Markus story from afar

[Elonsmusk]

100% yes sir right here.  jamal got the quickest hook for things jh was doing wrong routinely.  but wojo succumbed to the hot breath on his neck from behind him...unfortunate all around.  could have been coaching moments for most.  jamal and brendon are playing like unleashed dogs

This was the core frustration I've had with Wojo since he took over.  Consistency in approach and coaching is critical.  It erodes confidence when a player knows he's on a short leash, and also adds resentment (mostly toward the coach) when you see some teammates not on that same leash.

I credit the hell out of Jamal maintaining a positive attitude through last season.  Jamal still has needed to play quite well from the get go in games this season to get his run, BUT, Wojo has given him a bit more wiggle room to play through a few "mistakes."

Very pleased with how Wojo has coached this team this year.  I was anticipating a pretty big slippage due to losing the Hausers - as in we'd be in the 50-60ish range in KenPom.

[The Sultan]

This was the core frustration I've had with Wojo since he took over.  Consistency in approach and coaching is critical.  It erodes confidence when a player knows he's on a short leash, and also adds resentment (mostly toward the coach) when you see some teammates not on that same leash.

Yeah there is no evidence that Wojo's quick hook for some players has been a problem. In fact Joey should have had a quicker hook and he wrote a letter in response.

It's all part of the coaching process most of which you aren't privy to.

[wadesworld]

There isn't a single coach in any sport at any level who had the same exact leash for every player on his team. It's dumb and naive to suggest there is. A turnover or bad shot by Markus will not and should not have the same reaction by Wojo as a turnover or bad shot by Symir.

[Cheeks]

There isn't a single coach in any sport at any level who had the same exact leash for every player on his team. It's dumb and naive to suggest there is. A turnover or bad shot by Markus will not and should not have the same reaction by Wojo as a turnover or bad shot by Symir.

This ^^^

[GooooMarquette]

There isn't a single coach in any sport at any level who had the same exact leash for every player on his team. It's dumb and naive to suggest there is. A turnover or bad shot by Markus will not and should not have the same reaction by Wojo as a turnover or bad shot by Symir.

Yup.

[Elonsmusk]

There isn't a single coach in any sport at any level who had the same exact leash for every player on his team. It's dumb and naive to suggest there is. A turnover or bad shot by Markus will not and should not have the same reaction by Wojo as a turnover or bad shot by Symir.

Which is why I posted SOME teammates.  Of course a superstar player gets more leash, yet once past your alpha player, there shouldn't be a lot of variance as to how you coach your guys. 

Last year, Joey could miss early shots, have turnovers..and he'd remain in game.  Jamal comes in and has a quick miss/turnover, frequently benched. 
 
I know some here refuse to believe that if a player doesn't start the game ablaze, or have the "hot hand," that, that is proof positive the player will suck for the remainder of that game. Unfortunately, that is dumb and naive AF.

[tower912]

JC got a quick hook.  Agreed.   Should have gotten more run.  Looking for an argument that isn't there

[The Sultan]

Which is why I posted SOME teammates.  Of course a superstar player gets more leash, yet once past your alpha player, there shouldn't be a lot of variance as to how you coach your guys. 

Last year, Joey could miss early shots, have turnovers..and he'd remain in game.  Jamal comes in and has a quick miss/turnover, frequently benched. 
 
I know some here refuse to believe that if a player doesn't start the game ablaze, or have the "hot hand," that, that is proof positive the player will suck for the remainder of that game. Unfortunately, that is dumb and naive AF.

So is the idea that you know more than Wojo about proper substitution patterns.

Again I will point out that the guy Wojo supposedly gave preferential treatment to is gone. While the guy he supposedly didn't is still here.

So obviously it's not as simple as you would suggest.

[Cheeks]

Which is why I posted SOME teammates.  Of course a superstar player gets more leash, yet once past your alpha player, there shouldn't be a lot of variance as to how you coach your guys. 

Last year, Joey could miss early shots, have turnovers..and he'd remain in game.  Jamal comes in and has a quick miss/turnover, frequently benched. 
 
I know some here refuse to believe that if a player doesn't start the game ablaze, or have the "hot hand," that, that is proof positive the player will suck for the remainder of that game. Unfortunately, that is dumb and naive AF.

Tried to keep the Hausers happy, when so many here said he wasn't trying...didn't work.  If Joey stayed, other guys leave.  I know that makes people unhappy, but that's the way it goes.

Always tough when you are trying to coddle certain stars.  I can only imagine here if Wojo benches Hauser or cut his minutes drastically and he pouted publicly how many would blast Wojo.  No win position.

[Elonsmusk]

So is the idea that you know more than Wojo about proper substitution patterns.

Again I will point out that the guy Wojo supposedly gave preferential treatment to is gone. While the guy he supposedly didn't is still here.

So obviously it's not as simple as you would suggest.

My argument was, and has been that there largely haven't been substitution patterns/consistent roles.  What had been consistent was Wojo giving the quick hook to certain guys if they made a "mistake" such as missing a shot/turning the ball over - while others played through those mistakes.

Some of you guys just need to chill out and stop looking for an argument that isn't there.  I think he's doing a better job (and good job) this year, and probably learned some from last year.  So, those of you who have preached patience, appear validated - just wish it wouldn't have taken him 5 years and the transfer out of the Hausers to figure it out.

[The Sultan]

It was never a problem. You're the one creating something that's not there.

[Elonsmusk]

It was never a problem. You're the one creating something that's not there.

Yeah.  You are right.  We've witnessed pure genius these last 5 years.  Worst results at MU since Bob Dukiet, yet taking over the reigns after the 2nd best run in program history, while inheriting more Top 100 players on the roster that at any time since Al was coach. 

Those facts aside, I am glad to see that in Year 6 it looks like he's getting it together. 

[wadesworld]

Yeah.  You are right.  We've witnessed pure genius these last 5 years.  Worst results at MU since Bob Dukiet, yet taking over the reigns after the 2nd best run in program history, while inheriting more Top 100 players on the roster that at any time since Al was coach. 

Those facts aside, I am glad to see that in Year 6 it looks like he's getting it together.

Lol. Sticking with the idea that he had a loaded group to work with when he came in I see?

Maybe go back to dunking on people at the Y. Your basketball takes continue to suck. Even your beloved Bazz couldn't find a way to win with that group.

[The Sultan]

Yeah.  You are right.  We've witnessed pure genius these last 5 years.  Worst results at MU since Bob Dukiet, yet taking over the reigns after the 2nd best run in program history, while inheriting more Top 100 players on the roster that at any time since Al was coach. 

Those facts aside, I am glad to see that in Year 6 it looks like he's getting it together. 

Substitution patterns were never a problem. You can insist otherwise but you'd be wrong.

[Elonsmusk]

Lol. Sticking with the idea that he had a loaded group to work with when he came in I see?

Maybe go back to dunking on people at the Y. Your basketball takes continue to suck. Even your beloved Bazz couldn't find a way to win with that group.

I take this as a supreme compliment coming from you, bud.  Thank you.

Substitution patterns were never a problem. You can insist otherwise but you'd be wrong.

What were the problems?

[Cheeks]

Yeah.  You are right.  We've witnessed pure genius these last 5 years.  Worst results at MU since Bob Dukiet, yet taking over the reigns after the 2nd best run in program history, while inheriting more Top 100 players on the roster that at any time since Al was coach. 

Those facts aside, I am glad to see that in Year 6 it looks like he's getting it together.

Worst results since Bob Dukiet...good Lord this is outstanding stupidity.  Epic stupidity on the 100 nonsense and the Dukiet claim.  EPIC STUPIDITY

[The Sultan]

I take this as a supreme compliment coming from you, bud.  Thank you.

What were the problems?

The main problem was, and continue to be, lack of adjustments in real time.

[🏀]

Vanilla Soft Serve consistently had one of the shittiest on-court demeanors at Marquette I had seen.

[Elonsmusk]

Worst results since Bob Dukiet...good Lord this is outstanding stupidity.  Epic stupidity on the 100 nonsense and the Dukiet claim.  EPIC STUPIDITY

I'll hang up and listen...


Al McGuire           1964–77    295–80    .787
Hank Raymonds   1977–83   126–50   .716
Rick Majerus   1983–86   56–35   .615
Bob Dukiet   1986–89   39–46   .459
Kevin O'Neill   1989–94   86–62   .581
Mike Deane   1994–99   100–55   .645
Tom Crean   1999–08   190–96   .664
Buzz Williams   2008–14   139–69   .668
Steve Wojo   2014–   97–67   .591

[Pakuni]

I'll hang up and listen...


Al McGuire           1964–77    295–80    .787
Hank Raymonds   1977–83   126–50   .716
Rick Majerus   1983–86   56–35   .615
Bob Dukiet   1986–89   39–46   .459
Kevin O'Neill   1989–94   86–62   .581
Mike Deane   1994–99   100–55   .645
Tom Crean   1999–08   190–96   .664
Buzz Williams   2008–14   139–69   .668
Steve Wojo   2014–   97–67   .591

According to this Mike Deane was a better coach than Kevin O'Neill and only marginally worse than Crean and Buzz.
So this obviously is a valuable way to measure success.

[Cheeks]

I'll hang up and listen...


Al McGuire           1964–77    295–80    .787
Hank Raymonds   1977–83   126–50   .716
Rick Majerus   1983–86   56–35   .615
Bob Dukiet   1986–89   39–46   .459
Kevin O'Neill   1989–94   86–62   .581
Mike Deane   1994–99   100–55   .645
Tom Crean   1999–08   190–96   .664
Buzz Williams   2008–14   139–69   .668
Steve Wojo   2014–   97–67   .591

Laughable

Last I checked, who you played...mattered.  Not only that, some coaches inherited NCAA tournament teams, some had to rebuild entirely.

Absolutely laughable.

[Elonsmusk]

According to this Mike Deane was a better coach than Kevin O'Neill and only marginally worse than Crean and Buzz.
So this obviously is a valuable way to measure success.

You could make that argument.  Deane was a very good bench coach.  But, lets of course take a look at where the program was when K.O., Deane, and Wojo took over.  Who had it the worst?

[The Sultan]

You could make that argument.  Deane was a very good bench coach.  But, lets of course take a look at where the program was when K.O., Deane, and Wojo took over.  Who had it the worst?

I think the 101st time we have this argument will change everyone's minds.

[GooooMarquette]

I'll hang up and listen...


Al McGuire           1964–77    295–80    .787
Hank Raymonds   1977–83   126–50   .716
Rick Majerus   1983–86   56–35   .615
Bob Dukiet   1986–89   39–46   .459
Kevin O'Neill   1989–94   86–62   .581
Mike Deane   1994–99   100–55   .645
Tom Crean   1999–08   190–96   .664
Buzz Williams   2008–14   139–69   .668
Steve Wojo   2014–   97–67   .591

If winning percentage while at MU is your only standard, you might want to pick the phone back up and let the college hoops HOF people know that Mike Deane was a better coach than Rick Majerus.

[Cheeks]

If winning percentage while at MU is your only standard, you might want to pick the phone back up and let the college hoops HOF people know that Mike Deane was a better coach than Rick Majerus.

Not only that, while he is hold waiting for the phone to ring his own criteria is trumped with Wojo better record than KO, but he said not since Dukiet.

Using straight winning percentages, who coaches are allowed to recruit, conference, etc, all matter.