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Next up: A long offseason

Marquette
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Marquette
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Date/Time: Oct 4, 2025
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Schedule for 2024-25
New Mexico
75

Lennys Tap

Quote from: Ners on June 02, 2014, 11:58:00 AM
After his success at MU - which no one will deny - he sure as hell seemingly could have landed at a program much better than VaTech, no??  Then again, perhaps Buzz doesn't like the pressure of high expectations, and being expected to be a big time winner that would go along with being at a more high profile basketball school...?





He told you he danced to a different drummer. He told you that it was about relationships and happiness, not geography or a school's basketball profile. You and most others didn't listen. You obsessed over him leaving for the pretty girl (Texas). I guess some guys are too thick to think outside the box regarding career choices, too self important and insecure to choose happy over other's perception of success.

I don't know all the details that eventually turned happy into miserable for Buzz at MU. And I'm not suggesting that Buzz shouldn't take some responsibility for that unhappiness. But the simple fact is this: when the relationships that Buzz held dear and the dynamic at Marquette that he loved were severed or changed he became unhappy. And when he looked around, he sought his best friend's advice about where he was most likely to find the relationships to make happy possible again. If you were ever actually listening to him you wouldn't have been all that surprised.


GGGG

Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 02, 2014, 01:19:55 PM
He told you he danced to a different drummer. He told you that it was about relationships and happiness, not geography or a school's basketball profile. You and most others didn't listen. You obsessed over him leaving for the pretty girl (Texas). I guess some guys are too thick to think outside the box regarding career choices, too self important and insecure to choose happy over other's perception of success.

I don't know all the details that eventually turned happy into miserable for Buzz at MU. And I'm not suggesting that Buzz shouldn't take some responsibility for that unhappiness. But the simple fact is this: when the relationships that Buzz held dear and the dynamic at Marquette that he loved were severed or changed he became unhappy. And when he looked around, he sought his best friend's advice about where he was most likely to find the relationships to make happy possible again. If you were ever actually listening to him you wouldn't have been all that surprised.


Exactly. 

Ners, you were the one that was openly pissed that LW and the new administration was "messing with Buzz's happy." 

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=36527.msg461631#msg461631

So now that his happy has been messed with, and he leaves, he is an arrogant, stubborn, egomaniac.  HE DID EXACTLY WHAT YOU THOUGHT HE WOULD DO!!!

Canned Goods n Ammo

Quote from: Ners on June 02, 2014, 12:52:23 PM
Character revealed...that's why....preaches and demands toughness out of his players...and then exhibits little to none himself.  Hypocrisy isn't an attractive quality in anyone.  To add further explanation...I'll give a Plus 1 to Chicos below:



I guess that's fair. It's part of being a fan, I suppose.

To be honest, I just don't fall in love with coaches anymore.

I know it's their job to sell EVERYBODY on their program, so I'm not surprised that they using a schtick or routine. 

Conversely, when a coach decides to leave, I don't get my feelings hurt either.

Maybe I need to be more emotional about this stuff.





GGGG

Quote from: Guns n Ammo on June 02, 2014, 01:54:34 PM
I guess that's fair. It's part of being a fan, I suppose.

To be honest, I just don't fall in love with coaches anymore.

I know it's their job to sell EVERYBODY on their program, so I'm not surprised that they using a schtick or routine. 

Conversely, when a coach decides to leave, I don't get my feelings hurt either.


This is pretty much where I stand as well. 

ChicosBailBonds

Quote from: Guns n Ammo on June 02, 2014, 01:54:34 PM
I guess that's fair. It's part of being a fan, I suppose.

To be honest, I just don't fall in love with coaches anymore.

I know it's their job to sell EVERYBODY on their program, so I'm not surprised that they using a schtick or routine. 

Conversely, when a coach decides to leave, I don't get my feelings hurt either.

Maybe I need to be more emotional about this stuff.

Smart man

Lennys Tap

Quote from: Guns n Ammo on June 02, 2014, 01:54:34 PM
I guess that's fair. It's part of being a fan, I suppose.

To be honest, I just don't fall in love with coaches anymore.

I know it's their job to sell EVERYBODY on their program, so I'm not surprised that they using a schtick or routine. 

Conversely, when a coach decides to leave, I don't get my feelings hurt either.

Maybe I need to be more emotional about this stuff.






How you handle your emotions is your business. I will not judge that.

If, however, if you're asserting that everyone in coaching (or any other profession) is alike, the same, no better, no worse (the Chico Principle), I will judge that. You're way too young to be that cynical - you'll never get your heart broken but you'll never be happy either.

GGGG

I don't need a basketball coach to say nice things about my alma mater to make me happy.  Want to make me happy?  Just win basketball games and represent the university well in the process.  That's it.

TAMU, Knower of Ball

I fall in love with coaches because they are my teams coach. They are men providing valuable service to my alma mater and providing me with a great deal of entertainment. I support,even during rough patches because in my mind that is a fans job. When you go down fifteen in the second half you don't start to boo, you cheer louder.

When coaches leave, as most do, they are no longer a part of my team. Thank them for their service and never give them a second thought. Start loving the next guy.
Quote from: Goose on January 15, 2023, 08:43:46 PM
TAMU

I do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.


ChicosBailBonds

Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 02, 2014, 03:32:55 PM
How you handle your emotions is your business. I will not judge that.

If, however, if you're asserting that everyone in coaching (or any other profession) is alike, the same, no better, no worse (the Chico Principle), I will judge that. You're way too young to be that cynical - you'll never get your heart broken but you'll never be happy either.

Quite to contrary, I've said often that they aren't all the same.  Yes, they can all ultimately act the way they do because it is part of their job to schmooze, put on the schtick, etc, but let's not let their actions of diction to fanbases that want to hear what they want to hear be somehow equivocated into who they really are behind the words.  I expect the coaches of my teams to do exactly what Buzz did or what any other coach does.  Whether one links what they say to how long they will be here, well that's a fool's device.  Messing with happy and all that bullshyte, that plays wonderful when only one person gets to decide what happy is and can then blame the rest of the world when his perceived definition of it is tampered with.

There are certain functions of one's job in these types of professions where coach speak is what it is, and from that perspective the similarities are there for all to see.  That doesn't mean at their core that they are, though unfortunately far too many have similar traits.  This is why I have brought up Mike Scioscia here often as someone I worked with that does not exude those traits.  Joe Madden is another.  So no, not all of them are alike, but too many are.

Canned Goods n Ammo

Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 02, 2014, 03:32:55 PM
How you handle your emotions is your business. I will not judge that.

If, however, if you're asserting that everyone in coaching (or any other profession) is alike, the same, no better, no worse (the Chico Principle), I will judge that. You're way too young to be that cynical - you'll never get your heart broken but you'll never be happy either.

I hear ya.

I guess I'm just fighting the meatball "Our school/coach is different!" mentality.

Are all coaches the same? No, obviously not.

But, every coach is going to SELL his/her program. They ALL do it.

What coach said this:
"I love it here at (insert school). We have a unique culture and a great history. We're going to do our best to make the alumni proud, and we're going to do it the right way, on and off the field.
We're going to have high standards for our kids, and we're going to push them farther than they ever thought possible. The real value is the degree that they earn, and I'm going to make sure they all get their degree because that's what (insert school) has always been about... dating all the way back to (insert famous former coach)."


Want a hint?: Nobody. I just made it up. But, it's hard to tell, right?

Wash. Rinse. Repeat.

bilsu

My expectations are that when a coach is hired he will last 5 years. While I do not like them leaving Crean lasted 9 years and Buzz 6 years. I expect Wojo to be here 5 years and he will either be fired or take the Duke job.

wadesworld

Quote from: bilsu on June 02, 2014, 05:42:47 PM
My expectations are that when a coach is hired he will last 5 years. While I do not like them leaving Crean lasted 9 years and Buzz 6 years. I expect Wojo to be here 5 years and he will either be fired or take the Duke job.

I bet he's here longer and ends up going somewhere other than Duke.

brandx

Quote from: wadesworld on June 02, 2014, 06:11:27 PM
I bet he's here longer and ends up going somewhere other than Duke.

Because of the lack of success of some of the Duke assistants, I think the path is clear for Collins or Wojo IF they have success the next 3 - 5 years.


Wojo'sMojo

Quote from: brandx on June 02, 2014, 06:32:39 PM
Because of the lack of success of some of the Duke assistants, I think the path is clear for Collins or Wojo IF they have success the next 3 - 5 years.



I believe ESPN just handicapped the odds a couple days ago and Tommy Amaker is the favorite right now.

NersEllenson

Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on June 02, 2014, 01:37:07 PM

Exactly. 

Ners, you were the one that was openly pissed that LW and the new administration was "messing with Buzz's happy." 

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=36527.msg461631#msg461631

So now that his happy has been messed with, and he leaves, he is an arrogant, stubborn, egomaniac.  HE DID EXACTLY WHAT YOU THOUGHT HE WOULD DO!!!

Yes Sultan....and Lenny...Here's my issue:  Buzz WON the power struggle with Larry.  I stand by my comments on Larry, and how he treated Buzz/commented on him to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel - thought it was terrible judgement 90 days on the job to essentially bash the cash cow of your department.  

My issue with Buzz is that he ultimately got what he wanted - rid of Larry, Wild the President at the time of his hire back in charge of the university, albeit if only temporarily...and an A.D. in Bill Cords who Kevin O'Neill flat out told Buzz was a very good A.D. to work under..and has a nice legacy at MU.  No, Cords wasn't Cottingham...but he sure as hell wasn't Larry Williams.

So...the landscape at MU returned a lot closer to Buzz's "happy" than it had been the 2 prior years when he CHOSE to stay at MU...but he then bolts for Va Tech?  And particularly if Sultan, as you say..Buzz wasn't encouraged to leave...it displays poor character and hypocrisy on Buzz's part - that at the first season and time of adversity..and some fans grumbling....he bails...to an outpost of a program.  It truly doesn't add up...that Buzz entirely left on his own volition...or didn't sense that he wasn't wanted by Wild or Cords any longer.  Perhaps they weren't going to fire Buzz...but they certainly let him know he wasn't going to get his way with everything...and Buzz picked up his ball and went to VaTech.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

TAMU, Knower of Ball

Quote from: bilsu on June 02, 2014, 05:42:47 PM
My expectations are that when a coach is hired he will last 5 years. While I do not like them leaving Crean lasted 9 years and Buzz 6 years. I expect Wojo to be here 5 years and he will either be fired or take the Duke job.

I don't care if he Coach K says "I wanna be here for five more years" or whatever the number was. I think that was a dropped quote to easy the fears of kids he will be recruiting in the upcoming season. I think he is gone within 3.
Quote from: Goose on January 15, 2023, 08:43:46 PM
TAMU

I do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.


dgies9156

Quote from: Ners on June 02, 2014, 06:40:53 PM
Yes Sultan....and Lenny...Here's my issue:  Buzz WON the power struggle with Larry.  I stand by my comments on Larry, and how he treated Buzz/commented on him to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel - thought it was terrible judgement 90 days on the job to essentially bash the cash cow of your department.  

My issue with Buzz is that he ultimately got what he wanted - rid of Larry, Wild the President at the time of his hire back in charge of the university, albeit if only temporarily...and an A.D. in Bill Cords who Kevin O'Neill flat out told Buzz was a very good A.D. to work under..and has a nice legacy at MU.  No, Cords wasn't Cottingham...but he sure as hell wasn't Larry Williams.

So...the landscape at MU returned a lot closer to Buzz's "happy" than it had been the 2 prior years when he CHOSE to stay at MU...but he then bolts for Va Tech?  And particularly if Sultan, as you say..Buzz wasn't encouraged to leave...it displays poor character and hypocrisy on Buzz's part - that at the first season and time of adversity..and some fans grumbling....he bails...to an outpost of a program.  It truly doesn't add up...that Buzz entirely left on his own volition...or didn't sense that he wasn't wanted by Wild or Cords any longer.  Perhaps they weren't going to fire Buzz...but they certainly let him know he wasn't going to get his way with everything...and Buzz picked up his ball and went to VaTech.

He's gone. Get over it.

St. Al of Brookfield, pray for us.... And the check is in the mail!

NersEllenson

Quote from: dgies9156 on June 02, 2014, 06:48:33 PM
He's gone. Get over it.

St. Al of Brookfield, pray for us.... And the check is in the mail!


I'm totally over Buzz leaving...that's been the point of my posts since he left.  A few others are having a hard time letting go.  After last season....glad Buzz is gone.  It was beyond bizarre.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

GGGG

Quote from: Ners on June 02, 2014, 06:40:53 PM
Perhaps they weren't going to fire Buzz...but they certainly let him know he wasn't going to get his way with everything...and Buzz picked up his ball and went to VaTech.


I agree with that.  But that doesn't make him stubborn or arrogant.  Just a guy who wanted a new job.  Nothing really wrong with that.


wadesworld

#144
Quote from: brandx on June 02, 2014, 06:32:39 PM
Because of the lack of success of some of the Duke assistants, I think the path is clear for Collins or Wojo IF they have success the next 3 - 5 years.



The only thing Wojo has going for him is he was the assistant coach for Coach K. Duke is not Marquette. Duke is a blue blood, top 5 program. Every single coach in the country with the exception of maybe 5 will ditch everything in a second to go there. They will be able to choose whoever they want. If Wojo's best season is, say, a Sweet 16 appearance (not unreasonable to think that's the best season he has in the next 3-5 years at MU) do you really think Duke's going to be throwing the kitchen sink at him? I have my doubts, but maybe I'm wrong.

dgies9156

Quote from: wadesworld on June 02, 2014, 07:50:22 PM
The only thing Wojo has going for him is he was the assistant coach for Coach K. Duke is not Marquette. Duke is a blue blood, top 5 program. Every single coach in the country with the exception of maybe 5 will ditch everything in a second to go there. They will be able to choose however they want. If Wojo's best season is, say, a Sweet 16 appearance (not unreasonable to think that's the best season he has in the next 3-5 years at MU) do you really think Duke's going to be throwing the kitchen sink at him? I have my doubts, but maybe I'm wrong.

I have said it before and I will say it again and again and again. The only way Coach Wojo leaves is if Duke offers.

The only way Duke offers is if Coach Wojo wins another natchap and hangs a banner next to the 1977 edition.

I actually think when Coach Wojo settles in, he'll like it. His family will like it here and he will be the greatest Milwaukeean of Polish descent since Clement Zablocki.

Think of what it will mean for the Polish Community -- Marquette wins a national championship with a Head Coach of Polish Descent. He'll never buy another meal in town again!

wadesworld

Quote from: dgies9156 on June 02, 2014, 09:20:08 PM
I have said it before and I will say it again and again and again. The only way Coach Wojo leaves is if Duke offers.

The only way Duke offers is if Coach Wojo wins another natchap and hangs a banner next to the 1977 edition.

I actually think when Coach Wojo settles in, he'll like it. His family will like it here and he will be the greatest Milwaukeean of Polish descent since Clement Zablocki.

Think of what it will mean for the Polish Community -- Marquette wins a national championship with a Head Coach of Polish Descent. He'll never buy another meal in town again!

Just like Buzz was only going to leave for Texas and Crean was only going to leave for Michigan State.

Wojo will move on.  But it won't be to Duke.

Brad Stevens will be the next Duke coach, unless the Celtics end up with Kevin love and then sign Kevin Durant next offseason.

brandx

Quote from: wadesworld on June 02, 2014, 07:50:22 PM
The only thing Wojo has going for him is he was the assistant coach for Coach K. Duke is not Marquette. Duke is a blue blood, top 5 program. Every single coach in the country with the exception of maybe 5 will ditch everything in a second to go there. They will be able to choose whoever they want. If Wojo's best season is, say, a Sweet 16 appearance (not unreasonable to think that's the best season he has in the next 3-5 years at MU) do you really think Duke's going to be throwing the kitchen sink at him? I have my doubts, but maybe I'm wrong.

I agree with what you say. One good year won't get him the Duke job. But I think keeping MU where Buzz had it (discounting last year) will.

ChicosBailBonds

Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 02, 2014, 09:38:45 AM
What idiot ever said that Marquette was rated in the top 15 in the preseason polls? Oh, sorry, that would be you. They were actually ranked 17th in both. Indiana was ranked 24th and 28th. From that you extrapolated that MU's season was a disaster and IU met expectations.

You're right. This is fun.

Sorry, as you know I don't pay attention to preseason polls like you.  17th, 15th...those idiots.  LOL. 

And no, I extrapolated that MU was picked to win the Big East and finished 6th.  IU was picked to finish 6th and finished 8th....thus much closer to expectations.  Please, try to keep up.

This is fun


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