two people and a paragraph that is going to live in infinity on the interwebs.

Also, seeing someone use "U" instead of "you" in an online post makes me want to drive to their house and stab them.  But then again, they must save hours of typing time over the course of a year doing that.

Y r u sooooooo upset bout that? Theirs no reason too bee upset.lolz.

Off to lock my door so I don’t get stabbed. 

[Galway Eagle]

I actually like Hawleys wage increase idea. > billion dollar companies bump to 15.

I still think it could be much better by cost of living index but that is much better than nothing.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I actually like Hawleys wage increase idea. > billion dollar companies bump to 15.

I still think it could be much better by cost of living index but that is much better than nothing.

I thought sanders proposed it for some reason and hawley supported it. 

In any case, I’m not sure how that doesn’t functionally end up in the same place.  If corporations are in every community and dictating min wage, small business will have to come up too to keep their employees. 

I’m supportive, it just seems overly complex. 

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I actually like Hawleys wage increase idea. > billion dollar companies bump to 15.

I still think it could be much better by cost of living index but that is much better than nothing.

But my understanding is that this includes a tax credit of some sort instead, which means we will all be paying for this.

Just pass the $15 wage and tie it to inflation. It’s ridiculous that we haven’t gotten there yet.

[MU82]

I say scrap the minimum wage and trust businesses to pay their employees a fair wage. And while we're at it, get rid of all workplace rules, pollution regulations, anti-monopoly laws, etc.

Corporations are people, after all, and they want to be great American "citizens."

What could possibly go wrong?

[GooooMarquette]

I actually like Hawleys wage increase idea. > billion dollar companies bump to 15.

I still think it could be much better by cost of living index but that is much better than nothing.

The idea sounds reasonable on the surface, but I worry how they would manage it. For example, would it apply to franchisees and contractors of billion dollar companies? If so, it would be unfair to the mom and pop franchisees. If not, it might cause huge companies to franchise and contract out more and more of their work, to get hourly workers out of the main business.

I think it's actually easier - and in the end, more fair - to make it apply to all companies, and to peg it to widely available cost-of-living statistics.

[jesmu84]

I say scrap the minimum wage and trust businesses to pay their employees a fair wage. And while we're at it, get rid of all workplace rules, pollution regulations, anti-monopoly laws, etc.

Corporations are people, after all, and they want to be great American "citizens."

What could possibly go wrong?

Anarcho-capitalism is a conservative utopia

[shoothoops]

London School of Economics study:

"50 years of tax cuts for the wealthy have failed to trickle down."

https://www.lse.ac.uk/News/Latest-news-from-LSE/2020/L-December/Tax-cuts-for-the-rich

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/tax-cuts-rich-50-years-no-trickle-down/?__twitter_impression=true

[jesmu84]

London School of Economics study:

"50 years of tax cuts for the wealthy have failed to trickle down."

https://www.lse.ac.uk/News/Latest-news-from-LSE/2020/L-December/Tax-cuts-for-the-rich

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/tax-cuts-rich-50-years-no-trickle-down/?__twitter_impression=true

The Rand Org agrees: https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5888024/50-trillion-income-inequality-america/%3famp=true

[TSmith34, Inc.]

London School of Economics study:

"50 years of tax cuts for the wealthy have failed to trickle down."

No one seriously believed that they did, least of all the trickle down proponents. But it was a nice way to con the rubes.