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Author Topic: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets  (Read 33096 times)

Herman Cain

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Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #276 on: February 29, 2020, 05:35:39 PM »
Big East NET Rankings as of games of February 28
New Old
8   8   Creighton   
12   12   Villanova   
15   15   Seton Hall   
21   21   Butler
24   24   Marquette   
42   42   Xavier   
50   50   Providence   
58   58   Georgetown   
72   73   St. John's
75   75   DePaul
2/28 Team Sheets
MU is on page 24
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20Feb%2028,%202020.pdf?Mobile=1&Source=%2Fsolutions%2Frpi%2F%5Flayouts%2F15%2Fmobile%2Fmblwikia%2Easpx%3FUrl%3D%252Fsolutions%252Frpi%252FSitePages%252FHome%252Easpx

shoothoops

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #277 on: March 01, 2020, 10:17:32 AM »
Marquette moved from 24 in NCAA Net Rankings, to 25 NCAA Net Rankings today.

Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #278 on: March 01, 2020, 11:37:06 AM »
Big East NET rankings as of games of February 29
New Old
8   8   Creighton   
13   15   Seton Hall   
16   12   Villanova   
19   21   Butler   
25   24   Marquette   
44   50   Providence   
45   42   Xavier   
59   58   Georgetown   
74   72   St. John's
82   75   DePaul
2/29 Team Sheets
MU is on page 25
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20Feb%2029,%202020.pdf?Mobile=1&Source=%2Fsolutions%2Frpi%2F%5Flayouts%2F15%2Fmobile%2Fmblwikia%2Easpx%3FUrl%3D%252Fsolutions%252Frpi%252FSitePages%252FHome%2Easpx%26wdFCCState%3D1

HowardsWorld

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #279 on: March 01, 2020, 12:01:44 PM »
The fact that Wisconsin is still behind Marquette shows me everything that I need to know about how the NET is a crap ranking. Despite the fact that I hate the Badgers there is no denying there resume is night and day difference. They have 7 sargin top 25 wins the most in the country. Kansas has 5 and the next few teams have 4. They have 3 tops 25 road wins. And yet they are still at 27?

I am only using them as comparison because its beyond obvious who the higher seed should be yet looking at NET you wouldn't be able to tell.

JamilJaeJamailJrJuan

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #280 on: March 01, 2020, 12:54:17 PM »
SJU running Creighton off the floor in Queens.

Yikes.
I would take the Rick SLU program right now.

JWags85

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #281 on: March 01, 2020, 01:21:24 PM »
The fact that Wisconsin is still behind Marquette shows me everything that I need to know about how the NET is a crap ranking. Despite the fact that I hate the Badgers there is no denying there resume is night and day difference. They have 7 sargin top 25 wins the most in the country. Kansas has 5 and the next few teams have 4. They have 3 tops 25 road wins. And yet they are still at 27?

I am only using them as comparison because its beyond obvious who the higher seed should be yet looking at NET you wouldn't be able to tell.

Wisconsin has great wins, but they also have 4 losses to teams below Marquette’s worst loss, which is Providence (44).

And 3 of those Richmond (48), NC St (54), and New Mexico (148  :o) were not even road games, but on neutral floors

Nukem2

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #282 on: March 01, 2020, 01:23:55 PM »
SJU running Creighton off the floor in Queens.

Yikes.
SJU wins 91-71  shooting 14-22 from the 3 point line while the Bluejays shot a horrific 4-27.  Real role reversal today.

TAMU Eagle

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #283 on: March 01, 2020, 02:04:46 PM »
SJU wins 91-71  shooting 14-22 from the 3 point line while the Bluejays shot a horrific 4-27.  Real role reversal today.

Ceilings and floors.

SJU played near their ceiling, Creighton played near their floor. This is what makes college basketball great, anyone can beat anyone on any given night.

It also means that sometimes a loss doesn't mean the loser played poorly. Sometimes it means the other team played out of their mind.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

JWags85

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #284 on: March 01, 2020, 02:25:15 PM »
Ceilings and floors.

SJU played near their ceiling, Creighton played near their floor. This is what makes college basketball great, anyone can beat anyone on any given night.

It also means that sometimes a loss doesn't mean the loser played poorly. Sometimes it means the other team played out of their mind.

Feels like our game at Carnesecca last year. A team that shot 35% from 3 on the year shot 46% but I remember they missed like their last 3-4 3PA when they were up big cause they were well over 50% all game.  Marquette played bad but they were unconscious


Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #285 on: March 02, 2020, 08:33:55 AM »
Big East D1 NET rankings as of games of March 1
New Old
12   13   Seton Hall   
13   8   Creighton   
17   16   Villanova
20   19   Butler   
25   25   Marquette   
43   45   Xavier   
44   44   Providence   
60   59   Georgetown   
64   74   St. John's
81   82   DePaul
3/1 Team Sheets
MU is on page 25
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20March%201,%202020.pdf?Mobile=1&Source=%2Fsolutions%2Frpi%2F%5Flayouts%2F15%2Fmobile%2Fmblwikia%2Easpx%3FUrl%3D%252Fsolutions%252Frpi%252FSitePages%252FHome%2Easpx%26wdFCCState%3D1

Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #286 on: March 02, 2020, 03:40:34 PM »
Big East Poll rankings as of March 2
AP
8. The Hall
11. Creighton
14. Nova
Others receiving votes- Butler, Cooley & Company, MU

Coaches
7. The Hall
12. Nova
14. Creighton
25. Butler
Others receiving votes -MU, Cooley & Company

Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #287 on: March 03, 2020, 02:30:46 PM »
Big East NET Rankings as of games of March 2
New Old
12   12   Seton Hall   Big East   
13   13   Creighton
17   17   Villanova   
20   20   Butler   
25   25   Marquette   
43   43   Xavier   
44   44   Providence   
60   60   Georgetown   
64   64   St. John's
81   81   DePaul
3/2 Team sheets
MU is on page 25
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20March%202,%202020.pdf
   

Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #288 on: March 04, 2020, 09:41:51 AM »
Big East NET Rankings as of games of March 3
New Old
12   12   Seton Hall   
13   13   Creighton   
14   17   Villanova   
20   20   Butler   
26   25   Marquette   
41   43   Xavier   
44   44   Providence   
62   60   Georgetown   
66   64   St. John's
81   81   DePaul
3/3 Team Sheets
MU is on page 26
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20March%203,%202020.pdf?Mobile=1&Source=%2Fsolutions%2Frpi%2F%5Flayouts%2F15%2Fmobile%2Fmblwikia%2Easpx%3FUrl%3D%252Fsolutions%252Frpi%252FSitePages%252FHome%252Easpx

Cfollow

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #289 on: March 04, 2020, 10:38:07 AM »
Truly amazing  that Marquette can lose to an awful DePaul team and drop only one spot in the NET.
Can they lose their next 2 to SJU and DePaul and still be in the top 35 of the NET? What a worthless tool if that is the case.

Litehouse

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #290 on: March 04, 2020, 10:40:33 AM »
I'm more surprised DePaul didn't move at all.

Nukem2

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #291 on: March 04, 2020, 10:41:48 AM »
Truly amazing  that Marquette can lose to an awful DePaul team and drop only one spot in the NET.
Can they lose their next 2 to SJU and DePaul and still be in the top 35 of the NET? What a worthless tool if that is the case.
Interestingly, MU would be at #27 under the old RPI per Warren Nolan’s website (he still crunches it out for comparative purposes with the NET).  All more of a comment on the weakness of the field this year?

JamilJaeJamailJrJuan

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #292 on: March 04, 2020, 10:44:01 AM »
Interestingly, MU would be at #27 under the old RPI per Warren Nolan’s website (he still crunches it out for comparative purposes with the NET).  All more of a comment on the weakness of the field this year?

Its truly amazing having watched this collapse first hand, but purely resume-wise, MU is still likely a 7 seed even with 2 more losses in a row.  Now, maybe the committee would ding them a line or two in that scenario having lost 7 of 8 (cant blame them!), but purely from a resume standpoint, there is an ocean between MU and the last 4 in. 
I would take the Rick SLU program right now.

BM1090

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #293 on: March 04, 2020, 10:46:43 AM »
Its truly amazing having watched this collapse first hand, but purely resume-wise, MU is still likely a 7 seed even with 2 more losses in a row.  Now, maybe the committee would ding them a line or two in that scenario having lost 7 of 8 (cant blame them!), but purely from a resume standpoint, there is an ocean between MU and the last 4 in.

Not sure if I'd go as far as you are, but Lucas Harkins who is pretty good at this echoes your thoughts

https://twitter.com/hardwiredsports/status/1235046254763061248?s=19

Litehouse

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #294 on: March 04, 2020, 10:50:18 AM »
To me it kinda seems like there isn't a huge difference between team #25 and #75, and aside from the top 5 or so, anyone can beat anyone this year.  Our resume still looks pretty good in comparison to those behind us.  I don't know if it's necessarily the weakness of the field, I think it's more that there isn't that big of a difference between the 6-11 seeds and the NIT teams.

JamilJaeJamailJrJuan

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #295 on: March 04, 2020, 11:13:30 AM »
To me it kinda seems like there isn't a huge difference between team #25 and #75, and aside from the top 5 or so, anyone can beat anyone this year.  Our resume still looks pretty good in comparison to those behind us.  I don't know if it's necessarily the weakness of the field, I think it's more that there isn't that big of a difference between the 6-11 seeds and the NIT teams.

On the eye test, sure. 

But MU is 5-9 in Q1, 6-2 in Q2, Q3 2-0 and Q4 5-0, with a NET of 26.  That is 11 Q1 and Q2 wins, and zero losses out Q1 and Q2 with only 7 games in that category. 

Compare that to the last 4 at large teams in per bracket matrix:

Stanford Q1: 5-5; Q2: 2-3; Q3: 6-1; Q4: 7-0; NET 25
Cinci Q1: 2-6; Q2: 7-0; Q3: 7-4; Q4: 3-0; NET 51
UCLA Q1: 6-6, Q2: 3-3; Q3: 4-1; Q4: 5-1; NET 75
Utah State Q1: 2-4; Q2: 2-2: Q3: 7-2; Q4: 10-0; NET: 38

Its frankly not close. 
I would take the Rick SLU program right now.

Litehouse

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #296 on: March 04, 2020, 11:36:44 AM »
I agree there's a big difference in resumes.  What I meant is that if the teams played each other it would all be pretty close, more of a "anybody can beat anybody".  We were only favored by 4 against #81 DePaul.  Look at point spreads for tonight...

#11 Florida State
#59 Notre Dame +1.5

#48 Virginia
#108 Miami +2

#3 Dayton
#52 Rhode Island +4

#45 Minnesota
#54 Indiana -3.5

#34 Florida
#84 Georgia +2.5

#31 LSU
#47 Arkansas -3.0

JamilJaeJamailJrJuan

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #297 on: March 04, 2020, 11:55:25 AM »
I agree there's a big difference in resumes.  What I meant is that if the teams played each other it would all be pretty close, more of a "anybody can beat anybody".  We were only favored by 4 against #81 DePaul.  Look at point spreads for tonight...

#11 Florida State
#59 Notre Dame +1.5

#48 Virginia
#108 Miami +2

#3 Dayton
#52 Rhode Island +4

#45 Minnesota
#54 Indiana -3.5

#34 Florida
#84 Georgia +2.5

#31 LSU
#47 Arkansas -3.0

Yah, I get/got what you were sayingm and you're absolutely right. 
I would take the Rick SLU program right now.

TAMU Eagle

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #298 on: March 04, 2020, 12:46:43 PM »
Truly amazing  that Marquette can lose to an awful DePaul team and drop only one spot in the NET.
Can they lose their next 2 to SJU and DePaul and still be in the top 35 of the NET? What a worthless tool if that is the case.

Honestly, it's not that surprising. Its a Q2A loss, so not a loss that really hurts your resume. Plus we are at the end of the season, it's one data point out of 29. The further you go in the season, the harder it is to move up or down because each game impacts the overall score less. We earned our high rankings early.

What this metric doesn't cover is the fact that DePaul was missing their best player and the overall trend to end the season. We've been playing our worst basketball of the season in 2 of the past 4 games.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

Herman Cain

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Re: Big East Poll,NET rankings and Team Sheets
« Reply #299 on: March 05, 2020, 09:20:49 AM »
Big East NET Rankings as of games of March 4
New Old
12   13   Creighton   
13   14   Villanova   
14   12   Seton Hall   
17   20   Butler   
26   26   Marquette   
40   44   Providence   
42   41   Xavier   
62   62   Georgetown   
70   66   St. John's
83   81   DePaul

3/4 Team Sheets
MU is on page 26
https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/NET%20Team%20Sheets%20-%20March%204,%202020.pdf

 

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