Friars go down

[keefe]

Good try but UNC ultimately ran away with it.

My question, though, is that since UNC is guilty of widespread institutional fraud why are they even playing tonight. They betrayed the trust of the taxpayers, the boosters, and the student athletes and their parents as well as every team they played who expected an honest contest. They cheated the broadcasters and everyone who invested in the UNC athletic program.

UNC needs to be stripped of every win from every tainted contest. Dean Smith should no longer have his current win total and Hound Dog needs to be shown the door.

UNC epitomizes everything that is wrong about collegiate athletics. That school is a fraud.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Good try but UNC ultimately ran away with it.

My question, though, is that since UNC is guilty of widespread institutional fraud why are they even playing tonight. They betrayed the trust of the taxpayers, the boosters, and the student athletes and their parents as well as every team they played who expected an honest contest. They cheated the broadcasters and everyone who invested in the UNC athletic program.

UNC needs to be stripped of every win from every tainted contest. Dean Smith should no longer have his current win total and Hound Dog needs to be shown the door.

UNC epitomizes everything that is wrong about collegiate athletics. That school is a fraud.

Agreed on all counts. They are a disgrace. The banhammer is coming soon to North Carolina soon. I just hope North Carolina Central is ready for it

[MU82]

The investigation is still ongoing.

I have hope that once it concludes, the hammer will fall. But it probably won't.

Whenever asked, Roy goes into his, "Dadgum it, golly geepers, I had no idea. Jiminy Crickets!"

It's pathetic.

[#UnleashSean]

How is punishing current players helpful?

[forgetful]

How is punishing current players helpful?

Most of them have came since the academic fraud was found.  They knew the possibility that a ban hammer would fall.  They chose to take the risk.

If ever a school deserved the death penalty it is UNC.  They should be banned from all competition for at least 1 year...more deservedly 2.

[#UnleashSean]

Most of them have came since the academic fraud was found.  They knew the possibility that a ban hammer would fall.  They chose to take the risk.

If ever a school deserved the death penalty it is UNC.  They should be banned from all competition for at least 1 year...more deservedly 2.

That has yet to explain how punishing current players is helpful. All that would do is prove the ncaa is powerless to stop schools.

[ChicosBailBonds]

How is punishing current players helpful?

What other suggestion would you have?   Yes, it sucks, but it's the only thing that knocks a program down several pegs....see USC football.   

The NCAA is going to knock them very hard, from what I'm hearing no later than end of Summer, but likely earlier sans any more procedural stuff.  I'm only hearing this from other TV folks in the sports biz, but they're pretty well connected so I'm trusting they know something.

[#UnleashSean]

What other suggestion would you have?   Yes, it sucks, but it's the only thing that knocks a program down several pegs....see USC football.   

The NCAA is going to knock them very hard, from what I'm hearing no later than end of Summer, but likely earlier sans any more procedural stuff.  I'm only hearing this from other TV folks in the sports biz, but they're pretty well connected so I'm trusting they know something.

You could banish TV deals, suspend money from NCAA tournaments, limit new scholarships, etc... All but doing things such as banning players who had nothing to do with the issues from playing basketball.

[ChicosBailBonds]

You could banish TV deals, suspend money from NCAA tournaments, limit new scholarships, etc... All but doing things such as banning players who had nothing to do with the issues from playing basketball.

Not near enough pain, that's the problem.  Those punishments have been tried before, and they rarely do the trick.  Post season bans AND taking away scholarships, that starts to grab people's attentions.  It might be unfair, but when other punishments don't work and it is an institutional control issue, then the INSTITUTION needs to suffer....that includes everyone along for the ride.  Boosters than think twice, coaches think twice, administrators act with more diligence, players, etc.  The amount of stuff put in place cross town here at USC to make sure that nightmare scenario of Reggie Bush is hard to repeat has been breathtaking.  A huge wakeup call for them.  Nothing is 100%, but it will take willful ignorance for it to happen again with the safeguards Haden put into place.  The alums and boosters don't like it, but in the long run it will help them out from the nonsense that was going on prior.

[forgetful]

That has yet to explain how punishing current players is helpful. All that would do is prove the ncaa is powerless to stop schools.

I don't think you get it. 

Current players knew before they came to UNC that major sanctions were likely because of decades of academic fraud.

They chose to go there anyway.  When they made that conscious decision, they decided that they were willing to take those sanctions for the chance to play at UNC. 

This is not a case where the players on the team were not involved in the actions, did not know that sanctions would come and then were stuck with the consequences.  They chose UNC after the allegations and the investigation were ongoing.

The punishment is against UNC.  By deciding to go to UNC when they knew sanctions were coming, the players chose that as what they wanted.  So the players are not being punished, beyond what they knew was likely coming.

[tompopsicle]

Just allow the players to transfer without having to sit out a year. Similar to what Penn State did.

That would really kill their program.

[warriorfred]

(1) Most people seem to be operating under the assumption that North Carolina has cleaned-up its act, and there is not on-going, systematic abuse. 

(2) I can only assume that the recruitment process for the existing athletes was similarly fraudulent.

NCU, Louisville, Kentucky . . .  it does make it difficult to enjoy college basketball.

[Norm]

What does any of this have to do with Dean Smith? He hasn't been their coach for almost 20 years.

[SuddenSam]

Down to two BEAST teams, Friars just couldn't get open looks to fall.

X needs to put rodents in their place.

[rocket surgeon]

The investigation is still ongoing.

I have hope that once it concludes, the hammer will fall. But it probably won't.

Whenever asked, Roy goes into his, "Dadgum it, golly geepers, I had no idea. Jiminy Crickets!"

It's pathetic.

well, at least the TA's stood for teaching assistants and not the other T's and A's, ain'a fellas?  i think??

[GooooMarquette]

You could banish TV deals, suspend money from NCAA tournaments, limit new scholarships, etc...

Which would have NO impact on the basketball program at a school like UNC.  They would simply replace the short-term losses of revenue with student activity fees, then move whatever $$ they need from non-revenue sports.  Hell, they'd probably raise millions just by selling "Ban the NCAA" t-shirts in Carolina Blue.

[ecompt]

What does any of this have to do with Dean Smith? He hasn't been their coach for almost 20 years.

The scandals started while Dean was coach. They had an entire fictional department that helped keep the players eligible. Now we know why Joe Wolf spurned MU for the Heels.

[dgies9156]

Nothing will happen here... nothing, just move on folks.

Punishing North Carolina would have no good come out of it from an NCAA perspective. North Carolina is the blue blood of blue bloods. The cost to the NCAA of having no North Carolina for one or two years in its tournament would be unconscionable.

Besides, North Carolina didn't do anything that most other schools don't do. The joke when I was younger was that most athletes major in underwater basket weaving, which is the traditional university version of NC's sham classes.

If the NCAA came down as hard as they should on North Carolina -- giving it the death penalty for lack of institutional control and academic integrity -- it would foster a revolution in which more than a few P5 conferences and teams would leave the NCAA, making it toothless.

On the other hand, look out Louisville! What the NCAA won't and can't do to North Carolina will be taken out on Louisville. Expect a road trip from Indianapolis to Louisville by the NCAA's arson squad. What they will do to the University of Louisville would make the Romans, who sacked and salted Carthage, squeamish. It would make General Sherman compassionate!

[Goatherder]

Um, you realize the Hannibal was a Carthaginian, right?  You sure Sherman did not burn Philadelphia?

[dgies9156]

Um, you realize the Hannibal was a Carthaginian, right?  You sure Sherman did not burn Philadelphia?

Fixed.

Sherman probably should have sacked and burned Philadelphia! They would have called it urban renewal.

[naginiF]

Nothing will happen here... nothing, just move on folks.

Punishing North Carolina would have no good come out of it from an NCAA perspective. North Carolina is the blue blood of blue bloods. The cost to the NCAA of having no North Carolina for one or two years in its tournament would be unconscionable.

First off, I thought this thread was about Providence co-eds.

I agree that not much will happen to UNC but not because of any reverence to their BB position - if anything ESPN cares more about having them in the tournament than the NCAA.  Nothing much will happen because NCAA is dysfunctional at best and totally at the whim of the power conferences/corrupt at worst.  I hope I'm proven wrong and both Louisville and UNC get appropriate punishments.

Some would argue that Sherman was compassionate by making war as horrible as possible - the worse it is the shorter it'll last and therefore ultimately saving lives and resources. 

[Marcus92]

I'm actually of the opposite opinion — this can't and won't be swept under the rug.

It's not like the university is denying wrongdoing. A report found that the academic fraud was systemic and far-reaching — involving more than 3,000 students (half of them athletes), lasting for nearly 20 years and consisting of almost 200 classes in the African and Afro-American studies department.

North Carolina has already been embarrassed by the scandal and fired people over it. The university has been placed on 12 months probation by its accreditation board for seven violations, including academic integrity and a failure to monitor sports. That's unheard of — the school's certification as an educational institution is at stake.

If there was ever a case deserving of the death penalty, this is it. That's not likely, given UNC's prominence and the NCAA's reluctance to even investigate. But there's no debate that the fraud rises to the level of the most serious NCAA violations.

Based on the recent sanctions against Syracuse (nowhere near as serious), I'd expect at least a year postseason ban, loss of scholarships and possibly a year's suspension for Roy Williams for lack of oversight. Anything less and both the NCAA and university could face a maelstrom of negative publicity.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

What other suggestion would you have?   Yes, it sucks, but it's the only thing that knocks a program down several pegs....see USC football.   

The NCAA is going to knock them very hard, from what I'm hearing no later than end of Summer, but likely earlier sans any more procedural stuff.  I'm only hearing this from other TV folks in the sports biz, but they're pretty well connected so I'm trusting they know something.

Chicos is totally correct here. 
Just give the current players the chance to transfer without penalty and then you're not punishing any current players.

[warriorchick]

Chicos is totally correct here. 
Just give the current players the chance to transfer without penalty and then you're not punishing any current players.

Is there anyone we'd want?   

[keefe]

Is there anyone we'd want?   

Who has Joe Wolf's email and cell number?