Tip of the hat to Ners

[GGGG]

Derrick and Jake playing together has gotten MU out in front in the last two games.

Regardless, I have decided to just let it play out and see what happens.  Nothing can be said in this debate that hasn't been said 100 times.

[MerrittsMustache]

Derrick and Jake playing together has gotten MU out in front in the last two games.

Regardless, I have decided to just let it play out and see what happens.  Nothing can be said in this debate that hasn't been said 100 times.

I don't know. Has anyone mentioned Derrick's Net Efficiency or not being able to negatively judge Dawson based on a small sample size?

[Lennys Tap]

First, major kudos to John and to the rest of the team. Awesome, Davidsonesque comeback. I suspect some will call us lucky - not me. The thing that stood out the most to me was a calm/poise in overtime I haven't seen from this team all year. Regarding John D in particular:

He was our most outstanding Warrior in the OT. The baseline jumper, the 3 from the corner in front of the bench, the 2 big free throws and the outstanding stuff/steal of Starks - 5 tremendous minutes of ball that I hope is the launching pad to a great career.

But let's not forget that in 27 minutes of play in regulation, he was serviceable but hardly spectacular - 27 minutes, 5 points, 2-5 shooting, 0 rebounds, 4 assists, 2 TOs, 4 fouls. Basically, he was Derrick Wilson but for a 3 and zero boards. He was on the floor for most of our furious comeback but was pretty much a bystander while Davante, Jamil and finally Todd brought us back and took the game to OT. If we lose the game in regulation the consensus is that John D looked solid, seemed comfortable and should get regular minutes going forward.

Whether a star was born last night (I hope, I hope) or we found a co-point guard, Ners and others who saw something in John that wasn't apparent to most of us deserve a tip of the cap. For their constant and often mean spirited attacks on Derrick, though, (rooting for him to fail? really?) they deserve something else.

[Windyplayer]

I am very concerned with the Villanova game.  They just had a clunker and got blown out.  I am hoping they don't have a rebound game

Eh, people said the same thing about Georgetown after their loss to Seton Hall. And Creighton his 21 friggin' 3-pointers. It's not like Nova crapped the bed--Creighton just had one of their nights. I didn't watch it, but I'm assuming Creighton hit contested 3s and Nova didn't just pack it in the paint.

[GooooMarquette]

First, major kudos to John and to the rest of the team. Awesome, Davidsonesque comeback. I suspect some will call us lucky - not me. The thing that stood out the most to me was a calm/poise in overtime I haven't seen from this team all year. Regarding John D in particular:

He was our most outstanding Warrior in the OT. The baseline jumper, the 3 from the corner in front of the bench, the 2 big free throws and the outstanding stuff/steal of Starks - 5 tremendous minutes of ball that I hope is the launching pad to a great career.

But let's not forget that in 27 minutes of play in regulation, he was serviceable but hardly spectacular - 27 minutes, 5 points, 2-5 shooting, 0 rebounds, 4 assists, 2 TOs, 4 fouls. Basically, he was Derrick Wilson but for a 3 and zero boards. He was on the floor for most of our furious comeback but was pretty much a bystander while Davante, Jamil and finally Todd brought us back and took the game to OT. If we lose the game in regulation the consensus is that John D looked solid, seemed comfortable and should get regular minutes going forward.

Whether a star was born last night (I hope, I hope) or we found a co-point guard, Ners and others who saw something in John that wasn't apparent to most of us deserve a tip of the cap. For their constant and often mean spirited attacks on Derrick, though, (rooting for him to fail? really?) they deserve something else.

Very well stated.  

Go Marquette!  (And that includes Derrick and John.)

[mileskishnish72]

Gratifying to see Buzz utilizing more of his assets better. It's clear that Derrick and John bring a different skill set to the PG position and let's hope we can benefit from both. Had to wonder, though - where the hell has STJr been? I watched him very carefully and couldn't tell that he was favoring one leg so I'm not sure his absence has been all health-related. It sure was good to see him come in clicking on all cylinders - he made a huge difference.

[mu-rara]

In addition to all the other mentions in this thread, Davante hitting shots from the high post is huge.

[Norm]

First, major kudos to John and to the rest of the team. Awesome, Davidsonesque comeback. I suspect some will call us lucky - not me. The thing that stood out the most to me was a calm/poise in overtime I haven't seen from this team all year. Regarding John D in particular:

He was our most outstanding Warrior in the OT. The baseline jumper, the 3 from the corner in front of the bench, the 2 big free throws and the outstanding stuff/steal of Starks - 5 tremendous minutes of ball that I hope is the launching pad to a great career.

But let's not forget that in 27 minutes of play in regulation, he was serviceable but hardly spectacular - 27 minutes, 5 points, 2-5 shooting, 0 rebounds, 4 assists, 2 TOs, 4 fouls. Basically, he was Derrick Wilson but for a 3 and zero boards. He was on the floor for most of our furious comeback but was pretty much a bystander while Davante, Jamil and finally Todd brought us back and took the game to OT. If we lose the game in regulation the consensus is that John D looked solid, seemed comfortable and should get regular minutes going forward.

Whether a star was born last night (I hope, I hope) or we found a co-point guard, Ners and others who saw something in John that wasn't apparent to most of us deserve a tip of the cap. For their constant and often mean spirited attacks on Derrick, though, (rooting for him to fail? really?) they deserve something else.

Um, Dawson was not basically a Derrick Wilson or "pretty much a bystander" during the comeback in regulation. He passed the ball very well, made Georgetown guard him - which helped open up the front court action of Taylor and Gardner - and played pretty good D. There was actually a spurt in the game when Buzz put Wilson in for Dawson and the offense immediately sputtered and MU went from up 4 or 5 to down 4 or 5 in a span of about 4 minutes. If he was just like D Wilson, then why put him in and not just stay with Wilson?

[Norm]

In addition to all the other mentions in this thread, Davante hitting shots from the high post is huge.

DG's passing was really nice last night too.

[tower912]

Gratifying to see Buzz utilizing more of his assets better. It's clear that Derrick and John bring a different skill set to the PG position and let's hope we can benefit from both. Had to wonder, though - where the hell has STJr been? I watched him very carefully and couldn't tell that he was favoring one leg so I'm not sure his absence has been all health-related. It sure was good to see him come in clicking on all cylinders - he made a huge difference.

Taylor looked far better last night than he did early in the year when he was starting.   He WASN'T favoring the leg anymore.   That was the difference.   Having STjr and Gardner doing their high/low game against a 2-3 zone is a huge weapon.   

[Aughnanure]

Most noticeable thing when Derrick is not on the floor is ball movement is much, much better.  Has been true all season, though time without him on the floor is not regular.  He spends a lot of time just killing time around the 3 point line.  In my experience, ball movement is contagious.

Now, Georgetown zoned us last night, and I don't think that is a particularly smart thing to do, because we were able to work the high-low post effectively, more than we ever do against man to man.  How much of that was the zone, how much of that was freedom of movement because all the players were being guarded, I don't know.  Whatever the reason, hopefully Dawson has earned more minutes and he makes good use of them.

There were a few times our ball movement was absolutely phenomenal. First time I had seen something like that all year.

[CTWarrior]

Um, Dawson was not basically a Derrick Wilson or "pretty much a bystander" during the comeback in regulation. He passed the ball very well, made Georgetown guard him - which helped open up the front court action of Taylor and Gardner - and played pretty good D. There was actually a spurt in the game when Buzz put Wilson in for Dawson and the offense immediately sputtered and MU went from up 4 or 5 to down 4 or 5 in a span of about 4 minutes. If he was just like D Wilson, then why put him in and not just stay with Wilson?

+1 - This is the point the folks who have a problem with Derrick are trying to make.  Making the defense play honest helps everybody.  The only caveat I have about last night was that, in addition to Dawson playing, we faced a zone defense.  How much of our improved ball movement was because all 5 guys on the floor had to be guarded and how much was due to the fact that we are better at finding openings against that type of zone?  Only time will tell, but I want to see more of Dawson.

[NersEllenson]

Against Butler, Dawson came into the game, turned the ball over and committed a silly foul within a minute. He came into the game again and turned the ball over within 4 seconds. Maybe a basketball savant like you saw something else in that limited time, but I saw a player who looked lost and hesitant and was hurting the team. Apparently my fellow basketball stupid cohort, Buzz Williams, agreed because Dawson quickly found himself back on the bench for the remainder of the game.

I don't want to argue about Dawson's limitations, especially after he played so well. I'm just saying that you need to temper your expectations a little bit because John Dawson did not transform into John Stockton by having a nice game and making a couple 3s. His game still needs work but he's showing potential.

Look Merritt - I don't want to dog Derrick to make my points about John's merits, but if you want to nitpick, there was a possession in the 2nd half when Derrick came back in the game and on his first trip up the court...he bobbled the ball and turned it over.  It can happen to anybody.  My freaking point all along is that we had 20 games of Derrick getting max minutes, most on the team, and neither Derrick nor the team were showing much, if any signs of improving.  My contention all along is that giving Dawson 25+ likely wouldn't result in a WORSE outcome than what we've seen, and that it might actually spark the team and provide a lift - but at least we get a benchmark as to what Dawson can do for this season or next year.  I thought Dawson showed good flashes of potential in his limited time running the point, and nothing about his performance against X or G'town has made me any less bullish on Dawson - he's a good prospect.

[Sunbelt15]

Dawson earned those minutes last night.

I hope he continues to do so.

No, Dawson earned major minutes for the NEXT GAME!!  Maybe even a starting position..?

[Sunbelt15]

I don't think you can start him. Fouls a my biggest concern with Dawson. I think you bring him off the bench to protect him from himself a little bit, as well as to be a little bit of a change of pace. Then again, I don't like Derrik and Jake playing together, so its tough to say.

.

Same can be said for Jamil. Protect him from himself.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

No, Dawson earned major minutes for the NEXT GAME!!  Maybe even a starting position..?

He will continue to get the minutes he earns in practice and by his performance in games.

That's how it has worked all year. That's how it will continue to work.

[ATL MU Warrior]

The team looked like a different team last night.  Confident, resilient, poised, assertive.

I can't say for certain what caused the difference.  I know the Dawson backers will give him 100% of the credit.  And some of the credit should certainly go his way.  He played a very good game and hopefully there are many more to come.

In my opinion, there were a number of things that went very right last night and contributed to the win:

- Steve Taylor Jr.  - Wow, where has this guy been?  We don't win the game without him last night.
- John Dawson - Mentioned above, but after a slow start in the first half, he looked great the rest of the way.  Very confident and under control.  That's two games against good teams where he has played really well.  He is critical moving forward and I could easily see an even split of PT between him and Derrick if he plays like he did vs GT.
- Buzz - Great decision to give Dawson a shot when it was clear that Derrick was not the answer against the GT zone.  
- Shooters hitting shots - Great job by Jake, JD and Mayo to confidently step into some shots and let fly.  Mayo's shot to send into OT was PURE.
- Leadership - Did we finally see the emergence of Jamil, DG (and maybe Todd) to step up and take control?  Jamil played a pretty darn good game on both ends last night only to be overshadowed a bit by others.  10-6-5-3.  Big rebounds, blocks and that huge dunk at the end to get us within 2 (off a great defensive board in amongst the trees and quick outlet pass from Derrick).  DG was hitting shots and getting to the line like the DG of old.  Great passing by both.  Todd was pretty much Bad Todd until :06 left in the game but at least he was aggressive attacking the basket throughout the game.

Don't know what it was that did it, but something (or combination of things) "clicked" with this team last night and it was fun to watch.

Great win by the team.  Let's keep 'em coming.

[Nevada233]

The team looked like a different team last night.  Confident, resilient, poised, assertive.

I can't say for certain what caused the difference.  I know the Dawson backers will give him 100% of the credit.  And some of the credit should certainly go his way.  He played a very good game and hopefully there are many more to come.

In my opinion, there were a number of things that went very right last night and contributed to the win:

- Steve Taylor Jr.  - Wow, where has this guy been?  We don't win the game without him last night.
- John Dawson - Mentioned above, but after a slow start in the first half, he looked great the rest of the way.  Very confident and under control.  That's two games against good teams where he has played really well.  He is critical moving forward and I could easily see an even split of PT between him and Derrick if he plays like he did vs GT.
- Buzz - Great decision to give Dawson a shot when it was clear that Derrick was not the answer against the GT zone.  
- Shooters hitting shots - Great job by Jake, JD and Mayo to confidently step into some shots and let fly.  Mayo's shot to send into OT was PURE.
- Leadership - Did we finally see the emergence of Jamil, DG (and maybe Todd) to step up and take control?  Jamil played a pretty darn good game on both ends last night only to be overshadowed a bit by others.  10-6-5-3.  Big rebounds, blocks and that huge dunk at the end to get us within 2 (off a great defensive board in amongst the trees and quick outlet pass from Derrick).  DG was hitting shots and getting to the line like the DG of old.  Great passing by both.  Todd was pretty much Bad Todd until :06 left in the game but at least he was aggressive attacking the basket throughout the game.

Don't know what it was that did it, but something (or combination of things) "clicked" with this team last night and it was fun to watch.

Great win by the team.  Let's keep 'em coming.

No way should Dawson get all of the credit.....

It was a solid performance by all.... Including De Wilson who played good defense and was supportive of the team winning when Dawson was on the floor..

I know his supporters including myself have been really wanting him to play...

but he is not bigger than the team... He needs to continue to develop and play better.....

this is a on going thing.... hes not a One and Done.... But will be alotta fun to watch!

Go Warriors!!!

[tower912]

A reference on jsonline about team officials being really impressed with Dawson's work ethic.   To me, it indicates that he has improved recently.   He certainly looked better last night than he did early in the year.   

[NersEllenson]

A reference on jsonline about team officials being really impressed with Dawson's work ethic.   To me, it indicates that he has improved recently.   He certainly looked better last night than he did early in the year.   

I'm sure John has improved in his 6 months in the program - yet it is next to impossible to truly gauge what I guy's game talent/potential are, until you give him consistent run for 10 minute stretches in a game.  You cannot evaluate anything by giving a player 2 minute stints.

In my view it was quite evident early on - Grambling game - that Dawson had a lot of skill/potential - as we got to see him running the point for 20 minutes (not playing off the ball as Buzz did the next few games when he'd play Dawson.) 

Dawson has a great feel for the game, and he delivers passes quickly, and in great position for guys to score - watch his placement on post entry passes, and even passes to perimeter guys - they are on time, and in the perfect place.  He's a cerebral player, and I look forward to watching him develop at MU - gonna be a good one.

[jsglow]

A reference on jsonline about team officials being really impressed with Dawson's work ethic.   To me, it indicates that he has improved recently.   He certainly looked better last night than he did early in the year.   

It's certainly reasonable to think that Frosh would improve during the year.  What's a bit unfortunate is that some of our upperclassmen seem to have reached the upper limit of their ability and those limitations have negatively impacted our results to date while we wait for development (and health in the case of Steve) from our young guys.

[LloydMooresLegs]

Go Hoyas!!!!

[brandx]

What a difference two days makes.   On Saturday, in the first half Derrick was either the best or second best MU player and Dawson was dreadful in his minutes.   Monday, Derrick picks up a couple of early fouls and Dawson stepped up.   It was great to see.   He's come a long way and he looks ready.   

This is where I disagreed with you earlier. 100 percent!! If anyone is one of the best players on the floor, I think maybe the coach on the other team would say "Hey, let's guard that guy".

It should be a given that you are not one of the best players when the other team uses you to help themselves win (using your man to double-team elsewhere on basically every possession).

[Silkk the Shaka]

First, major kudos to John and to the rest of the team. Awesome, Davidsonesque comeback. I suspect some will call us lucky - not me. The thing that stood out the most to me was a calm/poise in overtime I haven't seen from this team all year. Regarding John D in particular:

He was our most outstanding Warrior in the OT. The baseline jumper, the 3 from the corner in front of the bench, the 2 big free throws and the outstanding stuff/steal of Starks - 5 tremendous minutes of ball that I hope is the launching pad to a great career.

But let's not forget that in 27 minutes of play in regulation, he was serviceable but hardly spectacular - 27 minutes, 5 points, 2-5 shooting, 0 rebounds, 4 assists, 2 TOs, 4 fouls. Basically, he was Derrick Wilson but for a 3 and zero boards. He was on the floor for most of our furious comeback but was pretty much a bystander while Davante, Jamil and finally Todd brought us back and took the game to OT. If we lose the game in regulation the consensus is that John D looked solid, seemed comfortable and should get regular minutes going forward.

Whether a star was born last night (I hope, I hope) or we found a co-point guard, Ners and others who saw something in John that wasn't apparent to most of us deserve a tip of the cap. For their constant and often mean spirited attacks on Derrick, though, (rooting for him to fail? really?) they deserve something else.

To call Dawson a bystander during that run is to completely discount his value on the court even if he isn't shooting. His man guards him. The others are no longer double teamed instantly and the lane is no longer clogged. His presence on the court alone opened things up for everyone else on offense.

And I don't hate Derrick! I like having a guy like him on the team. But he's well suited to a change of pace/give the main PG a breather type of role. I think he's really good at that, and not only doesn't hurt the team but helps it in that role. He's currently being asked to do too much and is not put in a position to thrive (due to circumstance). Reduced minutes will benefit Derrick & the team. Hopefully Dawson is ready to step into a larger role full time. In my opinion, it is the only chance we have at the tournament.

[keefe]

Go Hoyas!!!!

WTFO?

A wolf in sheep's clothing?

Trojan?