Marquette gambled ...

[NersEllenson]

How'd that work out for K having WoJo on the floor that long?

LOL - I'd give my left nut to have Wojo's production out of Derrick.  And for the team to have McDonald's All American's surrounding Derrick.

Wojo averaged 28.2 minutes per game as a senior.  Made 70, 2 point FGs - and my guess is they weren't all layups.  Made 54 3 point shots on 38.8% shooting.  Shot 73% from the FT line.  Scored 241 points for the year.  So while Derrick has similarities to Wojo (though I don't think Derrick will win Big East Defensive Player of the Year award), Wojo was still more talented.  Duh. 

http://goduke.statsgeek.com/basketball-m/seasons/season-stats.php?season=1997-98

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Hi genius:  Was Northwestern coming off of Sweet 16, Sweet 16, Elite 8 and have 7 Top 100 kids in the program when Collins took over?

Psssst, McIntosh was not a top 100 ranked player and I would take him over any of the guards Marquette currently has except for maybe Duane while their top 100 recruit hasnt played like it. Dont get in an argument with me over Northwestern athletics because you will look like more of a fool than you already do. Any coaching change takes transition. Its not a magical fix.

[Warrior]

If this is complete turmoil, I can't wait for next season! 

[NersEllenson]

Psssst, McIntosh was not a top 100 ranked player and I would take him over any of the guards Marquette currently has except for maybe Duane while their top 100 recruit hasnt played like it. Dont get in an argument with me over Northwestern athletics because you will look like more of a fool than you already do. Any coaching change takes transition. Its not a magical fix.

I have very little knowledge of Northwestern athletics - you are correct - other than knowing one of their current players...and he likes Collins.  I do know that all coaching transitions are NOT the same - as you seem to be trying to indicate?  Collins situation at NWestern was far more challenging than what Wojo walked into at MU.  WE sure hit the skids here at MU when Buzz took over for Crean.  That was a brutal transition.  Or wait - that actually seemed like a magical fix.   

[Shark]

If this is complete turmoil, I can't wait for next season! 

This just really highlights that although some people grow older with age, they don't necessarily grow up. People on this board want Marquette to win so badly and it's been anything but desirable. So instead of being a rational fan and pointing out that the record doesn't really tell the full story, we make endless threads lashing out at individual players. We fight about our own personal lives and whether or not you played in high school. We bring up one obscure stat to prove theories. And this is all because some people can't handle the fact that Marquette was sad last year and this year is even more, although expected, heartbreak. I'm gonna stay the optimism course while other posters lash out at obscure things. Once MU is great again those same posters ranting about Wojo will be horrified at the thought of him leaving.

[Nevada233]

This board has officially jumped the shark.

Yea, I'd say the same thing.... The team is not that good this year. No need for a new coach.

[MU B2002]

Tommy Amaker (Harvard Head Coach)
Amaker was fired at Michigan in 2007 and is now toiling in the obscurity of the Ivy League.

It's so convenient that you left out the fact that he has won the conference 4 years in a row.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Hi genius:  Was Northwestern coming off of Sweet 16, Sweet 16, Elite 8 and have 7 Top 100 kids in the program when Collins took over?

Was Marquette? I seem to recall that they were coming off a season where they missed the NIT.

and have 7 Top 100 kids in the program when Collins took over?

So? Florida Gators.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Neither pass the sniff test

Pretty sure I don't believe in teal.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Pretty sure I don't believe in teal.

Oh I know. But there are those still cursing that we didn't hire old Bennie. Figured I nip that in the bud

[jakeec]

This team only has a high level of talent if you take HS recruiting rankings as gospel. By that standard, Luke is better than Kaminsky, Juan is better than Hayes, Steve is better than Dukan, and Dekker is the only guy on your team that would start for Marquette.

Reality is recruiting rankings only have so much value. This is not a talented team.

So Marquette doesn't develop their players like Wisconsin does?  Is that your argument?

[jakeec]

No.  I assume you are all over Tony Bennet's a$$ after he blew one yesterday as well?

What does Tony Bennett have to do with Marquette and the hiring of Wojo?

[GGGG]

So Marquette doesn't develop their players like Wisconsin does?  Is that your argument?

To be honest, I think there is some truth in that.

But I also think that Bo does an excellent job with his system and recruiting players to fit that system. 

[🏀]

To be honest, I think there is some truth in that.

But I also think that Bo does an excellent job with his system and recruiting players to fit that system. 

Recently, there is truth to that.

Part of Wojo's allure to the search party was player development, which was thought to be substandard under Buzz.

Crean did a much better job developing players.

[dgies9156]

OK, suppose we did? So what....

We retained the best candidate available, bar none. That includes Shaka! I like what I see in Wojo.He's learning, just like O'Neill, Crean and the Hillbilly did when they started. He'll get better as he gets his own players in and as the existing players adapt to his system.

What we're seeing here is what I once described as the differences in expectations. All Marquette basketball fans can be split into three groups. The first is, "We're not good enough, he's gone in five years." These folks are quiet for now, but expect them to start howling again when Wojo gets our program back to where it belongs.

The second group is the "Good Lord, could it get any worse?" crowd. These folks were 1980s era grads of Marquette or Deane years grads and they think Marquette can't do anything right. Chicken Little came from this crowd.

The third group is anyone who graduated Marquette before 1982. Anything less than an NCAA bid is a failure and we're the folks screaming the loudest. We're the folks with this year's unrealistic expectations and we're the folks wondering where is our 20 win season, NCAA berth and plan to be national champion (as in, do you really think we could last 10 minutes with Kentucky -- not than anyone could!).

Hang in there folks. This year is a Lost Cause, but give the guy time. He deserves it.

[brewcity77]

What about those of us that have high hopes for Wojo, believe he can get us back to contending for conference titles, and might just stick around, especially if Duke looks elsewhere? No room for optimists? 

[Lennys Tap]

The third group is anyone who graduated Marquette before 1982. Anything less than an NCAA bid is a failure and we're the folks screaming the loudest. We're the folks with this year's unrealistic expectations and we're the folks wondering where is our 20 win season, NCAA berth and plan to be national champion (as in, do you really think we could last 10 minutes with Kentucky -- not than anyone could!).

Hang in there folks. This year is a Lost Cause, but give the guy time. He deserves it.

I'm in this group (1970) but I don't have unrealistic expectations. I fully realize that a 10 year run (1969-1978) as the second best program in the country is virtually impossible. Buzz brought us closer than we've been since and for that and other reasons I loved the guy. But the folks running things today are uncomfortable with a guy like Buzz (or Al) as the face of the program. They want a button down, white bread, blue blazer guy whose quotes won't surprise them and who won't sweat too much on the sidelines. Their call.

I hope the "Duke North" concept works. I think Wojo's a solid guy and he knows the game. His first recruiting class is top notch. This year I give Wojo a mulligan. My hope is that a couple of years down the road we're back to where Buzz got us. Patience.

[WI inferiority Complexes]

So I woke up with a massive hangover. Turns out Milwaukee isn't as big as it seems. I visited 4 bars 3 miles apart and ran into people I knew at all of them. Pretty sure I ate an entire pizza by myself. I am not ashamed of that. Vague memory of a one mile zombie march through the snow. I figured this post was as germane to a Marquette board as some of the posts in this thread since I wore my MU hat.

I'm a volunteer bar tender at my local Knights of Columbus.  Last night, former students of mine, (now well into their 20's) encouraged me to drink Fireball.  I didn't like it, but had probably a dozen shots anyway.  I don't remember any of the game, nor my mile and a half walk home.  I left my dripping wet clothes in the garage and passed out on the couch.  Yesterday, I was wearing a Marquette hoodie.

[Dawson Rental]

Maybe you need to get that there is not as much "talent" there as you think. I don't give a sh## what their ranking was coming out of HS. Here is the talent as I see it, Carlino, Duane Wilson and Sandy Cohen. Luke will be fine next season. STR just is not panning out and JJJ is still trying to figure it out. JA is a sixth man on most teams. So, that is the "talent"

When I read your post the thought that I had is that you define talent as the ability to make a three point shot.  Rebounding and defense seem to get the short shift in your definition.

[Dawson Rental]

I love the whole "5-year plan" laid out by Wojo in his interview.  Newsflash - This program wasn't in nearly the shambles it was when Kevin O'Neill and Tom Crean took over.

Everyone has a major hard on over Wojo for basically one reason at this point:  Henry Ellenson.  Heldt, Cheatham, and Nick N are simply guys in the 75-100 ranking range - which is the level we'd been recruiting at for 5 years under Buzz.

Wojo has personnel on this team that can be victorious - particularly so had Burton not bailed on him.  And it isn't Derrick's fault that Wojo has come to the conclusion that his clone needs to be on the floor for 35 minutes to apparently give the team its best chance to win.  The reality though, however, is much like last year - we don't win, and our team is having another historically bad year offensively.  Gee - I wonder what my be the primary cause?    Did Buzz all of a sudden just forget how to coach offense last year?  Buzz's team's ORatings:  12, 22, 21, 52, 25, 96, and now 109??

Wojo lost Burton, Mayo and Dawson.  Burton and Dawson were good attitude kids.  The team should have 10 guys on it.  Other teams keep beating us playing 7 and 8 players.  7 of our 8 players are ranked in the Top 52 in the Big East. 

And as for hating on the original poster - the pedigree of Coach K assistants, is NOT good.  Perhaps Wojo will be the exception to the rule.  I'm skeptical.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aR_vxJKLJ54

[79Warrior]

When I read your post the thought that I had is that you define talent as the ability to make a three point shot.  Rebounding and defense seem to get the short shift in your definition.

Nope. Overall ability. Never mentioned shooting. Imo, our record is a reflection of that.

[jakeec]

7 top 100 guys THIS YEAR guys on that roster.  Will Marquette fans be patient for the next few years not in the tournament?

[BCHoopster]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aR_vxJKLJ54

Kevin O'Neal, Tom Crean, Buzz Williams were all assistants, so is Wojo.  Give him a chance.  Love his staff, next 4 recruits critical.  Hope they are building some relations with whomever they are recruiting.  Unless they sign a point this year, next year they will be to young. will be another challenging year.

[Goose]

Lenny

I agree completely that MU is uncomfortable having a "grey area" type coach. You are also correct that we were spoiled badly back in the day and that does jade our thinking to some degree. I lean to "grey area" when picking a coach and I 100% believe MU runs from that now.

[Lennys Tap]

Lenny

I agree completely that MU is uncomfortable having a "grey area" type coach. You are also correct that we were spoiled badly back in the day and that does jade our thinking to some degree. I lean to "grey area" when picking a coach and I 100% believe MU runs from that now.

Big, dynamic personalities (Al, KO and Buzz) or big luck (TC with Wade) have been the blueprint for success at MU in the past. We swung and missed at another dynamo in Shaka. Wojo's anything but that but he has a lot of good things going for him. My biggest short term fear is that Henry is good enough to be a one and done but that his supporting cast won't help him enough to make a real splash next year. Buzz completely rebuilt our roster by year 3 and the result was S16,S16, E8. If Henry's gone in year 3 (or even if he isn't) that's a high bar.