Good for UW-Madison - free tuition

[jesmu84]

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/373110-university-of-wisconsin-madison-to-offer-free-tuition-for

[muwarrior69]

So if a family makes 56000.01 they're SOL.

[MUEng92]

So if a family makes 56000.01 they're SOL.

Exactly what I said when I read that headline.  Seems illogical to me.  I don't usually get hung up on things having to be absolutely fair (except on a basketball court that my team is playing on), but this seems really unfair.  Are people going to go into their HR departments and ask for a pay cut?

[mu03eng]

Exactly what I said when I read that headline.  Seems illogical to me.  I don't usually get hung up on things having to be absolutely fair (except on a basketball court that my team is playing on), but this seems really unfair.  Are people going to go into their HR departments and ask for a pay cut?

Had a friend in high school who's parents were close enough to retirement that they could afford to do so and as a such had zero income and so he got a free ride to Notre Dame (obviously we aren't friends any more). When you give away stuff for some but not all there will always be inequities and/or ways to game the system.

[mu_hilltopper]

What's amazing is this program will cost $3.3m .. it's a pittance.

UW-Madison's budget is $3b.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

So if a family makes 56000.01 they're SOL.

There is still needs-based financial aid one would presume, I doubt it goes from zero tuition to full tuition.

[Benny B]

In other news, UW-Madison announcing they will increase out-of-state admissions quotas by 5,000% for students whose families make under $56,000.

[Shaka Shart]

Is this a sly way to get more walk-ons?

[GGGG]

What's amazing is this program will cost $3.3m .. it's a pittance.

UW-Madison's budget is $3b.

While you are correct, that's not fungible money. 

30% of that is federal financial aid or grants that must be spent for an intended purpose.  (financial aid, research, etc.)

14% are gifts, which are usually restricted in nature but can be more flexible.  In face most of the program is being funded through gifts.

13% are auxiliaries, which is operating revenue that is usually turned back to the function (bookstore, athletics, etc.)  They are using some of this income to fund this.

They have said they aren't using tuition or state revenue, which is about 35% of the budget and pretty flexible.

So yeah to a school like UW-Madison its fairly easy to swing this.  However their budget is must more restrictive than the $3B figure implies.

This is an enormous PR win for the university however.  IMO Chancellor Blank made a big deal of how it impacts rural areas and small communities because they are trying to counter the thought that Madison is an elite, liberal institution that doesn't serve most Wisconsinites.

[mu_hilltopper]

Understood about the funding sources.   

However it's all cut, $3.3m is spent every 9 hours at UW-Madison.  It's small and could be doubled, quadrupled, and it's almost a rounding error.

The first question I'd ask is .. How much would it cost to make the $56k, $66k instead? 

.. Unrelated, what are the procedures for an 18 year old saying, hey, I am my own family unit, I make zero.

[warriorchick]

Exactly what I said when I read that headline.  Seems illogical to me.  I don't usually get hung up on things having to be absolutely fair (except on a basketball court that my team is playing on), but this seems really unfair.  Are people going to go into their HR departments and ask for a pay cut?

My guess is that there will be some moms who will be quitting their part-time jobs.

[mu_hilltopper]

Ha .. good old reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnethicalLifeProTips/comments/7wf1e7/ulpt_if_you_live_in_wisconsin_get_your_parents_to/

[GGGG]

Understood about the funding sources.   

However it's all cut, $3.3m is spent every 9 hours at UW-Madison.  It's small and could be doubled, quadrupled, and it's almost a rounding error.

The first question I'd ask is .. How much would it cost to make the $56k, $66k instead? 

.. Unrelated, what are the procedures for an 18 year old saying, hey, I am my own family unit, I make zero.

It's still a business.  They have be responsible.

Anyway, an 18 year old has to meet independence standards for financial aid to be able to do what you are suggesting.  It's very restrictive. 

[GGGG]

My guess is that there will be some moms who will be quitting their part-time jobs.

*parents

[forgetful]

Here is the problem with programs like this, they are great for the students that are able to get into UW, but most kids from families that make less than $56k, have next to no chance of getting in to begin with. 

They don't have access to the necessary resources and environment conducive to getting into the university in the first place. 

That is why it only costs $3.3M for the entire program.  That represents the tuition for 313 students, or less than 1% of the undergraduate enrollment at UW. 

[GGGG]

Here is the problem with programs like this, they are great for the students that are able to get into UW, but most kids from families that make less than $56k, have next to no chance of getting in to begin with. 

They don't have access to the necessary resources and environment conducive to getting into the university in the first place. 

That is why it only costs $3.3M for the entire program.  That represents the tuition for 313 students, or less than 1% of the undergraduate enrollment at UW. 

No it's way more than that.  Remember this program will fund whatever financial aid doesn't fund up to the cost of tuition and fees.  So all grants, scholarships and loans will be applied first.

They estimate about 800 students per class.

[forgetful]

No it's way more than that.  Remember this program will fund whatever financial aid doesn't fund up to the cost of tuition and fees.  So all grants, scholarships and loans will be applied first.

They estimate about 800 students per class.

I was unaware that this covers whatever financial aid does not.   Thank you for the correction.

How do they do that exactly, as this is only for tuition and not room and board?  Do they apply all financial aid to room and board first?

[Benny B]

Ha .. good old reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnethicalLifeProTips/comments/7wf1e7/ulpt_if_you_live_in_wisconsin_get_your_parents_to/

Hilarious... first comment is about how UW is some no-name liberal arts school, and the peanut gallery goes wild. 

[GGGG]

I was unaware that this covers whatever financial aid does not.   Thank you for the correction.

How do they do that exactly, as this is only for tuition and not room and board?  Do they apply all financial aid to room and board first?

I don't know. I just read the statement they put out. Maybe they apply a ratio of some sort?

[forgetful]

I don't know. I just read the statement they put out. Maybe they apply a ratio of some sort?

It looks as if they will assign all financial aid to Tuition, and then just add in a bit extra (average of about $1k per student) to make sure Tuition is free.  Students are still responsible for all of Room and Board and all non-segregated fees.

[muwarrior69]

Here is the problem with programs like this, they are great for the students that are able to get into UW, but most kids from families that make less than $56k, have next to no chance of getting in to begin with. 

They don't have access to the necessary resources and environment conducive to getting into the university in the first place. 

That is why it only costs $3.3M for the entire program.  That represents the tuition for 313 students, or less than 1% of the undergraduate enrollment at UW.

Every kid that goes to public school has the access and resources necessary to go to UW. As to the environment I agree with you. Just because your family makes 56K or less does not mean your too stupid to get into UW.

[forgetful]

Every kid that goes to public school has the access and resources necessary to go to UW. As to the environment I agree with you. Just because your family makes 56K or less does not mean your too stupid to get into UW.

Not true.  Many kids from poor families do not have access to things like the internet, and tutors, and in some cases even textbooks that are essential to completing course material.

They are in competition for a select number of slots, with inferior resources. 

Education, particularly in regards to competition for select universities, is highly dependent on resources outside the school that the majority of lower and even middle class families do not have access to.

[muwarrior69]

Not true.  Many kids from poor families do not have access to things like the internet, and tutors, and in some cases even textbooks that are essential to completing course material.

They are in competition for a select number of slots, with inferior resources. 

Education, particularly in regards to competition for select universities, is highly dependent on resources outside the school that the majority of lower and even middle class families do not have access to.

So you are telling me with all the money we put into public schools they are not educating our kids to be admitted to a "select" public institution such as UW because they don't have textbooks?  Where is the money going?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/06/02/the-states-that-spend-the-most-and-the-least-on-education-in-one-map/?utm_term=.e2b57550e930

[#UnleashSean]

Not true.  Many kids from poor families do not have access to things like the internet, and tutors, and in some cases even textbooks that are essential to completing course material.

They are in competition for a select number of slots, with inferior resources. 

Education, particularly in regards to competition for select universities, is highly dependent on resources outside the school that the majority of lower and even middle class families do not have access to.

Okay are you telling me middle class families don't have access to internet. Come on now.

[GGGG]

So you are telling me with all the money we put into public schools they are not educating our kids to be admitted to a "select" public institution such as UW because they don't have textbooks?  Where is the money going?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/06/02/the-states-that-spend-the-most-and-the-least-on-education-in-one-map/?utm_term=.e2b57550e930

I'm telling you that there is a very strong correlation between family income and standardized test scores.  So yes, the money that we are pouring into public schools isn't leveling the playing field.  It's much more complex than "money."