Big East Conference Results

[Herman Cain]

Looks like Villanova has come out strong against Temple in the Big 5 Championship game.  Will be good for them to get some positive exposure on ESPN2

[Herman Cain]

Good quality road win for Villanova versus Temple. Xavier hold home court with win over Providence .

Would be good for Big East if Seton Hall could win on road versus Georgetown tonight.

[WarriorPride68]

DePaul is good at basketball

[BM1090]

Seton Hall beats Georgetown. Big win for them.

[WarriorHal]

DePaul will either be coming into MU game with a little momentum or they will be in the tank after today's game at St. John's.

St. John's 80-65 over DePaul

[Herman Cain]

St. John's 80-65 over DePaul

Congratulations to The Johnnies and Coach Mullin. First Big East win.

[Herman Cain]

Seton Hall beats Georgetown. Big win for them.

Seton Hall winning is good for the Big East.

Georgetown only hope for bid at this point  is to win BET.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Seton Hall winning is good for the Big East.

Georgetown only hope for bid at this point  is to win BET.

Anyone remember that one Georgetown fan on here posting that they would get a 3 seed this year? To be fair, as opposing fans go I've always thought he was pretty reasonable but he was just a bit off with that one.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Anyone remember that one Georgetown fan on here posting that they would get a 3 seed this year? To be fair, as opposing fans go I've always thought he was pretty reasonable but he was just a bit off with that one.

He also thought they had a legit shot at a one seed, if I remember correctly. To be fair, he was much more spot on on MU than most of us were!

[Lennys Tap]

Anyone remember that one Georgetown fan on here posting that they would get a 3 seed this year? To be fair, as opposing fans go I've always thought he was pretty reasonable but he was just a bit off with that one.

Hoyasincebirth is a very knowledgeable fan of college basketball in general and the Big East in particular. His predictions/assessments are fair and fact based except when it comes to Georgetown whom he consistently overrates, usually by a good margin. He's a fan first, like many of us on Scoop.

[Wade for President]

Anyone remember that one Georgetown fan on here posting that they would get a 3 seed this year? To be fair, as opposing fans go I've always thought he was pretty reasonable but he was just a bit off with that one.

To be fair,  G'town was close to pulling off upsets @ Maryland and against Duke on a neutral floor (both games decided in the final minute). 

[jsglow]

Seton Hall winning is good for the Big East.

Georgetown only hope for bid at this point  is to win BET.

Totally agree.  That's fantastic.

[Golden Avalanche]

To be fair,  G'town was close to pulling off upsets @ Maryland and against Duke on a neutral floor (both games decided in the final minute).

High watermark of their season........and it happened three months ago. Since then, the Hoyas have been a turgid mess of misaligned expectations, hype, conditioning, and coaching.

[brewcity77]

So...I thought I'd post some thoughts on the teams in this league as far as where they stand regarding the tournament. Right now, I don't see any way we don't get a minimum of 4 bids, and think 5 is probably most likely, with an outside shot at 6 (or 7 if there's a BET surprise). Breaking down everyone's chances...

IN -- Villanova and Xavier

The Wildcats and Musketeers are absolute locks. They could lose out and still be comfortably on the right side of the bubble.

LIKELY IN -- Seton Hall

Not quite a lock yet, but look at their schedule. St. John's (A), Providence (H), Xavier (H), Butler (A), DePaul (A). If they beat the Johnnies and DPU, have to think that will have them on the right side of the bubble, and two of their three toughest games are at home. The Hall needs three total wins to be guaranteed a spot, but even going 2-4 (with a BET loss) would probably be enough at 20-11 (10-8), RPI 65, SOS 63. Anything more than that and they're locks.

LIKELY IN -- Providence

After beating 'Nova, the Friars looked like they were cruising to a top-4 seed. Since then, they are 2-4. Thank god for the Hoyas, as both of those wins are over Georgetown. PC has a fairly pedestrian finish. Seton Hall (A), DePaul (H), Creighton (H), St. John's (A). Beat the bottom-feeders and their stellar non-con would put them at 21-11 (9-9) even if they lost their first BET game. They won't be in that top-4 seed range, but Providence has very little work to do to make the tourney.

ON THE BUBBLE -- Butler

Butler is in a similar situation to the Hall and PC, but they don't get to play DePaul and St. John's in the next two weeks, making their road a little tougher. Villanova (A), Georgetown (A), Seton Hall (H), Marquette (H) is how they finish their season. Win two of those and Butler probably gets in. Get three or one at MSG and they will be in. If I were guessing now, I'd say Butler is the fifth and final team in from the Big East.

ON THE BUBBLE -- Creighton

The Jays are interesting. Their best non-con win was lowly Nebraska, missing big chances against Indiana, Oklahoma, and Arizona State while also dropping a bad loss to Loyola. Had they won two more of those, they'd be close to locks. Because they didn't, they have the same magic number of total wins (12) that Marquette does to get in. Considering they need four more wins to be assured a bid, their schedule looks daunting. Marquette (H), St. John's (H), Providence (A), Xavier (A). Even if they win 3 of those, they'll still need to do work at MSG because they'll be looking at a sub-70 RPI. Creighton really needs to win their next three then hope they can catch fire in NYC for at least a game or two. I think they will come up short and be one of the top seeds in the NIT.

VIRTUALLY OUT -- Marquette

We are on life support. If they run the table to the BET Final and lose, I think they would get in, but considering how little tourney games seem to factor into seeding, I wouldn't be confident. After losing to Creighton, the best chance seems to be winning the Big East Tournament. Any loss in the conference season or BET earlier than that probably ends any hopes.

VIRTUALLY OUT -- Georgetown

The Hoyas are a team like Marquette. Any rational, neutral observer could have told you they had virtually no chance a month ago. Only the diehard fans would have believed they could get in. They had an awful non-con. Despite playing tough teams, two bad losses (Radford and Asheville) coupled with six total losses after squandering a late lead at UConn is just poor. And with 7 conference losses already, any at-large bid would include a minimum of 14 losses even if they were to win out. Of course, the rest of their conference slate is tough, with them likely underdogs in 3/4 games. Xavier (H), Butler (H), Marquette (A), Villanova (A). Lose any one of those and their at-large dreams are completely dead. No way the committee takes a 15-loss team.

OUT -- DePaul and St. John's

Expected before and during the entire season. No surprises here.

My guess is that Villanova and Xavier both end up on the top-three seed lines. Seton Hall and Providence should both get in, probably in the 5-9 range depending on how they finish. Then I think Butler also sneaks in a bit lower, probably 8-11. Creighton, Marquette, and Georgetown all have their possibilities listed, if any of them get in as an at-large, it's probably in the play-in games. All three have different problems with their resumes. For Creighton, just too many losses in the non-conference. They could have got in had they scheduled tougher or won a couple more, but 4 losses against a mediocre non-con is just too much. For Marquette, obviously it's our non-con. Granted, win enough in conference and you render that irrelevant, but we didn't, so we didn't have any margin for error. And for Georgetown, they just needed to win more in non-conference. Beat Radford and Asheville and 9-9 in league probably would have been enough because they played such a difficult non-con and the wins over Wisconsin and Syracuse look a lot better now than they did a month ago. You just can't lose 6 non-con games and hope to get in unless you are great in conference play, which they haven't been.

[MarquetteDano]

So...I thought I'd post some thoughts on the teams in this league as far as where they stand regarding the tournament.

Thanks for this Brew. This was more enlightening for the teams that actually have a chance (not us). For Marquette I think it is time to start looking at what it will take to get an NIT offer. It is certainly no lock at this point.

[MerrittsMustache]

Nice work, brew.

I tend to think that 10 BE wins (i.e over .500 in the conference) would get Creighton, Providence and/or Butler in.

At 9-9, the BET would have some importance for these teams if they play each other or if they're able to knock off Nova or Xavier.

[mu03eng]

So...I thought I'd post some thoughts on the teams in this league as far as where they stand regarding the tournament. Right now, I don't see any way we don't get a minimum of 4 bids, and think 5 is probably most likely, with an outside shot at 6 (or 7 if there's a BET surprise). Breaking down everyone's chances...

Outstanding work as usual. I agree that the Big East gets 5 at most unless there is some crazy in the BET.

Marquette is definitely out now unless they some how run the regular season table and win at least 2 in the BET.

I think Marquette has to beat DePaul plus two wins out of Creighton, Butler, Nova, and Gtown plus a BET to be assured an NIT bid. It's a hard bubble this year and I think a fair number of teams that would be in the dance normally will be out, taking up spots in the NIT (lot of regular season champs not getting NCAA bids).

[jsglow]

Outstanding work as usual. I agree that the Big East gets 5 at most unless there is some crazy in the BET.

Marquette is definitely out now unless they some how run the regular season table and win at least 2 in the BET.

I think Marquette has to beat DePaul plus two wins out of Creighton, Butler, Nova, and Gtown plus a BET to be assured an NIT bid. It's a hard bubble this year and I think a fair number of teams that would be in the dance normally will be out, taking up spots in the NIT (lot of regular season champs not getting NCAA bids).

Agree.  Good work Brew.  I agree with eng that MU's reasonable goal must be the NIT.  That quest starts Saturday.  The guys really can't afford to lose to DePaul again.

[ChicosBailBonds]

He also thought they had a legit shot at a one seed, if I remember correctly. To be fair, he was much more spot on on MU than most of us were!

That's because he used his brain to evaluate us, used his heart to evaluate his own team.  That's the achilles heal with most posters here, the eyeballs and brain see things or ignore things they shouldn't about our team.  We too easily hide the bad stuff, or assume the absolutely best case scenario with our expectations, or the flip side go overboard the other way.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

That's because he used his brain to evaluate us, used his heart to evaluate his own team.  That's the achilles heal with most posters here, the eyeballs and brain see things or ignore things they shouldn't about our team.  We too easily hide the bad stuff, or assume the absolutely best case scenario with our expectations, or the flip side go overboard the other way.

That's called diehard fandom.

[Herman Cain]

So...I thought I'd post some thoughts on the teams in this league as far as where they stand regarding the tournament. Right now, I don't see any way we don't get a minimum of 4 bids, and think 5 is probably most likely, with an outside shot at 6 (or 7 if there's a BET surprise). Breaking down everyone's chances...

IN -- Villanova and Xavier

The Wildcats and Musketeers are absolute locks. They could lose out and still be comfortably on the right side of the bubble.

LIKELY IN -- Seton Hall

Not quite a lock yet, but look at their schedule. St. John's (A), Providence (H), Xavier (H), Butler (A), DePaul (A). If they beat the Johnnies and DPU, have to think that will have them on the right side of the bubble, and two of their three toughest games are at home. The Hall needs three total wins to be guaranteed a spot, but even going 2-4 (with a BET loss) would probably be enough at 20-11 (10-8), RPI 65, SOS 63. Anything more than that and they're locks.

LIKELY IN -- Providence

After beating 'Nova, the Friars looked like they were cruising to a top-4 seed. Since then, they are 2-4. Thank god for the Hoyas, as both of those wins are over Georgetown. PC has a fairly pedestrian finish. Seton Hall (A), DePaul (H), Creighton (H), St. John's (A). Beat the bottom-feeders and their stellar non-con would put them at 21-11 (9-9) even if they lost their first BET game. They won't be in that top-4 seed range, but Providence has very little work to do to make the tourney.

ON THE BUBBLE -- Butler

Butler is in a similar situation to the Hall and PC, but they don't get to play DePaul and St. John's in the next two weeks, making their road a little tougher. Villanova (A), Georgetown (A), Seton Hall (H), Marquette (H) is how they finish their season. Win two of those and Butler probably gets in. Get three or one at MSG and they will be in. If I were guessing now, I'd say Butler is the fifth and final team in from the Big East.

ON THE BUBBLE -- Creighton

The Jays are interesting. Their best non-con win was lowly Nebraska, missing big chances against Indiana, Oklahoma, and Arizona State while also dropping a bad loss to Loyola. Had they won two more of those, they'd be close to locks. Because they didn't, they have the same magic number of total wins (12) that Marquette does to get in. Considering they need four more wins to be assured a bid, their schedule looks daunting. Marquette (H), St. John's (H), Providence (A), Xavier (A). Even if they win 3 of those, they'll still need to do work at MSG because they'll be looking at a sub-70 RPI. Creighton really needs to win their next three then hope they can catch fire in NYC for at least a game or two. I think they will come up short and be one of the top seeds in the NIT.

VIRTUALLY OUT -- Marquette

We are on life support. If they run the table to the BET Final and lose, I think they would get in, but considering how little tourney games seem to factor into seeding, I wouldn't be confident. After losing to Creighton, the best chance seems to be winning the Big East Tournament. Any loss in the conference season or BET earlier than that probably ends any hopes.

VIRTUALLY OUT -- Georgetown

The Hoyas are a team like Marquette. Any rational, neutral observer could have told you they had virtually no chance a month ago. Only the diehard fans would have believed they could get in. They had an awful non-con. Despite playing tough teams, two bad losses (Radford and Asheville) coupled with six total losses after squandering a late lead at UConn is just poor. And with 7 conference losses already, any at-large bid would include a minimum of 14 losses even if they were to win out. Of course, the rest of their conference slate is tough, with them likely underdogs in 3/4 games. Xavier (H), Butler (H), Marquette (A), Villanova (A). Lose any one of those and their at-large dreams are completely dead. No way the committee takes a 15-loss team.

OUT -- DePaul and St. John's

Expected before and during the entire season. No surprises here.

My guess is that Villanova and Xavier both end up on the top-three seed lines. Seton Hall and Providence should both get in, probably in the 5-9 range depending on how they finish. Then I think Butler also sneaks in a bit lower, probably 8-11. Creighton, Marquette, and Georgetown all have their possibilities listed, if any of them get in as an at-large, it's probably in the play-in games. All three have different problems with their resumes. For Creighton, just too many losses in the non-conference. They could have got in had they scheduled tougher or won a couple more, but 4 losses against a mediocre non-con is just too much. For Marquette, obviously it's our non-con. Granted, win enough in conference and you render that irrelevant, but we didn't, so we didn't have any margin for error. And for Georgetown, they just needed to win more in non-conference. Beat Radford and Asheville and 9-9 in league probably would have been enough because they played such a difficult non-con and the wins over Wisconsin and Syracuse look a lot better now than they did a month ago. You just can't lose 6 non-con games and hope to get in unless you are great in conference play, which they haven't been.

This is a very good analysis. I think there is a good probability that the committee will consider the strength of our conference this year and weigh the conference wins accordingly. As such, I think a team like Creighton has a decent shot of making it in. I agree the key for Creighton will be winning a game in the conference tournament. 

I think Marquette can help the rest of the league by winning the DePaul and Georgetown game. Helps overall strength of league. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

That's called diehard fandom.

Yup....and it leads to silly talk and lost money when gambling.     Also leads to unneeded depression and anger when losses pile up and the person has no idea he should have seen that coming  miles away.

[Wade for President]

I know they floundered, but I just can't imagine them not getting in. 

I hope the committee were to attribute Butler's struggles more to the grind of the Big East versus anything else. 

There's no doubt in my mind that Butler could compete and win against a lot of these projected 9-12 seeds. 

Hope they get a shot.

[Benny B]

Yup....and it leads to silly talk and lost money when gambling.     Also leads to unneeded depression and anger when losses pile up and the person has no idea he should have seen that coming  miles away.

So the Carolina fan who bet on the Panthers to win the Super Bowl is a moron right... because he bet with his heart, not his mind?

[Lennys Tap]

So the Carolina fan who bet on the Panthers to win the Super Bowl is a moron right... because he bet with his heart, not his mind?

Sure. But he was a genius when he bet on the same Panthers to cover against Seattle and Arizona. Chico bats 1.000 as long as he picks after the game ends.