Bucks to unveil $500 million stadium plan just north of BC

[MerrittsMustache]

This could have happened.  And downtown would have benefited.  Except .. attendance at Brewers games would be about a quarter less.

Milwaukee is a cheap town, and over the past couple decades, the Brewers were a sub-mediocre ball club.   I'm comfortable guessing that the majority of folks in the stands are not there to see the glory that is baseball .. which is why they have security people kicking people IN TO the stadium after the 3rd inning, as so many are quite content drinking their 50 cent beers instead of $8 ones, locked in to a seat watching some painful game.

That "quarter" of missing fans would have been more than made up by people, particularly young people, living downtown who would attend more games if the stadium was easy for them to get to.

[Groin_pull]

Doubt it. Young people aren't exactly flocking to MLB games these days.

[GOO]

Doubt it. Young people aren't exactly flocking to MLB games these days.

But if it was downtown and part of the social scene....

[The Lens]

Doubt it. Young people aren't exactly flocking to MLB games these days.

When's the last Brewers game you were at?  It's filled with twenty somethings who spend more time walking the concourse than watching the game.  Miller Park is a huge scene for young people.

In fact the Brewers reach 18-34 year old's at a higher rate than the Milwaukee market.

35% of their fans are 18-34, whereas 29% of the market is 18-34

[brewcity77]

When's the last Brewers game you were at?  It's filled with twenty somethings who spend more time walking the concourse than watching the game.  Miller Park is a huge scene for young people.

In fact the Brewers reach 18-34 year old's at a higher rate than the Milwaukee market.

35% of their fans are 18-34, whereas 29% of the market is 18-34

Agreed. My younger cousins are in their 20s and they and their friends flock religiously to Brewer games. Same goes for many of my co-workers, which includes quite a few guys under the age of 30. They don't just go to games but watch them regularly as well. It may not be the case nationally, but the Brewers have done a great job engaging the youth in this market.

[Herman Cain]

The owners of the Bucks are fully invested in the team financially and emotionally. The politicians really don't need to do anything to support the development of the arena, other than facilitate zoning etc. The Owners are pushing to see what they can get, it is in their nature. Politicians should just say no. Owners will just step in and get it done through commercial channels.  There are plenty of Financial institutions who will lend the money with the franchise as collateral.

At the end of the day if the Bucks do it privately, my sense is they will get more community support.

MU is in a no lose situation. Just let it all play out.   

[warriorchick]

That "quarter" of missing fans would have been more than made up by people, particularly young people, living downtown who would attend more games if the stadium was easy for them to get to.

Yeah, Miller Park is so hard to get to. 

It's an express bus ride, or a 15-minute drive from anywhere in Milwaukee.

My bold assertion is that no one makes the decision to commit to a 3+ hour Brewers game based on the commute.

[MerrittsMustache]

Yeah, Miller Park is so hard to get to. 

It's an express bus ride, or a 15-minute drive from anywhere in Milwaukee.

My bold assertion is that no one makes the decision to commit to a 3+ hour Brewers game based on the commute.

You're right. It's a 15-minute drive from anywhere in Milwaukee...which means that it's a 15-minute drive from anywhere in Milwaukee. There's a reason why nearly every other ballpark built in the last 20 years has been downtown or in a densely populated area.

You can look at it two ways:

1) I have tickets to a game and the commute isn't going to deter me from going.

2) I don't have tickets but I'm going to go to a game because the stadium is right there.

IOW, you're right that not many people would turn down a game because of the commute, but it's also fair to say that more people would go if they could commute there on foot.

When I was a 20-something living downtown, my buddies and I definitely would have gone to a lot more Brewers games if we could have made a quick walk to the stadium as opposed to driving 15 minutes, paying to park, then trekking 15 more minutes across the parking lot to get into the stadium all while trying to decide who was stuck being the DD. We'd often decide to go to a Bucks or Admirals games after happy hour-ing but I don't recall ever making a last-minute decision to go to a Brewers game.

[warriorchick]

When I was a 20-something living downtown, my buddies and I definitely would have gone to a lot more Brewers games if we could have made a quick walk to the stadium as opposed to driving 15 minutes, paying to park, then trekking 15 more minutes across the parking lot to get into the stadium all while trying to decide who was stuck being the DD. We'd often decide to go to a Bucks or Admirals games after happy hour-ing but I don't recall ever making a last-minute decision to go to a Brewers game.

So, single 20-somethings living downtown who are baseball fans comprise, what, 1-2% of the Milwaukee area's population? Let's be generous and assume they go to 10 additional games a year because the stadium is downtown.  My cyphering tells me that would increase attendance by less than 2,000 per game, and that is not taking into account suburbanites that would go to fewer games because of the hassle of coming downtown. If they attend 2-3 fewer games each, your increase would be wiped out.

[LAMUfan]

you could walk to a bar and get a free ride to miller park from downtown.  It's the easiest ball park to get to I've ever been too, and by far the most 20 somethings you are going to see (in the parking lot at least)

[MerrittsMustache]

So, single 20-somethings living downtown who are baseball fans comprise, what, 1-2% of the Milwaukee area's population? Let's be generous and assume they go to 10 additional games a year because the stadium is downtown.  My cyphering tells me that would increase attendance by less than 2,000 per game, and that is not taking into account suburbanites that would go to fewer games because of the hassle of coming downtown. If they attend 2-3 fewer games each, your increase would be wiped out.

So, fewer suburbanites would go because of the commute despite your bold assertion that "no one makes the decision to commit to a 3+ hour Brewers game based on the commute."

We're clearly not going to agree on this and that's fine. The fact of the matter is that Miller Park is one of the very few "new" stadiums that is not in a downtown or densely populated area. You just don't see many stadiums built in huge open spaces that are "15 minutes from anywhere" and there's a reason for that.

[MerrittsMustache]

you could walk to a bar and get a free ride to miller park from downtown.  It's the easiest ball park to get to I've ever been too, and by far the most 20 somethings you are going to see (in the parking lot at least)

Be honest, is it the only stadium you've ever been to? 

[mu03eng]

So, fewer suburbanites would go because of the commute despite your bold assertion that "no one makes the decision to commit to a 3+ hour Brewers game based on the commute."

We're clearly not going to agree on this and that's fine. The fact of the matter is that Miller Park is one of the very few "new" stadiums that is not in a downtown or densely populated area. You just don't see many stadiums built in huge open spaces that are "15 minutes from anywhere" and there's a reason for that.

The Vikings new stadium will be an interesting test case.

[GGGG]

When I was a 20-something living downtown, my buddies and I definitely would have gone to a lot more Brewers games if we could have made a quick walk to the stadium as opposed to driving 15 minutes, paying to park, then trekking 15 more minutes across the parking lot to get into the stadium all while trying to decide who was stuck being the DD. We'd often decide to go to a Bucks or Admirals games after happy hour-ing but I don't recall ever making a last-minute decision to go to a Brewers game.

You were doing it wrong.

I used to take the bus from downtown to the games for something like $2.  No need to pay to park.  No need to find a DD.

[mu_hilltopper]

The Vikings new stadium will be an interesting test case.

Why is it a test case?  It's on the same site as the old Dome.

.. As for 20 somethings invading a downtown stadium .. that's an interesting theory.  I don't believe it, but it's just as good as any theory with no data to rely on.

Anyone else have luck googling "Brewers demographics"...?

[MUfan12]

Anyone else have luck googling "Brewers demographics"...?

This was all I got-

[LAMUfan]

Be honest, is it the only stadium you've ever been to? 

Not quite.  I grew up on Dodger stadium and Fenway, both are pretty horrible for convenience although for totally different reasons.  Dodger dogs > fenway franks however (size wise  )

[GGGG]

This was all I got-

IS THAT GORMAN THOMAS!!!!

[mu_hilltopper]

This deserves a thread of its own.

[GOO]

That last picture totally encompasses the malaise and general feel of an average fan at a Brewers game.  Now, if the game were downtown, he'd have already left and be at the bars surrounding the stadium.  No driving, no bus....    Bud would have lost out on the parking revenue, however.

[We R Final Four]

That first picture looks like it was taken at Wrigley.

[Spotcheck Billy]

what do the last few pages have to do with a new Bucks arena?

[brewcity77]

what do the last few pages have to do with a new Bucks arena?

Absolutely nothing. But considering this mostly stayed on topic for the better part of 20 pages is a near miracle.

[Cooby Snacks]

That first picture looks like it was taken at Wrigley.

During the 1980s.

[brewcity77]

Back on topic...the Bucks are certainly trying to sell the idea that this will rejuvenate Milwaukee, while also trying to sell themselves as Wisconsin's team.

http://www.nba.com/bucks/release/arena