Ouch... Boeheim calls Andy Katz an 'idiot' and 'disloyal person'

[Logi4three]

Very odd comments by J.B. after the Uconn game (speculation is it has to do with private comments J.B. told Katz re Southerland's problems):
http://www.yardbarker.com/college_basketball/articles/msn/jim_boeheim_calls_espns_andy_katz_an/12912679

[Windyplayer]

If any comments were indeed made off the record by Boeheim to Katz, Katz obviously shouldn't have disclosed them regardless of who writes his checks, but that being said, Boeheim needs to be smarter. This is an ideal time to display a little passive aggression and let the media read between the lines. Boeheim didn't need to come off as a complete dick. One to two word answers to Katz's questions and elaborate answers to other media members' questions would have been sufficient.

[NavinRJohnson]

Pretty sure I gotta go with JB on this one. Katz's tweet in response, about not being paid by Syracuse seems to indicate to me that he did in fact disclose off the record comments - or at least thought to be off the record, which may be where the problem lies. Then again, if Katz did not think they we off the record, I suspect his tweet/response might have been something different.

[icheights]

Playing a little devil's advocate here as everyone has jumped all over Boeheim about his remarks to Katz at the Presser..

Katz not only betrayed Boeheim's trust but Katz was profiting off of a 19-20 year olds struggles that were meant to stay private.  So now Southerland probably feels betrayed by Boeheim as well...I think JB needed to show his team that he was still behind them and needed to show Katz up so that he wouldn't do something like this again...

I don't necessarily agree with how JB handled the situation but I definitely can understand why he did what he did.

[jesmu84]

I can't believe this story failed to make the late sportscenter last night.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Pretty sure I gotta go with JB on this one. Katz's tweet in response, about not being paid by Syracuse seems to indicate to me that he did in fact disclose off the record comments - or at least thought to be off the record, which may be where the problem lies. Then again, if Katz did not think they we off the record, I suspect his tweet/response might have been something different.

+100000

Off the record is off the record.  Anyone that deals with the media knows that.  We do stories all the time and say stuff off the record. If that trust is broken, then that's it for that reporter.  I agree, if he didn't know it was off the record that gives him an out, but Katz's problem here is now he is going to have issues with other coaches who will not want to talk to him if they feel his trust has been remotely compromised.

[CAGASS24]

Katz (a Madison grad)....go figure.   I don't want to weigh in on the off the record or not off the record issue because who cares really.  To me Katz looks like an idiot here for blowing a level of cred over this obvious story.  Southerland was not hurt, there were no criminal issues which would have been ferreted out by public record requests, and he wasn't playing.  Its been pretty obviously an academic issue and that's been understated since he stopped playing.  Seems like if Katz was gonna burn his off the record card, why here?

But, If I'm Boeheim, I'm worried.  While he alwasys sounds like a whiney old man, hasn't he subjected SU to a level of breach of student privacy?

[MU82]

Right now, we don't know who is telling the truth.

Sometimes -- very often, in fact -- a source claims that he has been misquoted or that off-the-record information has been unethically reported after the source realizes the report made him look bad.

[Pakuni]

Off the record is off the record. But nobody has a clue as to whether that's the issue here. In the rush to defend JB, some here are making pretty serious accusations against Katz that are completely unproven at this point ...and, in fact, haven't even been leveled by Boeheim.

Let's  see ... in one corner we have a well-established pud with a penchant of being a dick in his press conferences and history of going after media members who dare to write/broadcast something remotely negative about his program.
In the other corner, we have a reporter who's been doing this work on the sport's largest stage for more than a decade without this kind of allegation ever surfacing (to my knowledge) previously.

I'm not sure why anyone is giving JB the benefit of the doubt here. He's a querulous prick and always has been.

[MU82]

Off the record is off the record. But nobody has a clue as to whether that's the issue here. In the rush to defend JB, some here are making pretty serious accusations against Katz that are completely unproven at this point ...and, in fact, haven't even been leveled by Boeheim.

Let's  see ... in one corner we have a well-established pud with a penchant of being a dick in his press conferences and history of going after media members who dare to write/broadcast something remotely negative about his program.
In the other corner, we have a reporter who's been doing this work on the sport's largest stage for more than a decade without this kind of allegation ever surfacing (to my knowledge) previously.

I'm not sure why anyone is giving JB the benefit of the doubt here. He's a querulous prick and always has been.

First, I absolutely agree.

Second, Pakuni, outstanding use of "querulous"!! This is particularly impressive in that so many people can't even spell, have atrocious grammar, can't figure out the difference between there and their, etc.

[Lennys Tap]

Off the record is off the record. But nobody has a clue as to whether that's the issue here. In the rush to defend JB, some here are making pretty serious accusations against Katz that are completely unproven at this point ...and, in fact, haven't even been leveled by Boeheim.

Let's  see ... in one corner we have a well-established pud with a penchant of being a dick in his press conferences and history of going after media members who dare to write/broadcast something remotely negative about his program.
In the other corner, we have a reporter who's been doing this work on the sport's largest stage for more than a decade without this kind of allegation ever surfacing (to my knowledge) previously.

I'm not sure why anyone is giving JB the benefit of the doubt here. He's a querulous prick and always has been.

I agree. The most likely scenario is they disagree as to whether the conversation was on or off the record. Number two is JB slipped and let information out that he shouldn't have and is covering his backside. To me, it's highly unlikely that Katz would intentionally ignore JB's off the record condition, especially for such a nothing story.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Off the record is off the record. But nobody has a clue as to whether that's the issue here. In the rush to defend JB, some here are making pretty serious accusations against Katz that are completely unproven at this point ...and, in fact, haven't even been leveled by Boeheim.

I think most people are saying off the record is off the record, but giving wiggle room if Katz didn't know that was the case.  This is an age old problem when talking to the media.  Was it off the record or wasn't it?  Most of the time when we do this, we say "this is off the record".  Then upon conclusion of statement or conversation, we reiterate, "again, this was off the record".  Sometimes the reporter will ask specifically if he\she can use something and will ask "is that off the record as well?"  Never had anyone violate that trust.

[Pakuni]

I think most people are saying off the record is off the record, but giving wiggle room if Katz didn't know that was the case.  This is an age old problem when talking to the media.  Was it off the record or wasn't it?  Most of the time when we do this, we say "this is off the record".  Then upon conclusion of statement or conversation, we reiterate, "again, this was off the record".  Sometimes the reporter will ask specifically if he\she can use something and will ask "is that off the record as well?"  Never had anyone violate that trust.

And that's kind of my point. Reporters, like sources, tend to take "off the record" very seriously. It seems to me highly improbable that Katz - who like I said has been at this for more than a decade at ESPN without (to my knowledge) something like this having previously occurred - would violate that covenant and risk his reputation over a relative non-story.
It's entirely possible Katz is in the wrong here, but given the two guys' histories, I'm more inclined to think JB is just being his prickly old self.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Boeheim is a weird dude. One one hand, I think he's a dick. On the other hand, I kind of like him for that very reason.

[Silkk the Shaka]

I could be totally wrong on this, but aren't you supposed to assume that nothing is ever "off the record"?

[Aughnanure]

I think most people are saying off the record is off the record, but giving wiggle room if Katz didn't know that was the case.  This is an age old problem when talking to the media.  Was it off the record or wasn't it?  Most of the time when we do this, we say "this is off the record".  Then upon conclusion of statement or conversation, we reiterate, "again, this was off the record".  Sometimes the reporter will ask specifically if he\she can use something and will ask "is that off the record as well?"  Never had anyone violate that trust.

If you are talking off the record it is always YOUR responsibility to make that clear to reporters. He may have, and if so his complaints are more than reasonable. But if he just "thought" they were, I see it more as Boeheim's mistake - either not being clear/careful or assuming too much.

[Jay Bee]

If you are talking off the record it is always YOUR responsibility to make that clear to reporters. He may have, and if so his complaints are more than reasonable. But if he just "thought" they were, I see it more as Boeheim's mistake - either not being clear/careful or assuming too much.

That's probably fair. I think there are times when you're talking to your 'sources' you should explicitly ax the question. "Are you OK with me saying _____ in a story?".. "Is it alright if I share this information?"

Depends on the relationship / history / circumstance...

[Windyplayer]

I could be totally wrong on this, but aren't you supposed to assume that nothing is ever "off the record"?

Well, anyone can say they would like a conversation off the record, but there's no direct legal consequence for disclosing a so called off the record comment in a media outlet--not even libel is an option if it's the truth. BUT, your credibility as a reporter takes a serious nosedive AKA your livelihood.

[Windyplayer]

Playing a little devil's advocate here as everyone has jumped all over Boeheim about his remarks to Katz at the Presser..

Katz not only betrayed Boeheim's trust but Katz was profiting off of a 19-20 year olds struggles that were meant to stay private.  So now Southerland probably feels betrayed by Boeheim as well...I think JB needed to show his team that he was still behind them and needed to show Katz up so that he wouldn't do something like this again...

I don't necessarily agree with how JB handled the situation but I definitely can understand why he did what he did.

Good points.

[ChicosBailBonds]

If you are talking off the record it is always YOUR responsibility to make that clear to reporters. He may have, and if so his complaints are more than reasonable. But if he just "thought" they were, I see it more as Boeheim's mistake - either not being clear/careful or assuming too much.

We do not disagree, that is why we always reconfirm with the reporter to remind them that this was off the record and have them confirm that as well.

This seems like a classic he said she said.  Judging at how ticked off he is, he clearly thinks it was off the record but we will probably never know.

[Logi4three]

Anyone know what the "off-the-record" comments were about Southerland?  Also, who is working on the Andy Katz big head for the Cuse game?     That has to be done... or perhaps there is a place where we can buy Andy Katz masks to wear (particularly those lucky enough to sit behind Cuse's bench). 

[4everwarriors]

I guess Boeheim is an expert when it comes to loyalty, considerin' Bernie Fein and such. Just sayin'.

[Coleman]

I used to not mind Boeheim. Then he caused our conference to fall apart.

[jficke13]

I feel like a baseline set of rules to live by should be: Never trust any politician, any lawyer, any car salesman, or any journalist.

If Andy Katz reported something JB thought was off the record, Katz might be a nozzle, but he's doing his job. JB is at fault for being an idiot himself.

[Niv Berkowitz]

Pretty sure I gotta go with JB on this one. Katz's tweet in response, about not being paid by Syracuse seems to indicate to me that he did in fact disclose off the record comments - or at least thought to be off the record, which may be where the problem lies. Then again, if Katz did not think they we off the record, I suspect his tweet/response might have been something different.

As my PR prof said, there is no such thing as off-the-record.