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Author Topic: Millennial Non-Voters  (Read 21400 times)

Benny B

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2018, 09:52:35 AM »
3. Sounds to me as if you're assuming that a single-income family would mean mom stays home and dad works ... so who's the one subscribing to archaic ideas about gender roles here?

Oooohhh, nice one.  Hang on, I got one for you...

“When you point your finger at someone else, there’s always three fingers pointing back at you.”


Aside: Out of respect for the contest, would you be willing to agree that “I know you are but what am I” and all “your momma...” cracks are off-limits?
Wow, I'm very concerned for Benny.  Being able to mimic Myron Medcalf's writing so closely implies an oncoming case of dementia.

Pakuni

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2018, 10:04:13 AM »
Oooohhh, nice one.  Hang on, I got one for you...

“When you point your finger at someone else, there’s always three fingers pointing back at you.”


Aside: Out of respect for the contest, would you be willing to agree that “I know you are but what am I” and all “your momma...” cracks are off-limits?

I've come to expect better from you, Benny. I'll assume you were out late last night and not at your sharpest.

vogue65

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #27 on: November 03, 2018, 10:26:02 AM »
I don't have a cell phone, what does that make me?  I have Sirius radio and a tablet, but don't do  many Apps..
I play an acoustic piano not digital, I drive a small fast car, what does that make me?  I would never use Uber.
My point is that with maturity come discernment.  The young folks are susceptible to fads and nearly everything is a fad.

Juan Anderson's Mixtape

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2018, 10:45:49 AM »
I don't have a cell phone, what does that make me?  I have Sirius radio and a tablet, but don't do  many Apps..
I play an acoustic piano not digital, I drive a small fast car, what does that make me?  I would never use Uber.
My point is that with maturity come discernment.  The young folks are susceptible to fads and nearly everything is a fad.

In other words, old people are resistant to change.

I don't say that as a good or bad thing, but it tends to be true across the primate world.  There are studies in which young chimps and gorillas learn to do new things better than older members of their species.

brewcity77

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #29 on: November 03, 2018, 10:46:11 AM »
1. Wasn't intended as a swipe. In fact, I noted that it's often necessary.
2. That said, while some families truly need a second income due to the rising costs of education, health care and the like, it's also worth noting that we spend far more today on discretionary items (entertainment, vacations, etc.) than prior generations. And while the size of our families is, on average, smaller, the size of our homes is 1,000-sq-feet larger than they were a couple of generations ago.
3. Sounds to me as if you're assuming that a single-income family would mean mom stays home and dad works ... so who's the one subscribing to archaic ideas about gender roles here?

Another factor involved is the division of families. Grandparents retire & move away, parents move for jobs, & divorces spread families even more thin. The old system of grandparents, parents, & kids living in close proximity often doesn't exist like it once did. Because of that, modern parents are "on their own" more than they may have in the past.

It's anecdotal, so maybe this isn't a fair comparison, but when my niece was raised, my sister was a working single mom. But both of my parents were around, I was a teenager able to help out, & we had other family nearby that could help when needed. My wife & I don't have nearly as much of that as my parents retired 1,000 miles away, my sister & niece moved away, & my wife's only surviving parent is an hour away.

I understand how easy it is to put a kid in front of a screen. I do as much as I can to avoid it, but when I have to prepare dinner, 20-30 minutes of Sesame Street to prevent a crying baby can do a lot to help the sanity, & we're more fortunate than many parents because we have schedules flexible enough that one of us is always home.
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vogue65

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2018, 11:45:33 AM »
In other words, old people are resistant to change.

I don't say that as a good or bad thing, but it tends to be true across the primate world.  There are studies in which young chimps and gorillas learn to do new things better than older members of their species.

I have given this subject a lot, probably too much, of thought.  When I was young I did a lot of things simply because they were new things.  Over time most of the fads have worn off. 

What is difficult for me to see is the nature of a fad.  Music is a great example of fads, food habits and drinking is another one.  Look at how "we" old folks dressed in the 60's, please. 

So now we have millenials standing on the corner in the city (NYC) waving their cell phones in the air looking for their Uber.  We have older folks, for the most part, standing on the same corner waving for a Yellow Cab. 

In five or ten  years what will the corner look like?  Rickshaws, Uber cars, Yellow Cabs, moving sidewalks, everyone staying home?  It has nothing to do with age.  Some millenials take Yellow Cabs, some old folks take an Uber to the podiatrist, life is good.






jsglow

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2018, 12:20:34 PM »
Another factor involved is the division of families. Grandparents retire & move away, parents move for jobs, & divorces spread families even more thin. The old system of grandparents, parents, & kids living in close proximity often doesn't exist like it once did. Because of that, modern parents are "on their own" more than they may have in the past.

It's anecdotal, so maybe this isn't a fair comparison, but when my niece was raised, my sister was a working single mom. But both of my parents were around, I was a teenager able to help out, & we had other family nearby that could help when needed. My wife & I don't have nearly as much of that as my parents retired 1,000 miles away, my sister & niece moved away, & my wife's only surviving parent is an hour away.

I understand how easy it is to put a kid in front of a screen. I do as much as I can to avoid it, but when I have to prepare dinner, 20-30 minutes of Sesame Street to prevent a crying baby can do a lot to help the sanity, & we're more fortunate than many parents because we have schedules flexible enough that one of us is always home.

All 100% true brew. Our kids grew up without any family help to speak of.  And of course they watched plenty of Sesame Street and Barney.  But the one lesson they need to learn is that they're not the center of the universe or that their parents solve all of their problems.  It's harder now.  I think back to my youth.  I learned to solve problems in the schoolyard by myself.  Sometimes that involved fists with my very best friends.

I think the very best thing a parent can do these days is insist that their kids play sports.  My kids learned so much from that experience, even though they weren't great athletes.  And there'll be a time when their coach can get through to them better than you can.  All good.

JWags85

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2018, 12:24:02 PM »
I have given this subject a lot, probably too much, of thought.  When I was young I did a lot of things simply because they were new things.  Over time most of the fads have worn off. 

What is difficult for me to see is the nature of a fad.  Music is a great example of fads, food habits and drinking is another one.  Look at how "we" old folks dressed in the 60's, please. 

So now we have millenials standing on the corner in the city (NYC) waving their cell phones in the air looking for their Uber.  We have older folks, for the most part, standing on the same corner waving for a Yellow Cab. 

In five or ten  years what will the corner look like?  Rickshaws, Uber cars, Yellow Cabs, moving sidewalks, everyone staying home?  It has nothing to do with age.  Some millenials take Yellow Cabs, some old folks take an Uber to the podiatrist, life is good.

But its not a specific service or invention.  Food, clothing, trends that are very cyclical with short half life, I agree with (music not so much, but I could see an argument).  Cell phones clearly are not a fad, if you have one or not.  As for Uber, maybe Uber isn't the pre-eminent ride share service, but that method of on-demand transportation is the future, especially with self driving cars.  Its not a "fad" its a shift in transportation technology and economics.  Buggy whip makers probably called cars a fad that impressionable young people fell for.

Also, for the record, as a millennial, I know VERY few, if any of my peer group, with sample sets stretching from NY, Chicago, LA, Milwaukee, Nashville, and all 3 major cities in Ohio that use traditional cabs, short of emergency availability like a rainstorm.  A WILDLY disproportionate amount of "old folks" have adapted to the new "fad" as opposed to younger generations continuing with a way of transportation favored in the past.

WarriorDad

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2018, 01:15:15 PM »
In other words, old people are resistant to change.

I don't say that as a good or bad thing, but it tends to be true across the primate world.  There are studies in which young chimps and gorillas learn to do new things better than older members of their species.

Old people are resistant to some change, not all change.  The advantage we older people have is we have lived life and have many more experiences than you do. That is why people pay for experience, to avoid really stupid dumb things being repeated by inexperienced people.

Change can be great. Change can be bad.  Let's not treat change as if all change is wonderful.  It isn't.
“No one is more hated than he who speaks the truth.”
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brewcity77

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2018, 01:16:55 PM »
I think the very best thing a parent can do these days is insist that their kids play sports.  My kids learned so much from that experience, even though they weren't great athletes.  And there'll be a time when their coach can get through to them better than you can.  All good.

At risk of this becoming a child-rearing thread, I think this is definitely worth a look. As soon as she's old enough, I want to get my daughter involved in public service, whether she wants to or not. Volunteer at soup kitchens, walk shelter dogs, pick up garbage at parks, and anything else we can think of on a regular basis. I want her to understand the importance of service to the community without reward as well as hoping it will teach her to appreciate both her own fortunes and understand those less fortunate.

Thinking about the non-voting aspect of this thread, I wonder how much public service has been passed down from generation to generation. While I didn't do a lot myself as a kid, my father was a volunteer firefighter in our community, a deacon at our church, and my mother spent time beyond her teaching career mentoring and tutoring kids.

Being a voter is a public service. Maybe teaching future generations the importance of other public services could reinforce that while voting may be a right, it is also a duty.
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GGGG

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2018, 01:19:13 PM »
Another factor involved is the division of families. Grandparents retire & move away, parents move for jobs, & divorces spread families even more thin. The old system of grandparents, parents, & kids living in close proximity often doesn't exist like it once did. Because of that, modern parents are "on their own" more than they may have in the past.

It's anecdotal, so maybe this isn't a fair comparison, but when my niece was raised, my sister was a working single mom. But both of my parents were around, I was a teenager able to help out, & we had other family nearby that could help when needed. My wife & I don't have nearly as much of that as my parents retired 1,000 miles away, my sister & niece moved away, & my wife's only surviving parent is an hour away.

I understand how easy it is to put a kid in front of a screen. I do as much as I can to avoid it, but when I have to prepare dinner, 20-30 minutes of Sesame Street to prevent a crying baby can do a lot to help the sanity, & we're more fortunate than many parents because we have schedules flexible enough that one of us is always home.

Is this actually the case?  Are families located further apart than they were a generation or two ago?

brewcity77

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2018, 01:32:26 PM »
Is this actually the case?  Are families located further apart than they were a generation or two ago?

In my case, yes. As I said, it's anecdotal for me, but entire communities have grown in places like Florida and Arizona from mostly migrating retired boomers. The Villages in Florida is a great example; when my aunt & uncle moved there 20 or so years ago, it was just a few hundred homes, now it boasts over 125,000 residents. We hear constantly about millennials migrating to cities for work, especially from rural areas.

I'd love to see research done on the topic, and it's entirely possible my experience compared to my sister's from 30 years ago is unique, but I do think the rapid growth of retirement communities (usually out-of-state transplants) and the shift of the younger generation from rural to urban areas due to a lack of jobs is a very real thing.

Maybe it's always been the case, but I think the combination of increased retirement wealth of the 60+ generations along with automation & big box retail that has shrunk job opportunities in rural America are very real things and those consequences will almost certainly be felt on new families.
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WarriorDad

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2018, 01:35:27 PM »
At risk of this becoming a child-rearing thread, I think this is definitely worth a look. As soon as she's old enough, I want to get my daughter involved in public service, whether she wants to or not. Volunteer at soup kitchens, walk shelter dogs, pick up garbage at parks, and anything else we can think of on a regular basis. I want her to understand the importance of service to the community without reward as well as hoping it will teach her to appreciate both her own fortunes and understand those less fortunate.

Thinking about the non-voting aspect of this thread, I wonder how much public service has been passed down from generation to generation. While I didn't do a lot myself as a kid, my father was a volunteer firefighter in our community, a deacon at our church, and my mother spent time beyond her teaching career mentoring and tutoring kids.

Being a voter is a public service. Maybe teaching future generations the importance of other public services could reinforce that while voting may be a right, it is also a duty.

It takes a village some would say.  I love the idea of mandatory public service (military, peace corps, or stateside programs).  I will say that participating in these service programs does a couple of things.  Opens the eyes to man's plight and those truly oppressed.  Also opens the eyes to the waste and corruption by some agencies, too.  I've come away from some furious at times, and other times feeling positive about mankind. 
“No one is more hated than he who speaks the truth.”
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Juan Anderson's Mixtape

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2018, 02:23:34 PM »
Old people are resistant to some change, not all change.

My comment was a generalization,  not a universal truth.  But I can see how one can infer otherwise.   Management regrets the error.


Change can be great. Change can be bad.  Let's not treat change as if all change is wonderful.  It isn't.

Which is why I said


I don't say that as a good or bad thing

Please don't falsely represent what I said in the future.

mu_hilltopper

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #39 on: November 04, 2018, 09:32:31 AM »
Is this actually the case?  Are families located further apart than they were a generation or two ago?

I did some googling but couldn't come up with an answer on family geographic mobility (in the time it took to eat a Beef n Cheddar.)

I can certainly say in my/wife's family, there's been a pattern for 25 years:  Kids go to college then graduate and stay or move to entirely different locations, leaving the older generation in their home state.   ~80% of our cousins do not live in the same US state as their parents.

I imagine this applies 10x to kids on the college track versus not, though, so not sure what the average would be.

mu03eng

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #40 on: November 04, 2018, 04:25:06 PM »
Anecdotal to be sure, but other than my MiL no one is within 45 minutes of us. Same is true with everyone I went to MU with that I'm still tight with (though a good portion of those are military/ex-military so that may not count)
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buckchuckler

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #41 on: November 04, 2018, 07:42:07 PM »


Please don't falsely represent what I said in the future.

Uhhhhh, if that is your desire, you should probably stay off the internet. 

dgies9156

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #42 on: November 04, 2018, 10:29:00 PM »
One of the things I find interesting this year is the concept of "branding." I have been traveling back and forth between Illinois and Florida and the same commercials -- new names -- are running in both places. I'm troubled by the ad hominum fallacies, the scare mongering and the lack of any substance in campaigns in either state.

It's so bad even Eric Zorn, an acknowledged liberal, seemed objective, unbiased and very clear in his column today.

Still, I voted. Did it Friday because I'll be in Wisconsin Tuesday.

MU Fan in Connecticut

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #43 on: November 05, 2018, 09:39:00 AM »

MU82

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #44 on: November 05, 2018, 10:16:43 AM »
I have stayed off this thread until now because I abhor any political discussion on Scoop and will never take part in it.  8-)

Seriously, I'll wait to see what the demographics show from this election. Anecdotal evidence is that Millennials have finally been riled up enough to vote, but I'll be interested in seeing the actual post-election numbers.
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MUBurrow

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #45 on: November 05, 2018, 10:35:28 AM »
Maybe I missed it earlier in the thread, but do millenials vote less than young people in years past? For example, over the past handful of elections, has a smaller percentage of the 18-35 age group voted than in the 70s, 80s or 90s?

jesmu84

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #46 on: November 05, 2018, 11:57:00 AM »
I have stayed off this thread until now because I abhor any political discussion on Scoop and will never take part in it.  8-)

Seriously, I'll wait to see what the demographics show from this election. Anecdotal evidence is that Millennials have finally been riled up enough to vote, but I'll be interested in seeing the actual post-election numbers.

But with gerrymandering and voter suppression (such as in Georgia), unlikely to make a significant change on results.

MU82

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #47 on: November 05, 2018, 11:59:26 AM »
But with gerrymandering and voter suppression (such as in Georgia), unlikely to make a significant change on results.

That will be true in many states, including (sadly) the corrupt state in which I live, but we'll still get raw voting numbers as to how many Millennials actually voted, which is what this thread is about.
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mikekinsellaMVP

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #48 on: November 05, 2018, 12:25:16 PM »
But with gerrymandering and voter suppression (such as in Georgia), unlikely to make a significant change on results.

It's been widely reported that many locations have had early voter turnout already exceed total turnout for the 2014 midterms.  I think the demographic information for early voting this year could be fascinating, and probably has a ton of value to candidates/parties in how they conduct their campaigns in the future.  Objectively, I wonder if a lot of early voters have been those worried about potential disenfranchisement giving themselves extra time in case there's an issue the first time they show up to the polls.

Billy Hoyle

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Re: Millennial Non-Voters
« Reply #49 on: November 05, 2018, 12:52:27 PM »
Vehemently disagree, Citizens United while extremely frustrating is largely an excuse for people to not engage in the process "why should I vote/volunteer/make a difference, the corporate money is just gonna box me out." Further it is symptomatic of(not the cause of) the nationalization of our politics, which I think is calamitous to our political discourse.

Prime example, in state senate and representative races in southeastern Wisconsin the far and away #1 issue being thrown at each candidate is around pre-existing medical conditions. Practically speaking (regardless of position) what impact can a state rep have on pre-existing coverage? Sure, it's worth to have a position on, but why is it the #1 issue to the exclusion of almost everything at that level of political office?

Lastly, every younger generation has been "disillusioned" by the older generation....this isn't some strange new phenomenon that impacts only millennials.

The problem though is that you are voting for a party, not an individual who will represent you and your district. Those who go "off the reservation" are primaried. That's also where Citizens United comes in. Once a rep or senator votes against the party line the money flows to an opponent who will vote party line.  It's no longer about representing individuals, it's about representing the parties, special interests and benefactors. Then you have unqualified sycophants put into cabinet positions and you get people saying "what does it matter?"

It's sad though. People died for the right to vote.  One party is currently doing all they can to prevent many of those groups from voting - they brag that lower turnout means victory for htem.  Exercise your right!
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