Markus' head?

[WhoaJoe2020]

I know the only thing that matters is winning and losing, but has anyone heard how Markus is doing after taking that elbow to the head?

He didn't look right after that hit and actually looked pale and glassy eyed in some of the close-ups.

Did Wojo say anything in the post game presser??

If anyone has heard anything and would care to reply I would appreciate it.

[StillAWarrior]

I know the only thing that matters is winning and losing, but has anyone heard how Markus is doing after taking that elbow to the head?

He didn't look right after that hit and actually looked pale and glassy eyed in some of the close-ups.

I had the same thought. I was surprised when they came back to see he was going right back into the game. At minimum I thought he’d be out for a minute or two while they looked him over.

[Miss Katie’s]

He looked possibly concussed to me, but I’m not a doctor and didn’t stay at a Holiday Inn last night either.  Didn’t he miss a non con game with concussion symptoms?  The probability of successive concussions increases and can be more severe or need longer recovery.  Hoping he is ok.  He may have passed the tests on the bench immediately, but felt more effects as time went on.  Obviously, we will see. 

[WhoaJoe2020]

He looked concussed to me.  Didn’t he miss a non con game with concussion symptoms?  The probability of successive concussions increases and can be more severe or need longer recovery.  Hoping he is ok.

That's what I recalled which is why I was really concerned when he went down. No word from the team yet, so hopefully no news is good news.

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

That's what I recalled which is why I was really concerned when he went down. No word from the team yet, so hopefully no news is good news.

The team is going to keep it hidden anyways if it truly is a concussion.  Why?  Because their medical staff severely screwed up by letting Howard play through it, if that is indeed the case.

[CountryRoads]

The team is going to keep it hidden anyways if it truly is a concussion.  Why?  Because their medical staff severely screwed up by letting Howard play through it, if that is indeed the case.

Major red mark on Wojo if Howard is out Wednesday with a concussion. Also, if he wasn’t able to pass concussion protocol last time, why was he even at the game? It all seems very dumb and dangerous to me.

[WhoaJoe2020]

The team is going to keep it hidden anyways if it truly is a concussion.  Why?  Because their medical staff severely screwed up by letting Howard play through it, if that is indeed the case.

If he is truly concussed the team won't be able to hide it. He will have to sit the next game. If they put him out on the floor and he got severely injured I can't imagine the uproar that would ensue.

In the Butler game if Markus said he was okay to play, the team could probably get away with it, but after a day to assess him fully there would be no plausible deniability.

[hairy worthen]

If he is truly concussed the team won't be able to hide it. He will have to sit the next game. If they put him out on the floor and he got severely injured I can't imagine the uproar that would ensue.

In the Butler game if Markus said he was okay to play, the team could probably get away with it, but after a day to assess him fully there would be no plausible deniability.

Wrong. The person who gets hit in the head doesn't get to decide. The team cant get away with that if they knew he was concussed and then putting him in because he said he was ok to play. What the hell are u thinking.

[MDMU04]

If he is truly concussed the team won't be able to hide it. He will have to sit the next game. If they put him out on the floor and he got severely injured I can't imagine the uproar that would ensue.

In the Butler game if Markus said he was okay to play, the team could probably get away with it, but after a day to assess him fully there would be no plausible deniability.

The protocol is in place precisely to prevent either the team or the player from saying “rub some dirt on it and get back out there.”

[WhoaJoe2020]

The protocol is in place precisely to prevent either the team or the player from saying “rub some dirt on it and get back out there.”

I guess what I'm saying is that you can't possibly do the same level testing court side that you can post game. I don't know what the actual protocol is to allow a player to continue but I would imagine it's fairly standard. Quick tests of sensitivity to light and sound, historical and situational awareness, etc.

 All types of brain injuries are not the same and the onset of the negative effects can sometimes be delayed.

Regardless, Markus didn't look right after the elbow to the head.

[Cheeks]

The team is going to keep it hidden anyways if it truly is a concussion.  Why?  Because their medical staff severely screwed up by letting Howard play through it, if that is indeed the case.

Ah yes...Mike Deane who has been wrong so many times is now rendering medical diagnosis from his couch.  Good Lord.

[Cheeks]

A lot of speculation going on here without an ounce of knowledge as to what happened.


OUTSTANDING

[Sheriff]

We need more witnesses

[Elonsmusk]

I guess what I'm saying is that you can't possibly do the same level testing court side that you can post game. I don't know what the actual protocol is to allow a player to continue but I would imagine it's fairly standard. Quick tests of sensitivity to light and sound, historical and situational awareness, etc.

All types of brain injuries are not the same and the onset of the negative effects can sometimes be delayed.

Regardless, Markus didn't look right after the elbow to the head.

So therefore the effects of the red herring concussion, didn't affect Markus's performance because the "effects can sometimes be delayed."

Keep posting buddy.  We are all more enlightened as a result of your genius. 

[WhoaJoe2020]

So therefore the effects of the red herring concussion, didn't affect Markus's performance because the "effects can sometimes be delayed."

Keep posting buddy.  We are all more enlightened as a result of your genius.

You obviously know nothing about brain injuries or basketball.

Probably because you have the former and have never played the latter.

[Elonsmusk]

You obviously know nothing about brain injuries or basketball.

Probably because you have the former and have never played the latter.

More rich irony. Keep it up!

[WhoaJoe2020]

More rich irony. Keep it up!

Hitting too close to home ??

Why else would you respond??

[Elonsmusk]

Hitting too close to home ??

Why else would you respond??

I respond because it triggers your responses - which I find highly amusing and entertaining. Fun to laugh. Thanks for the entertainment on this slow Saturday.

[Not A Serious Person]

Oh no, the internet doctors are back!!!

Does this mean we have to go through another mindless and useless discussion of HIIPPAAA

[WhoaJoe2020]

I respond because it triggers your responses - which I find highly amusing and entertaining. Fun to laugh. Thanks for the entertainment on this slow Saturday.

Yeah, but you know it's only funny because it's true.

[Dr. Blackheart]

You obviously know nothing about brain injuries or basketball.

Probably because you have the former and have never played the latter.

Whoa. You have posted over 40 odds times since the game with 95% on this play and the concussion you diagnosed on TV.  You might be right.  Or Butler may have made adjustments. Or it was both.

You seem certain of your finding to the point where you defend it over and over, and accuse MU as being incompetent. The rest of us see basketball reasons too...and trust and know MU's training and medical staff.  Don't you think that they were observing him over and over for the next hour and a half?

You are at the point of being over the top. Call me silly.

[4everwarriors]

Witch hed, hey?

[Silent Verbal]

I guess what I'm saying is that you can't possibly do the same level testing court side that you can post game. I don't know what the actual protocol is to allow a player to continue but I would imagine it's fairly standard. Quick tests of sensitivity to light and sound, historical and situational awareness, etc.

 All types of brain injuries are not the same and the onset of the negative effects can sometimes be delayed.

Regardless, Markus didn't look right after the elbow to the head.

“Wojo should be commended for getting his team to play well despite injuries to Greg, Jayce, Theo, Koby, and now Markus.”

You love to point out how 50% of our team is injured, even when all those guys except Greg are in the rotation, and all of them but Jayce are playing max minutes (but only because that’s not his role).  Because if half the team is hurt, it really isn’t Wojo’s fault that they’re not playing to their full potential.  It’s just bad luck.

Even if Markus plays 38 minutes and takes 25 shots next game, I’m guessing there’s a good chance you’ll continue to talk about how injured he is.  It makes for a nice red herring.

[Spaniel with a Short Tail]

Tower mentioned he saw a video where Markus was elbowed in the head. I don't recall that, just the slide into the chair. Anyone have a link to such a video?

[CountryRoads]

I took a few screenshots (quality is best I could get) of the play and am just not seeing any elbow or malicious intent like a few others have mentioned.

Screenshot #1: Butler guy goes up with both hands as if to block the ball.

Screenshot #2: Best evidence I could find of an "elbow"

Screenshot #3 & #4: Markus appears to turn his head towards the hoop as if to see if the ball went in. Don't think he'd make that reaction if he just got clocked in the head.

Screenshot #5: Head hitting the chair.

[Afroman]

Nice of gramps to help out there.
Anyone else think that those seats are ridiculously close to the baseline?

[hairy worthen]

Tower mentioned he saw a video where Markus was elbowed in the head. I don't recall that, just the slide into the chair. Anyone have a link to such a video?

I wish someone had a video because seeing it last night I thought he got hammered until I saw the replay that showed he didnt

[WhoaJoe2020]

Whoa. You have posted over 40 odds times since the game with 95% on this play and the concussion you diagnosed on TV.  You might be right.  Or Butler may have made adjustments. Or it was both.

You seem certain of your finding to the point where you defend it over and over, and accuse MU as being incompetent. The rest of us see basketball reasons too...and trust and know MU's training and medical staff.  Don't you think that they were observing him over and over for the next hour and a half?

You are at the point of being over the top. Call me silly.

Cite one example of me asserting MU was incompetent. I said Markus went to the sidelines and after a brief examination, and I'm sure some lobbying on his part, returned to the game where he looked and played like he was out of it.

It was a hard hit and Markus remained on the floor for a long time. It was not a nothing foul.

A player can pass the sideline concussion protocol and still be affected to a significant degree by a hit to the head. Are you suggesting it can't be a factor??

There's a very good article on how sideline concussion protocols can fail.

It's about the hit Ziggy Ansah put on Jimmy Clausen. People should read it and get a clue.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I wish someone had a video because seeing it last night I thought he got hammered until I saw the replay that showed he didnt

Yeah because players always fly into the seats when there not hammered on a play like that.

[tower912]

Screen shot 2 shows the defenders right arm hitting Markus in the head.   You can see Markus head moving backwards from the impact.  I do not believe there was malice aforethought.

[WhoaJoe2020]

Screen shot 2 shows the defenders right arm hitting Markus in the head.   I do not believe there was malice aforethought.

That's the only thing we disagree on. It looked like a frustration foul to me when he lowered his arms on Markus' head. Butler was already pissed at the calls Markus had received in the first half as evidenced by the T right before half. Then Markus burns them on a breakaway layup. to increase the lead. I've played a lot and I've seen the exact same foul many times.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Yeah, but you know it's only funny because it's true.

There is another guy that always has to have the last word...

Or maybe there isn't another guy.

[WhoaJoe2020]

There is another guy that always has to have the last word...

Or maybe there isn't another guy.

I'm so much worse than the other guy.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I'm so much worse than the other guy.

Impossible

[WhoaJoe2020]

Impossible

Believe it LOL

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Believe it LOL

Impossible

[Cheeks]

Impossible

Aren’t you the one having the last word...only you have done it amazingly for about 2 weeks without playing the race card...progress.

$5000 bet holds.  You in or not.  Can easily prove this guy isn’t me....do you have stones or not?  Don’t answer..we know you don’t.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Aren’t you the one having the last word...only you have done it amazingly for about 2 weeks without playing the race card...progress.

$5000 bet holds.  You in or not.  Can easily prove this guy isn’t me....do you have stones or not?  Don’t answer..we know you don’t.

Nope, I saw your call and raised to $10,000 that you have a long history of lying about your identity.  You in, Hoopaloop?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I also wanted to see how many time "WhoaJoe" would insist on getting the last word.  appears he had to switch accounts to do so.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I also wanted to see how many time "WhoaJoe" would insist on getting the last word.  appears he had to switch accounts to do so.

Whaaaaat????

[TSmith34, Inc.]

There ya go!

[hairy worthen]

Aren’t you the one having the last word...only you have done it amazingly for about 2 weeks without playing the race card...progress.

$5000 bet holds.  You in or not.  Can easily prove this guy isn’t me....do you have stones or not?  Don’t answer..we know you don’t.

If u can easily prove it then do it. And not some surgery that proves nothing. Personally I don't think u are this whoa Joe character. He is more obnoxious than even you. Hows that for a back handed compliment.

[WhoaJoe2020]

If u can easily prove it then do it. And not some surgery that proves nothing. Personally I don't think u are this whoa Joe character. He is more obnoxious than even you. Hows that for a back handed compliment.

I'm especially obnoxious to the posters who are only experts after losses.

[hairy worthen]

I'm especially obnoxious to the posters who are only experts after losses.

Which is not me btw. I post periodically and after nearly every game and my posts are my opinions both positive and negative. Including today's posts. I don't have an agenda that requires me to make over the top posts to fulfill it.

I was out of town after the last game and didnt have means to post so don't even go there.

[WhoaJoe2020]

Which is not me btw. I post periodically and after nearly every game and my posts are my opinions both positive and negative. Including today's posts. I don't have an agenda that requires me to make over the top posts to fulfill it.

I was out of town after the last game and didnt have means to post so don't even go there.

When people casually dismiss arguably the most important moment in the game and then trash Markus??? Yeah I'm gonna point it out. I'm also going to call out a cheap shot when I see it. Baddley took out our leading scorer. Should I applaud him??

You would think on a Marquette fan site people would be a little more upset, but not the fine "fans" on scoop.

[Silent Verbal]

When people casually dismiss arguably the most important moment in the game and then trash Markus??? Yeah I'm gonna point it out. I'm also going to call out a cheap shot when I see it. Baddley took out our leading scorer. Should I applaud him??

You would think on a Marquette fan site people would be a little more upset, but not the fine "fans" on scoop.

Baddley did not “take out” our leading scorer.  Literally.  Markus didn’t miss one second as a result of that play.  And the play itself wasn’t dirty.  It was two guys going full speed in transition.  Take off your blue and gold glasses and stop using this as an excuse for why we lost.

[hairy worthen]

When people casually dismiss arguably the most important moment in the game and then trash Markus??? Yeah I'm gonna point it out. I'm also going to call out a cheap shot when I see it. Baddley took out our leading scorer. Should I applaud him??

You would think on a Marquette fan site people would be a little more upset, but not the fine "fans" on scoop.

Like I said over the top to satisfy an agenda. I'm impressed you are so sure of a college kids intent. Well done. Now of course you will have the last word but I am done, you are not worth the effort.

[1SE]

I took a few screenshots (quality is best I could get) of the play and am just not seeing any elbow or malicious intent like a few others have mentioned.

Screenshot #1: Butler guy goes up with both hands as if to block the ball.

Screenshot #2: Best evidence I could find of an "elbow"

Screenshot #3 & #4: Markus appears to turn his head towards the hoop as if to see if the ball went in. Don't think he'd make that reaction if he just got clocked in the head.

Screenshot #5: Head hitting the chair.

I don't know about an elbow to the head, but I definitely see a puff of smoke from behind the grassy knoll

[Elonsmusk]

When people casually dismiss arguably the most important moment in the game and then trash Markus??? Yeah I'm gonna point it out. I'm also going to call out a cheap shot when I see it. Baddley took out our leading scorer. Should I applaud him??

You would think on a Marquette fan site people would be a little more upset, but not the fine "fans" on scoop.

That's it.  I don't want to just be considered a Scoop "fan."  I am personally going to try to "fan up" to reach your level of fandom. 

[lawdog77]

Baddley did not “take out” our leading scorer.  Literally.  Markus didn’t miss one second as a result of that play. 

He should have

And the play itself wasn’t dirty.  It was two guys going full speed in transition.

Still worthy of a look at the monitor and a Flagrant 1- excessivecontact above the shoulders

stop using this as an excuse for why we lost.

My opinion, it is on of the myriad of reasons why we lost, but not as important as not changing defenses on Kamar. Kamar is not a 3 point shooter. Play some zone. Double on the screens...something. If Coach does that, we don't even need to see Markus try to take over.

[WhoaJoe2020]

Baddley did not “take out” our leading scorer.  Literally.  Markus didn’t miss one second as a result of that play.  And the play itself wasn’t dirty.  It was two guys going full speed in transition.  Take off your blue and gold glasses and stop using this as an excuse for why we lost.

With Marquettes short bench and Symirs inexperience Markus almost had to play. Though after the foul he didn't play like he normally does. It reminded me of the Providence game when the refs let the Friars knock Markus around. He didn't look very good at the end of that game either, though this game was much worse.

You're wrong about the foul that wasn't called. It was a dirty play and should have been reviewed as a flagrant foul. I call it like I see it.

[WhoaJoe2020]

He should have
 Still worthy of a look at the monitor and a Flagrant 1- excessivecontact above the shoulders
 My opinion, it is on of the myriad of reasons why we lost, but not as important as not changing defenses on Kamar. Kamar is not a 3 point shooter. Play some zone. Double on the screens...something. If Coach does that, we don't even need to see Markus try to take over.

To your first point , I agree, Markus wasn't right, but with Marquettes short bench who do you put in?? Symir was getting roasted and Greg is out.

To your second point, I agree, if the refs would have looked at it and assessed a flagrant foul it may have changed the game.

To your third point, I mostly agree, but Baldwin was making some tough shots. It wasn't all bad defense, some of it was better offense. If Markus had been scoring on the other end like he normally does, Marquette still wins that game. I contend that the hit he took to his head was the key factor.

Fair take though.

[rocket surgeon]

I took a few screenshots (quality is best I could get) of the play and am just not seeing any elbow or malicious intent like a few others have mentioned.

Screenshot #1: Butler guy goes up with both hands as if to block the ball.

Screenshot #2: Best evidence I could find of an "elbow"

Screenshot #3 & #4: Markus appears to turn his head towards the hoop as if to see if the ball went in. Don't think he'd make that reaction if he just got clocked in the head.

Screenshot #5: Head hitting the chair.

  thank you for this!  i was just going to post my recollection of that the announcers pointed out that his head hit the chair(not an elbow to the melon) and something about it not being the fan's faults because of the tight quarters/seating arrangements etc etc.   

 i sometimes wonder about the schools need to make money-fans in folding chairs, positions of camera crews and safety of the players.   

[WhoaJoe2020]

  thank you for this!  i was just going to post my recollection of that the announcers pointed out that his head hit the chair(not an elbow to the melon) and something about it not being the fan's faults because of the tight quarters/seating arrangements etc etc.   

 i sometimes wonder about the schools need to make money-fans in folding chairs, positions of camera crews and safety of the players.

The announcers, and every other blind umpire, missed the elbow to the head. Fortunately tower and others have the game on dvr and Markus definitely took an elbow to the head. The only real debate is whether it was intentional. I contend it was because of the exaggerated arm movement by Baddley. Others disagree. That's fine.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The announcers, and every other blind umpire, missed the elbow to the head. Fortunately tower and others have the game on dvr and Markus definitely took an elbow to the head. The only real debate is whether it was intentional. I contend it was because of the exaggerated arm movement by Baddley. Others disagree. That's fine.

I've rewatched it a couple of times. While I agree there was an elbow to the head, I have no idea what "exaggerated arm movement" you are referring to. I see absolutely no evidence of it being intentional. Maybe it was, but I'm not sure what has convinced you that it's a certainty.

[Not A Serious Person]

Maybe this is related ... Markus missed 14 3PA, the most by a Big East player in a conference game since 2009.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I've rewatched it a couple of times. While I agree there was an elbow to the head, I have no idea what "exaggerated arm movement" you are referring to. I see absolutely no evidence of it being intentional. Maybe it was, but I'm not sure what has convinced you that it's a certainty.

Somebody just posted a video of the play and at the end of the attempted block Baddley swings his right arm at Markus. His body actually turns in Markus' direction like he was targeting him.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Somebody just posted a video of the play and at the end of the attempted block Baddley swings his right arm at Markus. His body actually turns in Markus' direction like he was targeting him.

Still not seeing it. It looks like an attempted block of a layup to me. Sometimes hard contact happens.

[WhoaJoe2020]

Still not seeing it. It looks like an attempted block of a layup to me. Sometimes hard contact happens.

Pay attention to the turning of his body toward Markus when he swings his right arm down on his head.

It's also interesting to watch Baddleys actions after the play. He slinks away because he knows what he did.

[Elonsmusk]

Somebody just posted a video of the play and at the end of the attempted block Baddley swings his right arm at Markus. His body actually turns in Markus' direction like he was targeting him.

We are now 36 hours removed from the incident, and have read ~50+ posts from you on this one particular play.  How long should we plan on you continuing to post on that play?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Pay attention to the turning of his body toward Markus when he swings his right arm down on his head.

It's also interesting to watch Baddleys actions after the play. He slinks away because he knows what he did.

Yeah...you have what we call confirmation bias. I'm not seeing what you are seeing and even if I was, it would tell us zero about his intentions.

[Nukem2]

Yeah...you have what we call confirmation bias. I'm not seeing what you are seeing and even if I was, it would tell us zero about his intentions.

I see the contact, though it certainly looks unintentional.

[WhoaJoe2020]

Yeah...you have what we call confirmation bias. I'm not seeing what you are seeing and even if I was, it would tell us zero about his intentions.

The angle Baddley took to block the shot did not allow for his body to blade in the direction of Markus unless it was intentional.

By the way, what did you think of Baddleys reaction??

[WhoaJoe2020]

We are now 36 hours removed from the incident, and have read ~50+ posts from you on this one particular play.  How long should we plan on you continuing to post on that play?

It's  obvious you don't care about Markus getting hammered and the effect it had on his game. That's fine.

You do you.

[hairy worthen]

The angle Baddley took to block the shot did not allow for his body to blade in the direction of Markus unless it was intentional.

By the way, what did you think of Baddleys reaction??

I think you should have your own head checked. No seriously, you are over the top obsessing.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I think you should have your own head checked. No seriously, you are over the top obsessing.

Noted, another scooper who doesn't care about Markus getting hammered and how it affected his game. That's fine.

You do you

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Noted, another scooper who doesn't care about Markus getting hammered and how it affected his game. That's fine.

You do you

I care about Markus. I also care about truth and your slandering of another player.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I care about Markus. I also care about truth and your slandering of another player.

Intentional fouls and flagrant fouls are part of the game. I'm sure you've never seen a cheap shot before in basketball.

That play was intentional in my opinion and I think the video supports it.

It's part of a bigger issue with Markus, as he's  had his share of getting beat up and not getting calls.

You have your opinion, that's fine.

You do you

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Intentional fouls and flagrant fouls are part of the game. I'm sure you've never seen a cheap shot before in basketball.

That play was intentional in my opinion and I think the video supports it.

It's part of a bigger issue with Markus, as he's  had his share of getting beat up and not getting calls.

You have your opinion, that's fine.

You do you

I will. Maybe you should stop claiming that others don’t care about Markus’ health.

[WhoaJoe2020]

I will. Maybe you should stop claiming that others don’t care about Markus’ health.

I started this thread because no one seemed to be interested in Markus' condition or the lack of a call on what I thought was a flagrant foul.

People make lots of claims on message boards, the only people who should be bothered by my statement are those with a guilty conscience.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I started this thread because no one seemed to be interested in Markus' condition or the lack of a call on what I thought was a flagrant foul.

People make lots of claims on message boards, the only people who should be bothered by my statement are those with a guilty conscience.

You’re tiresome.

[WhoaJoe2020]

You’re tiresome.

Maybe it's time for your afternoon nap.