A true basketball-only league

[Hards Alumni]

Just fundamentally disagree. The money won't actually change much. We will still be able to pay. And this conference would still be better than the PAC-12...not a mid-major. I'm sorry you view everything with such a negative pessimistic disdain.

It isn't negative or pessimistic (everything?  Do you even read half of my posts?) it realistic.

We can all dream here which conference we will be in and if we will call it the BEAST or whatever.  At the end of the day, the big boys are playing football, and basketball is a nice secondary sport to have in the winter for students to follow.  If you honestly think that some of the schools that you have listed are going to create a basketball only conference while they have football programs, I don't know what to tell you.

Except you are totally off your nut.  Wanting something so badly does not make it likely to happen.  Half the schools you guys have listed have football (albeit crappy ones). 

Furthermore, if you take the schools that have basketball ONLY... you have:

St. John's
Seton Hall
Providence
Richmond
Georgetown
Villanova (for now)
Xavier
Creighton
Butler
St. Louis
DePaul
Marquette

and you really think that isn't a mid major conference?  Who are the major schools?  Marquette, Villanova, Xavier, Butler, and Georgetown  When is the last time ANY of those other schools weren't perennial doormats in their conferences?  Even if most people don't consider this a mid major conference, what is it?  It is at best the WORST major conference... and it isn't even close.  What is going to happen when money from the big schools and big alumni bases we have lost isn't there anymore?  What happens when no one wants to pay us a ton of money to be on TV anymore? 

Look, I want this to shake out in a very positive way, but I just don't see it happening.

[Benny B]

Seems to me a lot of people are more upset about the term "mid-major" than they are about the prospect of having to play in a conference headlined by GTown, Nova, Butler, Xavier, etc.

Sticks and stones, people.  You think Butler fans are going Napoleonic because North Carolina fans called them a low-major as recently as 6 days ago?

[Dawson Rental]

So I got to thinking this morning...if the Big East dissolved, what if we all started a true basketball-only league? What I mean is, a nationwide league for basketball programs only. All other sports, like lacrosse, soccer, golf, volleyball, and others would be parked in another conference that was more local to cut down on travel costs for all schools involved. The Horizon, MAC, MVC...doesn't really matter.

ONLY basketball plays in this new league. And basketball programs could afford the travel. We could realistically look at a conference with teams like Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, Gonzaga, Creighton, Wichita State, and St John's. Hell, even if schools wanted they could leave their football behind. San Diego State, Memphis, even Duke if they get left out in all the shuffling would be welcome.

Would it be worth losing the Big East affiliation for all other sports to create a true basketball super-conference?

Boy, we'd even be willing to take Duke?  That would be big of us.

[Aughnanure]

It isn't negative or pessimistic (everything?  Do you even read half of my posts?) it realistic.

We can all dream here which conference we will be in and if we will call it the BEAST or whatever.  At the end of the day, the big boys are playing football, and basketball is a nice secondary sport to have in the winter for students to follow. If you honestly think that some of the schools that you have listed are going to create a basketball only conference while they have football programs, I don't know what to tell you.

Except you are totally off your nut.  Wanting something so badly does not make it likely to happen. Half the schools you guys have listed have football (albeit crappy ones).  

Furthermore, if you take the schools that have basketball ONLY... you have:

St. John's
Seton Hall
Providence
Richmond
Georgetown
Villanova (for now)
Xavier
Creighton
Butler
St. Louis
DePaul
Marquette

When, in any of my posts, did I suggest any schools playing D1 football would join a basketball only league? Jesus, I was refuting a previous poster's assertion that that could happen.  Maybe you should read my posts before getting all huffy about a point I didn't make. But just to be clear - No, I don't think BYU, Memphis, etc are part of our future bball-only conference.

and you really think that isn't a mid major conference?  Who are the major schools?  Marquette, Villanova, Xavier, Butler, and Georgetown When is the last time ANY of those other schools weren't perennial doormats in their conferences?    

Look, I want this to shake out in a very positive way, but I just don't see it happening.

So Marquette, Nova, Xavier, Butler, GTown are perennial doormats? I'm going to assume that's not want you meant to write.

But moving on, so having 5 major schools isn't enough to make a conference major. Jeez, how many conferences meet your expectations then? How many schools do you need?

Big 12: Kansas, Texas, West Virginia (cause of Huggy), Baylor is pushing it
B1G: Michigan St, Michigan, Ohio St, Indiana, Illinois, Maryland now
ACC: Cuse, Duke, Pitt, UNC, UConn/Ville?, NC State
PAC 12: Arizona, UCLA, Stanford
SEC: Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Florida, no Mizzou doesn't count, Arkansas
BBallOnly: Marquette, Xavier, Butler, Georgetown, St. John's, Villanova, Creighton

You don't think that matches up decently? Fine. But I think you're hearing big state school names that are good at football and making that = major status.

[Aughnanure]

nm

[Aughnanure]

Even if most people don't consider this a mid major conference, what is it?  It is at best the WORST major conference... and it isn't even close.  What is going to happen when money from the big schools and big alumni bases we have lost isn't there anymore?  What happens when no one wants to pay us a ton of money to be on TV anymore?  

Look, I want this to shake out in a very positive way, but I just don't see it happening.

Everything comes from your preconceived notion that if we don't play those teams that we've only played FOR 6 F****** YEARS that's it's an epic disaster. It was nice while it lasted, but it's not going to last. Get over it. This is still better than any conference before the Big East (which was arguably the greatest basketball conference ever constructed for those first 5 years...shocking we might have to feel a pinch of degradation). And no, this ain't the worst major conference. PAC-12 is better? No. SEC? Outside Vanderbilt, Florida, Kentucky what is the SEC?

This conference would compete as the 4th to 6th best conference every year, and maybe grow even higher with the top-bottom strength.

[MarquetteDano]

Furthermore, if you take the schools that have basketball ONLY... you have:

St. John's
Seton Hall
Providence
Richmond
Georgetown
Villanova (for now)
Xavier
Creighton
Butler
St. Louis
DePaul
Marquette

and you really think that isn't a mid major conference?  

Assuming the conference above, according to the Sagarin Rankings  for 2011-12 that conference would have an adjusted ranking of 80.73.  That would have ranked FOURTH only behind the Big Ten, Big East (which would be lower w/o schools above), and  Big Twelve.

Some other things of note about that conference:

• Would have had five NCAA bids, more than PAC-12 and SEC, and tied with ACC
• Would have had two Sweet Sixteen teams, no less than other major conferences

[muguru]

Everything comes from your preconceived notion that if we don't play those teams that we've only played FOR 6 F****** YEARS that's it's an epic disaster. It was nice while it lasted, but it's not going to last. Get over it. This is still better than any conference before the Big East (which was arguably the greatest basketball conference ever constructed for those first 5 years...shocking we might have to feel a pinch of degradation). And no, this ain't the worst major conference. PAC-12 is better? No. SEC? Outside Vanderbilt, Florida, Kentucky what is the SEC?

This conference would compete as the 4th to 6th best conference every year, and maybe grow even higher with the top-bottom strength.

You hit the nail on the head....the 4th-6th best conference. When you played in the best BB conference ever assembled for 6+ years, going to consistently the 4th-6th best IS a downgrade in the program, is it not???

[Hards Alumni]

When, in any of my posts, did I suggest any schools playing D1 football would join a basketball only league? Jesus, I was refuting a previous poster's assertion that that could happen.  Maybe you should read my posts before getting all huffy about a point I didn't make. But just to be clear - No, I don't think BYU, Memphis, etc are part of our future bball-only conference.

So Marquette, Nova, Xavier, Butler, GTown are perennial doormats? I'm going to assume that's not want you meant to write.

But moving on, so having 5 major schools isn't enough to make a conference major. Jeez, how many conferences meet your expectations then? How many schools do you need?

Big 12: Kansas, Texas, West Virginia (cause of Huggy), Baylor is pushing it
B1G: Michigan St, Michigan, Ohio St, Indiana, Illinois, Maryland now
ACC: Cuse, Duke, Pitt, UNC, UConn/Ville?, NC State
PAC 12: Arizona, UCLA, Stanford
SEC: Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Florida, no Mizzou doesn't count, Arkansas
BBallOnly: Marquette, Xavier, Butler, Georgetown, St. John's, Villanova, Creighton

You don't think that matches up decently? Fine. But I think you're hearing big state school names that are good at football and making that = major status.

Thats why I wrote ANY other.

And no, it doesn't match up decently.  Creighton is having a nice run this year but they aren't anything special.  St. Johns?  really, we are counting them?

[Hards Alumni]

Assuming the conference above, according to the Sagarin Rankings  for 2011-12 that conference would have an adjusted ranking of 80.73.  That would have ranked FOURTH only behind the Big Ten, Big East (which would be lower w/o schools above), and  Big Twelve.

Some other things of note about that conference:

• Would have had five NCAA bids, more than PAC-12 and SEC, and tied with ACC
• Would have had two Sweet Sixteen teams, no less than other major conferences

Cool Story bro, now put Pitt, Cuse, Uconn all in the ACC, I'd be willing to bet they'd leapfrog and make the "basketball only" conference 5th.  Whoopie, slightly better than the PAC-12.  In 5 years the conference will fall to 6th, and be the best mid-major conference in the land.

[SqueallyDRyan]

Creighton has never been anything resembling a doormat in the MVC. Additionally, they've been to the NCAA tournament 8 times since 1999.   Richmond has made it three times since then. Providence twice.  So it's not like these teams are all doormats.

[Aughnanure]

Thats why I wrote ANY other.

And no, it doesn't match up decently.  Creighton is having a nice run this year but they aren't anything special.  St. Johns?  really, we are counting them?

Check all-time wins...and remember how ESPN went nuts when there was even the possibility of them being good.

[Aughnanure]

You hit the nail on the head....the 4th-6th best conference. When you played in the best BB conference ever assembled for 6+ years, going to consistently the 4th-6th best IS a downgrade in the program, is it not???

Yeah, and we finished in the top 3 once. Is that a downgrade? Always being a top 6-8 team? Slightly over .500%? I'm not arguing it is, but you're acting like anything different than that is the f***ing end-of-the-world. Our program grade is not based simply on our conference. Get over it, there are no other options, and guess what, it is still an upgrade over where we were before the BE. We will survive.

[Aughnanure]

Creighton has never been anything resembling a doormat in the MVC. Additionally, they've been to the NCAA tournament 8 times since 1999.   Richmond has made it three times since then. Providence twice.  So it's not like these teams are all doormats.

I like Richmond over VCU because they have $1+ billion endowment and they're private (the one thing all the other schools would share).

[MarquetteDano]

Cool Story bro, now put Pitt, Cuse, Uconn all in the ACC, I'd be willing to bet they'd leapfrog and make the "basketball only" conference 5th.  Whoopie, slightly better than the PAC-12.  In 5 years the conference will fall to 6th, and be the best mid-major conference in the land.

If that all happens, the new conference would be 4th since the Big East would, in essence, be gone as the new conference would be still ahead of the SEC and PAC-12.

The biggest issue with the new conference you posted (excluding the tv deal issue) is not having a blue blood team like the other conferences would have (ACC: UNC/Duke, Big 12: Kansas, SEC: Kentucky, Big Ten: Indiana, Pac-12: UCLA, etc.).

However the 4th best conference is not exactly Mid Major territory.

[unforgiven]

I like Richmond over VCU because they have $1+ billion endowment

Tobacco money