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Author Topic: Kevin Love trade  (Read 15359 times)

wadesworld

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2014, 06:45:49 PM »
Livingston was injured - not nexessarily over rated.

Love is comparable to Bosh 4 years ago - a very good player, but not sure I would call him elite.

Love averaged 26 points, 13 rebounds, and 4.5 assists per game last year on 46% shooting and 37% from beyond the arc last year.  Curious to know what he has to do to be considered elite in your mind.
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ChitownSpaceForRent

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #26 on: July 23, 2014, 06:46:46 PM »
I know Sheridan reported it, but I still believe the Wolves are leaking this.

This Bulls offer is the same one they offered last year (Gibson, Mirotic, 1st rounder, which is McDermott).

I'm not buying into any of it.

I believe this one is legit. The Bulls have a surplus of stretch 4s. This way they keep their very shallow back court in tact and they get rid of what they have extras of, stretch 4s. Plus Mirotic and Mcdermott are unproven and Taj is almost 30 already. Great trade for the Bulls if it were to happen.

DegenerateDish

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #27 on: July 23, 2014, 07:07:10 PM »
I'm not saying it isn't legit, it's just the same offer that's been on the table for months (except McDermott is the first round pick).

This is quite easy to report, because its existed for so long.

I'd like to see the Bulls keep one of either Mirotic or McDermott personally, and send Kings protected 2015 first rounder, but probably not enough.

ChitownSpaceForRent

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #28 on: July 23, 2014, 07:10:38 PM »
I'm not saying it isn't legit, it's just the same offer that's been on the table for months (except McDermott is the first round pick).

This is quite easy to report, because its existed for so long.

I'd like to see the Bulls keep one of either Mirotic or McDermott personally, and send Kings protected 2015 first rounder, but probably not enough.

Meh. Im ok with sending both away. Love is still only 25 and proven. I just have this feeling Mcdermott is gonna turn into Adam Morrison. Mirotic is an interesting prospect but id take Love over him.

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2014, 07:21:29 PM »
I'd like to see what Nikola has, but won't be upset to see him go.

Of course if they trade Taj, he's going to average 20/15 on the Wolves. #chicagostupid

ChitownSpaceForRent

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #30 on: July 23, 2014, 07:29:15 PM »
I'd like to see what Nikola has, but won't be upset to see him go.

Of course if they trade Taj, he's going to average 20/15 on the Wolves. #chicagostupid

Ive never been that impressed with Taj. Never struck me as a player who could be a solid starter night in and night out.

DegenerateDish

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #31 on: July 23, 2014, 07:29:24 PM »
I'd like to see what Nikola has, but won't be upset to see him go.

Of course if they trade Taj, he's going to average 20/15 on the Wolves. #chicagostupid

I'm intrigued by Miritoc and McDermott, mostly because the Bulls have lacked pure scorers for so long, and because Noah is an ideal guy for them to play with.

Love is clearly a top 10-5 player, and if he's available, you get him.

All comes down to Rose and whatever he has left.

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #32 on: July 23, 2014, 07:32:27 PM »
Ive never been that impressed with Taj. Never struck me as a player who could be a solid starter night in and night out.

I agree. He has some great, great bursts of output though. He also tugs at the strings of the meatheads.

I'm intrigued by Miritoc and McDermott, mostly because the Bulls have lacked pure scorers for so long, and because Noah is an ideal guy for them to play with.

Love is clearly a top 10-5 player, and if he's available, you get him.

All comes down to Rose and whatever he has left.

This is what worries me.

If Rose has 85%+ of what he had, make the trade for Love. Go for it.

If Rose is less than that, I don't trade those assets. I don't know what to do except tickle the flames of basketball hell.

brandx

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #33 on: July 23, 2014, 08:12:04 PM »
Love averaged 26 points, 13 rebounds, and 4.5 assists per game last year on 46% shooting and 37% from beyond the arc last year.  Curious to know what he has to do to be considered elite in your mind.

I don't want to argue on this cuz you'd probably win. I guess maybe my point was that big numbers on a non-playoff team don't mean that much to me. When you are the best offensive option (by far) on a bad team and always the #1 option when your team has the ball, you are gonna have big numbers.

Bosh averaged 24 pts and 11 Rebs in his last year with the Raptors. Those, too, are elite - or near elite - numbers but I considered him a very good player rather than elite.

So, I guess our difference is that you think he is elite and I consider him to be a very good player - maybe not top 10 in the league, but close.

If he goes to Cleveland and puts up something like 24 and 12 while playing solid "D" - then I would put him at the elite category. Because he would be doing that on a team with 2 other very good offensive options.

DegenerateDish

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #34 on: July 23, 2014, 08:27:13 PM »
I agree. He has some great, great bursts of output though. He also tugs at the strings of the meatheads.

This is what worries me.

If Rose has 85%+ of what he had, make the trade for Love. Go for it.

If Rose is less than that, I don't trade those assets. I don't know what to do except tickle the flames of basketball hell.

+ Infinity

If Rose is close to old Rose, you're all in on Love.

If Rose sucks, you almost need those guys to give you more scoring options. Clearly Love is the best player here, but I think for a potential trade to be great, Rose has to be good to great again. We'll see.

frozena pizza

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #35 on: July 24, 2014, 09:37:28 AM »
It may seem a bit far fetched, but as a Wolves fan I'm starting to hope they just hang on to Love.  They know that they had a lot of bad luck last year and were better than their record.  Add a few free agents to add some depth and try to make a playoff run, then if he wants to leave for less money next year that's up to him.  If the Wolves are below .500 by the trade deadline they could still make a deal then, but none of the packages being discussed are particularly compelling.  I wouldn't mind getting Wiggins I guess and the Cavs should be begging the Wolves to make that deal.  Love is a unique talent and a top 5 player in the league and players like that rarely hit the trade market.

swoopem

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #36 on: July 24, 2014, 09:55:57 AM »
If the Bulls trade for Love is Pau the 6th man or do they both start and Love plays the 3?

Obviously these are problems you worry about once Love is a Bull, but it'll be interesting.
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Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #37 on: July 24, 2014, 10:19:26 AM »
I don't want to argue on this cuz you'd probably win. I guess maybe my point was that big numbers on a non-playoff team don't mean that much to me. When you are the best offensive option (by far) on a bad team and always the #1 option when your team has the ball, you are gonna have big numbers.

Bosh averaged 24 pts and 11 Rebs in his last year with the Raptors. Those, too, are elite - or near elite - numbers but I considered him a very good player rather than elite.

So, I guess our difference is that you think he is elite and I consider him to be a very good player - maybe not top 10 in the league, but close.

If he goes to Cleveland and puts up something like 24 and 12 while playing solid "D" - then I would put him at the elite category. Because he would be doing that on a team with 2 other very good offensive options.

I think some of Love's value is his efficiency, and he doesn't need the ball every possession to be effective. He's a great rebounder, and if you took some of his offensive responsibilities away, he might be even better.

He's not a high volume guy stuck on a bad team.

He can run pick & roll offense, or you can just put him on the weakside and let him create some havoc in the lane, or even by stretching the defense (have to guard him out to the 3pt line).

He can also run some high/low stuff, which makes him more versatile than most 4/5's.

JWags85

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #38 on: July 24, 2014, 10:46:36 AM »
If the Bulls trade for Love is Pau the 6th man or do they both start and Love plays the 3?

Obviously these are problems you worry about once Love is a Bull, but it'll be interesting.

Absolutely.  The ability to bring Pau off the bench, and manage his minutes, given that he's had a few injuries and is in his mid 30s would be excellent in terms of increasing his effectiveness and efficiency.

MU82

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #39 on: July 24, 2014, 11:54:52 AM »
+ Infinity

If Rose is close to old Rose, you're all in on Love.

If Rose sucks, you almost need those guys to give you more scoring options. Clearly Love is the best player here, but I think for a potential trade to be great, Rose has to be good to great again. We'll see.

If I'm Love and I have any say in this at all, I'd rather go to Cleveland.

I don't know if Rose will ever truly be Rose again - or if he is, for how long before the next injury strikes. I do know that Rose, even at his MVP best, never sniffed an NBA title.

Meanwhile, I know for certain that LeBron figures to be the best basketball player in the world for several more years. I also know he has led two franchises to the NBA Finals 5 times and wears two championship rings.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #40 on: July 24, 2014, 12:06:47 PM »
Absolutely.  The ability to bring Pau off the bench, and manage his minutes, given that he's had a few injuries and is in his mid 30s would be excellent in terms of increasing his effectiveness and efficiency.

Agreed. Obviously not an apples to apples comparison, but Bill Walton had a nice resurgence with Boston when he became a role player and they could limit his minutes.

Spotcheck Billy

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #41 on: August 07, 2014, 09:04:32 AM »
The Minnesota Timberwolves have reached an agreement in principle to send All-Star forward Kevin Love to the Cleveland Cavaliers for Andrew Wiggins, Anthony Bennett and a protected 2015 first-round draft pick, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

Cleveland is making the deal with Minnesota with a firm agreement Love will opt out of his contract in 2015 and re-sign with the Cavaliers on a five-year, $120 million-plus contract extension, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

The deal cannot be finalized until Aug. 23, because Wiggins, the No. 1 overall pick in the 2014 NBA draft, cannot be traded until one month after the signing of his rookie contract. The two teams have agreed to the deal, but neither would have recourse if the other decided to pull out of the arrangement before it can be formally completed this month. No third team is involved in the Cavaliers-Timberwolves trade agreement.

The precise deal terms have been agreed upon for weeks, but the teams and Love plan to stay silent about the particulars until the trade is announced in 16 days, sources told Yahoo Sports.

Part of the Cavaliers' motivation in making the deal for Love was a belief Love would have ended up with the rival Chicago Bulls in a trade and created a significant obstacle in the Eastern Conference, sources said. Cleveland wouldn't have had the salary-cap space to sign Love next summer and could have only obtained him through the trade with Minnesota in a deal now.

Wiggins is the centerpiece of the package for Minnesota. The Timberwolves see superstar potential in the forward out of Kansas. Bennett, the No. 1 pick in the 2013 draft, has shown signs of progress after a difficult start to his rookie season.

The T'wolves had hopes of unloading contracts in a Love deal, but that won't be happening. Minnesota still has a goal of freeing itself of J.J. Barea, Luc Mbah a Moute and Alexey Shved, league sources said.

StillAWarrior

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #42 on: August 07, 2014, 09:23:36 AM »
I think the Cavs gave up too much.  But, they're going to be fun to watch next season.
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swoopem

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #43 on: August 07, 2014, 09:39:57 AM »
I think the Cavs gave up too much.  But, they're going to be fun to watch next season.

You think so? Wiggins absolutely has potential and could become a star, but that could take 5 years which is how long Love's deal is. Bennett on the other hand might turn into a role player if he has vast improvement. I'm not ready to write him off. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but I don't think he'll be a, say, 16 & 8 type of guy. Also, the first round pick is protected which works in Cleveland's favor.  If I'm Cleveland I do this trade 8 days a week.
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GGGG

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #44 on: August 07, 2014, 09:41:21 AM »
It's a trade that benefits both teams.  Cleveland needs a proven star to go with Lebron, and the Wolves need to build for the future.  Both got what they needed.

StillAWarrior

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #45 on: August 07, 2014, 10:10:57 AM »
You think so? Wiggins absolutely has potential and could become a star, but that could take 5 years which is how long Love's deal is. Bennett on the other hand might turn into a role player if he has vast improvement. I'm not ready to write him off. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but I don't think he'll be a, say, 16 & 8 type of guy. Also, the first round pick is protected which works in Cleveland's favor.  If I'm Cleveland I do this trade 8 days a week.

It's not so much that I think Cleveland gave up too much (although I think that it is debatable), it's just that I think that they might have been able to get Love for less if they'd waited a bit.  Minnesota had to trade Love.  They could not risk losing him and getting nothing in return.  I think down the road, the price would have been lower.  And, worst case scenario, I think they could have picked him up next summer if Minnesota traded him to someone else.  Love made no bones about wanting to play in Cleveland (i.e., play with Lebron), so I think he wouldn't have done a long term sign and trade deal with anyone else.  So, I'm not sure anyone else would have offered nearly the package that the Cavs would offer.

Don't get me wrong...as a Clevelander, I'm not upset about the trade.  In fact, I'm very excited for what Love brings and how the team will look next season.  I just think that the Cavs should have stared the Timberwolves down a little more to see if they could get them to blink first.
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wadesworld

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #46 on: August 07, 2014, 10:55:30 AM »
Does next year's Cavs roster match up better with the Spurs?  What if it's the Thunder or Clippers (heck, maybe even Blazers or Mavs) that make it to the Finals?

Just points of discussion.  I'd still take the Spurs, mainly because every single year I keep thinking, "This is their last chance to win the Finals, they're getting too old," and every year they're right back in the thick of things.  Then again, we're 10 months away from that point...
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flash

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #47 on: August 07, 2014, 11:33:45 AM »
I think the Cavs gave up too much.  But, they're going to be fun to watch next season.

Gave up too much??? Anthony Bennett was awful last year for a 1st overall pick, Andrew Wiggins has never played a minute in the NBA, and the Cavs 1st round pick is likely to be in the high 20's.  Sounds like a great deal for the Cavs. 

Spotcheck Billy

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #48 on: August 07, 2014, 12:04:34 PM »
^ plus they're likely to get the overall #1 pick again in the next year or 2

MUfan12

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Re: Kevin Love trade
« Reply #49 on: August 07, 2014, 12:16:56 PM »
Gave up too much??? Anthony Bennett was awful last year for a 1st overall pick, Andrew Wiggins has never played a minute in the NBA, and the Cavs 1st round pick is likely to be in the high 20's.  Sounds like a great deal for the Cavs. 

Bennett was bad, and very lazy from what I've been told. Some think he'll be out of the league in 5 years.

 

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