NY Times: Imagine the Big East, Coast to Coast

[Coleman]

And Fordham.  Where on earth is Fordham?

In the Bronx

[Coleman]

The more I think about it, the more I don't think you need to bring St. Mary's, as long as Gonzaga is ok with being the only team out West.

Bring in Gonzaga and VCU. That would be a helluva conference.

Gonzaga home games can always have the late time slot (10 pm central) on FS1. Basically guarantee them FS1 coverage for most of their games, because of the time zone difference.

Yeah a travel partner would be nice but the Big East has the upper hand here, not Gonzaga.

[GoldenWarrior11]

Utah State?  New Mexico?  SMU?  I swear, it's like some of us want to destroy the Big East again...

[SaveOD238]

Big East-WCC Challenge?

This makes the most sense.  Even if ALL of the west coast schools were dragged in on a rotating basis, it would help fill one of the cupcake slots in the schedule.  And the low 100s-low 200s RPIs of the "other" WCC schools would be infinitely better than the 300+ RPIs we now schedule in non-con.

2015-2016 RPI
SMU-38
Zags- 45
BYU- 75
Pepperdine- 129
LMU- 224
SF- 227
Portland- 249
Santa Clara- 251
Pacific- 268
San Diego- 302

Who wouldn't trade Grambling for LMU in a heartbeat?  Even if we had to play @ LMU one year, the exposure of playing in LA (or San Fran...SC and SF) would be worth it.

[Coleman]

This makes the most sense.  Even if ALL of the west coast schools were dragged in on a rotating basis, it would help fill one of the cupcake slots in the schedule.  And the low 100s-low 200s RPIs of the "other" WCC schools would be infinitely better than the 300+ RPIs we now schedule in non-con.

2015-2016 RPI
SMU-38
Zags- 45
BYU- 75
Pepperdine- 129
LMU- 224
SF- 227
Portland- 249
Santa Clara- 251
Pacific- 268
San Diego- 302

Who wouldn't trade Grambling for LMU in a heartbeat?  Even if we had to play @ LMU one year, the exposure of playing in LA (or San Fran...SC and SF) would be worth it.

While I agree with this from a scheduling RPI perspective, my biggest issue with it is the perception it gives off...namely, that the Big East and WCC are equals. "Challenges" are generally reserved for conferences of equals...Big East vs. Big 10, Big 10 vs. ACC, etc.

[Eldon]

I just don't know what to think on this proposal, but you did stick Dayton out west!

The subtlety translates to hilarity.  Subtlety in humor is like fine wine.  Although, if I'm being honest I can't really taste the difference between fine wine and bottom-shelf-Serbian-liquor-store-on-51st-and-Oklahoma-Avenue wine.

Anyway, cheers Benny. 

[DFW HOYA]

Assuming that you did not choose ND and BC by chance, it seems you are defining peer institution as:

*Catholic
*Research powerhouse (R1/RUVH)
*High USWNR ranking

If so, then can you really fault the new BE for not having any Gtown peers?  By that definition, ND and BC are the only peers that Gtown has!

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

....I did. Marquette and BC were on my list too. Got into all four, picked Marquette.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

Wrong, try again with your last sentence...My 3 choices were between Illinois, Northwestern and Marquette. You're as arrogant as that Syracuse writer today.

[AZMarqfan]

Being a West Coast Conference Alum, I've wished the Big East would partner with the WCC to bolster each conference's early season scheduling.  Most WCC teams tend to have to travel or play neutral sites, so an agreement could probably be worked out where Each team faces 3 (or however many) opponents from the other conference in a given season, the more than half of the games played in Big East sites.  Both leagues also have 10 teams as well.

[Galway Eagle]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

ND was ranked above GU in the last rankings lol Duke was wayyy higher than GU in the last ranking.  GU is obviously a great school but right now you're like the Notre Dame grad that picks their nose to show you their class ring.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Why?

[forgetful]

This makes the most sense.  Even if ALL of the west coast schools were dragged in on a rotating basis, it would help fill one of the cupcake slots in the schedule.  And the low 100s-low 200s RPIs of the "other" WCC schools would be infinitely better than the 300+ RPIs we now schedule in non-con.

2015-2016 RPI
SMU-38
Zags- 45
BYU- 75
Pepperdine- 129
LMU- 224
SF- 227
Portland- 249
Santa Clara- 251
Pacific- 268
San Diego- 302

Who wouldn't trade Grambling for LMU in a heartbeat?  Even if we had to play @ LMU one year, the exposure of playing in LA (or San Fran...SC and SF) would be worth it.

Based on the above, add:

SMU-38
Zags- 45
BYU- 75
Pepperdine- 129
and maybe get the other SMU (RPI-15)

Make them the west division or throw Creighton out west.

[NorthernDancerColt]

ND was ranked above GU in the last rankings lol Duke was wayyy higher than GU in the last ranking.  GU is obviously a great school but right now you're like the Notre Dame grad that picks their nose to show you their class ring.

Agree completely. And in the new reality of the conference landscape, it's about survival. You bring in he who fortifies you. Like a game of the old 80s-90s arcade classic Sinistar. The giant skull of the Power 5 is constantly floating around threatening our little ship, while we navigate the asteroid belt of pro-power5 ESPN, biased media in general, NCAA tournament  refs favoring Sinistar, etc. If a program has an excellent basketball tradition with solid academic credentials, and can help our tiny (but shiny and strong)  BigEast ship sail through the minefield unharmed....who gives a flying F if they match Gtown's hoity-toity  academic profile????!!!!!

When that effin giant skull started attacking me, I got pissed. When it started doing its Syracuse dance and flew at  me screaming "I LIVE", I wanted to blow the living sh!t out of it. Right now, that skull is growing, and this all-ACC Sweet 16 is sickening me. If we can get better,let's do it! Gonzaga makes us better, and their academics are pretty solid.

[real chili 83]

Since they don't play football any more, we should add ND.

[Coleman]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

I'd say their peers are more like George Washington, Northeastern, Boston College, NYU.

All great schools. But not Ivy. Keep dreaming Hoya.

[GooooMarquette]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

And Wisconsin-Madison's peers are Harvard and Yale.

[MUfan12]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

Still failing to grasp what this has to do with basketball conferences.

[Eldon]

Georgetown's peers (per the school) are generally some combination of Penn, Duke, Brown, and Virginia, with ND, BC, and Wake Forest on a second tier after that. That's a reflection of the admissions pool right now. There are next to no kids choosing between GU and, say, Creighton.

Fair enough.  I would argue that university presidents, who are typically former academics, likely judge their peer institutions by research/grad programs, not undergrad pool.  But then I would be arguing for the sake of arguing.  I digress. 

So I have a question: Was Georgetown crying out in the wilderness about lack of peers in the old Big East?  Who were your peers?  BC and ND...and Syracuse on a third tier after that?  Surely you don't consider Pitt, Rutgers, and UConn your academic peers (undergrad pool) if you are lumping yourself in with the likes of Penn, Duke, etc.

Academically (undergrad pool), the new BE is probably on par with the old BE (e.g., lost ND, but also lost WVU).  A Gonzaga and St. Mary's addition wouldn't change that.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Lately GT basketball has looked a lot like Penn, Brown and Princeton.  Maybe that's what he meant.

[GGGG]

I'm not going to comment on who Georgetown thinks are its academic peers.

I just don't get DFW HOYA's comments about DePaul and Creighton and why that matters.  My guess is that in every conference you see this.  How many Wisconsin applicants also apply to Rutgers and Maryland?  Even in primarily private school conferences, I doubt this is much of an issue.

Georgetown, like Marquette, is in the best conference it can be in at this point in time given the landscape of college athletics.  Very likely the landscape will change someday.  (It always has.)  And I'm not necessarily talking in the next five years, but 10 or 20.  Maybe you will see more conference adapt non-football members.  Maybe schools will drop football and cause a reshuffling.  Maybe one of the P5 blows up causing another reshuffle.

This is the bottom line for me on the Big East and expansion.

1.  The Big East is a good conference.  It is the best non-football conference in college basketball.

2.  There is no reason to expand right now.  All the obvious candidates are either geographic outliers (Zags), the wrong type of school (VCU) or just aren't good enough (SLU).  Unless Fox steps up to make their contract more lucrative, it just isn't necessary.

3.   Sitting and waiting may be the best strategy due to what I said above.  If a school like Wake Forest or UConn decide to drop football in 10-15 years, I would love for them to be part of the BE.  Adding mediocre programs for the sake of doing so isn't smart.

[Benny B]

Fair enough.  I would argue that university presidents, who are typically former academics, likely judge their peer institutions by research/grad programs, not undergrad pool.  But then I would be arguing for the sake of arguing.  I digress. 

So I have a question: Was Georgetown crying out in the wilderness about lack of peers in the old Big East?  Who were your peers?  BC and ND...and Syracuse on a third tier after that?  Surely you don't consider Pitt, Rutgers, and UConn your academic peers (undergrad pool) if you are lumping yourself in with the likes of Penn, Duke, etc.

Oooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhh   SNAP!

[Coleman]

Lately GT basketball has looked a lot like Penn, Brown and Princeton.  Maybe that's what he meant.

[Eldon]

Lately GT basketball has looked a lot like Penn, Brown and Princeton.  Maybe that's what he meant.

[Groin_pull]

Careful. Where has MU been the past three years???