COVID Economy

[MU82]

I find it hard to believe also. Especially, when one candidate has accomplished more in 47 months, than the other has in 47 years, aina?

You make a good point. It's difficult for any president to oversee the deaths of 220K+ Americans on his watch, the unemployment of millions of Americans on his watch, and the permanent closure of hundreds of thousands of businesses on his watch, all while stoking the worst racial unrest in America since the 1960s.

Accomplishments galore, oona!

[Mutaman]

Yes, but that 35 million number is artificially low, perhaps significantly so. A few examples why:

(1) several states (including NY, which is kinda big) still haven't reported absentee/early voting numbers at all;

Early voting,as opposed to absentee, in NY doesn't start until next week. Easier to vote in Kentucky. Thank you Governor Cuomo. 

[Pakuni]

I find it hard to believe also. Especially, when one candidate has accomplished more in 47 months, than the other has in 47 years, aina?

Remember this next time you whine about politics on the board.

[Jockey]

Early voting,as opposed to absentee, in NY doesn't start until next week. Easier to vote in Kentucky. Thank you Governor Cuomo.

Isn't this the 1st time New Yorkers can vote early in a presidential race? Wasn't Cuomo the one that signed it into law?

[MU82]

Senate voted on the $500B plan, which McConnell admitted was largely for show, and it got rejected.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/coronavirus-stimulus-500-billion-plan-fails-as-larger-deal-deadline-looms-174627586.html

[Mutaman]

 

Isn't this the 1st time New Yorkers can vote early in a presidential race? Wasn't Cuomo the one that signed it into law?

Its a little more complicated than that.
Yes this is the 1st time New Yorkers can vote early in a presidential race.
Yes Cuomo is the one that signed it into law.
Yes Como has been governor for 9 years- so why did it take so long? This is the first time the Dems have controlled both houses of the state legislature. The Republicans always controlled the State Senate even though there were more Democratic Senators , due to a group called the Independent Democratic Conference (IDC) , Democrats who voted as Republicans   in return for quid pro quos.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Democratic_Conference

Cuomo could have broken up the IDC any time he wanted, but chose not to. Why? "Mr. Cuomo, a Democrat, has at times benefited from that strange reality: Having a divided Legislature allowed him to position himself as a deal-making centrist."
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/09/nyregion/cuomo-stewart-cousins-new-york-senate-democrats.html

Finally, the IDC members were trounced in the last election, the Dems took over the Senate, and various positive laws have been passed which Cuomo has had no choice but to sign.- see the revolutionary 2019 NY Rent Reform Law.

So why does Cuomo, who the whole world thinks of as a big liberal, continue to govern like a Republican unless dragged kicking and screaming by the overwhelming Democratic majority in the state? Ask Andy.

In any event, starting in a few days NYers, members of one of the most liberal states on the planet, will be able to vote early. And it only took nine years.

I'm told that someday, despite Andy's best efforts, , NY might actually legalize reefer.

[Jockey]

Thanks for the reply, Muta. Always good to hear from someone closer to the situation.

BTW, I always considered him to be a centrist. Never understood why people saw him as a Lib.

[Mutaman]

Thanks for the reply, Muta. Always good to hear from someone closer to the situation.

BTW, I always considered him to be a centrist. Never understood why people saw him as a Lib.

I hate labels but gun to my head , I'd call Andy a Rat Face. Have never voted for him. But I will say that he has provided some strong leadership during covid. We were blindsided out here but having a leader stand and say "put on masks, social distance, and wash your hands and I'll keep the bars shut until you do," has helped. What a concept. And as a whole, New Yorkers have acted with a lot of common sense throughout this ordeal, with a few exceptions.
Andy's endless pissing contests with the mayor serve no purpose though.

[shoothoops]

Its a little more complicated than that.
Yes this is the 1st time New Yorkers can vote early in a presidential race.
Yes Cuomo is the one that signed it into law.
Yes Como has been governor for 9 years- so why did it take so long? This is the first time the Dems have controlled both houses of the state legislature. The Republicans always controlled the State Senate even though there were more Democratic Senators , due to a group called the Independent Democratic Conference (IDC) , Democrats who voted as Republicans   in return for quid pro quos.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Democratic_Conference

Cuomo could have broken up the IDC any time he wanted, but chose not to. Why? "Mr. Cuomo, a Democrat, has at times benefited from that strange reality: Having a divided Legislature allowed him to position himself as a deal-making centrist."
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/09/nyregion/cuomo-stewart-cousins-new-york-senate-democrats.html

Finally, the IDC members were trounced in the last election, the Dems took over the Senate, and various positive laws have been passed which Cuomo has had no choice but to sign.- see the revolutionary 2019 NY Rent Reform Law.

So why does Cuomo, who the whole world thinks of as a big liberal, continue to govern like a Republican unless dragged kicking and screaming by the overwhelming Democratic majority in the state? Ask Andy.

In any event, starting in a few days NYers, members of one of the most liberal states on the planet, will be able to vote early. And it only took nine years.

I'm told that someday, despite Andy's best efforts, , NY might actually legalize reefer.

Respectfully, having both lived in NYC and other places across the country, I would disagree that Cuomo has a liberal reputation. The only people that say that or think that are people with an agenda intentionally trying to misrepresent him for personal gain. This isn't much different than with other centrists, Obama, Clinton, Biden, etc...many people (even fsr outside of NYC) are well aware of Cuomo's policies and governing. If you take center, middle left, and far left as the categories, many are well aware Cuomo is center.

I would say many people are far less aware of the state legislature and your good information there.

[Hards Alumni]

Respectfully, having both lived in NYC and other places across the country, I would disagree that Cuomo has a liberal reputation. The only people that say that or think that are people with an agenda intentionally trying to misrepresent him for personal gain. This isn't much different than with other centrists, Obama, Clinton, Biden, etc...many people (even fsr outside of NYC) are well aware of Cuomo's policies and governing. If you take center, middle left, and far left as the categories, many are well aware Cuomo is center.

I would say many people are far less aware of the state legislature and your good information there.

Yup, large swaths of New York STATE are very conservative.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Isn't this the 1st time New Yorkers can vote early in a presidential race? Wasn't Cuomo the one that signed it into law?

True Blue Connecticut still has no early voting.  And before COVID-19 it was very hard to get an absentee ballot.  The Governor made a declaration and allowed for COVID-19 as an excuse for an absentee ballot in the primaries but his "emergency declaration powers" technically expired in September.  So the legislature held a special session and passed the COVID-19 excuse for absentee ballots for the general election. 
Apparently, to make "no excuse" absentee ballots or early voting permeant law requires an amendment to the the state constitution.  The legislature has to approve a referendum question for a general election then the referendum has to pass and then they have to pass a law.  And there might be 2/3 majority approval requirements along the way.

[GooooMarquette]

I hate labels but gun to my head , I'd call Andy a Rat Face. Have never voted for him. But I will say that he has provided some strong leadership during covid. We were blindsided out here but having a leader stand and say "put on masks, social distance, and wash your hands and I'll keep the bars shut until you do," has helped. What a concept. And as a whole, New Yorkers have acted with a lot of common sense throughout this ordeal, with a few exceptions.

Andy's endless pissing contests with the mayor serve no purpose though.

Agree completely, and especially on the underlined. There have been occasions where it seems he publicly disagrees just for the sake of disagreeing, and then later goes with the mayor's plan anyway...like with the NYC restrictions in the zip codes with recent surges.

[Billy Hoyle]

True Blue Connecticut still has no early voting.  And before COVID-19 it was very hard to get an absentee ballot.  The Governor made a declaration and allowed for COVID-19 as an excuse for an absentee ballot in the primaries but his "emergency declaration powers" technically expired in September.  So the legislature held a special session and passed the COVID-19 excuse for absentee ballots for the general election. 
Apparently, to make "no excuse" absentee ballots or early voting permeant law requires an amendment to the the state constitution.  The legislature has to approve a referendum question for a general election then the referendum has to pass and then they have to pass a law.  And there might be 2/3 majority approval requirements along the way.

Don't people realize they can just make up an excuse?  When I worked for the WI GOP we even sent out mailers instructing people on how to request an absentee ballot.

[GooooMarquette]

Don't people realize they can just make up an excuse?  When I worked for the WI GOP we even sent out mailers instructing people on how to request an absentee ballot.

Yep. "I will be out of town November 3." It isn't as though someone is gonna track your whereabouts. And even if they did, you could just say your plans changed at the last minute, after your sent in the ballot.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

The cure is worse than the disease?  It's just the disease....and always has been

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/business/economy/economy-coronavirus-lockdown-iowa.html

[MU82]

The cure is worse than the disease?  It's just the disease....and always has been

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/business/economy/economy-coronavirus-lockdown-iowa.html

I just read this piece, Frenns. The pandemic IS the economy. Control the pandemic, develop an effective vaccine and get the public to take it, and THEN the economy will come back, albeit probably not as fast as most would want.

[shoothoops]

"Out of work in America"

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/10/22/us/pandemic-unemployment-covid.html?smid=tw-share

[GooooMarquette]

The cure is worse than the disease?  It's just the disease....and always has been

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/business/economy/economy-coronavirus-lockdown-iowa.html

Yep. Many of us have recognized the false dichotomy of 'fight pandemic' vs 'support economic recovery' for a long time. The truth is that to support economic recovery in any lasting way, we need to first get the pandemic under some semblance of control.

The article gives the example of Iowa, but North Dakota is another good example. Never a lockdown, still no mask mandate...and leading the country in per capita cases. My daughter lives in Fargo, and tells me of mostly empty restaurants and shops, businesses closing, people out of work. The economy is struggling because the pandemic is raging on...NOT because of any (non-existent) lockdown or mask mandate.

[MU82]

Or as a wise man said: "I'm gonna shut down the virus, not the country."

[forgetful]

My concern economy wise is we have already done substantial damage, spent trillions, in the background of historically low taxes that from a budget perspective was already untenable.

Besides trillions more in deficit spending, we have no tools at our disposal to help dig us out of this mess.

So, the longer it takes us to get control of COVID, the deeper the long-term financial hole the nation is in, and the more likely that whoever is in Washington next term, has no chance of digging us out.

[GooooMarquette]

My concern economy wise is we have already done substantial damage, spent trillions, in the background of historically low taxes that from a budget perspective was already untenable.

Besides trillions more in deficit spending, we have no tools at our disposal to help dig us out of this mess.

So, the longer it takes us to get control of COVID, the deeper the long-term financial hole the nation is in, and the more likely that whoever is in Washington next term, has no chance of digging us out.

Agreed. Whether it is Trump or Biden, the economy is gonna be hurting for a long time. And the longer we wait to get the virus under some semblance of control (likely not until Inauguration Day, at the earliest), the harder it's going to be to recover.

And as the bill goes up, so does the national debt that we pass on to our children and grandchildren.

[tower912]

Going to have to raise some taxes and cut some spending.

[forgetful]

Agreed. Whether it is Trump or Biden, the economy is gonna be hurting for a long time. And the longer we wait to get the virus under some semblance of control (likely not until Inauguration Day, at the earliest), the harder it's going to be to recover.

And as the bill goes up, so does the national debt that we pass on to our children and grandchildren.

The problem is, I don't think the average American is aware of the long-term impacts of all of this. Rather, they take a very short-term perspective on it all.

I don't think that they understand that current economic conditions (unless something major like COVID), is a result of years old policies. And that current decisions, will impact the economy for the next 5-10 years.

[MU82]

Going to have to raise some taxes and cut some spending.

Neither party is adept at the second half of that equation.

For example, Obama asked Simpson and Bowles to give him recommendations for the economy and he then ignored it, especially the “cut spending” part.

For another, Dubya did the tax cut and created a new welfare program and oversaw two unfunded, unnecessary wars.

[shoothoops]

Pandemic fall out.

One million pounds of food daily for Houston's needy.

https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-houston-bf8acccbe9c47a4a402046316aef5c67?utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow