May I suggest a new starting 5?

[NersEllenson]

LOL....yeah....mostly because the denominator got f*cked with due to his suspension. 

Uhh...nice try jag....but the bet was for conference play...

[MU82]

How many times in the first three games has Derrick beaten his man off the dribble, penetrated to the basket, and created for himself and others? I can remember a couple.

That is my definition of a PG making plays.

Picking up your dribble 25 feet from the basket, throwing an easy pass to somebody standing 10 feet away from you and having that somebody hit a 3 is not being a playmaker.

I am not picking on Derrick. He is who he is. We need a better PG to be a legit team. That's Buzz's fault, not Derrick's. (And as anybody who would look at my history knows, I'm a HUGE Buzz fan. That doesn't mean he walks on water and is above a little criticism, though. He makes mistakes, too, and not having a PG for this team with its good frontcourt ranks as one of his biggest.)

It was far and away my No. 1 concern heading into this season, and not one thing has happened so far to make me believe I was incorrect. And I know I wasn't the only one who had that concern. Buzz probably had it, too, but would never admit it.

Oh, and no matter what any Derrick apologist might want to say about his alleged playmaking, it's pretty difficult to defend:

.275 ... .083 ... .422.

Those are his career shooting percentages from the floor, from 3-point range and -- yikes! -- from the FT line.

Sad to say (and almost impossible to believe), he actually has regressed in each category.

This isn't panic. This isn't overreaction to an early-season aberration. This is looking at the facts.

42% FT shooting for the starting PG for a team with Sweet 16 (and beyond) aspirations! Wow! (And 25% this season, BTW.)

As soon as Derrick hits, say, 4 FTs in a row, folks can start talking about him being a real PG for a real contender.

[NersEllenson]

How many times in the first three games has Derrick beaten his man off the dribble, penetrated to the basket, and created for himself and others? I can remember a couple.

That is my definition of a PG making plays.

Picking up your dribble 25 feet from the basket, throwing an easy pass to somebody standing 10 feet away from you and having that somebody hit a 3 is not being a playmaker.

I am not picking on Derrick. He is who he is. We need a better PG to be a legit team. That's Buzz's fault, not Derrick's. (And as anybody who would look at my history knows, I'm a HUGE Buzz fan. That doesn't mean he walks on water and is above a little criticism, though. He makes mistakes, too, and not having a PG for this team with its good frontcourt ranks as one of his biggest.)

It was far and away my No. 1 concern heading into this season, and not one thing has happened so far to make me believe I was incorrect. And I know I wasn't the only one who had that concern. Buzz probably had it, too, but would never admit it.

Oh, and no matter what any Derrick apologist might want to say about his alleged playmaking, it's pretty difficult to defend:

.275 ... .083 ... .422.

Those are his career shooting percentages from the floor, from 3-point range and -- yikes! -- from the FT line.

Sad to say (and almost impossible to believe), he actually has regressed in each category.

This isn't panic. This isn't overreaction to an early-season aberration. This is looking at the facts.

42% FT shooting for the starting PG for a team with Sweet 16 (and beyond) aspirations! Wow! (And 25% this season, BTW.)

As soon as Derrick hits, say, 4 FTs in a row, folks can start talking about him being a real PG for a real contender.

How dare you bring up stats to be critical of Derrick's career performance.  He passes the eye test of Brew City 77.  Derrick created all 31 of the shots Jamil, Jake and Todd took.  It's not Derrick's fault they missed the vast majority.

[GGGG]

Uhh...nice try jag....but the bet was for conference play...

You don't think his minutes during conference play were hampered by his suspension?

And perhaps you need to take a pill and calm down a tad.

[NersEllenson]

You don't think his minutes during conference play were hampered by his suspension?

And perhaps you need to take a pill and calm down a tad.

It doesn't matter if his minutes were hampered..it was points per 40 minutes...he played 322 minutes last year, or more than 8 full games.  It's a relevant enough sample size for the bet that Guns and I made...and Mayo finished 3rd on the team in points per 40 minutes during conference play...finishing just .0059 points per 40 less than Vander.

As for the chill pill, I'm all good - it's your poor arguments that are bad.  But I am glad to see you coming around on at least giving Dawson a shot to run the point a little more.  It can't get much worse, right?

[brewcity77]

How many times in the first three games has Derrick beaten his man off the dribble, penetrated to the basket, and created for himself and others? I can remember a couple.

That is my definition of a PG making plays.

I wouldn't disagree with that. There have been a few times he did that, which is a few more than he did last year. Derrick's development will be a process as he is adjusting to a completely different role. Look at how much time it took for Junior to adjust to a similar role last year as he went from primarily a distributor to a driver and secondary scorer. And Junior was further along to start the season in that regard than Derrick is now.

Picking up your dribble 25 feet from the basket, throwing an easy pass to somebody standing 10 feet away from you and having that somebody hit a 3 is not being a playmaker.

Finding the open man in a place they can score is being a playmaker. Maybe there's not as much flash to hitting the guy for the open three, but that makes it no less efficient. Though with this team, finding someone for the open three and them making it are two completely different things.

I am not picking on Derrick. He is who he is. We need a better PG to be a legit team. That's Buzz's fault, not Derrick's. (And as anybody who would look at my history knows, I'm a HUGE Buzz fan. That doesn't mean he walks on water and is above a little criticism, though. He makes mistakes, too, and not having a PG for this team with its good frontcourt ranks as one of his biggest.)

It was far and away my No. 1 concern heading into this season, and not one thing has happened so far to make me believe I was incorrect. And I know I wasn't the only one who had that concern. Buzz probably had it, too, but would never admit it.

I agree that it's Buzz's fault more than Derrick's. I believe that Derrick can be a good enough PG to fill that role.

Oh, and no matter what any Derrick apologist might want to say about his alleged playmaking, it's pretty difficult to defend:

.275 ... .083 ... .422.

Those are his career shooting percentages from the floor, from 3-point range and -- yikes! -- from the FT line.

Junior's numbers were .387, .207, and 0.662 coming into his senior year. He definitely had more freedom as a player in his two prior years, but none of those numbers are overwhelming. I'm not saying DeWil is going to morph into Junior this year, but if he can get to the .350, .200, and .600 range, he'd be decent enough, and none of those seem unrealistic.

However to do that, he needs help. Scoring isn't his strong suit, we can all see that. The guys that are there to score need to do that to take the pressure off him and allow him some space to start moving those numbers up.

This isn't panic. This isn't overreaction to an early-season aberration. This is looking at the facts.

42% FT shooting for the starting PG for a team with Sweet 16 (and beyond) aspirations! Wow! (And 25% this season, BTW.)

As soon as Derrick hits, say, 4 FTs in a row, folks can start talking about him being a real PG for a real contender.

But it's also looking at a guy in two completely different roles. Even when Junior was Dwight's backup, he at least occasionally saw the reins come off. Derrick never had that. If Buzz has done this team any disservice, it is that Derrick wasn't given enough of a chance over the past two years to get a sense of what it will be like being the guy holding the keys. That means Derrick has to learn on the job. I think we'll get a much better sense of who he is around the New Year.

He's made some nice drives. He's found open guys to score. Does he need to do more of that? Yes. But he's starting to show signs that he can do this. He's getting lambasted for an awful team performance yesterday, and frankly it isn't fair to Derrick for him to take all the blame for the 4-31 performance from Jake, Todd, and Jamil, especially with the number of missed open looks. If he keeps growing into the role, we'll be fine. If he's already peaked, we'll be in trouble, because there's no indication that anyone else on this roster is going to do a better job.

[MU82]

I wouldn't disagree with that. There have been a few times he did that, which is a few more than he did last year. Derrick's development will be a process as he is adjusting to a completely different role. Look at how much time it took for Junior to adjust to a similar role last year as he went from primarily a distributor to a driver and secondary scorer. And Junior was further along to start the season in that regard than Derrick is now.

Finding the open man in a place they can score is being a playmaker. Maybe there's not as much flash to hitting the guy for the open three, but that makes it no less efficient. Though with this team, finding someone for the open three and them making it are two completely different things.

I agree that it's Buzz's fault more than Derrick's. I believe that Derrick can be a good enough PG to fill that role.

Junior's numbers were .387, .207, and 0.662 coming into his senior year. He definitely had more freedom as a player in his two prior years, but none of those numbers are overwhelming. I'm not saying DeWil is going to morph into Junior this year, but if he can get to the .350, .200, and .600 range, he'd be decent enough, and none of those seem unrealistic.

However to do that, he needs help. Scoring isn't his strong suit, we can all see that. The guys that are there to score need to do that to take the pressure off him and allow him some space to start moving those numbers up.

But it's also looking at a guy in two completely different roles. Even when Junior was Dwight's backup, he at least occasionally saw the reins come off. Derrick never had that. If Buzz has done this team any disservice, it is that Derrick wasn't given enough of a chance over the past two years to get a sense of what it will be like being the guy holding the keys. That means Derrick has to learn on the job. I think we'll get a much better sense of who he is around the New Year.

He's made some nice drives. He's found open guys to score. Does he need to do more of that? Yes. But he's starting to show signs that he can do this. He's getting lambasted for an awful team performance yesterday, and frankly it isn't fair to Derrick for him to take all the blame for the 4-31 performance from Jake, Todd, and Jamil, especially with the number of missed open looks. If he keeps growing into the role, we'll be fine. If he's already peaked, we'll be in trouble, because there's no indication that anyone else on this roster is going to do a better job.

You are the eternal optimist, brew, and I like that about you. You were calling MU a BE-championship-caliber team last year when few others were, and you were right.

I hope you're right about Derrick, too. I'd be thrilled to be wrong about him.

[GGGG]

As for the chill pill, I'm all good - it's your poor arguments that are bad.  But I am glad to see you coming around on at least giving Dawson a shot to run the point a little more.  It can't get much worse, right?

Don't change my argument.

I never said that Dawson shouldn't be given a chance to run the point.  I specifically said that he did *not* outperform Derrick in the first two game, which was a point that you (and others) were making.  In fact, I said that if you want to give him more minutes based on potential, that's fine.

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