Nice Buzz Article

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Guys love or hate Buzz for a ton of different reasons and I get that. All I can say is that he came the closest to making us the real deal than any coach since Al. In addition, the style of ball they played was very close to what I would love to watch every game.

Said it at the time and will say it again, Buzz brought excitement to the program and came close to putting us back on the map. He and KO get a pay on the back from this fan for what they did for the program.

This is a great take.  Particularly the part about fun to watch.  Except the last season, that stretch was the most fun to watch group of MU teams in my MU fan tenure.

[goinUptown]

Again, to me, there's a difference between "Boys will be boys" and "Boys will be criminal, and I'll help them cover that up."  Some people buy into the "Just win baby" mentality, and as long as that's happening, meh, who cares if the coach wants to bring in kids who start a girl's hair on fire or wants to make sure to get his whole team together to ensure they all have the same story to tell authorities in a sexual assault case involving his players, or refuses to acknowledge any person that isn't directly involved with men's basketball within the athletic department, etc?  And that's fine and their right.  Me?  I want to win, but if it comes down to having a few seasons below the standard Marquette has set for itself on the court before we start winning at that level again in order to clean up the major issues within the basketball program or just continue to become Cinci of the Thuggins days I'll take the couple down seasons before we're back to where we need to be.

Morally superior or just different strokes for different folks, call it what you want.  I'll ride that high horse.

What makes you think we're only going to have a few subpar seasons and then start winning  [commensurate to the level at which Buzz won]?  Wojo hasn't shown any real coaching chops and made a big mistake in taking HE which is costing the program a lot right now. 

[tower912]

I wonder how Buzz would handle a similar situation now?   I am not going to defend how he handled it.    He clearly messed up.   But, having learned his lesson, and with new procedures in place at the institutional level, isn't it likely it would go differently?    The one thing we know about Buzz is that he is constantly learning. 


  Ah, well, water under the bridge.    He is gone, Wojo is here.    For better or worse.    Hopefully, a couple of years down the road, we can be debating whether Wojo is the best coach in the Big East and whether he takes over at Duke when K retires.   

[vogue65]

I agree with your thoughts. I think he did put us back on the map. Buzz has personality. Pretty much all the press says about Wojo is he played for and sat next to Coach K. On the other hand, Wojo is probably what the BOT wants, clean cut guy who will not create any waves.

What the BOT wants, the BOT gets.
Did Wojo ever talk with Coach K?
Does Wojo ever talk with his assistants, or do they just sit there next to him?

[Golden Avalanche]

I didn't give anyone a free pass.

What the f#ck is your problem? Still curled up in the fetal position since The Crooked One was rightfully consigned to the trash heap of history?

Eek. Sensitive little guy in the small hours of the day.

[vogue65]

I wonder how Buzz would handle a similar situation now?   I am not going to defend how he handled it.    He clearly messed up.   But, having learned his lesson, and with new procedures in place at the institutional level, isn't it likely it would go differently?    The one thing we know about Buzz is that he is constantly learning. 


  Ah, well, water under the bridge.    He is gone, Wojo is here.    For better or worse.    Hopefully, a couple of years down the road, we can be debating whether Wojo is the best coach in the Big East and whether he takes over at Duke when K retires.

Good point about the institutional changes, which leaves Buzz as a typical scapegoat, and the BOT riding the white stallion.

[goinUptown]

Good point about the institutional changes, which leaves Buzz as a typical scapegoat, and the BOT riding the white stallion.

Right, so what I understand from all of this, the Chicago Tribune article, the scandal, and rules established PRIOR TO BUZZ'S ARRIVAL, is that those rules were what was changed post-scandal.  So leaders at MU had rules in place that had to be changed to comply with federal law.  Now, who is at fault for having those rules on the books?  Is it Buzz?  I'm thinking not...

[GGGG]

Right, so what I understand from all of this, the Chicago Tribune article, the scandal, and rules established PRIOR TO BUZZ'S ARRIVAL, is that those rules were what was changed post-scandal.  So leaders at MU had rules in place that had to be changed to comply with federal law.  Now, who is at fault for having those rules on the books?  Is it Buzz?  I'm thinking not...

Right.  Which is why they fired the athletic director who used to be the General Counsel.  They also kept Buzz around.  He survived the LW regime, but wasn't comfortable with Cords and the Presidential vacancy and the boundaries that the BOT wanted on the program.

Regardless, this is the same sort of bullsh*t thinking that has people excusing both Paterno and Briles.  Anyone should know that what he did was wrong.  You don't need an institutional policy to outline that. 

To tower's point, I have no doubts that he learned from this.  He's not a dumb guy.

[GGGG]

What makes you think we're only going to have a few subpar seasons and then start winning  [commensurate to the level at which Buzz won]?  Wojo hasn't shown any real coaching chops and made a big mistake in taking HE which is costing the program a lot right now. 

Henry isn't costing the program anything.  That's nonsense.

[goinUptown]

Henry isn't costing the program anything.  That's nonsense.

Sure would be great to have had a PF with a year under his belt this year.  And don't forget about those we lost given even slightest bit of uncertainty about whether HE goes pro after frosh year.  My guess, and I hope I'm wrong:  We miss the Big Dance this year and in great part due to being short a PF.  Looks like we'll  do well against smaller lineups, not so much against Michigans of the world.

[Goose]

4ever
Spot on about Rick.

Keefe
Sadly I am in Milwaukee and could not sleep. No China until first week of 2017.

[GGGG]

Sure would be great to have had a PF with a year under his belt this year.  And don't forget about those we lost given even slightest bit of uncertainty about whether HE goes pro after frosh year.  My guess, and I hope I'm wrong:  We miss the Big Dance this year and in great part due to being short a PF.  Looks like we'll  do well against smaller lineups, not so much against Michigans of the world.

So the problem with this season is that we lack a lower quality player as a power forward.  Yeah I don't think so.

[goinUptown]

It's only one of our many problems this year.  But the probability of making the Big Dance increases significantly with even a serviceable PF with a year  under his belt in Wojo's system.

[Dr. Blackheart]

It's only one of our many problems this year.  But the probability of making the Big Dance increases significantly with even a serviceable PF with a year  under his belt in Wojo's system.

Hauser is looking damn good to me.

[goinUptown]

Right, Hauser looks great.  He's a freshman, of, course, but he looks like he will be a great one.

[vogue65]

Henry isn't costing the program anything.  That's nonsense.

O.K., let's take a vote on that one.

[naginiF]

O.K., let's take a vote on that one.

He's not costing the program anything.

Possible scenarios:
- Wojo doesn't recruit him and the Scoop b@tchers complain that Wojo can't recruit and let the best WI prospect go.
- Scoopers feel other recruits passed us by because there was 'uncertainty' about Henry's Soph year when in fact the only people who thought there may be a Soph year are Scoopers
- Scoopers blame Henry for not coming back for a Soph year
- Wojo recruits, and lands, a top player that literally ANY program in the country would've taken.

Is there really any answer but the last?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

O.K., let's take a vote on that one.

OK, I vote with Sultan on that.  In fact, I vote that his one year here is still paying dividends.

[keefe]

Keefe
Sadly I am in Milwaukee and could not sleep. No China until first week of 2017.

Doing some stuff with PowerChina. Are you going to be in Beijing late Jan?

[naginiF]

Doing some stuff with PowerChina. Are you going to be in Beijing late Jan?

sounds like a C level rapper or top flight stripper.  why are you inviting Goose?

[brewcity77]

O.K., let's take a vote on that one.

The argument would be that from a player perspective, Henry may have cost us Gabe Levin and Kyle Washington. On the court, he maybe cost us the DePaul and Georgetown games.

However, he gave us the positive exposure of a first round pick and without him we likely lose to Arizona State, Wisconsin, Providence (twice), Creighton, and Georgetown. Nothing against Levin, but we probably go 16-17 last year if he's here instead of Henry.

My vote is that he's still a net positive, despite some of the minor frustrations he gave us.

[Billy Hoyle]

Buzz's Bunch, tough but clean players, "the butcher, the baker, the candlestick maker", his friendship with the homeless dude, his work ethic, his respect for (and from) those who mentored him, etc., etc., etc..

All PR for him.

[Billy Hoyle]

Sultan

I respect your perspective and rather enjoy your caustic take on things.  But let me say that I have first hand knowledge of Crean's outrageous behavior and unacceptable treatment of others.

Tom Crean's lack of concern, consideration, and respect for those around him, indeed those who contributed to his success, had no place in a Jesuit institution.

Buzz likely doesn't know where the line is and, in any event, is an extremely bizarre person. Crean knows where the line is but simply doesn't give a sh1t.

As do I. No doubt his and his wife's ego got WAY out of control. However, I have first hand knowledge from people inside and outside MU that Buzz and family became far worse than TC ever did and people were longing for the days of TC and Joani. They all LOVE Wojo and Mrs. Wojo, nothing but positives.

[wadesworld]

All PR for him.

Right. Al Copone donated tons of money to charities. I don't think he was a saint.

[Babybluejeans]

As do I. No doubt his and his wife's ego got WAY out of control. However, I have first hand knowledge from people inside and outside MU that Buzz and family became far worse than TC ever did and people were longing for the days of TC and Joani. They all LOVE Wojo and Mrs. Wojo, nothing but positives.

Although I really liked Buzz and wish we made it work with him, I've also heard from People Who Know Things that Buzz became an entitled terror. Maybe that's the price of admission for great coaching (a la Harbaugh) but Buzz was definitely a weiner.