Coach K on the Marquette Basketball Hour tonight

[real chili 83]

Lenny
I ended up becoming a big Buzz guy and I believe Chico’s is 100% correct on the other shoe(s) dropping. Just because shoes did not drop, does not mean that they do not exist. Quite possibly those shoes are the exact reason why Buzz is no longer here.

What is this shoe you speak of?   You'll need to give a full report to the Underbard at NMD. Bradley's, second floor. Bring Chicos.

[brewcity77]

Then therefore Wojo must be guilty too, since he used to work there. Right?  Come on now, how naive can you be....right?  They must all be in on it.

The level of irony in this comment is atmospheric. Of course Duke cheats. Same with Kentucky. They cheat, everyone knows it, but you'll never catch K or Cal holding a bag.

The idea that a big brand or big name coach precludes cheating is mind-numbingly stupid in the wake of what's come out with Kansas & Self, Arizona & Miller, & Louisville & Pitino.

And the idea that $100k isn't a big sum because these guys will be worth more in three NBA, also incredibly stupid. It screams of a person that has never had to struggle for finances a day in their life. $100k, $10k, even $100 can be life changing money when you can't afford rent or food, and the idea of "it's okay, you'll be able to make more than that a year from now" is pretty meaningless if you don't have the means to comfortably survive the next 12 months.

It's not a coincidence that Lance Thomas thought he could take a $97k loan. It's not a coincidence that Carter and Williamson have been mentioned in these probes. It's because the shoe companies are working for Duke, just like they are for Kansas, Arizona, Louisville, UNC, Kentucky, and others. That's just the way this sport operates, and any argument otherwise is ridiculously, preposterously, out-of-this-world naive.

[ducs]

I don't know what MU's record is against Duke while Coach K has been coach.  All time we are W 2, L 6. 
I do remember one game MU beat Duke with the three Amigos and Ousman Barro.  DJ was head and shoulders above the Duke PG that had the Greek name.  Ooze I believe also had a huge game to propel us to victory.

CBE Classic in KC circa early 2000’s?

[WarriorDad]

And never get involved in a land war in Asia or go against a Sicilian when death is on the line.

Words to live by

[WarriorDad]

Does it, knowing Buzz?

A little bit.  Deane was fired by MU, but came back.  O'Neill eventually would have been fired, he has been fired everywhere and didn't leave on the best circumstances, but came back.

[Galway Eagle]

A little bit.  Deane was fired by MU, but came back.  O'Neill eventually would have been fired, he has been fired everywhere and didn't leave on the best circumstances, but came back.

Comparing things that happened over 20yrs to the most recent coach is not a fair comparison.

[WarriorDad]

Comparing things that happened over 20yrs to the most recent coach is not a fair comparison.

Deane wasn't 20 years ago, but you are probably right.  Maybe emotions still raw.

[WarriorDad]

Didn't Duke self report Lance Thomas situation to NCAA? 

Hard to say who cheats and who doesn't, but if it has been systemically happening at Duke, Kansas, North Carolina and others as some here suggest, then Wojo would have to know.   Unless the suggestion is that coaching staffs are totally in the blind and everything happens behind the scenes.

[brewcity77]

Unless the suggestion is that coaching staffs are totally in the blind and everything happens behind the scenes.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that. I think everyone knows and many either participate or turn a blind eye.

[Galway Eagle]

Deane wasn't 20 years ago, but you are probably right.  Maybe emotions still raw.

Ok 19yrs ago and 17 at the time. Still I'd say the 10yrs was enough for almost every rational MU fan to heal from Crean let alone O'Neil and for Deane to admit his shortcomings, for Buzz it was two and a half years, even for all his success we were still dealing with the rebuild he forced on us and it wouldn't have been as good. Maybe when he's retired he'll do a Buzz documentary and he'll give us his thoughts.

[WarriorDad]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that. I think everyone knows and many either participate or turn a blind eye.

Everyone seems to know a lot about all kinds of things, but doesn't make them true.  Accusations run wild these days.

[brewcity77]

Everyone seems to know a lot about all kinds of things, but doesn't make them true.  Accusations run wild these days.

Accusations are running wild because there's evidence that has cases in federal court. Don't be so deliberately obtuse. Anyone saying the coaches don't know is choosing stupidity.

[Cheeks]

The level of irony in this comment is atmospheric. Of course Duke cheats. Same with Kentucky. They cheat, everyone knows it, but you'll never catch K or Cal holding a bag.

The idea that a big brand or big name coach precludes cheating is mind-numbingly stupid in the wake of what's come out with Kansas & Self, Arizona & Miller, & Louisville & Pitino.

And the idea that $100k isn't a big sum because these guys will be worth more in three NBA, also incredibly stupid. It screams of a person that has never had to struggle for finances a day in their life. $100k, $10k, even $100 can be life changing money when you can't afford rent or food, and the idea of "it's okay, you'll be able to make more than that a year from now" is pretty meaningless if you don't have the means to comfortably survive the next 12 months.

It's not a coincidence that Lance Thomas thought he could take a $97k loan. It's not a coincidence that Carter and Williamson have been mentioned in these probes. It's because the shoe companies are working for Duke, just like they are for Kansas, Arizona, Louisville, UNC, Kentucky, and others. That's just the way this sport operates, and any argument otherwise is ridiculously, preposterously, out-of-this-world naive.

$100k is a big sum of money.  Don’t pretend to know what my upbringing was like or my situation.  Lived in third world countries, seen a lot.  My point is a lot larger amount awaits him and he absolutely has an insurance policy that if he was hurt tomorrow he will be fine.

When I read things like everybody knows they are all cheating, ok define the cheating.  Why isn’t someone like NC State or Wake who share a state doing everything they can to expose them?

I’m not naive to cheating that goes on, but it doesn’t mean they are all doing it or doing what some are implying.

[cheebs09]

$100k is a big sum of money.  Don’t pretend to know what my upbringing was like or my situation.  Lived in third world countries, seen a lot.  My point is a lot larger amount awaits him and he absolutely has an insurance policy that if he was hurt tomorrow he will be fine.

When I read things like everybody knows they are all cheating, ok define the cheating.  Why isn’t someone like NC State or Wake who share a state doing everything they can to expose them?

I’m not naive to cheating that goes on, but it doesn’t mean they are all doing it or doing what some are implying.

What happened to Bruce Pearl is probably one reason more don’t speak up. I’m sure most programs are floating in a grey area, so don’t want to throw stones when someone may expose them.

[Goose]

Chico’s
I give you credit for continuing discussions with folks “know” more than you do. I love when someone makes a reference about someone’s upbringing or counts other folks money. Minute I see that, I know everything I need to know about that person and what they stand for.
JD, you were missed by this guy. Keep up educating some of these folks.

[brewcity77]

$100k is a big sum of money.  Don’t pretend to know what my upbringing was like or my situation.  Lived in third world countries, seen a lot.  My point is a lot larger amount awaits him and he absolutely has an insurance policy that if he was hurt tomorrow he will be fine.

And that's a dumb take. An insurance policy doesn't give you any money now. The whole point is not waiting for an endorsement or contract or injury.

When I read things like everybody knows they are all cheating, ok define the cheating.  Why isn’t someone like NC State or Wake who share a state doing everything they can to expose them?

NC State? You're kidding, right? Have you heard of Dennis Smith?

It's because as has been detailed repeatedly, it's the shoe companies making payments. The coaches may feign ignorance when it benefits them, but that's just the way the sport operates.

I’m not naive to cheating that goes on, but it doesn’t mean they are all doing it or doing what some are implying.

No, but obviously the shoe companies are propping up the biggest programs. The idea that millions of dollars are flying around and Duke & Kentucky pull in the top recruiting classes every year and aren't benefiting is insane.

Not everyone, but if you look at the documents that have been released, it's far more widespread than people ever expected.

[Goose]

Brew
Do you thinking cheating happened at MU in the last ten years? My gut says that you think everyone cheats EXCEPT MU. Chico’s gets bashed for the show dropping on Buzz and everyone mocks him. He says that Duke does not need to cheat and you mock him. Try and read the message and ignore who wrote it. Who knows, you might learn something.

[wadesworld]

$100k is a big sum of money.  Don’t pretend to know what my upbringing was like or my situation.  Lived in third world countries, seen a lot.  My point is a lot larger amount awaits him and he absolutely has an insurance policy that if he was hurt tomorrow he will be fine.

When I read things like everybody knows they are all cheating, ok define the cheating.  Why isn’t someone like NC State or Wake who share a state doing everything they can to expose them?

I’m not naive to cheating that goes on, but it doesn’t mean they are all doing it or doing what some are implying.

Ask Dennis Smith Jr. why NCState might not want to shout atop the mountain top about Duke cheating...

[wadesworld]

Chico’s
I give you credit for continuing discussions with folks “know” more than you do. I love when someone makes a reference about someone’s upbringing or counts other folks money. Minute I see that, I know everything I need to know about that person and what they stand for.
JD, you were missed by this guy. Keep up educating some of these folks.

🤔

[brewcity77]

Brew
Do you thinking cheating happened at MU in the last ten years? My gut says that you think everyone cheats EXCEPT MU.

Your gut is wrong. I find it unlikely we haven't benefited at times from shoe company connections. That said, I do know of kids we stopped recruiting specifically because they asked for money. Players that continued to be recruited by the school west of us.

But no, as arguably the premier Jordan Brand school in the Big East, I think it's most likely we did benefit and our coaches looked the other way. Because that's just how this business works.

[Goose]

Brew
Did you think MU cheated in last ten years or just benefited?

[brewcity77]

Brew
Did you think MU cheated in last ten years or just benefited?

I think the majority of programs benefited. It seems like the companies do what they do and the coaches pretend to not know. Similar to the Self recordings. I would put us in that camp.

I'm sure others would disagree, but if any of our head coaches were directly involved, the least likely one would be Buzz.

[Cheeks]

So did Duke/Coach K just not want that type of class before the past 5 or so seasons or...?

What changed?

The entire basketball work changed.  One and dones at high rate of volume.  You know this already. 

[Cheeks]

Lenny
I ended up becoming a big Buzz guy and I believe Chico’s is 100% correct on the other shoe(s) dropping. Just because shoes did not drop, does not mean that they do not exist. Quite possibly those shoes are the exact reason why Buzz is no longer here.

Worked out for everyone as far as i’m concerned.

[Archies Bat]

Worked out for everyone as far as i’m concerned.

.