A little birdie heard....

[Aughnanure]

Aughnanure

I dream in the daytime and will continue doing so. MU has had stumbling blocks in the past a strong leadership made for positive steps forward. I am not going to sit back in MU basketball discussion and go along with the best option in bad case situation. You can chase mid majors and that is your right, but please do not bash me because I hold MU in high regard. If you think SLU, Dayton, Butler and Creighton's of the world are on par programs that is where our disagreement starts.

Funny thing is I said months ago MU knows their fan base and I would say you are target backer of the program. I will support MU regardless of conference but not ready to throw white towel in the air and jump in mid major conference. Trust me...I have dreamed my life and not going to stop today

Merry Christmas!!

And you live in a pessimistic fantasy world and I will continue to attack when all I hear is unconstructive bulls*** about who we are. Dream all you want but stop this 'world is ending' tripe because you think Creighton is not worthy. That's a small minded fearful response that is simply wrong on all grounds related to program performance.

This is also not the only issue where your paranoia and worry dominate your contributions to discussion.

[Galway Eagle]

Aughnanure

I dream in the daytime and will continue doing so. MU has had stumbling blocks in the past a strong leadership made for positive steps forward. I am not going to sit back in MU basketball discussion and go along with the best option in bad case situation. You can chase mid majors and that is your right, but please do not bash me because I hold MU in high regard. If you think SLU, Dayton, Butler and Creighton's of the world are on par programs that is where our disagreement starts.

Funny thing is I said months ago MU knows their fan base and I would say you are target backer of the program. I will support MU regardless of conference but not ready to throw white towel in the air and jump in mid major conference. Trust me...I have dreamed my life and not going to stop today.

Merry Christmas!!

Wow you seem a little too elitist of a person to be from Marquette.  But in any case Butler is a good program as is Creighton, not going to say they are elite but it takes time and people to believe in you in order to build a program, before McGuire we had what 4 truly successful years and yet he built us up, before O'Neil we only had those McGuire years and the handful in the 50s, but people believed in us and we built up a program.  You can't dismiss a program because they don't have some extremely long strand of success.  Butler has had as much as anybody recently and deserves to be in the conversation, same with X, same with creighton.  Dayton and SLU can bugger off. 

[Goose]

Aughnanure

How am I paranoid on the conference? To date I support LW and what he has done. We have, on paper, two years to figure out conference. I would think we should have two lists and the second list is full of mid majors. I would think Dayton, SLU or Creighton would jump at anytime to be better conference, so need to rush things. I actually have some confidence that our leaders do have two lists and are reaching for the stars first.

If saying MU is higher in basketball world than Dayton, Creighton or SLU is unconstructive bullshit I think you are off target. I have no problem with anything that has been reported regarding the conference. None of the reports I have seen is an effort to lower our conference to mid major.

All I know is ten years I never would have thought MU would someday be in the BE and four years ago I never thought BE would bust up. BE bust up because other opportunities presented itself to some members and I am fine with that. I still think we have opportunities out there.

[tower912]

Goose, no other conferences are going to the failed BEast hybrid model.   In other words, no one is going to add basketball only schools to their football conference.    If you accept that, what better options are out there?    Or do you honestly believe the football conferences are going to add basketball-only schools?

[Galway Eagle]

I always wondered what real denial looked like but Goose with conference realignment is a classic example. 

[ATL MU Warrior]

Aughnanure

How am I paranoid on the conference? To date I support LW and what he has done. We have, on paper, two years to figure out conference. I would think we should have two lists and the second list is full of mid majors. I would think Dayton, SLU or Creighton would jump at anytime to be better conference, so need to rush things. I actually have some confidence that our leaders do have two lists and are reaching for the stars first.

If saying MU is higher in basketball world than Dayton, Creighton or SLU is unconstructive bullcrap I think you are off target. I have no problem with anything that has been reported regarding the conference. None of the reports I have seen is an effort to lower our conference to mid major.

All I know is ten years I never would have thought MU would someday be in the BE and four years ago I never thought BE would bust up. BE bust up because other opportunities presented itself to some members and I am fine with that. I still think we have opportunities out there.

Again, who are the "stars"?

[ATL MU Warrior]

I always wondered what real denial looked like but Goose with conference realignment is a classic example. 

+1

[Goose]

Tower
You might be correct but I do think any effort is worth the effort. If nothing happens in that direction,nothing happens. I would rather be hearing upside discussions to Dayton in or out debates. Nothing surprises me anymore and I definitely would not be shocked in Georgetown ultimately is not part of this conference.

[The Process]

Wow you seem a little too elitist of a person to be from Marquette.

My wife thinks that everyone who went to Marquette is an elitist.

[Goose]

We always chirp about our top notch basketball budget, do you really think big time boosters will throw same money when new conference is formed? Not in denial at all, just know no need to rush.

[Benny B]

What I've learned from his thread:

1) Dayton bad? No, Dayton good.
2) No, Dayton bad. Gonzaga good.
3) No, Gonzaga no badder or gooder than Dayton.
4) Spectrum of infinite points require dichotomous comparison of any combination of two teams within spectrum.
5) St. Mary's?  Meh... Pterodactyl flight is pterodactyl flight.
6) Always worship all knowing TV contract in sky.
7) Me forget.... Dayton bad or good?
8) You forget St Louis?  Yes, good idea.
9) Wait... Good idea forget or good idea St Louis?

Moral of thread: Freeze self in ice, wait million years, come back to yet unresolved thread later.

[keefe]

My wife thinks that everyone who went to Marquette is an elitist.

Why? Because Marquette is ranked #83 among National Universities by US News? Exclusive? Elitist?


Other Academic Rankings:

Dayton: #113 National

Creighton: #1 Regional Univ (Midwest)

Gonzaga: #4 Regional Univ (West)

SLU: #92 National

BYU: #68 National

Memphis: #227 National

VCU: #170 National

Richmond: #28 National Liberal Arts

UMass: #97 National

Cincy: #139 National

UL: #160 National

UConn: #63 National

Loyola (Chi): #106 National

Notre Dame: #17 National

Kansas: #106 National

Indiana: #83 National (Tied with Marquette)

Michigan: #16 National

Northwestern: #12 National

Wisconsin: #41 National (How the Eff do they call themselves the "Harvard of the Midwest"???)

Looks like Marquette is rather comfortably settled in with most of the Catholic schools under consideration. All good, not great schools. And certainly better than Cincy, Louisville, Memphis, VCU, et al

[Tugg Speedman]

We always chirp about our top notch basketball budget, do you really think big time boosters will throw same money when new conference is formed? Not in denial at all, just know no need to rush.

We are not rushing ... we are in the BE this year and next.  The new conference starts in 2 years.  But first we need to hire a commissioner, hire conference staff, lease conference offices (what city?  NYC?) form by-laws, pick new members and set schedules for all the sports.  To do all this is JUST two years will be a breakneck pace.  Oh, and negotiate a TV deal with Fox, NBC and/or ESPN.

I would not be surprised if C7 starts in three years given everything that goes into starting a new conference (but I'm not predicting it, just would not be surprised.)

[boyonthedock]

I call marquette the harvard of the midwest. I call any school I'm talking about the harvard of x. Ots the same way I claimed, at one time or another, poker, croquet, boxing, soccer, and hunting to be "the sport of kings."

[keefe]

I call marquette the harvard of the midwest. I call any school I'm talking about the harvard of x. Ots the same way I claimed, at one time or another, poker, croquet, boxing, soccer, and hunting to be "the sport of kings."

I know William fancies a rousing game of cribbage while Harry, being the more sporty of the two, favors both polo and cricket. In that way these pastimes may indeed be called the sports of princes.

[madtownwarrior]

You forgot - The first step in Marquette becoming SLU is to join a conference with SLU.

What I've learned from his thread:

1) Dayton bad? No, Dayton good.
2) No, Dayton bad. Gonzaga good.
3) No, Gonzaga no badder or gooder than Dayton.
4) Spectrum of infinite points require dichotomous comparison of any combination of two teams within spectrum.
5) St. Mary's?  Meh... Pterodactyl flight is pterodactyl flight.
6) Always worship all knowing TV contract in sky.
7) Me forget.... Dayton bad or good?
8) You forget St Louis?  Yes, good idea.
9) Wait... Good idea forget or good idea St Louis?

Moral of thread: Freeze self in ice, wait million years, come back to yet unresolved thread later.

[muwarrior69]

I doubt there will be divisions if only because

1.) The Midwestern schools will want the east coast exposure through mirror games, rather than only playing in any given East Coast market every other year because they've got to pick up a mirror game with Dayton or SLU.
2.) Remember, kids, the Big East had 16 teams and no divisions.
3.) In fact, no high-level Division I Conference has divisions. Some allocate their schedules as if there were divisions, or seed their conference tournaments according to divisions, but the Big 10, Pac-12, SEC and ACC all treat their league standings as if it were a single table. If you're going to have divisions it has to mean something
4.) If you look at the likely teams and split it geographically, the divisions would likely split up Xavier and Dayton, only by virtue of the fact that there are 5 schools along I-95, and most of the other rumored teams are west of there.

X and Butler would appear to be locks. Dayton as well, given their rivalry with Xavier. That gets you to 10. Creighton would appear to be the lead contender for Spot #11, and while there's no doubt that Gonzaga surpasses SLU in basketball quality and sustained success, I don't want to add a school like St. Mary's or Loyola Marymount or whatever to get them. (Full disclosure: I got my J.D. at SLU.)

The format I see emerging is a 12 team league, with no divisions, and if I had to take a stab at membership, it would be Marquette, DePaul, SLU, Georgetown, Creighton, Butler, Seton Hall, Villanova, Dayton, Xavier, St. John's, and Providence.

Play everyone once. 7 mirror games that rotate through the league, so at most, any team would never miss out on trips to a certain market in consecutive years.

No divisions for basketball. All other sports could have divisions to mitigate travel expenses.

[Mufflers]

Has anybody explained what the hell a "travel partner" is and why it's needed?  Are advocates of it saying that St. Mary's and Gonzaga should share a plane?  Are advocates of it saying the East coast schools should play two teams every time they go to the West coast (by the way, this logic would be incorrect because it would make more sense to choose a school within 900 miles of your home location than a school 900 miles from Spokane)?  Are advocates saying St. Mary's needs to be added for the two times per year Gonzaga could play St. Mary's?

Help me understand the logic behind St. Mary's as a "travel partner."

[Galway Eagle]

My wife thinks that everyone who went to Marquette is an elitist.

Where did she go? Cause I only see us as elitist towards schools like DePaul Dayton and Loyola Chicago but humble with Notre Dame Boston College and Georgetown

[Dr. Blackheart]

Has anybody explained what the hell a "travel partner" is and why it's needed?  Are advocates of it saying that St. Mary's and Gonzaga should share a plane?  Are advocates of it saying the East coast schools should play two teams every time they go to the West coast (by the way, this logic would be incorrect because it would make more sense to choose a school within 900 miles of your home location than a school 900 miles from Spokane)?  Are advocates saying St. Mary's needs to be added for the two times per year Gonzaga could play St. Mary's?

Help me understand the logic behind St. Mary's as a "travel partner."

I explained it in the middle of this thread. : http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=35061.msg432049#msg432049

I will try again...if Marquette women's soccer is playing in a 14 team conference and is put in the West Division....then it can play a St. Mary's on Friday night after flying out Thursday after classes on a private charter with one flight crew one set of academic and support staff.  They stay in a hotel in the East Bay Thursday and Friday nights.  Wake  up Saturday AM and the same plane and flight crew flies from Oakland to Spokane.  Stay in a hotel in Spokane Saturday night...play an afternoon game Sunday and fly back Sunday night, buying fuel in the cheaper State of Washington. Two road games, one lost day of school, one weekend away, one road trip for a tight support staff who has to also support other teams another weekend.

[Mufflers]

I explained it in the middle of this thread. : http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=35061.msg432049#msg432049

I will try again...if Marquette women's soccer is playing in a 14 team conference and is put in the West Division....then it can play a St. Mary's on Friday night after flying out Thursday after classes on a private charter with one flight crew one set of academic and support staff.  They stay in a hotel in the East Bay Thursday and Friday nights.  Wake  up Saturday AM and the same plane and flight crew flies from Oakland to Spokane.  Stay in a hotel in Spokane Saturday night...play an afternoon game Sunday and fly back Sunday night, buying fuel in the cheaper State of Washington. Two road games, one lost day of school, one weekend away, one road trip for a tight support staff who has to also support other teams another weekend.

MKE to Spokane to Oakland to MKE = 4,030 miles

MKE to Spokane to Omaha to MKE = 3,782 miles

Why wouldn't Creighton be a better "travel partner?"

[Tugg Speedman]

I explained it in the middle of this thread. : http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=35061.msg432049#msg432049

I will try again...if Marquette women's soccer is playing in a 14 team conference and is put in the West Division....then it can play a St. Mary's on Friday night after flying out Thursday after classes on a private charter with one flight crew one set of academic and support staff.  They stay in a hotel in the East Bay Thursday and Friday nights.  Wake  up Saturday AM and the same plane and flight crew flies from Oakland to Spokane.  Stay in a hotel in Spokane Saturday night...play an afternoon game Sunday and fly back Sunday night, buying fuel in the cheaper State of Washington. Two road games, one lost day of school, one weekend away, one road trip for a tight support staff who has to also support other teams another weekend.

The soccer team is not taking a charter to St. Mary's at a cost of 50,000 one way.

The are taking a bus to midway airport in Chicago only to find their southwest flight is hours late, eat greasy food, fly all night ony to lose, the slep to the airport to take Alaska air to Spokane only to find their reservations are fouled up and the gate agent really doesn't care.  Another night of traveling, lost luggage, borrowed uniforms and then back to midway in the middle of rush hour for a three and a half hour bus ride back to MU.

Welcome to a conference that stretches 3000 miles.

[Dr. Blackheart]

MKE to Spokane to Oakland to MKE = 4,030 miles

MKE to Spokane to Omaha to MKE = 3,782 miles

Why wouldn't Creighton be a better "travel partner?"

They could...but that is two time zones with a long travel day to Spokane after playing Friday night in Omaha only to fly back. Not great for performance or academics.  Again, this is predicated on adding Gonzaga as the best basketball option and all sports.  If it goes to 14, then Creighton's travel partner would be SLU...and St. Mary's would be needed.  These are the two schools they are looking at...but the non-revenue cost issue is a major issue to be considered as I am saying. 

Btw, MU is flying out West to play St. Mary's in lacrosse already this Spring. Also, Syracuse as a BE travel partner with MU, is almost 800 air miles one way. Not ideal either.

[Dr. Blackheart]

The soccer team is not taking a charter to St. Mary's at a cost of 50,000 one way.

The are taking a bus to midway airport in Chicago only to find their southwest flight is hours late, eat greasy food, fly all night ony to lose, the slep to the airport to take Alaska air to Spokane only to find their reservations are fouled up and the gate agent really doesn't care.  Another night of traveling, lost luggage, borrowed uniforms and then back to midway in the middle of rush hour for a three and a half hour bus ride back to MU.

Welcome to a conference that stretches 3000 miles.

Has to be charter or it won't work.  MU will have to buy into charter time share...not to mention the East Coast schools in all this.  Non-revenue sports is big issue for this proposed conference...cost, quality, and SA performance. Has to be a big blocker for going Far West to add. Go slow.

[tower912]

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/basketball/game_of_name_in_big_east_split_Z8tWWS17CNrVQYweK2jPQK/1

Pretty good article.   His sources say that Gonzaga/St Mary's are cost prohibitive.    Also floats George Mason instead of Creighton.