+$500M/12 Year Catholic 7 TV Deal

[Windyplayer]

The C7 didn't vote to dissolve the Big East.  The voted to leave the Big East.  Everything from there on is up for negotiation...tourney credits, exit fees, etc.

If we voted to dissolve the BEast, what would happened to the remaining teams in the conference that were unable to latch onto another conference? Independent?  On a similar note, what does "dissolve" in fact mean in this context?

[Benny B]

The C7 didn't vote to dissolve the Big East.  The voted to leave the Big East.  Everything from there on is up for negotiation...tourney credits, exit fees, etc.

The C7 has been carrying forward as though they have some leverage, but if they truly did announce that they were leaving, they have no leverage because their voting rights would be terminated.

Frankly, I believe one of two things happened:

1) The dissolution vote did take place as a matter of the C7 reserving its rights; however, since nobody wants to be bogged down in litigation, they effectively suspended dissolution (and put a gag-order on announcing anything) pending negotiation of departure terms.

2) The C7 did not vote to dissolve, but voted to suspend the bylaws in order to preserve their voting rights in the Big East until the "negotiations" are complete.

[GGGG]

Yeah Benny, you are right.  They didn't actually vote.  I think technically they basically informed the Big East that they intend to leave the conference and are essentially seeking an amicable divorce. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

This is like the whining that the B1G is far behind the SEC, B12 and Pac012 in FB.  That they are the fourth conference?  Wrong from a media and attention standpoint, they are number 1.  Fact that they are 1-9 in the ten Rose Bowls and 4 - 13 in all January bowls is irrelevant.

Likewise the A-10's record is irrelevant.  The C7 generate more media attention and will be a more important conference.

Never said the C7 won't generate more media attention or that it wouldn't be an important conference.  I also disagree with you on the Big Ten being number 1...you likely live in the Midwest so you are getting hit by regional impressions.  I would put them as a strong #2, however.


I'm merely pointing out that there's a good chunk of the C7 right now that needs to get their crap cleansed because they aren't doing any of us any favors.  Fortunately, the A-10 schools that are rumored to be coming in are doing very well, better than almost every C7 school sans us and G'Town.  We're going to need it because most of the C7 right now...to put it mildly...is lacking.

[Benny B]

Yeah Benny, you are right.  They didn't actually vote.  I think technically they basically informed the Big East that they intend to leave the conference and are essentially seeking an amicable divorce. 

However it happened, the C7 still holds all or most of the chips at this table.  That's why this might happen sooner than we all think.

[muwarrior69]

Never said the C7 won't generate more media attention or that it wouldn't be an important conference.  I also disagree with you on the Big Ten being number 1...you likely life in the Midwest so you are getting hit by regional impressions.  I would put them as a strong #2, however.


I'm merely pointing out that there's a good chunk of the C7 right now that needs to get their crap cleansed because they aren't doing any of us any favors.  Fortunately, the A-10 schools that are rumored to be coming in are doing very well, better than almost every C7 school sans us and G'Town.  We're going to need it because most of the C7 right now...to put it mildly...is lacking.

Agree...There should be some form of a contractual agreement comitting all the participating schools in the new league to playing High Major D1 basketball.

[Pakuni]

Agree...There should be some form of a contractual agreement comitting all the participating schools in the new league to playing High Major D1 basketball.

How would such an agreement work and be measured? Wins? Tourney appearances? Program expenditures? Attendance?
What would be the consequences of not meeting the standards? Relegation?

I mean, do you really want to leave the Chicago or New York markets because DePaul and St. John's aren't winning enough games? Think the conference's TV partners would sign on to such an arrangement?

[The Equalizer]

Never said the C7 won't generate more media attention or that it wouldn't be an important conference.  I also disagree with you on the Big Ten being number 1...you likely live in the Midwest so you are getting hit by regional impressions.  I would put them as a strong #2, however.

I'm merely pointing out that there's a good chunk of the C7 right now that needs to get their crap cleansed because they aren't doing any of us any favors.  Fortunately, the A-10 schools that are rumored to be coming in are doing very well, better than almost every C7 school sans us and G'Town.  We're going to need it because most of the C7 right now...to put it mildly...is lacking.

First, could the offer by Fox be a move to screw CBS and NBC on their recent A10 deal?  By giving the C7 enough money to entice Butler & Xavier (possibly others) to move, they deprive CBS and NBC the most marketable teams in the A10.

Second, would you expect that CBS and NBC to proactively sweeten their deal with A10 to give them funding to try to keep Xavier, Butler, VCU, Dayton, St. Louis, etc. in the conference?  Or do they just suffer their losses and live with whatever the A10 turns into?

[ChicosBailBonds]

How would such an agreement work and be measured? Wins? Tourney appearances? Program expenditures? Attendance?
What would be the consequences of not meeting the standards? Relegation?

I mean, do you really want to leave the Chicago or New York markets because DePaul and St. John's aren't winning enough games? Think the conference's TV partners would sign on to such an arrangement?

It would be interesting, but you could do an arrangement sort of like the Premier League in soccer, but do it for revenue sharing.  If your school doesn't go to the NCAA tournament X times in Y period of time, your % goes down.  Something of that nature.  Some leagues now have basement or entry level financial commitments as part of their CBAs, requiring that teams not free load but spend a minimum on their team payrolls. That's another way to look at it...minimum expenditure.

I don't know of any collegiate conference that is doing this, but it would be an interesting exercise.  It would, at least in theory, attempt to hold some schools feet to the fire.  Make them put some significant skin in the game in terms of resources and commitment to play at the highest level.  I'm sure there are a number of downsides to it.

I'm just glad that if the rumored schools outside of the C7 come into the league, it's a good thing because we need the help.  There's a lot of dead wood right now at the bottom of the C7 over the past decade.

[ChicosBailBonds]

First, could the offer by Fox be a move to screw CBS and NBC on their recent A10 deal?  By giving the C7 enough money to entice Butler & Xavier (possibly others) to move, they deprive CBS and NBC the most marketable teams in the A10.

Second, would you expect that CBS and NBC to proactively sweeten their deal with A10 to give them funding to try to keep Xavier, Butler, VCU, Dayton, St. Louis, etc. in the conference?  Or do they just suffer their losses and live with whatever the A10 turns into?

Both great questions.  If I am the A10, I'm absolutely having those conversations BUT (big BUT) there may already be some protections in the contract that don't help the A10.  Some of the contracts I've seen over the years on the television side for conferences have clauses in them when teams are added or subtracted which allow some remedies for the broadcaster.  So if the A10 were to lose teams, it might kick in a provision already for the rights holder (ESPN) to reduce their payment.  If that's the case, A10 doesn't have a lot of leverage because the rights holder is already protected.  Again, no idea if this is in there, but pretty common for clauses such as this to be in there.

Fox and ESPN love to piss all over each other, though of late they've largely played nice...even co-bidded on some content.  Lots of possibilities, but not knowing what is in the A10 deal leaves me hogtied to give you a concrete answer.

[brewcity77]

Never said the C7 won't generate more media attention or that it wouldn't be an important conference.  I also disagree with you on the Big Ten being number 1...you likely live in the Midwest so you are getting hit by regional impressions.  I would put them as a strong #2, however.

When all is said and done, I'd guess the ACC will be #1 and the B1G will be #2.

ACC: North Carolina, Duke, Louisville, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Notre Dame, Maryland, Georgia Tech

Of those teams, all have either won a title, been to a Final Four, or been a #1 or 2 seed in the past 11 years. And NC State and Florida State are both very solid programs that seem to be on an upward trajectory.

B1G: Indiana, Michigan State, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Illinois

Pretty sure those are the only teams that can claim that distinction. Michigan and Minnesota seem to be on the rise, but other than Purdue the B1G generally stinks.

I do think depending on who's in the league, the C7+ can be right there in the next tier with the SEC and Big 12.

[Xbus]

Also Xavier tv money is different than the rest if the a10 because currently and for e past 5 years at least we have had our own individual and separate contract with fox sports Ohio. Every single x game is on tv and has been. Basically if you have direct tv sports package as most sports bars do you can get the x games anywhere in the nation.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Also Xavier tv money is different than the rest if the a10 because currently and for e past 5 years at least we have had our own individual and separate contract with fox sports Ohio. Every single x game is on tv and has been. Basically if you have direct tv sports package as most sports bars do you can get the x games anywhere in the nation.

MU also has their deal with Time Warner...UCONN and a few others with SNY I believe.  That won't change other than to make that local deal potentially more valuable.  Most interesting for X is the local deal is with Fox...which provides incentive to tie in their local with national properties.

[🏀]

Also Xavier tv money is different than the rest if the a10 because currently and for e past 5 years at least we have had our own individual and separate contract with fox sports Ohio. Every single x game is on tv and has been. Basically if you have direct tv sports package as most sports bars do you can get the x games anywhere in the nation.

That's what it's like being in Big East.

[Windyplayer]

When all is said and done, I'd guess the ACC will be #1 and the B1G will be #2.

ACC: North Carolina, Duke, Louisville, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Notre Dame, Maryland, Georgia Tech

Of those teams, all have either won a title, been to a Final Four, or been a #1 or 2 seed in the past 11 years. And NC State and Florida State are both very solid programs that seem to be on an upward trajectory.

B1G: Indiana, Michigan State, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Illinois

Pretty sure those are the only teams that can claim that distinction. Michigan and Minnesota seem to be on the rise, but other than Purdue the B1G generally stinks.

I do think depending on who's in the league, the C7+ can be right there in the next tier with the SEC and Big 12.

Maryland should be listed under the B1G.

[forgetful]

Maryland should be listed under the B1G.

If we are talking Basketball, yeah no doubt the new ACC is tops then a big gap and the BiG.

[brewcity77]

That's what it's like being in Big East.

Except nationwide, not just across Ohio.

[mu03eng]

It would be interesting, but you could do an arrangement sort of like the Premier League in soccer, but do it for revenue sharing.  If your school doesn't go to the NCAA tournament X times in Y period of time, your % goes down.  Something of that nature.  Some leagues now have basement or entry level financial commitments as part of their CBAs, requiring that teams not free load but spend a minimum on their team payrolls. That's another way to look at it...minimum expenditure.

I don't know of any collegiate conference that is doing this, but it would be an interesting exercise.  It would, at least in theory, attempt to hold some schools feet to the fire.  Make them put some significant skin in the game in terms of resources and commitment to play at the highest level.  I'm sure there are a number of downsides to it.

I'm just glad that if the rumored schools outside of the C7 come into the league, it's a good thing because we need the help.  There's a lot of dead wood right now at the bottom of the C7 over the past decade.

I think the minimum expenditure route is the way they will and should go.  Put bench marks around % of budget spent on the athletic department and some level of infrastructure spending, etc.  Also likely a commitment to X number of teams in non-revenue sports.

[The Equalizer]

If we are talking Basketball, yeah no doubt the new ACC is tops then a big gap and the BiG.

The problem with any of these types of comparisions is that the statistical differentiation tends to occur at the bottom--not the top.

If the top of the ACC is Duke and UNC and Syracuse, and the top of the Big Ten is Indiana, Michigan State and Ohio State, and all those teams are ranked in the top 10, then from a perception standpoint there really isn't that much difference there.  Someone is going to go to the RPI or Sagarain or Poermor ratings, avererage every team, and declare a winner.

Which means the debate devloves to whether Boston College or Wake Forest are better than Penn State or Northewestern, which I think is an essentially uninteresting debate.

So is there a big gap?  Not at the top. 

When this applies to us, there there will be a bunch of statistical navel gazing around the C7, the perception of strength will be where our top teams wind up vis-a-vis  Duke, UNC, Kansas, Kentucky, MSU, Indiana, etc.  We may get bragging rights on our average ranking higher than a Big 6 conference, but perception will be whether we acheive the same top 10 ranking.