Fire Gard

[TSmith34, Inc.]

An example presenting playing in the NBA of the talent Buzz left behind...
https://newsok.com/gallery/articleid/5615945

I told Wojo at the time* that killing Deonte's mother would be a bad move and cause him to have to leave Milwaukee, but he just wouldn't listen.




*Just as trues as MUFINY and Ners pretend inside information

[LoudMouth]

I told Wojo at the time* that killing Deonte's mother would be a bad move and cause him to have to leave Milwaukee, but he just wouldn't listen.

I thought that was a recruiting violation...shhh we needs to keep this under wraps

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yes.

21 Jump Street eh?

I am always amazed by how connected some Scoopers are. Well just as you advise us not take everything you heard at face value I would advise you to take your own advice. I'm sure Tim Maymon had some great stories about what Buzz was saying and doing during practice. Also keep in mind that Deonte has come out that he struggles with depression. A lot easier for a kid to tell his friends that he's mad about playing time then it is to admit that he's struggling with a mental illness. It's also possible for both to be true. In the grand scheme of things, I'm going to guess that mother's death and mental illness are a little more impactful.

All that being said, the original point still stands. Wojo had little to no chance of keeping Deonte, nor should he have kept him. From Deonte himself he said the move was the best thing for him.

EDIT: Wait a minute, I remember this now. Was the "Friend of Deonte" you mentioned that old scooper who claimed to be Dawson's uncle or something like that?

[jesmu84]

21 Jump Street eh?

I am always amazed by how connected some Scoopers are. Well just as you advise us not take everything you heard at face value I would advise you to take your own advice. I'm sure Tim Maymon had some great stories about what Buzz was saying and doing during practice. Also keep in mind that Deonte has come out that he struggles with depression. A lot easier for a kid to tell his friends that he's mad about playing time then it is to admit that he's struggling with a mental illness. It's also possible for both to be true. In the grand scheme of things, I'm going to guess that mother's death and mental illness are a little more impactful.

All that being said, the original point still stands. Wojo had little to no chance of keeping Deonte, nor should he have kept him. From Deonte himself he said the move was the best thing for him.

EDIT: Wait a minute, I remember this now. Was the "Friend of Deonte" you mentioned that old scooper who claimed to be Dawson's uncle or something like that?

Isn't that Tex/mufny/Herman?

[Floorslapper]

21 Jump Street eh?

I am always amazed by how connected some Scoopers are. Well just as you advise us not take everything you heard at face value I would advise you to take your own advice. I'm sure Tim Maymon had some great stories about what Buzz was saying and doing during practice. Also keep in mind that Deonte has come out that he struggles with depression. A lot easier for a kid to tell his friends that he's mad about playing time then it is to admit that he's struggling with a mental illness. It's also possible for both to be true. In the grand scheme of things, I'm going to guess that mother's death and mental illness are a little more impactful.

All that being said, the original point still stands. Wojo had little to no chance of keeping Deonte, nor should he have kept him. From Deonte himself he said the move was the best thing for him.

EDIT: Wait a minute, I remember this now. Was the "Friend of Deonte" you mentioned that old scooper who claimed to be Dawson's uncle or something like that?

You do realize you act as if you are the most connected person on Scoop?  You do realize some players and their families browse this board, correct?  You do realize users can PM information here and share identities that then get verified outside of Scoop on social media sites, and dialogue continues?

To answer your question:  There have been multiple posters here with direct ties/relationships with multiple players that I've developed friendships with over the past 8 years I've participated here. 

End of the day, Wojo was an idiot for not making Deonte the focal point of his first squad at MU -  most objective posters here would agree. It was the primary factor that caused him to transfer.  Yet I understand in the eyes of you and Wojo's most patient supporters - Wojo makes NO mistakes - and therefore putting Deonte on the bench 23+ minutes ON AVERAGE had zero bearing on him leaving. 

[JakeBarnes]

You do realize you act as if you are the most connected person on Scoop?  You do realize some players and their families browse this board, correct?  You do realize users can PM information here and share identities that then get verified outside of Scoop on social media sites, and dialogue continues?

To answer your question:  There have been multiple posters here with direct ties/relationships with multiple players that I've developed friendships with over the past 8 years I've participated here. 

End of the day, Wojo was an idiot for not making Deonte the focal point of his first squad at MU -  most objective posters here would agree. It was the primary factor that caused him to transfer.  Yet I understand in the eyes of you and Wojo's most patient supporters - Wojo makes NO mistakes - and therefore putting Deonte on the bench 23+ minutes ON AVERAGE had zero bearing on him leaving.

The real thing is...I'm the most connected. #iamthesource

[jesmu84]

You do realize you act as if you are the most connected person on Scoop?  You do realize some players and their families browse this board, correct?  You do realize users can PM information here and share identities that then get verified outside of Scoop on social media sites, and dialogue continues?

To answer your question:  There have been multiple posters here with direct ties/relationships with multiple players that I've developed friendships with over the past 8 years I've participated here. 

End of the day, Wojo was an idiot for not making Deonte the focal point of his first squad at MU -  most objective posters here would agree. It was the primary factor that caused him to transfer.  Yet I understand in the eyes of you and Wojo's most patient supporters - Wojo makes NO mistakes - and therefore putting Deonte on the bench 23+ minutes ON AVERAGE had zero bearing on him leaving.

Your ridiculous hyperbole undermines the majority of your arguments

[Floorslapper]

Your ridiculous hyperbole undermines the majority of your arguments

Well - Still waiting for Wades to utter just one critical statement regarding Wojo's performance.  There's a handful of others in the shrinking faction, but at least shrinking. 

Respect to Sultan, Brew and Tower for their objectivity and modifying their positions over the course of last year/this season.

[Floorslapper]

Just remember that "NEVER" was a grand total of eight games.

As regarding your predictions, is Dirk still quaking in his high-tops at the thought of guarding Davonte Gardner?  But seriously, a number of people said that he would get a good look by an NBA team but had to improve his shot to stick.

Haha.  Fair Sultan.  Let's provide some context around that statement (just as I did the other day about Dawson - saying he made some Magic Johnson-esque passes - NOT that he would become Magic Dawson.)

With Davante, the topic was if he could make the NBA.  It was put forth, he couldn't because who could he guard - such as a Dirk.  I said fair, but Dirk couldn't handle him in the post either.  (That aside I did think Davante had a chance to make the league - I was wrong.)

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

You do realize you act as if you are the most connected person on Scoop?  You do realize some players and their families browse this board, correct?  You do realize users can PM information here and share identities that then get verified outside of Scoop on social media sites, and dialogue continues?

To answer your question:  There have been multiple posters here with direct ties/relationships with multiple players that I've developed friendships with over the past 8 years I've participated here. 

End of the day, Wojo was an idiot for not making Deonte the focal point of his first squad at MU -  most objective posters here would agree. It was the primary factor that caused him to transfer.  Yet I understand in the eyes of you and Wojo's most patient supporters - Wojo makes NO mistakes - and therefore putting Deonte on the bench 23+ minutes ON AVERAGE had zero bearing on him leaving.

So it was the old scooper claiming to be Dawson's uncle. I wasn't aware that I come off like I am connected, certainly not my intent. I have no connections. I am some bum who lives in Texas who loves Marquette basketball a little too much.

Who said Deonte coming off the bench had zero bearing on him leaving? I'm sure he wanted to play more, all players do, but I believe he would have left regardless. More importantly, it was the right thing for Deonte. While it sucks for the program the move seems like it really helped him.

I think Wojo makes tons of mistakes and I point them out when I notice them. I also expect mistakes so I tend to not lose it when they happen. You don't have to resort to calling Wojo an idiot. He's not. He's a lot smarter than either you or I when it comes to basketball. You also don't have to resort to hyperbole. You have good opinions, don't undermine them.

The funny thing is, if all you said was, Deonte needed more minutes I would agree (not knowing anything that was going on in practice and off the court).

[brewcity77]

End of the day, Wojo was an idiot for not making Deonte the focal point of his first squad at MU -  most objective posters here would agree. It was the primary factor that caused him to transfer.  Yet I understand in the eyes of you and Wojo's most patient supporters - Wojo makes NO mistakes - and therefore putting Deonte on the bench 23+ minutes ON AVERAGE had zero bearing on him leaving.

I don't think most objective posters would agree. I think a small minority of non-objective posters like yourself would agree. You cornered yourself on the Burton/Dawson position early on and can no longer look at it objectively. Deonte was turning it over a ton and struggling mightily on defense. And as disastrous as that UNO game was, that bad team hung in with Michigan State and Wisconsin while Burton was still here.

I'm not saying Wojo never made mistakes, but the situation with Burton's mom led to his departure. He has said so repeatedly. It was what was best for the kid. That team wasn't going to the NCAAs with or without Burton. I get that Burton had flashes as a freshman for Buzz, but for Wojo in games against good teams, he was either bad on both ends or his offense wasn't good enough to offset his defense. He wasn't Rowsey.

And now that it's three years later and Burton's career is over, it's probably time to move on. We have more than enough concerns with the 2018-19 team. No need to belabor what wouldn't have been in 2014-15.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

And now that it's three years later and Burton's career is over, it's probably time to move on. We have more than enough concerns with the 2018-19 team. No need to belabor what wouldn't have been in 2014-15.

Annnnnnddddd, good luck with that.

[wadesworld]

Ners does seem like the kind of guy that would slide into some "hot girl's" Instagram DMs and find himself in a sticky situation.  Sounds like the Scoop equivalent of that has happened to him more than once.

[Galway Eagle]

Maybe taking DDDawson and Nevada's words for it isn't the best idea. Given that they initially claimed we were all sleeping on an underrated future NBA player.

[burger]

I am very comfortable as a MU fan giving Gard a lifetime extension......

Just eliminated 70% of the recruits in Wisconsin.....

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

Ners does seem like the kind of guy that would slide into some "hot girl's" Instagram DMs and find himself in a sticky situation.  Sounds like the Scoop equivalent of that has happened to him more than once.

Gotta do something, ran out of females in attendance for the fabled rec center performances long ago.

[Floorslapper]

I don't think most objective posters would agree. I think a small minority of non-objective posters like yourself would agree. You cornered yourself on the Burton/Dawson position early on and can no longer look at it objectively. Deonte was turning it over a ton and struggling mightily on defense. And as disastrous as that UNO game was, that bad team hung in with Michigan State and Wisconsin while Burton was still here.

I'm not saying Wojo never made mistakes, but the situation with Burton's mom led to his departure. He has said so repeatedly. It was what was best for the kid. That team wasn't going to the NCAAs with or without Burton. I get that Burton had flashes as a freshman for Buzz, but for Wojo in games against good teams, he was either bad on both ends or his offense wasn't good enough to offset his defense. He wasn't Rowsey.

And now that it's three years later and Burton's career is over, it's probably time to move on. We have more than enough concerns with the 2018-19 team. No need to belabor what wouldn't have been in 2014-15.

Not too concerned about your take here Brew - after all you thought we'd be better off with Derrick Wilson at PG than Junior Cadougan.

So Burton is in the NBA and Dawson plays in the G-League.  Yep.  I definitely cornered myself early on suggesting those two could play. 

[BM1090]

Not too concerned about your take here Brew - after all you thought we'd be better off with Derrick Wilson at PG than Junior Cadougan.

So Burton is in the NBA and Dawson plays in the G-League.  Yep.  I definitely cornered myself early on suggesting those two could play.

You know who else played in the G league? Derrick Wilson.

[brewcity77]

Not too concerned about your take here Brew - after all you thought we'd be better off with Derrick Wilson at PG than Junior Cadougan.

So Burton is in the NBA and Dawson plays in the G-League.  Yep.  I definitely cornered myself early on suggesting those two could play.

You obviously did. Being objective means being able to look at things through a neutral lens and being able to reconsider your opinions based on new information. Despite new information about Burton's departure, you are still beating this same stupid drum 3 years later. Despite new information like seeing how Dawson was a below average player in one of the 10 worst leagues in the country during his two years there you are still arguing he should have been a contributor here despite two coaches clearly not seeing that in his play.

You mentioned me changing my opinion on Wojo. I'm still waiting before a final judgment, but I'm troubled by the trends I've seen continue into this year. I want to be right about him succeeding with this team, but am willing to accept the alternative. You, on the other hand, have no such ability to be objective. This continued discussion only proves it further.

[skianth16]

Deonte is pure class.  He wasn't going to publicly throw Wojo under the bus.  Most kids don't when they transfer out.

Deonte had major expectations going into his sophomore year, and thought he was going to be a focal point.

I've assumed this the whole time. I'm not sure this is necessarily proof of why he left, but it does make sense. Obviously there is a ton of PR at this level of basketball, and it's rare to hear the full story of why a kid or a coach leaves a program.

We know guys transfer in today's college game, but mid-season transfers are much more rare. If Wojo had lost 1 guy mid-season, I may buy the PR fluff that comes out when the decision is made. But he's lost 3 or 4 guys now, right? Maybe there have been several very unique events that led to a mid-season decision. But what seems more likely is that something was off about the way Wojo was dealing with these guys.

I'm surprised at the way many posters here openly accept the PR story when a player leaves but are so willing to question the story when Buzz left. Maybe it's just because we know more about what was going on with Buzz. Or maybe it's easier to assume an adult isn't telling the whole truth while not wanting to question the motivations of young men. Regardless, the same department is working with the same PR team to craft the messages about both coaches and players.

[Floorslapper]

Ners does seem like the kind of guy that would slide into some "hot girl's" Instagram DMs and find himself in a sticky situation.  Sounds like the Scoop equivalent of that has happened to him more than once.

This is the kind of post that happens when one has been repeatedly owned here.

#respecttheprocess. 

[Floorslapper]

You know who else played in the G league? Derrick Wilson.

Wrong.  Drafted.  Cut.  Never played a minute. 

[GGGG]

I've assumed this the whole time. I'm not sure this is necessarily proof of why he left, but it does make sense. Obviously there is a ton of PR at this level of basketball, and it's rare to hear the full story of why a kid or a coach leaves a program.

We know guys transfer in today's college game, but mid-season transfers are much more rare. If Wojo had lost 1 guy mid-season, I may buy the PR fluff that comes out when the decision is made. But he's lost 3 or 4 guys now, right? Maybe there have been several very unique events that led to a mid-season decision. But what seems more likely is that something was off about the way Wojo was dealing with these guys.

I'm surprised at the way many posters here openly accept the PR story when a player leaves but are so willing to question the story when Buzz left. Maybe it's just because we know more about what was going on with Buzz. Or maybe it's easier to assume an adult isn't telling the whole truth while not wanting to question the motivations of young men. Regardless, the same department is working with the same PR team to craft the messages about both coaches and players.

I tend to believe that the the reasons players leave are complex and not as simple as some would portray it.  A lot of people who I trust more than Ners have said that the primary issue was him needed a fresh start after his mother died.    If he started those eight games instead of coming off the bench, would he have stayed?  I mean it may have helped, but I think it is very doubtful that he would have been here in the end.

[BM1090]

Wrong.  Drafted.  Cut.  Never played a minute.

My mistake. I should have said "was on a G League roster"

Only you could find a way to validate your opinion because a player has averaged 4 points, 1.8 rebounds and 1 assist per game while shooting 38% from the field in 42 games in the G league.

[skianth16]

I tend to believe that the the reasons players leave are complex and not as simple as some would portray it.  A lot of people who I trust more than Ners have said that the primary issue was him needed a fresh start after his mother died.    If he started those eight games instead of coming off the bench, would he have stayed?  I mean it may have helped, but I think it is very doubtful that he would have been here in the end.

It's very possible that Deonte's decision was primarily because of his mother's passing. But that only explains one of Wojo's 4 mid-season transfers, and that's the bigger concern to me. Maybe Deonte leaves due to a very legitimate non-basketball reason and then that plants a seed in the head of others, creating an ugly domino effect. Could be. I won't rule that out.

But then again, you know the old saying "where there's smoke, there's fire?" Could also very well be true here.