Virginia Tech Fans

[CountryRoads]

It seems $3.5 million is kind of the number now for coaches just below the elite ones (buzz, hoiberg just signed for that). Could MU feasibly get to that number if need be?

[NorthernDancerColt]

Look, believe it or not...I hope he absolutely kills it next year...that's the truth. With what he has coming back...there should be no more excuses. However, I am skeptical...because of how they finished this year, his lack of creativity offensively or defensively, and the fact that his legitimate top 10 team needed to win 1 game of 4 to win the BE title and couldn't do it. That's concerning...very concerning. What's even more concerning is the fact that he either didn't know how to fix their slide, or didn't know what caused it.

I don't know what you think caused it. I will tell you I think a perfect storm caused it. I think Markus was injured and/or finally feeling the effect of his advanced minutes. I think Sam, while fully healed from offseason hip surgery, was maybe dealing with some fatigue. I think mentally, they wanted that regular season crown maybe too badly, and their bodies simply could not give them the output needed to produce that result. Bad timing? You bet. I don't doubt that Markus prefers winning over personal results...but when you single-handedly put the team on your back and hang 50s on opponents...it's maybe hard for him to not abuse his green light. Wojo saw it all slipping away and maybe overcoached a bit, who knows. Was this not his first experience as a head of steadily climbing very near a tangible summit just as supplies were thinning? I'd bet he learned a ton from that last couple weeks. I'd also bet he applies what he learned to next year.

If you paid attention throughout, you had to see a well-oiled machine in the non-conference ranked games, followed by much of the initial 2/3 of the BEast, especially the games at Georgetown, at Providence, at DePaul. Did this machine sputter a bit? No doubt. Wojo felt that you don't apply a fix which saps your guys of the confidence they earned all year. Maybe he should've applied a little more IZZO and a little less salve to our wounds. It's a difficult calculus. 

[esotericmindguy]

It seems $3.5 million is kind of the number now for coaches just below the elite ones (buzz, hoiberg just signed for that). Could MU feasibly get to that number if need be?

Had buzz never left I believe he'd be at 3.5M all in. TV, Radio, salary, etc. I think he was 2.8 when he left

[wadesworld]

I hope VT gets Willard.  He'd be a perfect follow up to Buzz.

[🏀]

Had buzz never left I believe he'd be at 3.5M all in. TV, Radio, salary, etc. I think he was 2.8 when he left

He'd likely be above it by now with consistent success.

[muguru]

I don't know what you think caused it. I will tell you I think a perfect storm caused it. I think Markus was injured and/or finally feeling the effect of his advanced minutes. I think Sam, while fully healed from offseason hip surgery, was maybe dealing with some fatigue. I think mentally, they wanted that regular season crown maybe too badly, and their bodies simply could not give them the output needed to produce that result. Bad timing? You bet. I don't doubt that Markus prefers winning over personal results...but when you single-handedly put the team on your back and hang 50s on opponents...it's maybe hard for him to not abuse his green light. Wojo saw it all slipping away and maybe overcoached a bit, who knows. Was this not his first experience as a head of steadily climbing very near a tangible summit just as supplies were thinning? I'd bet he learned a ton from that last couple weeks. I'd also bet he applies what he learned to next year.

If you paid attention throughout, you had to see a well-oiled machine in the non-conference ranked games, followed by much of the initial 2/3 of the BEast, especially the games at Georgetown, at Providence, at DePaul. Did this machine sputter a bit? No doubt. Wojo felt that you don't apply a fix which saps your guys of the confidence they earned all year. Maybe he should've applied a little more IZZO and a little less salve to our wounds. It's a difficult calculus.

I guess I have a hard time buying the fatigue argument to be honest. Plenty of teams run 7-8 man rotations and we didn't see them get fatigued. Hell Virginia played 6 guys...6 over 1 minute in their Elite 8 game vs. Purdue. I'm just saying and I guess I would then wonder why MU would be any different then the other teams that do it??

[Lennys Tap]

I don't know what you think caused it. I will tell you I think a perfect storm caused it. I think Markus was injured and/or finally feeling the effect of his advanced minutes. I think Sam, while fully healed from offseason hip surgery, was maybe dealing with some fatigue. I think mentally, they wanted that regular season crown maybe too badly, and their bodies simply could not give them the output needed to produce that result. Bad timing? You bet. I don't doubt that Markus prefers winning over personal results...but when you single-handedly put the team on your back and hang 50s on opponents...it's maybe hard for him to not abuse his green light. Wojo saw it all slipping away and maybe overcoached a bit, who knows. Was this not his first experience as a head of steadily climbing very near a tangible summit just as supplies were thinning? I'd bet he learned a ton from that last couple weeks. I'd also bet he applies what he learned to next year.

If you paid attention throughout, you had to see a well-oiled machine in the non-conference ranked games, followed by much of the initial 2/3 of the BEast, especially the games at Georgetown, at Providence, at DePaul. Did this machine sputter a bit? No doubt. Wojo felt that you don't apply a fix which saps your guys of the confidence they earned all year. Maybe he should've applied a little more IZZO and a little less salve to our wounds. It's a difficult calculus.

Colt

Thoughtful analysis, generally plausible opinions. One nit I would pick is the "well oiled machine" meme. I think we were good, maybe even very good, but never top 10 good. Maybe on the edge of top 25 good (where Pomeroy had us). We were also very lucky. Down the stretch we had a few clunkers but also I think the "luck" element even out. We went from top 10 luckiest to the middle of the pack (#155) over the last 4 weeks.

[wadesworld]

All of this discussion/posts on Wojo leaving truly has me laughing out loud. There is not a program on par or better than MU that has any interest in hiring Wojo at this point of his career. I do not believe if Wojo's agents worked behind the scenes that he could make a lateral move right now. The folks talking Wojo to UNLV or Va Tech are not credible basketball sources.

I have spent virtually zero time on the Wojo watch and if I missed a college ball insider talking Wojo leaving, that is my bad. I'm a guy that would not be heartbroken if he left and have not even kept on the news regarding the potential departure.

You started with claiming that you searched for Wojo moving rumors on the internet and that if there was any talk about it it's in the dark interweb that you didn't have access to.  You moved on to shooting down UNLV rumors as being fake news.  Then yesterday you were saying maybe Wojo really is moving on.  Now you're laughing out loud at the rumors.  And in the very same post that you claim you're laughing out loud at the rumors and claim there is no way Wojo could even make a lateral move if he wanted to, you say you haven't even kept up on the news regarding the potential departure.

You're all over the place.

[Goose]

wades

I probably spent 20 minutes over two days looking for VaTech news and found the one guys post. My post on maybe Wojo is gone I hope you knew was in jest. The UNLV rumor was a stretch, IMO and any VaTech talk is a bigger stretch.
To sum it up, I do not think Wojo has been on any short lists this season, nor will he be. From what I have heard, read or believe, Wojo is not a real candidate at any job in the country, aside from MU.
Again, if you believe otherwise, I hope it goes the way you want to go. In addition, my post yesterday was 1000000% a joke.

[wadesworld]

wades

I probably spent 20 minutes over two days looking for VaTech news and found the one guys post. My post on maybe Wojo is gone I hope you knew was in jest. The UNLV rumor was a stretch, IMO and any VaTech talk is a bigger stretch.
To sum it up, I do not think Wojo has been on any short lists this season, nor will he be. From what I have heard, read or believe, Wojo is not a real candidate at any job in the country, aside from MU.
Again, if you believe otherwise, I hope it goes the way you want to go. In addition, my post yesterday was 1000000% a joke.

I guess I'm just confused.  Maybe it's my inability to comprehend the written word.  You literally wrote, "I have spent virtually zero time on the Wojo watch and if I missed a college ball insider talking Wojo leaving, that is my bad. I'm a guy that would not be heartbroken if he left and have not even kept on the news regarding the potential departure."  Yet you are so sure he's not on any lists or a candidate for any jobs outside of Marquette...all based on...spending no time looking into whether he's actually on any lists.

At least you admit you just spew stuff without actually looking into it.

[Goose]

wades

I am sure he is not any lists because he has done nothing to be on a list. On previous coaching rumors I was far more interested because I believed there was a real story. Yes, I have casually looked to see if anything new popped up, but more in passing.

One last thing, I have spoken to people that told me there is nothing going at MU in regards to a possible coaching change.

[willie warrior]

I don't know what you think caused it. I will tell you I think a perfect storm caused it. I think Markus was injured and/or finally feeling the effect of his advanced minutes. I think Sam, while fully healed from offseason hip surgery, was maybe dealing with some fatigue. I think mentally, they wanted that regular season crown maybe too badly, and their bodies simply could not give them the output needed to produce that result. Bad timing? You bet. I don't doubt that Markus prefers winning over personal results...but when you single-handedly put the team on your back and hang 50s on opponents...it's maybe hard for him to not abuse his green light. Wojo saw it all slipping away and maybe overcoached a bit, who knows. Was this not his first experience as a head of steadily climbing very near a tangible summit just as supplies were thinning? I'd bet he learned a ton from that last couple weeks. I'd also bet he applies what he learned to next year.

If you paid attention throughout, you had to see a well-oiled machine in the non-conference ranked games, followed by much of the initial 2/3 of the BEast, especially the games at Georgetown, at Providence, at DePaul. Did this machine sputter a bit? No doubt. Wojo felt that you don't apply a fix which saps your guys of the confidence they earned all year. Maybe he should've applied a little more IZZO and a little less salve to our wounds. It's a difficult calculus.

Very good. The perfect storm excuse. Better than some of the others

[Billy Hoyle]

wades

I am sure he is not any lists because he has done nothing to be on a list. On previous coaching rumors I was far more interested because I believed there was a real story. Yes, I have casually looked to see if anything new popped up, but more in passing.

I do not believe anything other than he'll be at MU next year, and I think the UNLV and Va Tech talk is garbage started by some anonymous message board posters or "reporters" throwing names out there, hoping they hit on one.  That said, while Wojo hasn't done enough to be on a list people are enamored with the Duke pedigree and will seek him out just for that.  Johnny Dawkins made one tourney appearance in seven years at Stanford, was fired, and was immediately hired.  Jeff Capel flamed out at Oklahoma, went back to Duke and is now head coach at VCU. Wojo moves up a few notches when it comes to coaching searches because he's a Dukie.

[Goose]

Billy

If Wojo was canned or on open market, he probably would get some looks. That is how the crazy biz works. I am strictly talking about the current situation. I cannot see how any on par or better program could sell their fan base on the hiring of Wojo. Programs want to make a splash, not trying to sell a hire to alums.

[mu03eng]

I suspect you'd have no idea whether the administration has offered him an extension.
That said, if MU announces an extension, will that make him a great coach?

I'm fully confident the administration is/has extended him. I'm also fully confident that they aren't dumb enough to announce it now given the optics of how the season ended and/or all these silly rumors. The former would anger the fanbase the later would make it look like MU gives into "extorsion".

Wojo ain't going anywhere

[tower912]

wades

I am sure he is not any lists because he has done nothing to be on a list. On previous coaching rumors I was far more interested because I believed there was a real story. Yes, I have casually looked to see if anything new popped up, but more in passing.

One last thing, I have spoken to people that told me there is nothing going at MU in regards to a possible coaching change.

Crean got hired again.  If Steve got fired, he would not be unemployed long.

[muguru]

Billy

If Wojo was canned or on open market, he probably would get some looks. That is how the crazy biz works. I am strictly talking about the current situation. I cannot see how any on par or better program could sell their fan base on the hiring of Wojo. Programs want to make a splash, not trying to sell a hire to alums.

Goose,

            That's the problem, for a lessor program like Va Tech, Wojo would be a "home run hire". That's the truth and their fans admit that. An even bigger problem is that MU as a program should be way way way above a Va Tech program...and yet Wojo is their Head Coach. The message that sends, to me, isn't a good one. MU was a MUCH better program, and a much more desirable place to be for Coaches when they were in the Old Big East...now, it seems to be a stepping stone league for Coaches..That's telling really, and it's telling a very sad story for a once proud program like MU.

[Goose]

Tower

First, sad to say, Wojo is no Crean. Secondly, I just said he would likely get looks if he got axed.

[Goose]

guru

Wojo is not a home run hire at any program of substance. We might be a stepping stone program at the moment, but not for Woj at the moment.

[muguru]

I'm fully confident the administration is/has extended him. I'm also fully confident that they aren't dumb enough to announce it now given the optics of how the season ended and/or all these silly rumors. The former would anger the fanbase the later would make it look like MU gives into "extorsion".

Wojo ain't going anywhere

So given what you said in the above..you're confident they extended him...let's assume that's true...then you say they aren't dumb enough to announce it given the optics of how the season ended...so...given that, knowing it would be dumb to announce it...why would you extend him?? Why extend a Coach with three years still remaining on his contract. Basically, if they know it would be a bad idea to announce an extension...then why the hell would you give him one to begin with...shouldn't that tell them, it's probably not a good idea??

[tower912]

Tower

First, sad to say, Wojo is no Crean. Secondly, I just said he would likely get looks if he got axed.

I am confident that at the 20 year mark of his coaching career, that his record will be better than Crean's at the same point.  Not the highest bar.   
And Wojo isn't going anywhere for a while.

[Heisenberg]

Goose,

            That's the problem, for a lessor program like Va Tech, Wojo would be a "home run hire". That's the truth and their fans admit that. An even bigger problem is that MU as a program should be way way way above a Va Tech program...and yet Wojo is their Head Coach. The message that sends, to me, isn't a good one. MU was a MUCH better program, and a much more desirable place to be for Coaches when they were in the Old Big East...now, it seems to be a stepping stone league for Coaches..That's telling really, and it's telling a very sad story for a once proud program like MU.

Yes ... it is a stepping stone conference to becoming one of the highest paid coaches in basketball.

But I think this is not what you meant.

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/

2019 NCAAB COACHES' PAY
RK
1   Kentucky   SEC   John Calipari   $7,950,000   $9,276,643   $50,000   $50,000   $25,000,000
2   Duke   ACC   Mike Krzyzewski   $7,048,206   $7,048,206   --   --   --
3   Michigan State   Big Ten   Tom Izzo   $3,732,562   $4,157,562   $350,000   $75,000   $5,325,950
4   Virginia   ACC   Tony Bennett   $4,150,000   $4,150,000   $1,450,000   $450,000   $19,793,478
5   Kansas   Big 12   Bill Self   $3,881,857   $4,066,857   $525,000   $225,000   $16,112,000
6   Louisville   ACC   Chris Mack   $4,007,494   $4,007,494   $375,000   --   $12,000,000
7   North Carolina   ACC   Roy Williams   $2,281,778   $3,928,778   $1,020,148   $200,000   $8,862,132
8   Villanova   Big East   Jay Wright   $3,878,768   $3,878,768   --   --   --
9   West Virginia   Big 12   Bob Huggins   $3,850,000   $3,865,000   $640,000   $200,000   $8,040,000
10   Michigan   Big Ten   John Beilein   $3,800,000   $3,800,000   $250,000   $175,000   $3,000,000
11   Utah   Pac-12   Larry Krystkowiak   $3,572,500   $3,572,500   $280,000   $80,000   $12,750,000
12   Wichita State   AAC   Gregg Marshall   $3,500,000   $3,570,000   $838,000   $151,000   $15,000,000
13   Indiana   Big Ten   Archie Miller   $3,250,000   $3,250,000   $1,035,000   $125,000   $17,000,000
14   Tennessee   SEC   Rick Barnes   $3,250,000   $3,250,000   $700,000   $125,000   $5,041,667
15   Texas   Big 12   Shaka Smart   $3,200,000   $3,200,000   $795,000   $45,000   $13,800,000
16   Georgia   SEC   Tom Crean   $3,200,000   $3,200,000   $450,000   --   $16,000,000
17   Oklahoma   Big 12   Lon Kruger   $3,200,000   $3,200,000   $270,000   $25,000   $3,900,000
18   Baylor   Big 12   Scott Drew   $3,051,076   $3,062,445   --   --   --
19   Alabama   SEC   Avery Johnson   $3,062,000   $3,062,000   $450,000   $75,000   $8,000,000
20   Ohio State   Big Ten   Chris Holtmann   $3,013,750   $3,013,750   $390,000   $90,000   $16,960,938

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/

[WarriorDad]

Billy

If Wojo was canned or on open market, he probably would get some looks. That is how the crazy biz works. I am strictly talking about the current situation. I cannot see how any on par or better program could sell their fan base on the hiring of Wojo. Programs want to make a splash, not trying to sell a hire to alums.

It would depend what state the program is in.  Not that hard a sell.  Young coach, took team to NCAA tournament 2 of last 3 years, developed player into a 2nd team All American, picked to be one of the next young coaches to go to the Final Four, too 10 finalist for national coach of the year.

[WarriorDad]

I am confident that at the 20 year mark of his coaching career, that his record will be better than Crean's at the same point.  Not the highest bar.   
And Wojo isn't going anywhere for a while.

I think this is accurate.  Crean has taken on rebuilds at every stop.  If Wojo avoids that moving forward, he will have a better record.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

his legitimate top 10 team

Nope.

They had a great first 27 games, but were never a legitimate top 10 team.  Top 20?  Top 25?  Sure.