Loyola University/Chicago billboard

[Brewtown Andy]

I'd like to talk about how accurate they are.

Someone posted above that MU has a better rank (86) than Loyola (99) in USNWR.  Close, but edge to MU.  And I checked the current estimates for tuition, room and board, books, fees, etc. and MU is slightly less expensive (MU about $46k all-in; Loyola about $49k).  Again, close, but edge to MU.  So how does a slightly lower rank and slightly higher costs make Loyola a better value?

Bit of artistic license by Loyola's ad folks?

I know the original post mentioned value, but it doesn't appear to be actually mentioned on the billboards, fwiw.

[GGGG]

I'd like to talk about how accurate they are.

Someone posted above that MU has a better rank (86) than Loyola (99) in USNWR.  Close, but edge to MU.  And I checked the current estimates for tuition, room and board, books, fees, etc. and MU is slightly less expensive (MU about $46k all-in; Loyola about $49k).  Again, close, but edge to MU.  So how does a slightly lower rank and slightly higher costs make Loyola a better value?

Bit of artistic license by Loyola's ad folks?

BTW, don't pay attention to the "list price."  Pay attention to how much students have to pay.

[GooooMarquette]

BTW, don't pay attention to the "list price."  Pay attention to how much students have to pay.

The numbers I saw - no idea if they're accurate - showed students getting about the same amounts of aid.  Neither particularly good.

[Coleman]

I'd like to talk about how accurate they are.

Someone posted above that MU has a better rank (86) than Loyola (99) in USNWR.  Close, but edge to MU.  And I checked the current estimates for tuition, room and board, books, fees, etc. and MU is slightly less expensive (MU about $46k all-in; Loyola about $49k).  Again, close, but edge to MU.  So how does a slightly lower rank and slightly higher costs make Loyola a better value?

Bit of artistic license by Loyola's ad folks?

It really depends on program. Loyola might be worth the extra 3k if your specific program is better at LUC.

edit: and to echo Sultan, list price is meaningless.

[Coleman]

I see a primary difference in that we have certain programs that are better than almost every other school in the country whereas Loyola doesn't. By the way Loyola took a massive jump these past few years because in 2013 they were about 140ish I believe and in 2008 when I was looking they were even lower.

And we are trending in the opposite direction. What's your point?

[Coleman]

I went to both MU (undergrad) and LUC (graduate)...each has pros and cons

At an undergrad level it really comes down to department by department...I'm sure there are some programs that are better than the other at both schools.

While MU has a good business school I think you'd have to give Quinlan the edge due to being in Chicago and the business and corporate contacts you can make while in school. Neither are ranked by US News.

Per US News, LUC's Law School is ranked #72 in the country. MU's is #123

Loyola also has a medical school.

The 2 schools are actually very similar overall. While there are differences (such as MU's basketball program), they are certainly in the same league.

I think the billboards are fine. MU already heavily recruits from the Chicago market, so I don't really know what they will gain. It will probably help LUC tap into Wisconsin more than help MU get more from Chicago.

[Galway Eagle]

And we are trending in the opposite direction. What's your point?

Are we trending opposite or just stagnate? And my point was along the lines of "wow surprised Loyola jumped that high that fast"

[Coleman]

Are we trending opposite or just stagnate? And my point was along the lines of "wow surprised Loyola jumped that high that fast"

We've been heading the wrong direction. I think we peaked in the low 70s

[Sir Lawrence]

I know the original post mentioned value, but it doesn't appear to be actually mentioned on the billboards, fwiw.

Yes, that was my mistake, but I just caught a glimpse of the billboard while traveling freeway speeds. 

[Brewtown Andy]

Yes, that was my mistake, but I just caught a glimpse of the billboard while traveling freeway speeds.

Yeah, no knock on you.  Just trying to point it out to anyone getting their feathers ruffled over something that didn't actually happen.........

[Galway Eagle]

We've been heading the wrong direction. I think we peaked in the low 70s

We were 74 my freshman year, I refuse to acknowledge that we are any less than a top 75 university.  Though in all honesty a great deal of it is beyond MU's control, if the higher end of applicants choose to go to their reach schools rather than MU then our class will be made up of more of the kids wait listed and such thus lower where we stand. Unfortunately it's been happening more and more. 

[Sheriff]

The 2 schools are actually very similar overall. While there are differences (such as MU's basketball program), they are certainly in the same league.

Chris Farley and Bob Newhart

http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/hi-bob/n10661

[Disco Hippie]

Marquette may want to compete with ND and BC, but the truth is, it's much closer to being Loyola than it is to being either one of those schools. It appears that at least someone at MU is recognizing that.

The problem is MU is all talk.  They say they want to compete with those schools but at the end of the day they are either unable, or more likely just flat out unwilling to do so.  They pretty much only compare themselves to other Jesuit or Catholic schools and more specifically mostly Midwestern Catholic schools?  Why???  It seems to me they're only interested in being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic.  They don't recruit at public high schools at all unless they're within a 100 mile radius of MKE and MU wears their religious affiliation on their sleeve to a much greater degree than the other catholic / Jesuit schools they claim to aspire to become more like.   At the risk of offending almost everyone on this board, the administration's parochial Midwestern ways are holding them back big time.  I don't know what happened with the whole Pilarz situation but I always loved the fact that he was an east coast guy and was dead serious about raising MU's profile.  After year 1 of the Pilarz administration, MU not only achieved it's highest ever US News ranking, but also made the list of "Most Innovative Schools" Where U.S. News asks top college officials to identify institutions in their ranking category that are making the most innovative improvements in terms of curriculum, faculty, students, campus life, technology or facilities.  No doubt Fr. Wild deserves a tremendous amount of credit as well because the school advanced tremendously under his reign, but I suspect because Pilarz was an east coast guy hell bent on playing the game and doing what's necessary to advance the institution such as unceremoniously dumping the FFP program and not being entirely on board with a goal of having 20% of each incoming class be a first generation college student, his advancement over altruism agenda rubbed many on the board the wrong way and they forced him out due to cultural differences between the Northeast and Midwest.  Of course I have no idea and am just speculating but that's my take.   All I'm saying is, the fact that MU even chose to engage LUC by placing a competing billboard tells you all you need to know.

 

[4everwarriors]

Ders more to da former prez' situation. Just sayin', hey?

[MUfan12]

Ders more to da former prez' situation. Just sayin', hey?

What a disaster that hire was, hey?

[Herman Cain]

The problem is MU is all talk.  They say they want to compete with those schools but at the end of the day they are either unable, or more likely just flat out unwilling to do so.  They pretty much only compare themselves to other Jesuit or Catholic schools and more specifically mostly Midwestern Catholic schools?  Why???  It seems to me they're only interested in being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic.  They don't recruit at public high schools at all unless they're within a 100 mile radius of MKE and MU wears their religious affiliation on their sleeve to a much greater degree than the other catholic / Jesuit schools they claim to aspire to become more like.   At the risk of offending almost everyone on this board, the administration's parochial Midwestern ways are holding them back big time.  I don't know what happened with the whole Pilarz situation but I always loved the fact that he was an east coast guy and was dead serious about raising MU's profile.  After year 1 of the Pilarz administration, MU not only achieved it's highest ever US News ranking, but also made the list of "Most Innovative Schools" Where U.S. News asks top college officials to identify institutions in their ranking category that are making the most innovative improvements in terms of curriculum, faculty, students, campus life, technology or facilities.  No doubt Fr. Wild deserves a tremendous amount of credit as well because the school advanced tremendously under his reign, but I suspect because Pilarz was an east coast guy hell bent on playing the game and doing what's necessary to advance the institution such as unceremoniously dumping the FFP program and not being entirely on board with a goal of having 20% of each incoming class be a first generation college student, his advancement over altruism agenda rubbed many on the board the wrong way and they forced him out due to cultural differences between the Northeast and Midwest.  Of course I have no idea and am just speculating but that's my take.   All I'm saying is, the fact that MU even chose to engage LUC by placing a competing billboard tells you all you need to know.

The sad thing about it all, is we have a great platform to build off of and could truly be an important national university if we went about it in a thoughtful way. The kids actually get a very good education and we really need to market that harder and in a more sophisticated way. 

[forgetful]

BTW, don't pay attention to the "list price."  Pay attention to how much students have to pay.

Agreed.  Assume a 20-30% haircut off the top of list price.  Unless you are international...then you are being recruited specifically because you will pay list.

[Coleman]

The problem is MU is all talk.  They say they want to compete with those schools but at the end of the day they are either unable, or more likely just flat out unwilling to do so.  They pretty much only compare themselves to other Jesuit or Catholic schools and more specifically mostly Midwestern Catholic schools?  Why???  It seems to me they're only interested in being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic.  They don't recruit at public high schools at all unless they're within a 100 mile radius of MKE and MU wears their religious affiliation on their sleeve to a much greater degree than the other catholic / Jesuit schools they claim to aspire to become more like.   At the risk of offending almost everyone on this board, the administration's parochial Midwestern ways are holding them back big time.  I don't know what happened with the whole Pilarz situation but I always loved the fact that he was an east coast guy and was dead serious about raising MU's profile.  After year 1 of the Pilarz administration, MU not only achieved it's highest ever US News ranking, but also made the list of "Most Innovative Schools" Where U.S. News asks top college officials to identify institutions in their ranking category that are making the most innovative improvements in terms of curriculum, faculty, students, campus life, technology or facilities.  No doubt Fr. Wild deserves a tremendous amount of credit as well because the school advanced tremendously under his reign, but I suspect because Pilarz was an east coast guy hell bent on playing the game and doing what's necessary to advance the institution such as unceremoniously dumping the FFP program and not being entirely on board with a goal of having 20% of each incoming class be a first generation college student, his advancement over altruism agenda rubbed many on the board the wrong way and they forced him out due to cultural differences between the Northeast and Midwest.  Of course I have no idea and am just speculating but that's my take.   All I'm saying is, the fact that MU even chose to engage LUC by placing a competing billboard tells you all you need to know.

Those accolades were all Wild's doing. Pilarz deserves zero credit for something that happened a year after he first saw campus.

Pilarz couldn't fundraise. He was probably a decent guy, but it was an untenable situation. Fr. Wild cleaned up the mess admirably, but damage had been done.

Jury is still out on Lovell. Lots of positives, but also a few negatives.

There will never be another Bob A. Wild. Him and Raynor were Jesuit giants. Let's hope future administrations honor that legacy.

[GGGG]

The problem is MU is all talk.  They say they want to compete with those schools but at the end of the day they are either unable, or more likely just flat out unwilling to do so.  They pretty much only compare themselves to other Jesuit or Catholic schools and more specifically mostly Midwestern Catholic schools?  Why???  It seems to me they're only interested in being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic.  They don't recruit at public high schools at all unless they're within a 100 mile radius of MKE and MU wears their religious affiliation on their sleeve to a much greater degree than the other catholic / Jesuit schools they claim to aspire to become more like.   At the risk of offending almost everyone on this board, the administration's parochial Midwestern ways are holding them back big time.  I don't know what happened with the whole Pilarz situation but I always loved the fact that he was an east coast guy and was dead serious about raising MU's profile.  After year 1 of the Pilarz administration, MU not only achieved it's highest ever US News ranking, but also made the list of "Most Innovative Schools" Where U.S. News asks top college officials to identify institutions in their ranking category that are making the most innovative improvements in terms of curriculum, faculty, students, campus life, technology or facilities.  No doubt Fr. Wild deserves a tremendous amount of credit as well because the school advanced tremendously under his reign, but I suspect because Pilarz was an east coast guy hell bent on playing the game and doing what's necessary to advance the institution such as unceremoniously dumping the FFP program and not being entirely on board with a goal of having 20% of each incoming class be a first generation college student, his advancement over altruism agenda rubbed many on the board the wrong way and they forced him out due to cultural differences between the Northeast and Midwest.  Of course I have no idea and am just speculating but that's my take.   All I'm saying is, the fact that MU even chose to engage LUC by placing a competing billboard tells you all you need to know.

Why do you care so much about Marquette raising its profile?  Marquette is what it is...a very good, midwestern Catholic university.  Why does it have to be the next Georgetown?  Or Boston College?  Is "being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic" that bad?

[4everwarriors]

So, middle of da road, ai na?

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Pilarz was not good, it had nothing to do with being a New York guy.

He couldn't fundraise, instead of trying to wine and dine donors, he made them read poetry, he drank A LOT (I'm not just talking about your average beer with a meal with the occasional binge) and he was never involved with the campus community. I don't ever think I saw him strolling through campus during hos entire tenure.

[Coleman]

he drank A LOT

Well he is a Jesuit, no surprises there

I've heard Fr Wild likes his scotch as well. The question is are you drinking socially to build relationships or pounding bottles alone on the 5th floor of the AMU. Big difference.

[Herman Cain]

Well he is a Jesuit, no surprises there

I've heard Fr Wild likes his scotch as well. The question is are you drinking socially to build relationships or pounding bottles alone on the 5th floor of the AMU. Big difference.

I agree with this analysis.

[rocket surgeon]

For most intents and purposes, Loyola and Marquette or pretty equivalent, except that we have a real basketball team and they have a medical school and hospital.

They dumped their dental school program in 1993

[rocket surgeon]

The problem is MU is all talk.  They say they want to compete with those schools but at the end of the day they are either unable, or more likely just flat out unwilling to do so.  They pretty much only compare themselves to other Jesuit or Catholic schools and more specifically mostly Midwestern Catholic schools?  Why???  It seems to me they're only interested in being a great catholic university and not a great university that happens to be catholic.  They don't recruit at public high schools at all unless they're within a 100 mile radius of MKE and MU wears their religious affiliation on their sleeve to a much greater degree than the other catholic / Jesuit schools they claim to aspire to become more like.   At the risk of offending almost everyone on this board, the administration's parochial Midwestern ways are holding them back big time.  I don't know what happened with the whole Pilarz situation but I always loved the fact that he was an east coast guy and was dead serious about raising MU's profile.  After year 1 of the Pilarz administration, MU not only achieved it's highest ever US News ranking, but also made the list of "Most Innovative Schools" Where U.S. News asks top college officials to identify institutions in their ranking category that are making the most innovative improvements in terms of curriculum, faculty, students, campus life, technology or facilities.  No doubt Fr. Wild deserves a tremendous amount of credit as well because the school advanced tremendously under his reign, but I suspect because Pilarz was an east coast guy hell bent on playing the game and doing what's necessary to advance the institution such as unceremoniously dumping the FFP program and not being entirely on board with a goal of having 20% of each incoming class be a first generation college student, his advancement over altruism agenda rubbed many on the board the wrong way and they forced him out due to cultural differences between the Northeast and Midwest.  Of course I have no idea and am just speculating but that's my take.   All I'm saying is, the fact that MU even chose to engage LUC by placing a competing billboard tells you all you need to know.

"Catholic"???  Must be da new normal then, huhyeahhuhyeahhuhyeah?