Wojo has to go

[Disco Hippie]

Loss on March 5, 2011 under Buzz.

http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball/sh_03_05_11

Now.  Just stop being dumb.

Agreed!   The comment about never losing to them until WOJO in the first post is factually incorrect.  I was at that game and it was brutal.  I left at halftime because we were down by 26 if memory serves me correctly.  We still ended up going to the Sweet 16 that year and I was at that game against North Carolina (which coincidentally was played at the Prudential Center in Newark, NJ, Seton Hall's home court) as well.  In that game we were down 40-15 at halftime.  Since it was the NCAA's I didn't leave at halftime out of frustration but I did have the pleasure of watching us get absolutely smoked 2x in 3 weeks at the same venue with Buzz in command of the program.  Still, hard to complain about a sweet 16 season.

I'm not a WOJO apologist by any means but hard to blame this L on him.  I guess I'm just more accepting of the fact that we're just not as good as everyone on here (myself included) wants us to be. 

[connie]

There are so many posts defending Wojo and his mediocrity. Hopefully at some point in the future our fan base and administration will expect to at least make the tournament again. Until then, we'll keep blowing second halfeads and seeing kids leave the program unexpectedly.

Wojo isn't the golden child we were promised. Until he earns some real W's I'll continue to remain unimpressed.

Guess you missed the "fire Wojo" threads--there are a few.  I am far from an apologist, but this one is not on the coaching.

[Galway Eagle]

Actually, I loved the Wojo hire on day 1. Maybe I am over-reacting, but being okay with losing to Seton Hall over and over again is like being okay with losing to East Carolina when we were in C-USA.  How long are we willing to wait for this guy to restore our program to the level Buzz had it, where we went to 3 Elite Eights in a row (with quite mediocre teams).

I watched today. And I thought we had turned a corner with Wojo. But then the last 40 seconds of the game happened.  This team should have won the game, and he has to shoulder some of the responsibility for the loss.

It was 2 sweet 16s and one elite 8. Those teams were not mediocre at all, the 2011 team was (though it was lead by someone who's now a top player in the NBA), the 2012 team was top 15 for almost the whole season and the 2013 team won the old Big East which mediocre teams don't do.

[BM1090]

Who cares? SHU got lucky in one game in the BET.

We have now lost 4 times in a row to them. It's inexcusable.

No we haven't.

[brewcity77]

No we haven't.

Oh stop with your "facts" and "counting skills".

[MU82]

This thread is so ridiculous, I won't even bother reading it.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

]

I have a PhD in Chemistry and work at Yale.

If I have any questions on chemistry I will be sure to call you. Your understanding of basketball is questionable.

Let me ask you this, do you think a coach should be fired for losing twice to the eventual Big East champions and then again on the road to a team that is a likely bubble team? Because that is what you are advocating for.

[keefe]

The guy that starts this thread says he works at Yale.  That backs up my claim that you can't measure real intelligence with a GPA or SAT/ACT.  Beautiful.

Hey Einstein, listen up.  This program is headed into the top 20 within 2 years so buckle up.

Says the guy whose only hope of getting into an Ivy is to take the public tour bus.

Hey, Baxter, listen up. That guy isn't a dude. And she works at Yale. And you never will.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Warrior - the team we played today didn't beat Villanova. Last year's Seton Hall team did. They no longer have the Big East tourney's unanimous MVP and principle architect of that win (Whitehead). So what's the point?

The point is that the OP said that losing to Seton Hall three times in a row was grounds for dismissal for a coach. Two of those three losses were to that Seton Hall team.

[keefe]

I am amazed that people demand adherence to some unstated party line.

Jutaw expressed an opinion that she is disappointed in the team's performance under Wojo.

Frankly, she is not alone. There are some key financial supporters of the program asking questions. And they should. The team is not making progress to their liking.

As for those mocking her for her Yale connection...there are some here employed at Yale, the Mayo Clinic, and in senior leadership positions in significant enterprises. As Marquette grads we should celebrate the success of some of our fellow alums. Because for every one teaching at Yale there are hundreds of others who are part of the mass of men leading lives of quiet desperation.

Were Thoreau to read the comments here he would shake his head in disgust.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I am amazed that people demand adherence to some unstated party line.

I don't think anyone has been loyal to any party line in this thread. I have seen consistent Wojo critics step in and say that the OP is off base. People have crossed party lines to say that the line of reasoning was absurd.

Jutaw expressed an opinion that she is disappointed in the team's performance under Wojo.

Jutlaw did not express disappointment in the team's performance under Wojo. She stated that Wojo needed to be fired because he had lost 4 times in a row to Seton Hall. A statement that is ridiculous for several reasons. 1. It's not factual. We've lost three times in a row. 2. Two of the losses in question were to a Seton Hall team that won the Big East. The third was a close, hard fought loss on the road to a solid but not great Pirate squad. 3. As many others have pointed out, Wojo had the team in good position to win tonight. Main issue was that the players couldn't execute down the stretch. The coach bears some responsibility because he needs to develop good habits and mental toughness within the players. But a majority of the blame goes on execution, not coaching. 4. Losing to a specific program three times is not justification for a firing in any circumstance.

Frankly, she is not alone. There are some key financial supporters of the program asking questions. And they should. The team is not making progress to their liking.

We have two options, go forward with Wojo until he's either successful or its become apparent that he never will be. Or fire him. I don't think there is a third option. If the boosters want to fire him, I think that would be a mistake at this point. The program has improved every year under Wojo and firing him would almost certainly set the program back by several years. Fortunately, I think most of the "key financial supporters" recognize this given we had a record fundraising weekend a few weeks ago. So while I am sure the the boosters are just as frustrated as the rest of us, they are smart men and women who recognize that rebuilds are painful but we are building towards something good.

As for those mocking her for her Yale connection...there are some here employed at Yale, the Mayo Clinic, and in senior leadership positions in significant enterprises. As Marquette grads we should celebrate the success of some of our fellow alums. Because for every one teaching at Yale there are hundreds of others who are part of the mass of men leading lives of quiet desperation.

No one should mock someone for working for Yale. It is a great achievement. And if I ever have a question on chemistry, I know who I will turn to. I will say that I meet the claim of working for Yale with the same skepticism as I meet every claim on the internet. When I first joined our beloved community, I didn't know you were truly a pilot in the air force. I didn't think you were lying but I wouldn't have bet money on it either. You have since demonstrated enough knowledge and experience that I would criticize anyone who tried to discredit you. Just like I would expect others to be skeptical of the fact that I work as a Title IX investigator. They don't know me, I could just be a punk living in his parents' basement claiming to be such.  I am still skeptical the 4ever is a dentist but enough people have confirmed it that I have to accept it!

Were Thoreau to read the comments here he would shake his head in disgust.

I think Thoreau would shake his head in disgust at 97% of what gets posted on this website.

[TedBaxter]

Says the guy whose only hope of getting into an Ivy is to take the public tour bus.

Hey, Baxter, listen up. That guy isn't a dude. And she works at Yale. And you never will.

You know what Keefe?  I'm going to take the time here to apologize to the young woman for my condescending tone towards her yesterday.  I was just not happy with some of the negative posting on all of the Marquette message boards yesterday and it got to me. I'm also going to explain my position on Wojo and the direction of the program. 

There is no doubt a change and the style of play is one of the aspects that is reflective of the change.  Yesterday I felt the defense was probably as good as it's been all year and the team shooting ability is as good as it's been in the past 3-4 years.

Another change is in recruiting and something I try to find out as much as I can about.  Some people think MU needs to be more open about recruiting JUCO's and Wojo has looked into that level.  MU has limitations and some of it is because of credits transferring matching what Marquette offers.  I know one recruiting situation pretty well and know the coaching staff was very specific on what the student/athlete needed to do academically to get into Marquette and he chose another school that didn't have the same academc requirements and expectations.  The other school was probably a better fit overall and he is doing well.  He could have helped Marquette a great deal, but would have it been a good match for him?  Maybe not.

Wojo has only had 2 recruiting classes hit the floor.  Henry and Traci are no longer in the program, yet the team might be playing better than at any time since Wojo took over.  Wojo isn't taking shortcuts other than grabbing a couple grad transfers or maybe you could argue adding the Ellenson's.  He's being very selective in who he offers, right or wrong.  He has a plan and is sticking to his guns.  Let's wait to see how he does the next two years and I think people will be very pleasantly surprised in that time frame.

[Loose Cannon]

]

I have a PhD in Chemistry and work at Yale.

Breaking Bad

[thekahoona]

We were playing the worst free throw shooting team in the league. And we kept giving them wide open looks under the basket instead of putting them on the line.  I thought this man was supposed to be smart...he graduated from Duke and was mentored by Coach K.  But he coaches without using his brain.

During one of the time outs in the 2nd half, they had Wojo mic'd up and he told the team exactly that. He said for them to go ahead and give the fouls and make SH earn it at the line. "No layups," he said.

Unfortunately, the team still has to execute.

[avid1010]

Says the guy whose only hope of getting into an Ivy is to take the public tour bus.

Hey, Baxter, listen up. That guy isn't a dude. And she works at Yale. And you never will.

if i am factually wrong on multiple accounts, i don't list my accomplishments and education background...i simply apologize and take it as a reminder to think before i speak/type. 

[GGGG]

Anyone who thinks that the last :40 seconds is on Wojo doesn't really know what they are talking about.  That was a great effort against a physically more imposing team on the road.  Yeah it sucks that they gave it away, but they are playing hard and their defense has improved (just like people were hoping it would.)

I said it in the other thread, but there is progress.  It may not be as fast as people would like but this team is much better than the last two, and IMO is going to get better in the next two. 

[4everwarriors]

Any truth to da rumor dat jutaw is really hoopaloop, hey?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I went to MU for undergrad because my GPA and SAT scores in high school were pretty average and would not admit me to the Notre Dame or Georgetown's of the world. 

You all need your troll detectors tuned up

[shoothoops]

If people look up coaches, many of them take four seasons to be successful initially.  These include new coaches, coaches new to a school, etc...the fast track is three years...the slow track is five years.  Of course some do not make it that long without signs of progress.  Less often, a coach will inherit a good or strong situation and have success earlier.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

if i am factually wrong on multiple accounts, i don't list my accomplishments and education background...i simply apologize and take it as a reminder to think before i speak/type.

Exactly.  If the topic were chemistry, Yale or higher education then touting her credentials would be relevant.  Touting them in regards to a basketball discussion are irrelevant and opened her up to further ribbing.

One can be an expert in one field and completely naive in another.

[tower912]

Jutaw was on this board early.  Female,  Conservative politically.  Then she all but disappeared.  Obviously, she was frustrated yesterday and needed to vent.  Happy New Year to you, jutaw.

[muwarrior69]

Agreed!   The comment about never losing to them until WOJO in the first post is factually incorrect.  I was at that game and it was brutal.  I left at halftime because we were down by 26 if memory serves me correctly.  We still ended up going to the Sweet 16 that year and I was at that game against North Carolina (which coincidentally was played at the Prudential Center in Newark, NJ, Seton Hall's home court) as well.  In that game we were down 40-15 at halftime.  Since it was the NCAA's I didn't leave at halftime out of frustration but I did have the pleasure of watching us get absolutely smoked 2x in 3 weeks at the same venue with Buzz in command of the program.  Still, hard to complain about a sweet 16 season.

I'm not a WOJO apologist by any means but hard to blame this L on him.  I guess I'm just more accepting of the fact that we're just not as good as everyone on here (myself included) wants us to be.

...but we're getting there.

[vogue65]

Why? Am I not allowed to have an opinion?  I am not name calling other poster or anything else, just merely expressing my opinion.  And my opinion is that  I am sick of losing to the Seton Halls of the world.  I saw no evidence that we will ever beat them again under Wojo. 

I miss Buzz.

Most of us miss BUZZ, I  root for him and V.T., but this is now.  The overtime win over S.H. after an O.T. win at St. Johns were things of beauty.  The team was junkyard tough, the S.H. coach was a clown, BUZZ was on a mission.  The man has no patience for the process to work, he is for winning now no matter what.  It makes his life easy, and our life a little more difficult.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Jutaw was on this board early.  Female,  Conservative politically.  Then she all but disappeared.  Obviously, she was frustrated yesterday and needed to vent.  Happy New Year to you, jutaw.

Ah, well, that certainly explains the I'm-basing-my-opinion-on-an-entire-set-of-made-up-and-completely-false-assumptions-and-no-amount-verifiable-reality-will-sway-me thing.

[rocky_warrior]

Let me jump in here.  I received a request from Jutaw to delete the thread, admitting it was just some venting, partially because of family that has SHU ties.

I declined, because at the time there was some good discussion here.  Please keep it focused on basketball discussion, and not just bashing of a particular member.  Thanks.