[PaintTouches]Why Derrick Wilson is not to blame for the MU offense

[82fanatic]

I don't believe Derrick is solely responsible for this season.  However, The one part of the article I strongly disagree with is this

"Those who say Marquette was “playing 4-on-5″ with Wilson in the game looked solely at his scoring. In that sense, those people are correct. A point guard averaging 5.0 points per game on 39 percent shooting isn’t going to win enough games, but he never played outside of his limitations and succeeded in other offensive areas.

Where Wilson did more than he was given credit for was in his passing. His 2.81 A/TO ratio (135 asts/48 TOs) was the second best mark among starting Marquette point guards under Williams (Maurice Acker, 3.09). And that 2.81 mark was tied for 29th best in the country, while Marquette as a team had its lowest turnover rate (17.5 percent) since 2010, when the Golden Eagles’ 16.0 percent mark was seventh best in the nation."

I do think MU was playing 4 on 5, and it has nothing to do with the scoring statistics.  No one ever covered Derrick.  He had few turn overs because often he was not even guarded!  Devante, Jamil and even Chris got less touches and rarely received he ball in a good scoring position.  Derrick could not make many passes because the inside guys were double covered by derricks man.  A lot harder to pass inside when your man plays 4 feet off of you!   

We don't need Derrick to be a scoring machine, but we do need him to make more than 1 outside shot every month.  If he does not improve his shooting, and still gets 35 minutes a game next year, it will be the same kind of disappointing year.  He does not have to score a lot, just make a defender pay when he is left wide open. 

He needs to shoot 1000 shots a day till October!!   

[mattyv1908]

Whoever asked for efficiency stats for Wilson compared to Dawson, while Wilson did have better offensive efficiency numbers for the season they just about leveled off if you look only at the conference efficiency numbers.

Perhaps Dawson got better.  Perhaps Wilson regressed.

Let's address one thing though after I peaked at the conference numbers again - Derrick Wilson had a higher TO% in conference play than Todd Mayo.

Todd may appear careless with the ball at times, but typically it's because he's being aggressive and often times later in the shot clock.

[mattyv1908]

Here's how Wilson ranks in all the advanced stats this year against the rest of this year's roster.

PER (player efficiency rating) - 8th
TS% (true shooting %) - 10th
eFG% - 9th
ORB% - 7th
DRB% - 12th
TRB% - 9th
AST% - 1st
STL% - 3rd
BLK% -11th
TO% -10th
USG% (usage percentage in offensive play) - 12th
PProd - 5th
ORtg - 8th
DRtg - 9th
OWS (offensive win shares) - 7th
DWS (defensive win shares) - 2nd
WS/40 - 9th

Minutes played - 2nd (trailed Jake Thomas by 2 minutes)

Scoopers you make the call regarding his value and whether or not he deserves criticism.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Ryan Arcidiacono 114.6 ORtg, .506 eFG%
Austin Chatman 115.6 ORtg, .492 eFG%
Bryce Cotton 121.9 ORtg, .483 eFG%
Dee Davis 110.3 ORtg, .500 eFG%
D'Angelo Harrisonn 109.4 ORtg, .436 eFG%
Markel Starks 111.9 ORtg, .480 eFG%
Sterling Gibbs 113.1 ORtg, .467 eFG%
Alex Barlow 109.7 ORtg, .468 eFG%
Billy Garrett 106.9 ORtg, .430 eFG%

Derrick Wilson 97.2 ORtg, .403 eFG%

Derrick Wilson is dead last in the two most important offensive statistics compared to every other point guard in the Big East.

Come to your own conclusions.

I knew he struggled but he wasnt even close to Billy Garrett...Almost a whole 10 points behind. Thats brutal especially since Garrett is a freshman,

[77ncaachamps]

Regarding Derrick's offensive offensive skills, Jake's inability to penetrate and become the scorer we needed, Jamil's disappearing act, and Chris's Farewell Tour...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=AMtbbzyo6D8#t=5

[UticaBusBarn]

Facts do not lie. Please see <www.valueaddedbasketball.com> , or, where is Bama when we need him?

The player with the highest value and ranked 117 in the country was Gardner. Mayo was 548, D. Burton was ranked 638, J. Wilson 644, J. Anderson 925, J. Thomas 1158, Otule 1478,and J. Johnson at 1730

D. Wilson was ranked 2111 with a value added of 0.60 - on offense 0.00, on defense 0.61 (negative number indicates outstanding defense).

With all do respect for all opinions offered ... Coach Williams did a disservice to this fine kid. It was as though Coach Williams was trying to prove himself, as coach, right, rather than doing what was right.

And, yes I love Coach Williams, but he got a pebble in his shoe on this one.

[willie warrior]

Facts do not lie. Please see <www.valueaddedbasketball.com> , or, where is Bama when we need him?

The player with the highest value and ranked 117 in the country was Gardner. Mayo was 548, D. Burton was ranked 638, J. Wilson 644, J. Anderson 925, J. Thomas 1158, Otule 1478,and J. Johnson at 1730

D. Wilson was ranked 2111 with a value added of 0.60 - on offense 0.00, on defense 0.61 (negative number indicates outstanding defense).

With all do respect for all opinions offered ... Coach Williams did a disservice to this fine kid. It was as though Coach Williams was trying to prove himself, as coach, right, rather than doing what was right.

And, yes I love Coach Williams, but he got a pebble in his shoe on this one.

Pebble in the shoe? How about a ball peen hammer to the big toe., would be more appropriate, based on performance.

[willie warrior]

Facts do not lie. Please see <www.valueaddedbasketball.com> , or, where is Bama when we need him?

The player with the highest value and ranked 117 in the country was Gardner. Mayo was 548, D. Burton was ranked 638, J. Wilson 644, J. Anderson 925, J. Thomas 1158, Otule 1478,and J. Johnson at 1730

D. Wilson was ranked 2111 with a value added of 0.60 - on offense 0.00, on defense 0.61 (negative number indicates outstanding defense).

With all do respect for all opinions offered ... Coach Williams did a disservice to this fine kid. It was as though Coach Williams was trying to prove himself, as coach, right, rather than doing what was right.

And, yes I love Coach Williams, but he got a pebble in his shoe on this one.

Agreed. That is what I also said, but the slurpers of course blasted away.

[ecompt]

I knew he struggled but he wasnt even close to Billy Garrett...Almost a whole 10 points behind. Thats brutal especially since Garrett is a freshman,

Watch the teams ion even the NIT and none of them has a point guard as remotely ineffective as Derrick. But this season was a team effort. Jake was a one-trick pony, Juan and Chris were absolute non-threats and Jamil decided he didn't want to play basketball. We have to start from scratch next season. Mayo, Duane, Hill, Burton and Taylor early, with Fischer taking STJr's play by January.

[Henry Sugar]

The problem wasn't Derrick. It was Derrick and Jake together all the time.

[BCHoopster]

The problem wasn't Derrick. It was Derrick and Jake together all the time.

Neither one of them could breakdown a defense, again, blame the coach.  Jake was a great walk-on, everybody has to remember that.

[NersEllenson]

The problem wasn't JUST Derrick. It was Derrick and Jake together all the time.

Perhaps the best way to say it with the added qualifier.  Derrick was a huge part of the team's problems.  They were only made worse by being played so much together with Jake.  Those two played the most minutes of any two players on the team....on one of them basically can't make a 2 point FG, and the other a 3 point FG, or 2 pt FG outside of 2 feet from the basket.  How Buzz ever thought he'd win with those two getting max minutes/and max minutes together is beyond me...particularly when started with Juan Anderson and Chris Otule..

[BCHoopster]

Perhaps the best way to say it with the added qualifier.  Derrick was a huge part of the team's problems.  They were only made worse by being played so much together with Jake.  Those two played the most minutes of any two players on the team....on one of them basically can't make a 2 point FG, and the other a 3 point FG, or 2 pt FG outside of 2 feet from the basket.  How Buzz ever thought he'd win with those two getting max minutes/and max minutes together is beyond me...particularly when started with Juan Anderson and Chris Otule..

Shows you how good a coach Buzz was with that talent, won 17 games, amazing.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

I was a big Jake hater in the beginning of the year but I came around in the end. He did what he was asked of, he knew what he was. For Jake I put the blame solely on Buzz. In order for Jake to be effective he needed to be run off screens and Buzz didnt create many plays for him unless it was a baseline inbounds play.

Also, put me in the camp where Jamil absolutely killed our team this year by not showing up. Derrick was bad but Jamil, for what he could have been was brutal. Leads me to believe that Jamil wasnt as good as everybody thought him to be. That being said, Derrick still shouldnt have gotten the minutes he did.

[BCHoopster]

I was a big Jake hater in the beginning of the year but I came around in the end. He did what he was asked of, he knew what he was. For Jake I put the blame solely on Buzz. In order for Jake to be effective he needed to be run off screens and Buzz didnt create many plays for him unless it was a baseline inbounds play.

Also, put me in the camp where Jamil absolutely killed our team this year by not showing up. Derrick was bad but Jamil, for what he could have been was brutal. Leads me to believe that Jamil wasnt as good as everybody thought him to be. That being said, Derrick still shouldnt have gotten the minutes he did.

Jamel only showed glimpses, you saw him at Seton Hall take off and score 24 or so, after that he was a non-factor and he was as much to blame about the year as anybody.  His talent was not there every game.  Did not look for his shot enough as many times he did not take the shot when he had it, non-aggressive offensive player, limited more between his ears, did not have the scoring mentality of Devonte Burton has who was the black hole when he got the ball, exact opposites.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

But wait...it's okay because we didn't expect him to be very good....he played to his expectations (that some had of him), therefore it isn't his fault the team didn't make tourney...Jamil regressed from a 109.8 ORating as a junior to 102.5...I highly doubt his game got WORSE with an offseason of work.  Gardner's ORating stayed pretty similar from junior year to senior year 123.2 as junior to 122.2 as a senior...yet notably his rating jumped from 118.1 as a sophomore...interesting there was no improvement as a senior - again, highly doubt his game, conditioning, etc., regressed with another off season of work and experience.

Would be interesting to see how Jake ranked against the other 2 guards in the league..

It's not okay. That is on Buzz for not recruiting better options at the point.

Again, if you go back to preseason predictions, I started a thread where I ranked the frontcourts and the backcourts of the BEast 1-10. I ranked Marquette either 9th or 10th in backcourt. So I am not surprised by Mattyv's comparison to the rest of the BEast.

We knew we had the worst or at least one of the worst backcourts in the BEast in the preseason, but we still expected to be a top 20 team.

What we didn't know was that Jamil would regress, Duane would get hurt, McKay would transfer, Taylor would suffer consistent setbacks, Johnson would be a dud, and Juan would get even worse.

So is Derrick being the best option at point one of the largest or even the largest problems with this team? Absolutely! Am I upset with him for that? Nope. I'm upset with Buzz for not recruiting a better option. I will always be more upset  with players not living up to their expectations (Jamil, JJJ, Juan) than I will be with a player who plays up to and beyond his low expectations (Derrick and Jake).

Honestly, I think we agree on more than either of us realize. We just have philosophical differences on where to place our frustration.

[Wojo'sMojo]

Lol, I usually like the paint touches articles...however this article was crap. Lots of minimizing and built in excuses. I really am sick of piling on Derrick, but he's terrible and to read this just made me laugh. I feel like this article was written by Buzz 

[connie]

As these discussions progress we seem to reach a "chicken or egg" moment.  Did our problems originate in the backcourt, or did others not progress (or did they actually regress) as necessary.  As with most things, I suspect it was a combination of both these factors and probably a few others.  It cannot be seriously questioned that our back court was *deficient* offensively.  Nor do I think it can it be argued that others failed to step up when needed (except Todd in the last few games).  Whatever the primary cause the end result was the CF we witnessed all year:  an out of sync offensively challenged team that when necessary could not get a key defensive stop.  A lot to learn from and hopefully avoid in the future. We have four seniors moving on, and next year's team will be very different, and hopefully a lot less frustrating.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

...and Gardner is getting heat in another topic at this same time.

What does that say about Scoop's basketball IQ?

I don't know if he was getting heat. I think the worst was that was said was that he was inconsistent. Which I believe was wrong.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Will you blame Buzz if he gives Derrick another shot next season?  Not stoking the fire or anything, you're a more-than-solid poster, and I'm curious about your answer

I was more talking about giving him a shot out of high school. But unless someone else can earn the starting job, Derrick is who we are stuck with.

[GooooMarquette]

As these discussions progress we seem to reach a "chicken or egg" moment.  Did our problems originate in the backcourt, or did others not progress (or did they actually regress) as necessary.  As with most things, I suspect it was a combination of both these factors and probably a few others.  It cannot be seriously questioned that our back court was *deficient* offensively.  Nor do I think it can it be argued that others failed to step up when needed (except Todd in the last few games).  Whatever the primary cause the end result was the CF we witnessed all year:  an out of sync offensively challenged team that when necessary could not get a key defensive stop.  A lot to learn from and hopefully avoid in the future. We have four seniors moving on, and next year's team will be very different, and hopefully a lot less frustrating.

Very well put.  Our failure to meet expectations this season was a team effort, which is why many of us get frustrated when Derrick is singled out as the main reason.

And for all the people who put out the complex stats, "value add" numbers and the like -- can you explain how those numbers account for intangibles like diving on the floor after loose balls, giving instructions to other players, etc. -- none of which show up in any stat I'm aware of, but which clearly help set the tone for the rest of the team? 

I'm just glad they still play the game on hardwood, instead of on a microchip....

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Very well put.  Our failure to meet expectations this season was a team effort, which is why many of us get frustrated when Derrick is singled out as the main reason.

And for all the people who put out the complex stats, "value add" numbers and the like -- can you explain how those numbers account for intangibles like diving on the floor after loose balls, giving instructions to other players, etc. -- none of which show up in any stat I'm aware of, but which clearly help set the tone for the rest of the team? 

I'm just glad they still play the game on hardwood, instead of on a microchip....

Well said. +1 isn't enough...+2 to you!

[Wojo'sMojo]

Very well put.  Our failure to meet expectations this season was a team effort, which is why many of us get frustrated when Derrick is singled out as the main reason.

And for all the people who put out the complex stats, "value add" numbers and the like -- can you explain how those numbers account for intangibles like diving on the floor after loose balls, giving instructions to other players, etc. -- none of which show up in any stat I'm aware of, but which clearly help set the tone for the rest of the team? 

I'm just glad they still play the game on hardwood, instead of on a microchip....

Don't forget the intangible of the defense sagging off when Derrick is in. That doesn't show up in any stat either and clearly hampers our team.

[GooooMarquette]

Don't forget the intangible of the defense sagging off when Derrick is in. That doesn't show up in any stat either and clearly hampers our team.

Agree.  But you also agree that it cuts both ways, correct?

[Wojo'sMojo]

Agree.  But you also agree that it cuts both ways, correct?

I agree that it does.