Travon Bunch

[willie warrior]

LOL....yes you are correct.  Back in January of DG's freshman year I did say that.

And I was right then.

Good think he improved.

Your credibility is gone when you said that. And by the way, Gardner was better than Otule even then. But of course you believe you were right. You are after all, a legend in your own mind.

[Benny B]

That pic isn't very representative of AFSOC ops. Those guys are in a TOC directing CAS in a set piece operation. Our teams are almost always independent and covert.

He looked pretty covert to me... how else do you explain the ND mascot beard?

[GGGG]

Your credibility is gone when you said that. And by the way, Gardner was better than Otule even then. But of course you believe you were right. You are after all, a legend in your own mind.

There is absolutely no way that you could look at them back on January 23, 2011 and claim Davante was better.  He was coming off a couple DNPs and some single digit minute games to start the BE season.  He was out of shape, couldn't defends, and racked up most of his points against poor opponents.

Otule was a solid, double digit minute guy who was doing a little bit of everything.

Now by the end of the year, Gardner started to emerge.  But at that point Otule was clearly better.

But if you need to feel better about yourself that you have to go back two and a half years ago to prove me wrong, more power to you.

[brewcity77]

Your credibility is gone when you said that. And by the way, Gardner was better than Otule even then. But of course you believe you were right. You are after all, a legend in your own mind.

And there are probably 2 people on this board that actually believe Gardner was better at that time. He simply wasn't. He was completely a one-dimensional player. Gardner added low-post scoring but couldn't play a lick of defense.

Look at the numbers in the 10 games prior to that post by Sultan:

Gardner: 43 minutes played, 4/9 FGs, 10 points, 7 rebounds, 1 block, 2 DNPs
Otule: 150 minutes played, 16/31 FGs, 41 points, 21 rebounds, 6 blocks, 0 DNPs

And trust me...you really don't want to discount the best performance by each player. 70% of Gardner's scoring in that stretch came against Mississippi Valley State. Otule did also have one game bigger than the rest...but that was against Vanderbilt. Otule was far and away our best big man that season. Only an idiot would contend otherwise.

[willie warrior]

There is absolutely no way that you could look at them back on January 23, 2011 and claim Davante was better.  He was coming off a couple DNPs and some single digit minute games to start the BE season.  He was out of shape, couldn't defends, and racked up most of his points against poor opponents.

Otule was a solid, double digit minute guy who was doing a little bit of everything.

Now by the end of the year, Gardner started to emerge.  But at that point Otule was clearly better.

But if you need to feel better about yourself that you have to go back two and a half years ago to prove me wrong, more power to you.

No, you said you never said--so you proved yourself wrong didn't you. Hope you feel good too.
And I get a real kick out "doing a little bit of everything"--whatever that means. As I recall Gardner's points per minute were better than Otule's even then. Gradner was just arrived, Otule already had two years on him. I still get a kick out of the Otule love. Next Roy Hibbert, etc. After being at MU for 6 years, I sure hope he will do a little bit of everything. But a career 5PPG, and what 3 or 4 RPG after that time does not get me as excited as the Great Sultan.
Yeah, I like Otule, but I just see things differently than the great  Analysis of Sultan, who continues to expound on his keen basketball analysis.

[GGGG]

Stop.  You're embarrassing me.

[brewcity77]

No, you said you never said--so you proved yourself wrong didn't you. Hope you feel good too.
And I get a real kick out "doing a little bit of everything"--whatever that means. As I recall Gardner's points per minute were better than Otule's even then. Gradner was just arrived, Otule already had two years on him. I still get a kick out of the Otule love. Next Roy Hibbert, etc. After being at MU for 6 years, I sure hope he will do a little bit of everything. But a career 5PPG, and what 3 or 4 RPG after that time does not get me as excited as the Great Sultan.
Yeah, I like Otule, but I just see things differently than the great  Analysis of Sultan, who continues to expound on his keen basketball analysis.

willie, you are maybe the most foolish, clueless poster I have ever experienced. I could completely deconstruct that entire post, but it'd be a waste of time because the effort would be lost on you.

[bilsu]

There is absolutely no way that you could look at them back on January 23, 2011 and claim Davante was better.  He was coming off a couple DNPs and some single digit minute games to start the BE season.  He was out of shape, couldn't defends, and racked up most of his points against poor opponents.

Otule was a solid, double digit minute guy who was doing a little bit of everything.

Now by the end of the year, Gardner started to emerge.  But at that point Otule was clearly better.

But if you need to feel better about yourself that you have to go back two and a half years ago to prove me wrong, more power to you.

He did not play, because of a shoulder injury. Prior to the injury he was better than Otule on the offensive end. He has never been better than Otule on the defensive end. He has always been a better rebounder although his rebounds generally come on the offensive end.

[brewcity77]

He did not play, because of a shoulder injury. Prior to the injury he was better than Otule on the offensive end. He has never been better than Otule on the defensive end. He has always been a better rebounder although his rebounds generally come on the offensive end.

I'd love to see the numbers if you discounted Gardner rebounding his own misses. I have no idea what the results would be, but it wouldn't surprise me if a third of DG's rebounds were from his own misses.

Also...not disputing DG has always been a better offensive player than CO, but Chris was hurt more that season because Buycks was running the point. Chris' disability hurt him even more when half the entry passes to him were bounce passes.

[Dawson Rental]

I'd love to see the numbers if you discounted Gardner rebounding his own misses. I have no idea what the results would be, but it wouldn't surprise me if a third of DG's rebounds were from his own misses.

Also...not disputing DG has always been a better offensive player than CO, but Chris was hurt more that season because Buycks was running the point. Chris' disability hurt him even more when half the entry passes to him were bounce passes.

I have no problem with a player increasing his rebounding stats by rebounding his own misses when that same player has the highest FG% on the team.  Missing a shot and not getting the rebound is hardly a virtue, it's often a lost possession.

[Lennys Tap]

I'd love to see the numbers if you discounted Gardner rebounding his own misses. I have no idea what the results would be, but it wouldn't surprise me if a third of DG's rebounds were from his own misses.

Also...not disputing DG has always been a better offensive player than CO, but Chris was hurt more that season because Buycks was running the point. Chris' disability hurt him even more when half the entry passes to him were bounce passes.

I have no problem discounting DG's rebounds of his own misses if you also don't count a rebounded miss as a field goal attempt. His rebounding totals would suffer, but his already off the charts FG% would be through the roof.

[brewcity77]

In discounting rebounding his own misses, I meant more to analyze how good a rebounder he actually is. That's what made Rodman so good, he had such a sense of reading how the ball was going to come off and despite often being the smallest guy in the frontcourt, he still managed to get to the ball nearly every time. It's easier to get your own misses because the ball is usually going to come right back to you.

Not meant as a criticism of Davante, he's an excellent offensive player and I am overjoyed we have a center of his caliber, I'm just curious how his rebounding stacks up when other people shoot. That's more what I meant. Not so much ignoring his own misses, but what his (and CO's, and others) rebounding percentage is on other players' shots.

[KenoshaWarrior]

Only on Scoop, can a conversation about a Racine Horlick recruit morph into an argument about Steve Novak being a big.

[Lennys Tap]

In discounting rebounding his own misses, I meant more to analyze how good a rebounder he actually is. That's what made Rodman so good, he had such a sense of reading how the ball was going to come off and despite often being the smallest guy in the frontcourt, he still managed to get to the ball nearly every time. It's easier to get your own misses because the ball is usually going to come right back to you.

Not meant as a criticism of Davante, he's an excellent offensive player and I am overjoyed we have a center of his caliber, I'm just curious how his rebounding stacks up when other people shoot. That's more what I meant. Not so much ignoring his own misses, but what his (and CO's, and others) rebounding percentage is on other players' shots.

I agree with you that his rebounding stats are skewed - he's not as good as his numbers would suggest. But offensively, he's even more off the charts than his FG% would indicate.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Only on Scoop, can a conversation about a Racine Horlick recruit morph into an argument about Steve Novak being a big.

+1

[bilsu]

2010-11
Otule 651 min off reb 58 def reb 76 total rebounds 134
Gardner 296 min off reb 35 def reb 38 total rebs 73
double Gardner's number
592 min off reb 70 def reb 76 total rebounds 146
Yes Gardner was rebounding on the offensive boards at a greater pace than Otule, but he was also rebounding on the defensive boards at a greater pace.

[real chili 83]

Tom Crean sucks.

There, somebody said it.

[Dawson Rental]

2010-11
Otule 651 min off reb 58 def reb 76 total rebounds 134
Gardner 296 min off reb 35 def reb 38 total rebs 73
double Gardner's number
592 min off reb 70 def reb 76 total rebounds 146
Yes Gardner was rebounding on the offensive boards at a greater pace than Otule, but he was also rebounding on the defensive boards at a greater pace.

"And that's the fact, Jack!"

[brewcity77]

2010-11
Otule 651 min off reb 58 def reb 76 total rebounds 134
Gardner 296 min off reb 35 def reb 38 total rebs 73
double Gardner's number
592 min off reb 70 def reb 76 total rebounds 146
Yes Gardner was rebounding on the offensive boards at a greater pace than Otule, but he was also rebounding on the defensive boards at a greater pace.

I specifically said in the last post I made I'm not trying to compare CO and DG, so this really had no relevance.

[bilsu]

I'd love to see the numbers if you discounted Gardner rebounding his own misses. I have no idea what the results would be, but it wouldn't surprise me if a third of DG's rebounds were from his own misses.

I posted the stats , because of this post.

[brewcity77]

I posted the stats , because of this post.

I realize that, but that post had two separate points about DG and CO, neither of which was meant as a comparison.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

http://www.allmetrohoops.com/index.php/recruiting-news/87-news-articles/133-trevon-bunch-expected-to-explode-this-summer

Travon Bunch has reclassified to the 2015 class. Will be playing ball for Mt. Zion Academy in North Carolina.

Travon mentioned Marquette by name.

He had this to say about Marquette, “I like their style of play.  It’s just they are missing a solid big man.”  He believes he could help them solve that problem if he chooses them.

Averaged 15 points, 7 boards, and 3 blocks for Horlick High last season.

[Dawson Rental]

http://www.allmetrohoops.com/index.php/recruiting-news/87-news-articles/133-trevon-bunch-expected-to-explode-this-summer

Travon Bunch has reclassified to the 2015 class. Will be playing ball for Mt. Zion Academy in North Carolina.

Travon mentioned Marquette by name.

Averaged 15 points, 7 boards, and 3 blocks for Horlick High last season.

He wasn't at Horlick High last season.  I believe that those numbers are probably from Mt. Zion, although they could also be from his first semester team, St. Louis Christian Academy.

Since the article you quote predates the coaching change, I'm not certain that Marquette is still recruiting Travon.  He may, in fact, epitomize the kind of player that made MU squeamish about Buzz.

A quote from the article regarding Marquette; "It’s just they are missing a solid big man” might cause one to question his basketball IQ, particularly in regards to PG play.

[Dawson Rental]

Travon is now listed as a player for Georgia Prep Sports Academy in Atlanta, GA.  He has an offer from Tennessee, and is visiting there in August.

Does anyone know the record for the number of high schools attended by a Division I basketball player?

[Texas Western]

Looks like Travon has a positive feeling toward Marquette. Hopefully he  does well this year on both the academic and athletic front this year.  An extra year will be a great thing for him.