Buzz Is Right,...

[connie]

Here I'll be more specific and then y'all can rip away:
1. Lack of team quickness, sans Blue. Everyone else is stuck in neutral.
2. Lack of shooters---guards, forwards--- it don't matter.
3. Donut defense---nothin' in the middle
4. Other than Blue and Taylor the roster is made up of mid-major talent.
5. Very weak backcourt---point guard position, I mean, really?
6. Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long.

I agree with #2, and think this is truly the root of all issues we have had this year.  The lack of any consistent perimeter scoring threat really limits what this team can do.  I disagree with #1 and #3.  I think this was a tough game against a tough opponent at a tough time in the schedule.  The Dr. is correct:

Fourth game in eight days, with two of these MU's two toughest conference road games...with this one with two days in between on one day's rest. MU actually won the second half...and played pretty good defense despite the 24-9 points off turnover lay ups...and the free throw discrepancy.

Despite the brain cramps by the guards and coach which happen, Buzz's teams seem to bounce back and he seems to make the adjustments.  This bunch has no star players but they have experience and moxie. The pieces are there, and their toughest opponents they have at the BMO-BC.  Good place to be.

[Coleman]

Agree, but they are not far off from 18th best. Have you watched college basketball this year. Lot of crap out there.

Oh I agree. They are probably more in the 25-30 range, which is where they will probably end up when everything is said and done.

[MU82]

Holy Crap.  We lose a game on the road by 8 to the 15th ranked team in the country and all the sudden "We arent very Good"  "We suck" "NIT"

this is ridiculous!!

I just did a term search. The first mentions of either "suck" or "NIT" were in your post, Kenosha.

The topic began with the poster quoting Buzz's contention that the team isn't very good as a way to start conversation. Most posters responded by talking about the flaws but saying they were happy with how this year has gone given that it's a rebuilding year.

Then you decided to rip everybody by misquoting and taking things out of context. Not very useful.

As for the team, I thought going in we'd be fortunate to be 9-9 in the Big East and would need to win a game or two in the conference tourney to make the NCAAs. I suppose it's still possible that we'll only win one more game to finish 9-9, but I'm guessing we'll win a few more than that and will easily make the tourney. So while, yes, this team is frustrating at times, and it is definitely flawed and limited, it has been a fun season. It already has given us a few crazy moments -- some good, some bad -- and I'm enjoying the ride, however long it lasts.

[MerrittsMustache]

The arguments about leadership are completely ignorant. Junior Cadougan could be the second coming of General Patton but that's not going to change the fact that Marquette can't shoot and can be careless with the basketball. DJO and Crowder were considered great leaders because they were damn good college basketball players.

This team is not the 18th most talented team in the country and not in the top 5-6 most talented teams in the BE. Marquette's margin for error is very small. They can't turn the ball over 10 times in a game, let alone in a half, against a team as talented as Georgetown and expect to win.

With the exception of GB, every game that MU has lost this season has been to a more talented team. They have also beaten Georgetown, Pitt and UConn all of whom likely have more talent on their rosters.

[Lennys Tap]

Here I'll be more specific and then y'all can rip away:
1. Lack of team quickness, sans Blue. Everyone else is stuck in neutral.
2. Lack of shooters---guards, forwards--- it don't matter.
3. Donut defense---nothin' in the middle
4. Other than Blue and Taylor the roster is made up of mid-major talent.
5. Very weak backcourt---point guard position, I mean, really?
6. Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long.

Last night was bad. I'm as frustrated as you are. But slow, bereft of talent and lacking in effort doesn't get you 17-6 and 8-3 in the Big East.

[Badgerhater]

It is a guard's game.   We don't have the elite guards we have had in the past.   We have good guards who can be really good on occasion but they don't collectively have all the skills needed to be an elite group.

When you don't have the whole range of skills in your group of guards, your team is a lot easier to play because a superior game is required by someone in the group and there will be nights where that person, who may play well within their range of the game, did not or cannot put together that superior game.

We have a good team.  A team that I would have been really excited about when I was a student during the Mike Deane era or for the post-Wade, pre-Amigo Crean era.  If this season is our floor, then the MU program is doing things right.

[Aughnanure]

Here I'll be more specific and then y'all can rip away:
1. Lack of team quickness, sans Blue. Everyone else is stuck in neutral.
2. Lack of shooters---guards, forwards--- it don't matter.
3. Donut defense---nothin' in the middle
4. Other than Blue and Taylor the roster is made up of mid-major talent.
5. Very weak backcourt---point guard position, I mean, really?
6. Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long.

Agreed, but you're a little over-the-top on some of this. Is the talent great? No. But mid-major? Hardly.

A lot of our problems would be solved if teams respected our outside shooting -  or we gave them a reason to. Would open up the lanes more for driving, give Taylor, Gardner, and Otule room to breathe below. The PG position has been a problem for more than 2 years now. Junior is nice and all sometimes, but he is a back-up on a great team.

[tower912]

Last night was bad. I'm as frustrated as you are. But slow, bereft of talent and lacking in effort doesn't get you 17-6 and 8-3 in the Big East.

Yup.   17-6, 8-3.   Good in many ways, but not yet good enough to beat a ranked team in their gym.   There are worse fates. 

[frozena pizza]

Here I'll be more specific and then y'all can rip away:
1. Lack of team quickness, sans Blue. Everyone else is stuck in neutral.
2. Lack of shooters---guards, forwards--- it don't matter.
3. Donut defense---nothin' in the middle
4. Other than Blue and Taylor the roster is made up of mid-major talent.
5. Very weak backcourt---point guard position, I mean, really?
6. Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long.

I'm not really sure I agree with any of this.
1.  Lockett is slow.  Otherwise, if you take out our bigs, we have decent quickness.
2.  Certainly could be better, but we have an adjusted FG% of 50%.  Not great, but better than Oregon, Louisville, Illinois, Wisconsin to name a few.
3.  Otule has been very good defensively.
4.  Mid-major?  Um, no.
5.  Cadougan and Blue are our best players.  They were not good last night but I expect them to rebound on Saturday.
6.  Fair enough.

The glaring problems were rebounding and turnovers.  How did they not make your top 6 points?  Georgetown is a good team and I would have expected GU to win by 8-10, especially given our struggles on the road.  There's no shame in that.  Saturday's game is really big.

[kmwtrucks]

My thoughts:

The good: Vander has player better this year and Juan Anderson is also playing improved.

Surprised:I thought J Wil was going to have the same type of Jump as Vander and that has not happened, both on O and D.  Still a solid player but not what I expected.

I really did think Lockett would be better, he is solid but more of a fringe starter on a good team. I'm glad he is here, but I did think he would be better.


What I expected.
Jr at a Sr is still a AVG HM PG, I was hoping but not expecting him to make a jump up.  He is not very good shooter, Lacks HM quickness for a PG and cannot seperate, which makes him a Below average defender.  CO has 1 eye and is always going to have bad hands and have trouble grabbing rebounds and turing the ball over.  DW is a good defender but cannot shoot and does not have any OFF feel to his game.  Steve T has made some really good plays but also made some mistakes on D.  

On the Fence:
Davante has been fine but is really out of sink and has lost confidence. But in general he just needs to get one good game under his belt and should be fine.  He seems to struggle more Vs a zone. (the whole team does)

Mayo can score but he is not someone I expect it from every game even though he has the talent.  Maybe he can ge3t some more consitent.

[ChicosBailBonds]

this team isn't very good. Having observed them for 3/4 of the season, the lack of talent is obvious. And for that, he's responsible.

And off back to back Sweet 16's and no early NBA defectors and no major injuries...how is this possible?  

Teal folks, teal, but goes to show that what you did the last few years isn't a guarantee of future success, future roster quality, etc.  

Fortunately, college hoops level of quality continues to erode so we're going to be just fine.  Buzz doing a very good job assembling average talent to play well.  That's also on him, in a good way.

[Golden Avalanche]

Last night was bad. I'm as frustrated as you are. But slow, bereft of talent and lacking in effort doesn't get you 17-6 and 8-3 in the Big East.

This.

I'm the biggest drum beater of the low quality of our conference and college ball as a whole but even in down times the cream rises to the top. Programs still have to maintain and I'd much rather be in our position with all the problems we have then, say, Villanova.

I posted a thread last week on how Buzz gets this team to bounce back after a loss. Even though Pitt scares poop out of me now that Adams is playing well and they'll have Woodall this time around, the evidence is there to suggest a strong performance on Saturday.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Here I'll be more specific and then y'all can rip away:
1. Lack of team quickness, sans Blue. Everyone else is stuck in neutral.
2. Lack of shooters---guards, forwards--- it don't matter.
3. Donut defense---nothin' in the middle
4. Other than Blue and Taylor the roster is made up of mid-major talent.
5. Very weak backcourt---point guard position, I mean, really?
6. Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long.

I disagree with 4 out of 6.

I think #2 and #5, you are correct. Shooting was my biggest concern coming into the season (which is why I was one of the lunatics who thought Jake would get 10min. per game because nobody else can shoot!)

Junior is an average PG. If he could shoot, he'd be above average. Unfortunately he can't, and that hurts.

As far as #6, that's the biggest bunch of cliched fan-BS I've read in a while. These kids bust their ass. They want to win as bad as anybody. Sometimes they will win, sometimes they won't. But, these kids are pretty tough. Look at how hard they play. Look at the close games they have won.

[MUfan12]

As far as #6, that's the biggest bunch of cliched fan-BS I've read in a while. These kids bust their ass. They want to win as bad as anybody. Sometimes they will win, sometimes they won't. But, these kids are pretty tough. Look at how hard they play. Look at the close games they have won.

Part of being mentally tough is not falling prey to extended lapses in focus.

No one is questioning their desire to win, but they have a bad habit of losing their heads for minutes at a time. Especially on the road.

[LAZER]

And off back to back Sweet 16's and no early NBA defectors and no major injuries...how is this possible?  
Fortunately, college hoops level of quality continues to erode so we're going to be just fine.  Buzz doing a very good job assembling average talent to play well.  That's also on him, in a good way.

How does the declining level of quality across the country help MU?

[MerrittsMustache]

Part of being mentally tough is not falling prey to extended lapses in focus.

No one is questioning their desire to win, but they have a bad habit of losing their heads for minutes at a time. Especially on the road.

Please provide examples of what you consider "losing their heads."

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Part of being mentally tough is not falling prey to extended lapses in focus.

No one is questioning their desire to win, but they have a bad habit of losing their heads for minutes at a time. Especially on the road.

Fine, but saying that they could improve their overall concentration and be more consistent inside of a game is a lot different that saying:

"Entire team needs to grow a pair and realize the game is 40 minutes long."

Derp. Derp. Derp.

Truthfully, I think the guys are still learning/transitioning into new roles. Last year, when the offense looked bad, DJO or Jae would bail them out with a great defensive or offensive play. This year, they have to execute all of the time. They don't have anybody who can just bail them out. They all just have to be better. I know that sounds silly, but that's the truth. They all have to be a little better at what they do. They don't have any room for error.

[MUfan12]

Please provide examples of what you consider "losing their heads."

Blown assignments, bad shots, turnovers.

Examples?
- First 4 minutes of the second half at Florida.
- The under 4 TO to the 10 minute mark against LSU.
- The end of regulation at Pitt.
- The last 10 minutes of the first half at UL
- The stretch last night where they had 8 TOs and 3 shots in 11 possessions.

They have had really bad spells that have killed them in games this season. Can't just chalk it up to poor shooting.

[Goose]

We have an elite guard in VB and playing along aside JR. does not get full effectiveness out of him. Him getting the ball 30 feet from the basket is not getting enough from him. If VB was given some room to isolate he can make things happen in half court. Problem is 90% of the time he has ball in position it is one dribble and lazy pass to another guy 30 feet from the basket.

[TJ]

Please provide examples of what you consider "losing their heads."

Are you watching the games?  First half Cincinnati game.  Do we need any more examples?

[ChicosBailBonds]

Holy Crap.  We lose a game on the road by 8 to the 15th ranked team in the country and all the sudden "We arent very Good"  "We suck" "NIT"

this is ridiculous!!

Saying we aren't very good doesn't mean we aren't good, it means we aren't VERY good.  I see absolutely nothing wrong with what 4ever said...the exact same thing Buzz said, by the way.  Same thing a number of analysts have said doing our games this year.

We can't shoot at all, we aren't quick, we struggle defensively at times, etc.  It doesn't mean we are NIT bound.  We've benefited from a soft Big East schedule.  We have our moments, we play hard (Buzz won't let them not play hard), we have grit.  We will win some games because we merely outwill the competition.  On pure talent, however, we're not very good.  We're good, we're not VERY good.

This is a bit of a rebuilding year, so not all surprising.  With hoops where it is, more NCAA bids now, the idea of going to the NIT in today's day and age would be really bad.  Not going to happen.

[MerrittsMustache]

Blown assignments, bad shots, turnovers.

Examples?
- First 4 minutes of the second half at Florida.
- The under 4 TO to the 10 minute mark against LSU.
- The end of regulation at Pitt.
- The last 10 minutes of the first half at UL
- The stretch last night where they had 8 TOs and 3 shots in 11 possessions.

They have had really bad spells that have killed them in games this season. Can't just chalk it up to poor shooting.

Are you watching the games?  First half Cincinnati game.  Do we need any more examples?

In other words, whenever the team plays poorly you guys chalk it up to the players "losing their heads."

[ChicosBailBonds]

How does the declining level of quality across the country help MU?

Because if you are half way decent, you always have a chance.  There are no elite teams anymore.  The second tier has dropped off as well.  So if you are a competent team, you have a better chance of sticking around then in years past in the standings, in games, for post season.  I thought the one national tweet last night about both G'Town and MU nailed it about the state of hoops.  Neither of these teams would be top 25 material 10 to 15 years ago and no where near the top of the Big East standings.  That's the state of hoops now.  UCLA fans out here cringe at the level of hoops now...the fact that this UCLA team is in first place of the Pac 12, they would be a middle of the road or bottom half team in the Pac 10 from 10 years ago.

[Pakuni]

Saying we aren't very good doesn't mean we aren't good, it means we aren't VERY good.  I see absolutely nothing wrong with what 4ever said...the exact same thing Buzz said, by the way.  Same thing a number of analysts have said doing our games this year.

We can't shoot at all, we aren't quick, we struggle defensively at times, etc.  It doesn't mean we are NIT bound.  We've benefited from a soft Big East schedule.  We have our moments, we play hard (Buzz won't let them not play hard), we have grit.  We will win some games because we merely outwill the competition.  On pure talent, however, we're not very good.  We're good, we're not VERY good.

This is a bit of a rebuilding year, so not all surprising.  With hoops where it is, more NCAA bids now, the idea of going to the NIT in today's day and age would be really bad.  Not going to happen.

Uh-oh .... I sense a soft bubble coming .....

[Goose]

I agree with Chico's for most part. This year more than any other year has really made me take notice of the quality of play. To me IU, Miami and Michigan are better than almost everyone night. The game is different and to me it is a positive. A school like MU has better chance to make FF now than ten years ago. Not saying this years team, just in general MU has better chance than in the past.