Will Froling's Friend be a Walkon?

[WarhawkWarrior]

Just heard his friend is coming to MU on an academic  scholly.

[GoldenDieners32]

Just heard his bro is coming to MU on an academic  scholly.

not his brother his friend, he announced he's coming here yesterday

[GoldenDieners32]

His name is Jacob Rose btw

[WarhawkWarrior]

Oops, sorry.

[GoldenDieners32]

Sounds like he wants to play though

[jesmu84]

Oops, sorry.

Probably would be good to change the thread title

[MarquetteDano]

Probably would be good to change the thread title

Can just change "Bro" to "Brah" and it's all good.   

[wadesworld]

Can just change "Bro" to "Brah" and it's all good.   

Dude, get with the times.  It's "bruh" now.

[Herman Cain]

Just heard his bro is coming to MU on an academic  scholly.

It is his friend.

[Silkk the Shaka]

Sounds like he wants to play though

Don't think you can walk on while receiving an academic scholarship. Could be wrong though - JayBee or anyone else know?

[StillAWarrior]

Don't think you can walk on while receiving an academic scholarship. Could be wrong though - JayBee or anyone else know?

I'm pretty sure you're wrong on this.  I believe there are NCAA rules that set some standards -- not the least of which is that it has to be pursuant to a scholarship program available to everyone.  Different sport, but I have first hand knowledge of an athlete who was offered a full-tuition academic scholarship for the freshman year packaged with four years athletic after that.  I was also surprised to learn that even scholarship players can get academic scholarships which reduce the amount that the athletic department must pay toward the athlete (but I'm not 100% sure that this applies to "fully funded" programs). 

[Silkk the Shaka]

I'm pretty sure you're wrong on this.  I believe there are NCAA rules that set some standards -- not the least of which is that it has to be pursuant to a scholarship program available to everyone.  Different sport, but I have first hand knowledge of an athlete who was offered a full-tuition academic scholarship for the freshman year packaged with four years athletic after that.  I was also surprised to learn that even scholarship players can get academic scholarships which reduce the amount that the athletic department must pay toward the athlete (but I'm not 100% sure that this applies to "fully funded" programs).

Yeah I think you can do that for track, soccer, etc. but I think basketball & football are treated differently.

Again, could be wrong

[Newsdreams]

Yeah I think you can do that for track, soccer, etc. but I think basketball & football are treated differently.

Again, could be wrong

Was clarified to me on twitter by True~Golden~Eagles
Can be done but student must be
Top 10% of his class with at least 3.5 GPA SAT at least 1200 or sum ACT 105

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

I too wonder if he is planning to walk on.

His twitter post said he tore an ACL recently, but a quick google search shows that he didn't exactly tear up HS hoops.  Assuming its the same guy, link I found showed he averaged 1.5 PPG as a junior in 13 GP. 

[Silkk the Shaka]

Was clarified to me on twitter by True~Golden~Eagles
Can be done but student must be
Top 10% of his class with at least 3.5 GPA SAT at least 1200 or sum ACT 105

Interesting... Did the SAT go back to 1600? Been out the game a while (but took it when it was 1600)

Those standards seem... lax to me. Like why wouldn't more schools take advantage to use more athletic schollies?

[Galway Eagle]

Was clarified to me on twitter by True~Golden~Eagles
Can be done but student must be
Top 10% of his class with at least 3.5 GPA SAT at least 1200 or sum ACT 105

Wouldn't Howard likely be eligible for an academic scholarship then?

[Newsdreams]

Wouldn't Howard likely be eligible for an academic scholarship then?

I imagine, but I bet he is not getting 100% tuition. As would a basketball scholarship that is probably the difference.

[GOO]

Doesn't the Ivy League technically offer no athletic scholarships?  But aren't the players who often have lesser credentials than most students end up on need based scholarships anyway? I know most players at Harvard now qualify for no fees/tuition simply if there household income is low enough... but I don't think that it true for all Ivy League schools, especially in the past.

If yes, to both, which I believe is the case, then any school should be able to offer need based or academic scholarships, I'd think.  To not run afoul of the NCAA the student better be a great student and be awarded the scholarship solely on academic achievement, diversity, need, etc.  I'm sure MU would cross all its t's and clear it with the NCAA and not use this to hide a player on the roster who is truly recruited as an athlete.

[StillAWarrior]

Wouldn't Howard likely be eligible for an academic scholarship then?

Even a full tuition scholarship leaves an awful lot for someone to pay.  I've seen figures suggesting that it would be in the neighborhood of $14k per year at Marquette.  I'm sure someone posting on this board could give an accurate number.  So, even at that extremely high level of scholarship, the difference between academic and athletic scholarship is in the neighborhood of $60k over the student's four years.  Even if they have the finances to pay the difference, I don't think that there are too many families out there who have a kid who merits a full ride who are going to want to walk on and pay the difference.

And, in addition to meeting the NCAA's criteria, I think they probably get scrutinized to make sure that the athlete is comparable to others receiving the scholarship. I'm pretty sure that there is an NCAA regulation that says that the academic aid must be available to others with comparable resume.  In other words, if a 3.5 GPA and 1200 SAT wouldn't merit a scholarship for a non-athlete, it can't be offered to an athlete.  Does anyone know what it takes to get a full tuition scholarship at MU?  I'd venture it's a hell of a lot higher than 3.5/1200.  On this issue, has anyone ever noticed that Alabama has generous academic scholarships for out-of-state students based on grades -- starting at 3.5 and 1210?  Coincidence?

Also, if he's got the academic resume to justify it, it's quite possible that Howard is getting an academic scholarship.  The team can save money from it's budget if the players get academic scholarships to supplement the athletic scholarship.  I'm pretty sure that if a player gets a $10k academic scholarship, that is just $10k that won't hit the BB budget.

[StillAWarrior]

Doesn't the Ivy League technically offer no athletic scholarships?  But aren't the players who often have lesser credentials than most students end up on need based scholarships anyway? I know most players at Harvard now qualify for no fees/tuition simply if there household income is low enough... but I don't think that it true for all Ivy League schools, especially in the past.

If yes, to both, which I believe is the case, then any school should be able to offer need based or academic scholarships, I'd think.  To not run afoul of the NCAA the student better be a great student and be awarded the scholarship solely on academic achievement, diversity, need, etc.  I'm sure MU would cross all its t's and clear it with the NCAA and not use this to hide a player on the roster who is truly recruited as an athlete.

You're generally correct about the Ivy League -- they do offer need based aid to all students.  It is true that the academic standards can be lower for athletes.  How that is handled varies a bit from school to school (and probably from sport to sport, even within the school).  I'm not sure it's true that "most" students qualify for no tuition/fees, but their financial aid is far more generous than most.  Based upon Harvard's calculator, a family income of $150k will result in pretty much tuition free -- but would still leave an estimated $19k+ per year.  That's much better aid that you'll get at most schools at that income range, but still $80k over four years.  At $75k income, the cost is about $7k.  A great deal, but still not "no fees/tuition."  We looked very closely at the Ivy League situation for a recruited athlete, but the finances just didn't work out for us.  We're far from rich, but even with the generous financial aid, we didn't think it was as good as the other option available at the time.  But by all means, if you're an academically motivated athlete with a low to mid income, you'd be crazy not to at least check out the Ivies.  Another thing to know:  if they want you, you can play them against each other on financial aid (e.g., Columbia might say, "tell us what Harvard offers, and we'll match it").

And schools can offer aid to athletes -- both need and academic.  They just have to be careful to do it right.

[Jay Bee]

There are certain non-athletic aid exemptions available

[forgetful]

Wouldn't Howard likely be eligible for an academic scholarship then?

This has been discussed before.  Howard, may be eligible for an academic scholarship.  But he would have to apply to the university as a student, become admitted, and apply for academic scholarships that the entire student body is eligible for.  He would then be considered as a general student, independent on basketball.

The basketball staff cannot guarantee anything, cannot offer a scholarship or intervene in anyway to facilitate the scholarship. 

The basketball scholarship is a guarantee, it covers the full cost of tuition, guaranteed. 

Athletes of Howard's caliber are not going to sit back and wait and hope they earn the academic scholarship when other schools will give the basketball guarantee.

[Galway Eagle]

This has been discussed before.  Howard, may be eligible for an academic scholarship.  But he would have to apply to the university as a student, become admitted, and apply for academic scholarships that the entire student body is eligible for.  He would then be considered as a general student, independent on basketball.

The basketball staff cannot guarantee anything, cannot offer a scholarship or intervene in anyway to facilitate the scholarship. 

The basketball scholarship is a guarantee, it covers the full cost of tuition, guaranteed. 

Athletes of Howard's caliber are not going to sit back and wait and hope they earn the academic scholarship when other schools will give the basketball guarantee.

Makes sense. I guess when I think of a high school valedictorian that graduated in 3yrs I imagine they're usually able to get full ride academic scholarships.

[warriorchick]

Makes sense. I guess when I think of a high school valedictorian that graduated in 3yrs I imagine they're usually able to get full ride academic scholarships.

I don't know what the exact numbers are for recent years, but I know for a fact that about 5 years ago that they had a freshman class that had over 50 high school valedictorians in it. I believe that the number of full academic schollys are fewer than a dozen, and I am pretty sure that none of them include room and board.

[Dawson Rental]

Valedictorians........ no matta.