Rental property

[JD]

Scoop,

I've recently become interested/able to purchase some rental properties.  I was wondering if any of you have any of your own?  Particularly do any of you own rental properties on college campuses?

Reason I ask is there's a property I have my eye on, however I'm not sure if being near MU campus would be a benefit, or a not.  I'd think steady income from students would be great, but what about the other 4 months out of the year?

I appreciate everyone's input.

Thanks

[real chili 83]

Scoop,

I've recently become interested/able to purchase some rental properties.  I was wondering if any of you have any of your own?  Particularly do any of you own rental properties on college campuses?

Reason I ask is there's a property I have my eye on, however I'm not sure if being near MU campus would be a benefit, or a not.  I'd think steady income from students would be great, but what about the other 4 months out of the year?

I appreciate everyone's input.

Thanks

Why 8 months?  Make them sign a year lease.  If I understand correctly, some landlords at MU write leases so that most of the rent is due when students get their student loan payments   They get two large payments twice a year.  Cash flow heaven. 

[warriorchick]

Why 8 months?  Make them sign a year lease.  If I understand correctly, some landlords at MU write leases so that most of the rent is due when students get their student loan payments   They get two large payments twice a year.  Cash flow heaven.

I have never heard of this twice per year arrangement, and I am not sure why anyone would sign it unless some sort of discount were offered.

Also, nearly all of the landlords require full year leases. It is becoming more and more common for students to stay on campus over the summer, so it really is not a big deal.

[dgies9156]

Make sure you do your due diligence before you go too far. The key questions are how much supply of rentals is there (and whether the university is using a lower cost of capital to acquire and subsidize its owned units).

Second, what's the condition of the building? The administration and maintenance headaches of the building can be extreme. What condition is the building in now and how long will it be until major roof, HVAC and plumbing/e;ectrical needs will be met?

Unlike a commercial building, you get turnover every year. Nonetheless, what's the occupancy been during the past three years, how are students being marketed?

Finally, does the building offer amenities? If so, what?

[warriorchick]

Make sure you do your due diligence before you go too far. The key questions are how much supply of rentals is there (and whether the university is using a lower cost of capital to acquire and subsidize its owned units).

There are no plans for the University to acquire or build new apartments in the foreseeable future that has been publicly discussed, so that is not really a factor. They also charge market rates for the units they currently have.

There are several developer/managers that have taken an interest in the Marquette area.  There have been several upscale properties built within the last few years.  At least property owner has knocked down an existing apartment building of theirs to build a bigger, better one.  Another has made arrangements with several sororities and fraternities to build very nice houses for them in exchange for long-term leases.  It is my feeling that Marquette has decided that the private market is doing a more than adequate job of providing apartments for students, so there is no need for them to devote their own capital.

[GGGG]

Many campuses do the twice a year arrangement.  Similar to a residence hall.  But I would mirror what the local market dictates.

And prepare to set aside more than usual for upkeep and repair.

[4everwarriors]

Ya gotta get large 'nough ta have a manager. Utterwise, you bee truckin' over ta 15th and Kilbourn at 2 am to unplug someone's chitter, hey?

[Jay Bee]

Bee deskreet when ur instawlin the cameraz. ZFB kin help, u ain'al?

[brewcity77]

My wife and I have been thinking about it. The Milwaukee Rec Center is running a workshop next month on buying rental properties. Go to this link and search "property":

https://web2.vermontsystems.com/wbwsc/wimilwaukeewt.wsc/search.html

No idea if it's any good, but if you live in the city it's only $8, so seems like little harm. I know a friend who is looking for 2 and 4 families with a small group of investors to try to make a manager viable. I definitely think there's benefits to either buying multiples or teaming up so you can get someone else to do the dirty work.

[jficke13]

If any of you guys end up getting in the landlord tenant game and need help of the... erm.. lawyerly persuasion... I know a guy who can do you a deal. Trust me, landlord tenant afternoons in Milwaukee Small Claims is nowhere you want to be.

[MU82]

asd.lfuawdr87q4mkva/sd fuqawomfa ;er adfm.

Right, 4ever?

[4everwarriors]

Couldn't have said it any better my own self, Nads, hey?

[rocket surgeon]

Ya gotta get large 'nough ta have a manager. Utterwise, you bee truckin' over ta 15th and Kilbourn at 2 am to unplug someone's chitter, hey?

you can say that again-i managed jerry hegarty's building(above his drinkin establishement) for 4 years while in dental school.  the money was great(free rent) but the headaches?  back then, i was young and energetic.  fire extinguisher discharge sucks to clean up.  locked out of apartments, noise, yup that kind of noise too-lots of religious stuff-oh God oh God, etc , vomitus,  i had to look for a person who hadn't been seen in a while-tripped over her body-found her!  got into a fight with a "homeless" guy-those guys can be kinda nasty. 

if you get a good manager-then all that stuff no matta i guess

perk-lloyd walton was a tenant for a while-great guy!

[brewcity77]

you can say that again-i managed jerry hegarty's building(above his drinkin establishement) for 4 years while in dental school.  the money was great(free rent) but the headaches?  back then, i was young and energetic.  fire extinguisher discharge sucks to clean up.  locked out of apartments, noise, yup that kind of noise too-lots of religious stuff-oh God oh God, etc , vomitus,  i had to look for a person who hadn't been seen in a while-tripped over her body-found her!  got into a fight with a "homeless" guy-those guys can be kinda nasty. 

if you get a good manager-then all that stuff no matta i guess

perk-lloyd walton was a tenant for a while-great guy!

Personally, I wouldn't want to have anything to do with college kids. Sure, you'll always have tenants, but you'll also always have headaches. I'd look towards the outskirts of the city. West Allis, Wauwatosa, Bay View, Garden District (NOT Garden Homes neighborhood), Franklin, St. Francis, those types of areas. Likely get a higher quality of tenant, longer-term tenants, and better cared for properties.

[warriorchick]

Personally, I wouldn't want to have anything to do with college kids. Sure, you'll always have tenants, but you'll also always have headaches. I'd look towards the outskirts of the city. West Allis, Wauwatosa, Bay View, Garden District (NOT Garden Homes neighborhood), Franklin, St. Francis, those types of areas. Likely get a higher quality of tenant, longer-term tenants, and better cared for properties.

Speaking as someone who has worked for property management companies, it's a toss-up.  The kids are probably going to leave your property a mess, but there are far fewer collection headaches. Mom and Dad are usually paying the rent. 

And if you think you are going to avoid eviction and property damage hassles by owning in a "nicer" neighborhood, think again.  My brother had to sue a former player for the Tennessee Titans because he caused tens of thousands of dollars in damages to the house he rented to them, as well as several months of unpaid rent.

[jficke13]

[..]  i had to look for a person who hadn't been seen in a while-tripped over her body-found her!  [...]

You found a dead body above Hegarty's?

[jficke13]

Anyway, in all seriousness though, one of my clients is a fairly big management company around SE Wisconsin. You own, they manage the property, find tenants, do maintenance, collect rent, etc., and my firm writes the lease and, if necessary, evicts and collects unpaid rent/damages.

I'm not positive on the arrangement between property owner and manager, but I've heard 1 month's rent is a fairly common rate. In my opinion, it's not a bad deal at all.

I'm happy to give more details if anyone's interested.

[real chili 83]

Anybody rent from Brenda Star?

[4everwarriors]

Rent watt, hey?

[keefe]

I wouldn't mess with college students - I cannot think of a more problematic tenant population.

We bought a few houses on Seattle's eastside which I rent out to Microsoftees. H1B tech workers are well paid, tend not to have kids, and are reluctant to purchase a house for at least three years until they ascertain their long term status in the US.

They are responsible tenants who sign multi-year leases, pay promptly, keep the property clean, and don't bother the neighbors. Unlike college students they don't punch walls, vomit everywhere, have wild ass parties, and leave the kitchens and bathrooms hazmat cleanup sites. 

[keefe]

Rent watt, hey?

Fighter Pilot Life Rule #2 - The Three F Rule:

If it Floats, Flies, or...uh...Fornicates it is cheaper to rent.

[#UnleashSean]

If you want to go the college direction.

A September to may 16th (or whatever date college ends) is one Lots of college students look for. You can charge more per month as they still save in the long run. Then finding students for summer school is also usually easy enough.

The other lease option is the normal full year. Charge a bit less per month but not have to worry about clean and repairs twice a year.

Students can be great and bad. You'll rarely have to deal with payments but have to deal with shitty cleaning and repairs.

[Benny B]

I'm not really an expert in student housing anymore, but it was my daily paycheck for several years... but I will say this, renting to students is very different than renting to families.  Whatever seminar you hear on the radio for making money as a landlord or book you're reading about building wealth in rentals, keep in mind that perhaps 60-80% of what they'll teach you won't be applicable if students are your target market.

In fact, when I talk about SH, I'm talking about the buildings with hundreds of beds... the smaller stuff I refer to as "student rentals."  I make the distinction because institutionally-owned SH is on a completely different plane than the townhomes, duplexes, 4-plexes, etc. on/near campuses.  So even when someone starts talking about how SH is one of the most sought-after product types amongst major real estate investors, understand that they're not talking about student rentals.

The biggest difference between student housing, student rentals and "traditional" rentals: trad rentals go by the apartment, unit, house, etc... the lessee controls everything behind the entry door.  Student housing - by contrast - is almost always rented by the bed, the same way the school rents their own on-campus housing.  SR can be rented by the bed or it can be rented to one student (who then sublets the rest of the space) or the entire house can be rented to the 3, 4, 5+ students that are going to be living there.

As a landlord, intuitively it might make sense to rent to one person and put them on the hook if their friends turn out to be deadbeats, but if the student doesn't have the coin to cover the share(s) of rent from his buddies who dropped out (or decided to go live somewhere cheaper), going after him personally for the entire rent may be a small claims sh|tshow... sure, if his parents have deep pockets, you don't have to chase down the deadbeats, but in most cases it would have been better to simply fill the bed instead of having to evict everyone in the unit.

So as a SR landlord, you need to make the decision as to whether you want less risk or more control.  It's not always an easy decision, and what might seem like the right decision one year might be the wrong decision the next... sometimes you can't be picky as a landlord and have to rent to whoever is willing to sign the lease; other years you'll have so many interested renters that you can run complete background and credit checks.

Last thing I'll say is that just like McDonald's franchisees... landlords will never get rich owning a single rental.  It's not a bad idea to start with one property, but unless you're buying your next property within a few years, you're quickly going to find that there are other places you can get the same growth/income returns on your money without the hassle of being a landlord.

[rocket surgeon]

You found a dead body above Hegarty's?

well around the corner in the old section-yes.  she was one of the last original original tenants from the 60's-70's, widowed, etc  hadn't picked up her mail in a few days, drapes all closed, dark as hell, before i could reach for the lights or open the drapes, i tripped over her.  the apartments above hegs were the newer ones-i got to live in one of them

 

[augoman]

PM me and I will share my personal experiences.